on course bookmaker

sysco

Hello,
I am just wondering if anyone has any advise on/experience of how to become an on course bookmaker i.e. costs associated with the setup and how much a licence would cost for tracks such as Ballinrobe, Roscommon or Gowran. Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks

SRFC

Turnover is falling constantly,no money in it biggest bets them boys take on them small dog tracks meeting is about 500 quid rest are made up of 10 bob bets,its a dog eat dog business aswell very easily get cleaned out sorry for the negativity if you go ahead with it good luck you'll need it.

chipsdave

Dont EVEN dream of it ! As poster above says dog eat dog , you'll be put down the end of the line and the big bookies will have their runners skimming prices off you , by the time you'll have travel to races ,exs etc paid , you'd be 10 times better off sitting at home on Betfair .Know of 1 particular Bookie as tight as you could find ,he'd bring sandwiches with him to the races ,didnt drink 'nor smoke and he was blown out of the water , pitches arent worth a pinch of piss now either , sorry for negativity also ,but its the truth !!

Howjoe1

I'd go along with the rest of the advice. It would become a loss making headache from day one. The days of the builders blowing €50s on every race are gone. The only big punters left are the shrewdies

The money to be made is in the online business and more so the bingo & casino games that the big players are pushing more and more.

Colonel Sanders

Unless you've a major bankroll you're better off playing on the exchanges IMO

A guy I knew from college bet on course for a while (about 8 or 9 years ago). Expenses killed him & this was before the exchanges took over

I don't know any of the on course book makers but you often over hear them chatting to each other on course. The word "dead" is the most often used adjective you hear them use to describe the ring

Hulk Hands

The industry is going to die. Every second person has a smart phone now and people are going to cotten on that you can get much better value just by opening up your betfair app on course etc. I know they're only trying to make a living the value on course is generally terrible. They can keep their e/w 1/6 odds

sysco

Thanks for all the responses. Obviously the money being made by most on course bookmakers is declining year on year but does anyone have any opinion on a summer racecourse such as Ballinrobe where there would be alot more punters just "out for the day" rather than shrewd gamblers. What would be a ballpark figure for a licence at a racecourse such as Ballinrobe?

maalummoja

IMO no value for money betting on course. I usually bet with PP before racing and if I fancy a bet on track stick it on the TOTE.
E/W fractions and not guaranted prices keep me away from them

finbarrk

sysco wrote: »

Thanks for all the responses. Obviously the money being made by most on course bookmakers is declining year on year but does anyone have any opinion on a summer racecourse such as Ballinrobe where there would be alot more punters just "out for the day" rather than shrewd gamblers. What would be a ballpark figure for a licence at a racecourse such as Ballinrobe?

You wouldn't have any problem getting a pitch anywhere nowadays. I'd say you could rent a pitch in any country racecourse for €100 per day. The expenses will beat you though. You have to have a lighted board, and they are expensive.
A mate of mine who does it says he has €300 spent before he lays a bet. Entry, clerk, levys, money for the lad that brings the boxes, diesel, etc.
PM me and I can give you more details maybe. He might have a spare pitch in Ballinrobe!

meriwether

Does anyone think there will be negative implications from the death of the on-course betting ring, or is it simply the marketplace having its say?

nevis7

if you have to come onto a forum asking the question of how to become a bookmaker in ireland, you are a million before you start.

i am one, and have pitches at most tracks, those pitches were a valuable asset a few years ago, now many are worthless and costing me a packet to maintain.

number 1 problem for you will be the license application. if you are tax compliant and getting a positive garda vetting, then assuming the hri betting division will be offering you the chance to bookmake. if you accept the offer, you then fork out an annual licence fee, an annual insurance liability fee, and a bond. once upon a time the bond was not that hefty, thanks to dixie, the hri are using the bond as a stiff barrier to entry. only 2 newcomers have got licences in the last 6 months and both have had to deposit 15,000 euros as their bond. it remains with the hri for the duration of your bookmaking career, if you leave the game in a clean financial state, you then get it back. therefore the start up for the licence is 15,500 odd, all dead money.

then you need a boards and the trimmings, paddy meehan might do you a 2nd hand one for 4-5,000 and someone like the wacker would sell you the rest for 200-300 euros.

then you need a clerk, say 130 a day including food.

thats for starters.

the way the game is gone, it is relatively easy to get a bottom pitch at most tracks. for every track you sign up for you pay a registration fee to hri of 500 euro. if you buy for instance pitch 33 at listowel off joe bloggs for 2,000, you still pay the registration on top. once you are registered as a pitch holder at a track, you say the raceday fee for every meeting whether you turn up or not. off memory ballinrobe is 60 or 70 a meet. leopardstown 75, killarney nearly 100. so if you had a bad run and decided to stay at home for a month, your monthly hri tab keeps on rising unless you have someone repping for you at the fixture.

it is cheaper to start off in points as you could buy a package of pointing pitches and only have to pay around 300 euros registration, the advantage of point to points is that there is no fee for absenteeism.

for the record, i have a good pitch at ballinrobe, after exs i lost about 2,000 euros there this year having attended all meetings. these casual mugs you describe at this track do not exist. sligo, roscommon, kilbeggan, all losing tracks, bellewstown, tramore, thurles my main winning ones amongst the division circuits. galway, my exs were 5,000 euros, i won 12, but that included plenty of risk, as it is not as easy as one thinks to get certain beaten favourites into the book, unless you allow credit betting, the days of that are long gone. i won 2,000 on the monday night 2 year old maiden, only because i took a chunk out of the ballydoyle horse on that machine. there was no cash for it on track, in fact in terms of raw cash the winner of the race the one trained by weld, was an on track cash loser for me on the race.

if you want to try out as a bookmaker, perhaps have a look at getting a norhern licence, about 2,500 sterling, no bond required. easy enough get a pitch at the 2 tracks up there, and if you get the equipment then for maybe 10,000 you have a starting point.

finbarrk

All explained there. Not as easy as people would think.

Barneyc

Interesting then I bet a pitch at the dogs would be a total waste of time unless it was Sherborne or maybe Harold's cross

chipsdave

Barneyc wrote: »

Interesting then I bet a pitch at the dogs would be a total waste of time unless it was Sherborne or maybe Harold's cross

CORRECT , a total disaster , The likes of Cork in the old days and for a time in The new Stadium were flying it esp on the big nights , there were maybe 12-15 books , it died a death 5-10 years ago . I went to the Laurels Final a few years back there and could not believe my eyes when there were only 3 Bookies and about half dozen punters !! it was bizzare really , i would say The Tracks emphasis on Restaurant and Bar profits destroyed the thing , The punters are all indoors now having their punts on the Tote .