Public transport in Atlanta

bk

I always like to try public transport while abroad and compare it to here. Last week I was in Atlanta Georgia and got to try out their public transport.

For one of the most spread out and car reliant cities in the US, with some roads I counted 20 lanes!! I was shocked at how good their public transport was.

Their public transport agency is called MARTA and it covers both buses and rail.

Their rail service consists of an electrified system similar to DART:

- Two core lines (north-south, east-west) which intersect and integrate at the heart of the city. There are also two branch lines.
- Underground stations in the city center. Much better network then DART.
- The Trains seemed much faster then DART, with less frequent stops.
- Runs every 15 minutes peak, every 20 minutes off peak including weekends, better then DART.
- Runs from 4:45am to 1am, again much better then DART.
- You can take your bike on the train at any time and buses also have racks up front.
- Train stations outside the central city area are massive, with free multi-storey car parks, taxi bays and most importantly bus station.
- The buses seem to operate from each MARTA station, serving the local areas from the MARTA station.
- Fully integrated ticketing, a ticket for the train can then be used on the bus.
- RTPI for train and bus fully integrated into Google Transit.
- Contact-less card like Leap called Breeze.
- You can only board the train using their Breeze card, if you don't already have one, you can buy one from a machine for just $1, it is a proper plastic card like leap and can be loaded with future purchases.
- The Breeze card can store a variety of different ticket types, including e-purse (like leap), single and return fares, daily, weekly, monthly, etc. fares.
- The Breeze card supports automated and online top-up.
- The online top-up even works on buses!!

The only problem I saw was it seems not many people really use it, even at peak times it was busy but not mad crowded like DART.

So in other words, even in a car dependent city in the US, they still have a vastly better public transport system then we have!!

There isn't much we can currently do about building new lines, but we certainly can do better with the resources we currently have.

- True integrated ticketing, usable on bus, luas, dart.
- RTPI on google maps
- Buses better integrated with LUAS and DART stations.
- Increased frequency and increased hours of operation.
- LEAP card gets daily, weekly, etc. tickets and replaces all other ticket types.

One interesting concept I think we should look at is to drop the price of the leap card to €1 and make the only way to pay for LUAS and DART be leap.

bk

Just been reading about Breeze (Atlantas Leap card). Interestingly it was first introduced in October 2006 and was fully rolled out by July 2007, just 9 months later!!

That means in just 9 months they implemented:

- Leap style e-purse
- single, return, daily, weekly and monthly tickets
- free transfers between bus and train
- eliminated all other magnetic tickets and required breeze card to use the train.

Wow they did all that in just 9 months 7 years ago!!

It shows just how slow it is to roll out Leap card, so far LEap has only the first feature. Really no excuse for it at all.

Also interestingly when Breeze was first introduced, the cards were given out for free.

LivelineDipso

The system was built as one of the requirements for the city to host the 98 Olympics.

It probably never would of been built otherwise.

bk

LivelineDipso wrote: »

The system was built as one of the requirements for the city to host the 98 Olympics.

It probably never would of been built otherwise.

Good point but it doesn't explain how they make transfers work so well and also how they were able to do their leap card equivalent so early, quickly and well.

markpb

bk wrote: »

Good point but it doesn't explain how they make transfers work so well and also how they were able to do their leap card equivalent so early, quickly and well.

I suspect that MARTA own and operate the buses and trains in Atlanta. I suspect they already had an integrated ticket system based on whatever preceded Breeze. Both of those things make rolling out a system like that easy.

In Dublin, the system operates as a clearing house for completely independent transit companies with a mix of standalone and semi-integrated tickets. The project has to integrate companies who don't want to be integrated and don't want to loose any money by introducing transfers and other nice things like that.

Basically, it all boils down to political leadership. There isn't any in Dublin.

Edit: A lot of American cities have public transport that is vastly better run than ours, Atlanta is no exception.

CIE

bk wrote: »

I always like to try public transport while abroad and compare it to here. Last week I was in Atlanta Georgia and got to try out their public transport.

For one of the most spread out and car reliant cities in the US, with some roads I counted 20 lanes!! I was shocked at how good their public transport was.

Their public transport agency is called MARTA and it covers both buses and rail.

