Brake pedal click?

Ronnie Beck

After some heavy braking into a sharp corner yesterday, the brake pedal has started to click just before it returns to the top. It never done this before. It happens now under any reasonably heavy braking. It doesn't happen at all if i'm not moving no matter how hard I press the pedal.

I pulled off a wheel for a look. There is a bit of a lip on the discs, but i'm not sure if the pads are worn or not. The brake pad wear indicator is on all the time. Pics below of front caliper. The pads rub off the disc all the time. I can still rotate the disc by hand. There isn't much resistance.




I was thinking of changing pads,discs and fluid this winter anyway. Is this clicking a sign of something else? Don't wont to crack open the piggy bank on the wrong parts. It's a MkIV transporter.

Thanks lads.

jayok

Not too sure what you mean by "click". Could it be something simply like a brake light switch... can you describe this click in more detail?

sheehan12

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Ronnie Beck

Under heavy braking 55mph - 20mph approaching a roundabout say, when I release the pedal it gets stuck for a second, just before it fully released, then pops up all the way. It's strange. At first I thought the edge of my runner was catching on the accel. pedal or the rubber on the brake pedal was catching on something. There's a **** load off clearance between the pedals though. You could drive with snow shoes on. Very odd. Brakes felt more spongy than usual. That could have been in my head though.

Ronnie Beck

sheehan12 wrote: »

is it just me or do disc look cracked

Where abouts?

SilverBell

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

Under heavy braking 55mph - 20mph approaching a roundabout say, when I release the pedal it gets stuck for a second, just before it fully released, then pops up all the way. It's strange. At first I thought the edge of my runner was catching on the accel. pedal or the rubber on the brake pedal was catching on something. There's a **** load off clearance between the pedals though. You could drive with snow shoes on. Very odd. Brakes felt more spongy than usual. That could have been in my head though.

So is it that the car continues to brake after your foot is off the pedal?

Or that the pedal stays down, and then returns a while after you lift your foot?

If its the second, I'd have a look into the pedal box, all linkages, pivots and the rod to the master cylinder.

Ronnie Beck

SilverBell wrote: »

So is it that the car continues to brake after your foot is off the pedal?

Or that the pedal stays down, and then returns a while after you lift your foot?

If its the second, I'd have a look into the pedal box, all linkages, pivots and the rod to the master cylinder.

The pedal returns as normal, but catches about an inch before the top, for a second, then pops up all the way. It may still be braking slightly at this catching point but it's unnoticable.

sheehan12

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

Where abouts?

it a shadow taught it look cracked

SilverBell

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

The pedal returns as normal, but catches about an inch before the top, for a second, then pops up all the way. It may still be braking slightly at this catching point but it's unnoticable.

Have a good look at the linkage first. Get the head down there, and see if there is anything catching the pedal, or its linkage, bit by bit.

Ronnie Beck

Stuck the head in. The problem is nothing is catching now. It's only under heavy braking. There is big return spring on the top of the pedal. It's sitting on a shaft. No problems there it seems. The light switch is too weak to cause this.

There is a bit of play when you first press the pedal followed by a bit of lumpyness and then what feels like actual braking.There is just a rod coming off the top of the pedal arm sticking into a diaphragm as usual. Feels like the problems in there somewhere inside the servo. ****. What to do?

SilverBell

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

Stuck the head in. The problem is nothing is catching now. It's only under heavy braking. There is big return spring on the top of the pedal. It's sitting on a shaft. No problems there it seems. The light switch is too weak to cause this.

There is a bit of play when you first press the pedal followed by a bit of lumpyness and then what feels like actual braking.There is just a rod coming off the top of the pedal arm sticking into a diaphragm as usual. Feels like the problems in there somewhere inside the servo. ****. What to do?

Try to replicate the situation, get Fat Freddy or some GAA player to put his size 12s on the pedal, while you look again!

yes, you could be right, there maybe a problem inside the servo or somewhere else. But this would eliminate a cracked pedal box, or something distorting under heavy braking. Cracked bulkhead?

I'm thinking you should be able to reproduce the problem while the van is stationary.

Ronnie Beck

SilverBell wrote: »

Try to replicate the situation, get Fat Freddy or some GAA player to put his size 12s on the pedal, while you look again!

yes, you could be right, there maybe a problem inside the servo or somewhere else. But this would eliminate a cracked pedal box, or something distorting under heavy braking. Cracked bulkhead?

