She moves in with me - what is the fairest arrangement?

LegacyUser

My girlfriend of two years and I have decided to live together. She is moving into the 3 bed apartment that I own. I also rent out the other two rooms. The income from that rent just falls short of paying the mortgage. In January, I would like to not rent one of the rooms (he is moving out) anymore to create more space in the apartment but am not currently in a position to take on the burden of the loss of income from his room.

My question is: what do you think is the fairest contribution that my girlfriend can make? Should she just pay rent? She has suggested that she pay 50% of what that renter is paying and that it goes into an account which can only be used for apartment maintenance (buying house stuff basically).

LegacyUser

Honestly OP I can't see this working. If she moves in with you while you are renting out a room to another person then you are just flatmates, you won't be able to live as a couple because you'll have the other tenant to consider. And I wonder have you discussed your gf moving in with the other tenant who's staying? because honestly I doubt many people would be happy to share with a couple, just be wary of this as you may find yourself with zero tenants if she does move in and finding new one(s) may be tricky as they will have to "share with a couple" which isn't exactly desirable for most renters these days.

To answer your question though I think your gf is *almost* right that what you've outlined is the fairest way. Like i said as you are not "living together" in the true sense and she has to "share a room" with you as it were, then realistically she should only have to pay half of what the other tenant is paying. But I disagree on you using her rent money to only buy "house stuff". It is rent money because she is renting and she needs to understand that. Does your other tenant chip in for cleaning products and the like? If so then it's only fair your gf would do the same on top of the rent she should pay.

I worry however your gf may mean "house stuff" as redecorating her/your new house, making it a 'home', if this is indeed the case i caution that it is unlikely to end well. You gf needs to realise that she is essentially in a house share situation and needs to contribute financially in the same way as your other tenant(s), and I would be making this quite clear to her if I were you before she moves in or it's just a recipe for disaster imho.

Penny Dreadful

Jbytcygvhb wrote: »

My girlfriend of two years and I have decided to live together. She is moving into the 3 bed apartment that I own. I also rent out the other two rooms. The income from that rent just falls short of paying the mortgage. In January, I would like to not rent one of the rooms (he is moving out) anymore to create more space in the apartment but am not currently in a position to take on the burden of the loss of income from his room.

My question is: what do you think is the fairest contribution that my girlfriend can make? Should she just pay rent? She has suggested that she pay 50% of what that renter is paying and that it goes into an account which can only be used for apartment maintenance (buying house stuff basically).

I think she should pay whatever the other guy was paying. This money, when it is transferred to your account, should also be labelled "Rent". It will keep things clear and simple for both of you.
The bills should also be split in three. This is only fair to the person who is renting out your spare room. They are currently living with a 3 way split and so it would be unfair to change the living arrangements to a 3 person household with only a 2 way split on the bills.

Your girlfriend is already paying rent to live somewhere I'm sure whether it is at her parent's house or her own place and so she should be well used to the cost of living.
The bills in terms of food will go down for both of you as you'll be sharing the cost of groceries and cooking will be split too I imagine.

Nody

Only so I get this straight; you're asking your gf to cover the loan repayments for you (i.e. the rent you're currently getting)? So she'll pay off your loan, you get your gf close by, you have one less stranger in the house AND you get to keep the house at the end of it all? Sorry but that does not sound very fair split to me as you get all the benefits and she get all the costs.

Yes, I'd expect her to chip in as she's doing today but she got a fair point in that it would go towards your common costs rather then down your pocket; after all she does not HAVE to move in and the spare room is not where she's going to sleep after all.

Merkin

Does the remaining tenant know that she's moving in? If not you need to tell them in order to give them ample time to find somewhere else should they choose not to be sharing with a couple (which most people would prefer not to).

Lorna123

I don't think you should be left short OP. I think that your g/f should be paying full rent if you decide not to rent out the other room and paying the same as everyone else in that apartment. Afterall you are doing this to benefit her as well as yourself and giving her more space as well as yourself. Explain to her that you cannot afford for her to just give you half the rent. Even if she wants to occupy that other room let her, there could be times when she might be glad to sleep in her own room. You will still be living in the same apartment as one another anyway and still have the convenience of living under the one roof, but I would definitely put it to her that she has to pay the same as everyone else, that's the only way this can work out. Otherwise you will be strapped for cash, with no money to take her out and that will pose further problems. Best of luck with it.