Their rail service consists of an electrified system similar to DART:

• Two core lines (north-south, east-west) which intersect and integrate at the heart of the city. There are also two branch lines.
• Underground stations in the city center. Much better network than DART.
• The Trains seemed much faster then DART, with less frequent stops.
• Runs every 15 minutes peak, every 20 minutes off peak including weekends, better than DART.
• Runs from 4:45am to 1am, again much better than DART.
• You can take your bike on the train at any time and buses also have racks up front.
• Train stations outside the central city area are massive, with free multi-storey car parks, taxi bays and most importantly bus station.
• The buses seem to operate from each MARTA station, serving the local areas from the MARTA station.
• Fully integrated ticketing, a ticket for the train can then be used on the bus.
• RTPI for train and bus fully integrated into Google Transit.
• Contact-less card like Leap called Breeze.
• You can only board the train using their Breeze card, if you don't already have one, you can buy one from a machine for just $1, it is a proper plastic card like leap and can be loaded with future purchases.
• The Breeze card can store a variety of different ticket types, including e-purse (like leap), single and return fares, daily, weekly, monthly, etc. fares.
• The Breeze card supports automated and online top-up.
• The online top-up even works on buses!!

The only problem I saw was it seems not many people really use it, even at peak times it was busy but not mad crowded like DART.

So in other words, even in a car dependent city in the US, they still have a vastly better public transport system then we have!!

There isn't much we can currently do about building new lines, but we certainly can do better with the resources we currently have.

• True integrated ticketing, usable on bus, Luas, DART.
• RTPI on Google Maps
• Buses better integrated with Luas and DART stations.
• Increased frequency and increased hours of operation.
• LEAP card gets daily, weekly, etc. tickets and replaces all other ticket types.

One interesting concept I think we should look at is to drop the price of the leap card to €1 and make the only way to pay for Luas and DART be leap.

MARTA's railway system is separated from the general railway network, unlike DART. The Atlanta area therefore does not have longer-distance commuter trains mixed in with the MARTA system, and the two commuter services that are planned (Atlanta to Athens, Atlanta to Lovejoy/Macon) would operate on the general railway network as owned by CSX and Norfolk Southern Railways. (Amtrak stops way out of town, at the Peachtree-Brookwood station, which was originally an outer suburb; there are some plans in the works to bring Amtrak and the new commuter trains into a new station downtown, since the old Atlanta Terminal Station and Union Station were both shut down and torn down in 1972.)

MARTA's rail system is very similar to the ones in Washington DC and San Francisco (so it's more like BART than DART); electrified with third rail, three doors per side on the cars, and automatic train operation with human backup (i.e. computer operation). And it serves Atlanta's airport (the station at Hartsfield-Jackson Airport opened in 1988). Systems like this come at a far higher capital cost than stuff like DART, which was merely the electrification of pre-existing suburban rail; albeit I do agree that adding stations to DART to slow it down was a mistake (before electrification, stations such as Sandymount, Salthill, Fairview etc. did not exist). I also agree about dropping the fares.

LivelineDipso wrote: »

The system was built as one of the requirements for the city to host the 98 96 Olympics

What system would that be? The core of MARTA's rail system opened between 1979 and 1981. By 1996, MARTA was doing mid-life overhauls of its original railway rolling stock.

bk

markpb wrote: »

In Dublin, the system operates as a clearing house for completely independent transit companies with a mix of standalone and semi-integrated tickets.

Independent, really??

I'm getting really tired of this excuse.

DB, BE and IR are all owned by CIE which is a bloody semi state!!

Luas is owned by the NTA also a government agency.

There really is no excuse for proper integrated ticketing and integrated services not to exist.

markpb

bk wrote: »

Independent, really??

I'm getting really tired of this excuse.

DB, BE and IR are all owned by CIE which is a bloody semi state!!

Luas is owned by the NTA also a government agency.

There really is no excuse for proper integrated ticketing and integrated services not to exist.

I'm not defending it or excusing it - just explaining why it's taken so long. Like it or not, they all act as independent companies with their own executive officers and boards. They do share a common shareholder but not one who seems to want or be able to wield any power.

Dravokivich

bk wrote: »

DB, BE and IR are all owned by CIE which is a bloody semi state!!

Luas is owned by the NTA also a government agency.

And they all work separately. With their own separate boards of directors operating each of those companies, independently.

It's that reason a lot of stuff gets held up. From what I've seen posted or put out, Luas were the only crowd to fully accept and take on the Leap card. DB and IR seem to find something to throw a spanner in the works. But with that, NTA don't seem to be very visible on the progress regarding the development of it either.

The main thing that needs to be pressed with Leap Card which is going to be hard to put in because of this, is how fares carry between the different companies. This is what you've seen in Atlanta between the different modes, but all the transport those tickets are valid for (Bus/Rail), are under the 1 umbrella company. Here, that umbrella is no more than a quango. I've seen a similar set up in Chicago, great value tickets, works periodically, easy to get and included transfers for bus/rail. Only thing is, all the bus/rail transport was provided and operated by the Chicago Transport Authority. Neither is the case here.

dowlingm

Public transport plans in ATL had a bit of a knock back this year:
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/legislators-move-plan-b-after-tsplost-defeat/nP8cH/
http://www.atlantamagazine.com/features/story.aspx?ID=1742459