I'm thinking you should be able to reproduce the problem while the van is stationary.

I can't that's what odd and led me to check the discs. I got home last night and stood up on the pedal a few times and all was normal. I thought it might have something to do with brakes binding or something.

SilverBell

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

I can't that's what odd and led me to check the discs. I got home last night and stood up on the pedal a few times and all was normal. I thought it might have something to do with brakes binding or something.

OK i see, not sure now what it could be. Running out of ideas. Hmm, the servo is probably operative when the engine is on or when you are braking on the road,

Switch the engine on and see does that make any difference when parked and looking/pressing again?

I thinks even if the brakes stick at the pad/disc, the master cylinder should still return as normal.

Sorry, dont mean to be giving u a bum steer, just voicing some ideas that I would be trying first. Might be time to get the yoke looked at by a pro, or another experienced head here maybe?

Ronnie Beck

Thanks silverbell. You've helped me narrow it down somewhat.

Switch the engine on and see does that make any difference when parked and looking/pressing again?

It does ye. It's a vaccuum powered.It is as hard as a rock with the engine off. I tried it last night when I got home, parked up with the engine running. Still wasn't catching. It only happened when breaking hard from high speed at roundabouts or sharp bends on main roads.

There is no play in the pivot pin, bulkhead, bush etc. It all appears 100% drivers side of the bulkhead.

Here what I'm dealing with: http://elsaweb.spaghetticoder.org/doc/N.en-GB.70-B-B1/607150/2#QwI8cbret

Would the non- return valve be causing this problem?

It feels like a vacuum type pop when it releases. Sort off like pulling a suction cup off glass if that makes sense.

Xenophile

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

After some heavy braking into a sharp corner yesterday, the brake pedal has started to click just before it returns to the top. It never done this before. It happens now under any reasonably heavy braking. It doesn't happen at all if i'm not moving no matter how hard I press the pedal.

I pulled off a wheel for a look. There is a bit of a lip on the discs, but i'm not sure if the pads are worn or not. The brake pad wear indicator is on all the time. Pics below of front caliper. The pads rub off the disc all the time. I can still rotate the disc by hand. There isn't much resistance.




I was thinking of changing pads,discs and fluid this winter anyway. Is this clicking a sign of something else? Don't wont to crack open the piggy bank on the wrong parts. It's a MkIV transporter.

Thanks lads.

This all sounds very unprofessional to me. Go ahead with your initial idea and change pads,discs and brake fluid. Be sure to check that you have the correct spec brake fluid. I can recommend Mintex Brake pads and other O.E (original equipment parts available from your local Motor Factor}.

jlacey

motor factor are brill

Ronnie Beck

The sticking pedal hasn't been too bad since but it did happen every so often. Changed front pads and discs today. When I was winding back the nearside piston the fluid coming out was heavily contaminated very off colour in patches and full of tiny bubbles. About 6/7 mm thick when I changed them and no thinner than this pic from october.



The fluid from the offside piston was clean, no bubbles at all. Here are the offside pads and the new ones. They were only 2mm thick:eek:. Right on the wear limit.



Going to bleed all the corners in the morning. I'm guessing the offside piston was doing most of the braking and so the pads were more worn. There was a slight nick in the seal on the piston. Maybe this was the source of the contamination. No sign of a leak from it or anything. I'll keep an eye on it.

Wheelnut

Ronnie, you've fixed something that needed doing but you have not fixed the clicking problem. That click is from the pedal, otherwise how would you hear it? I have had this problem a few times but always from Japanese cars, I can see your's is a VW.

The spring on the clutch pedal is an unusual design. When the pedal is up it pushes the pedal upwards, but when you press the pedal, about half way down the spring flips over and helps you push it down. Sometimes it gets a bit "notchy" at the flip-over point and gives the symptoms you describe. You also get the sensation of the pedal slapping the sole of your foot just after you release it.

You could take out the pedal box and grease everything, or you could try spraying a few shots of WD40 up there. Either might cure the problem or maybe not. Anyway, it's harmless and might even go away of its own accord.

Ronnie Beck

That makes sense. Pedal isn't travelling near as far now so hopefully that will be the end of it.