LegacyUser

Nody wrote: »

Only so I get this straight; you're asking your gf to cover the loan repayments for you (i.e. the rent you're currently getting)? So she'll pay off your loan, you get your gf close by, you have one less stranger in the house AND you get to keep the house at the end of it all? Sorry but that does not sound very fair split to me as you get all the benefits and she get all the costs.

Yes, I'd expect her to chip in as she's doing today but she got a fair point in that it would go towards your common costs rather then down your pocket; after all she does not HAVE to move in and the spare room is not where she's going to sleep after all.

So she should what live there rent free? What cost is she paying other then 50% of the rent the OP was charging his lodgers. Seems a pretty fair deal to me. If they were moving into a rented place together they'd each be paying their share of the rent. The reality is with a couple now living there it will be much harder for the OP to rent the other room if he needed to and a danger the remaining tenant will move out as well. Very few people like sharing with couples and as the OP owns the house it's a rent a room scheme meaning the lodgers can move out with zero notice.

The GF should pay her fair share of rent and it should be marked as rent not as random expenses or the what not. I assume the OP has kept the largest room in the flat for himself so he should work out what he would rent that room out for not what the rent is on the other rooms [unless he does charge just a flat rate regardless of room size or all the rooms are the same size] and the GF should pay 50% of that or if she's using the other room as hers then she should pay the full rate of rent for that room and as others mentioned it should be written down as rent. It's better for both of them if that is clear now in case there is an issue and the GF moves out and needs to prove she's been renting for rent allowance or similar.

MissFlitworth

I also rent out the other two rooms. The income from that rent just falls short of paying the mortgage.

Are you saying that currently the two rooms you rent out almost cover the mortgage payment and that you just top it up by a small amount yourself? So that if your girlfriend moved in she would cover nearly half your mortgage payment in rent while you continued to top up the rent you receive by the same amount to to cover the mortgage?

If it's going to work out that your girlfriend pays more in rent than you contribute towards the mortgage then I wouldn't be interested in doing that either if I was in her shoes. It's awkward when you move in with a partner who owns their own place and the rent you're paying is contributing towards their mortgage, it can feel very unfair if it feels like you're basically working towards someone else owning a home. If she is going to be paying rent then it shouldn't be more than you pay towards the mortgage yourself and I think the fact that she's paying rent to share a room with you should be taken into consideration when you're working out who pays what.

strandroad

It would essentially put you in the position of being your girlfriend's landlord, which is really weird dynamics in a relationship. Every couple I knew in such position got around it by doing something like "I provide the roof over our heads, you provide everything car/food related". It may be the same money but it's a much better feeling.

Distorted

If she's sharing a room with you, rather than having her own room, she should pay half of the rent for a rented room in your house. The cost of your mortgage is irrelevant - tenants do not undertake to pay off your mortgage, and neither do girlfriends. Oh, and give her a tenancy agreement if she is paying rent in a shared house - do things properly.

Anthony O Brien

It is up to both of you to decide whats fair
Before you commit to it thing about it carefully
Its not like you and your girlfriend are living separately and are moving into a new place together, she is moving into your place that you took the risk buying and have been paying for all along

My opinion is that if the second tenant was not moving out she should pay for half of the rental price of one room in the house. As you are not going to let out the second room to make more space which both of you will have the benefit of I think she should pay the rental price of one room
And this amount is rent, give her a lease, what you do with that money is entirely up to you. "buying house stuff basically" is utter nonsense. Why should she reap the benefits from a move you made in the past to purchase the property? If the rent from the tenant who is staying only covers one fifth of the mortgage and you have to come with four fifths, would she be so quick to come up with half of what you have to pay? Would she be so quick to move in at all?

I would sit down with her and explain how you feel about it, how you think you shouldn't have to pay for what will now be more than half of the cost of the mortgage because she is moving in, if you cannot agree to a compromise what I would say is that it wouldn't be a good idea to have her as your tenant, suggest that the two of you should rent a place of your own, you then rent out the three rooms in your own house, which will probably leave you in the same position as you are in now financially. It would be interesting to see her reaction to this suggestion and how quick she would want to move in with you then because to be honest she sounds very selfish to me, she wants to pay very little to live in your place and then she wants to benefit from the money that she pays by using it to buy house stuff

jimmycrackcorm

If she is renting already then why doesn't she simply pay the same under your roof? Effectively she replaces your tenant moving out even if she shares your room instead.

dearg lady

so if currently the rent makes up most of the mortgage, and you put towards it only a small amount, i would see the split the difference between the two of ye. For example, if the mortgage is 1,000, and each tenant currently pays 450 each, then when one moves out, there will be 550 to pay, you and your girlfriend split that, paying 275 each, and then split bills 3 ways, as normal in a houseshare. That way you both have the same costs and there can be no awkwardness.

I would reiterate what others have said about checking with your remaining tenant, living with a couple could be very offputting.

LegacyUser

Distorted wrote: »

If she's sharing a room with you, rather than having her own room, she should pay half of the rent for a rented room in your house. The cost of your mortgage is irrelevant - tenants do not undertake to pay off your mortgage, and neither do girlfriends. Oh, and give her a tenancy agreement if she is paying rent in a shared house - do things properly.

As the OP owns the house and will be living there as well she would fall under the rent a room scheme and be a lodger not a tenant so wouldn't be covered by any tenancy laws. She should be aware that she would have few legal rights moving into the house.

OP go to the accommodation forum there's a sticky about dividing up house shares rent wise that might be helpful.

username123

Id advise you to speak to a solicitor.

Is she moving in as a tenant or as a cohabitation partner?

If she is moving into your room then its cohabitation and in the event of a break up, under the Civil Partnership and Certain Rights and Obligations of Cohabitants Act 2010 she will have a strong legal claim to part ownership of the property if she is paying money towards the mortgage or paying bills instead of mortgage monies. Here.

However, if your relationship breaks down and your name is not on the title deeds to the house, you may still be able to show that you have some ownership rights in relation to the house. These rights are based on the fact that you made a contribution to the purchase price of the house with the intention of gaining a share in the ownership of the house.

Contributions to the purchase price of the house can be direct or indirect. Direct contributions include contributions to the initial down payment for the house or contributions to the mortgage installments. Indirect contributions may include paying some of the other day-to-day household expenses or unpaid work in the legal owner of the house's business.

Ive bolded the bits of interest to you.

On the subject of fairness of what she pays - again, speak to a solicitor, but, if I were asked to move in with a bf, I would assume this was a step of commitment, that we were forming a 'family home' together, and as such, I would expect the financial side of things to be equal. So I would expect the guy take his mortgage repayment, subtract the rent from the guy there and split the left over in half. In other words, both of us would benefit from the other renter, not just the guy. Plus all household bills should be split in three.

You are not running a business where you benefit to the cost of your gf, and a relationship should not be viewed that way. You could also find a spectacular backfire if you had her making a larger contribution to the mortgage than you due to the relatively new Act mentioned above as the rules of it stipulate

For example, if you have shown that you paid off half of a mortgage that represented 90% of the purchase price, you would be entitled to 45% of the ownership of the property.

Anyway, as with all major financial decisions, speak to a solicitor to cover the legal angle of things prior to making a bad decision.

A lot of the detail in the Civil Partnership and Certain Rights and Obligations of Cohabitants Act 2010 has not yet been tested in the courts due to the newness of the Act so best to take legal advice as to the potential consequences of any moves you make.

dannyc31

this is my i never understood single people buying places alone, property boom or no property boom. unless you were planning on staying single forever this was always gonna be a mine field if you eventually met someone. i know lots of couples in this situation, even worse actually because in some cases both members of the couple bought apartments. now they are both trying to service the mortgage on each others apartments, have them rented out and are now living in another house that they are renting together since its bigger and they would like to start a family but because of the 2 mortgages on the apartments they have'nt of hope of getting another mortgage on a house from the banks.

i just hope people realize this and dont start buying apartments alone unless as i said you are planning on staying alone for good.

OP i think the arrangement your gf has suggested is the best option for a bad situation otherwise you really have to look at all the legal ins and outs. what a terrible thing to be having to do in an early relationship, sitting down in front of a solicitor

LegacyUser

I would hold off moving in with your girlfriend till Jan/Feb and meanwhile I would look at renting out the whole of your present apt.
You would be far better off rent an apt with your girlfriend where you both pay the same amount of rent each month.
If your girlfriend moves into your apt and you brake up she could be in a position to make a claim on your apt.
I know a girl who brought a house before the boom. Her boyfriend moved in and when they broke up he suddenly helped her buy this house. He wanted her to sell the house so he could get this money back. She was lucky that her parents could pay him off so she could keep her house.
Also if you have a tenant/tenants they may not like sharing with a couple. Your present tenant could leave and you could end up paying out a lot more each month for whole apt rather than what you are paying at the moment.
You also have to consider that you may get to have to much time on your own if you have a tenant in your apt.

Big Bag of Chips

What are your long term plans? I know it's impossible to know where you are going to end up down the road, but as your gf is moving in, I assume you both see this as a pretty big step in your relationship, and the commitment it shows to each other....

So...

What do you plan to do with your apartment.. longterm?

Are you going to put her name on the deeds eventually? Is she going to make contributions to the mortgage with the view of jointly owning the property with you? (Any money she puts into the apartment, can be argued, is a contribution) Are you hoping to keep it long term or sell it?

As username123 rightly asks.. is she moving in as your partner, or your tenant? Do you expect that she will have any right to your apartment, long term?

Lorna123

Gosh, I think now that Username is right, a solicitor is in order here. I never thought about the implications of g/f making any claim on your apartment further down the line, but you need to take every precaution. Thankfully you have been forewarned on this. Best option is what another poster said above fab lady, rent a separate apartment between you and rent out the 3 rooms in your apartment. Better to be safe than sorry.

2rkehij30qtza5

Be careful. If she starts doing improvements to your home like even cutting the grass, putting up a shelf here or there, buying curtains etc. she can well claim an equitable interest in the house!!!
To cover all of this perhaps you should have like a lease agreement in place (as unromantic as that sounds!!). And she should deffo pay her share of the rent. If yee are sharing a room then 50% of a room rent would be fair as long as there is someone else there too. If not, then 50% of what it'd cost if the two of you were to rent by yourselves!

seamie87

Penny Dreadful wrote: »

I think she should pay whatever the other guy was paying. This money, when it is transferred to your account, should also be labelled "Rent". It will keep things clear and simple for both of you.

It's never that simple.

The best thing would be to let out all three rooms and rend a one bed appartment.

That way there can be no suggestion of her having "contributed" if things go sour, plus you'll have more privacy.

Sleepy

If renting 2 of the rooms covers most of the mortgage, renting out all 3 should more than cover it.

Moving a girlfriend into an apartment you're renting rooms in is likely to drive out your lodgers and leaves you open to her making a claim on it should things go pear-shaped.

jemmyboy

Nody wrote: »

Only so I get this straight; you're asking your gf to cover the loan repayments for you (i.e. the rent you're currently getting)? So she'll pay off your loan, you get your gf close by, you have one less stranger in the house AND you get to keep the house at the end of it all? Sorry but that does not sound very fair split to me as you get all the benefits and she get all the costs.

Yes, I'd expect her to chip in as she's doing today but she got a fair point in that it would go towards your common costs rather then down your pocket; after all she does not HAVE to move in and the spare room is not where she's going to sleep after all.

Shock horror!!! Asking her to cover her portion of the rent........it's really not such a terrible thing is it!!!

Riskymove

jemmyboy wrote: »

Shock horror!!! Asking her to cover her portion of the rent........it's really not such a terrible thing is it!!!

indeed

OP, if she is moving in with you, as oppossed to getting her own room, should you not just split whatever you are currently paying yourself between the two of you?

i.e. split €X where x= mortgage less the rent you get from the others?

Idle Passerby

Get rid of all tenants and split the cost of the mortgage between yourself and your girlfriend. There isn't much in it for her to move into a shared house and not even have a room to herself.

ash23

Look at the price of a double room for similar places in the area and split it. If you're charging her rent then it should be the same as what she is paying if you and her moved into a double room in a similar place. She shouldn't have to contribute more simply because you own it.

However, that rent money is yours to do as you see fit. She can buy throws and pictures to her hearts content to make the place homely, but she shouldn't be doing any work on the apartment, That is your job as the landlord. Bills split 3 ways and all is above board.

woodchuck

ash23 wrote: »

Look at the price of a double room for similar places in the area and split it. If you're charging her rent then it should be the same as what she is paying if you and her moved into a double room in a similar place. She shouldn't have to contribute more simply because you own it.

However, that rent money is yours to do as you see fit. She can buy throws and pictures to her hearts content to make the place homely, but she shouldn't be doing any work on the apartment, That is your job as the landlord. Bills split 3 ways and all is above board.

This is basically what I did when I moved in with the OH. He owns his apartment and I moved in, but there are no other tenants living there. I pay him 'rent' based on the average rent in the area. Bills and shopping are split down the middle.

It's working out ok for the moment!

I don't want to go too off topic, but I'd like to address the other side of the coin for a minute since people are talking about going to solicitors etc. YES you should protect yourself. BUT at the same time look at it from her point of view... she'll be paying rent for god knows how long because you made a decision to buy an apartment before you met her. This is money down the drain if she was planning to buy her own place (or with a partner). Personally I think if there is a breakdown in the relationship and one partner is after paying years and years worth of rent that could have otherwise been used as a deposit, then I think they deserve a legal share in the property. (I know they may have used this money for rent even if they were single, but they'd be in a much more flexible position if they decided to rent somewhere cheaper or move home to save etc). There's also the added fact that she doesn't get a say in where she lives... she's automatically tied down to one location that may or may not suit her. I'm not sure what I'm getting at really... just try to view it from both sides if you're going down a legal route is all. You're not the only one who has something to lose in this and sacrifices and compromises will need to be made on both sides. As already stated things are that much more complicated when one partner owns the property they're both living in... thread carefully with what you do and say as you try to sort this out (there's a reason money is such a major reason for people breaking up)

username123

woodchuck wrote: »

just try to view it from both sides if you're going down a legal route is all.

I would also advise the lady moving in to seek legal advice. It would make sense if the couple went to the same solicitor and got the low down on the legals and how both of them are affected in the event of a break up. They may be able to come to agreement today and draw it up legally - saving potential problems later on. But its the Civil Partnership and Certain Rights and Obligations of Cohabitants Act 2010 that would worry me, because no agreement drawn up can override current legislation so even if the lady in question agrees on no legal right share to the property, she may still have an entitlement in law. Thats what they need clarified by a solicitor.

Honestly, moving someone you are not married to into your own property is a legal minefield and it might make better sense to rent out that property in its entirety and rent somewhere else between the two of you.

woodchuck

username123 wrote: »

Honestly, moving someone you are not married to into your own property is a legal minefield and it might make better sense to rent out that property in its entirety and rent somewhere else between the two of you.

To be honest this is something worth considering. This isn't really possible with myself and the OH as he's unlikely to make back his monthly mortgage in rent so it would just be money down the drain on top of renting elsewhere. With a 3 bed though you might be able to turn a profit and the two of you could find somewhere else to yourselves.

I suspect you may be reluctant to do this though... I know the security of living in your own place vs renting isn't much competition (could be turfed out who knows when and can't put so much as a nail in the wall). But consider all possibilities. In particular I don't think the houseshare situation will work for your relationship in the long term... at some stage it will have to be just the two of you. Can you both afford to live there without another tenant contributing?

username123

woodchuck wrote: »

To be honest this is something worth considering.

10 years ago I may have made that suggestion as rent out or sell his property - but I have omitted the notion of selling it due to current market.