Current Junior Cert Programme Phased Out

JP Liz V1

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Minister for Education Ruairi Quinn has announced the phasing out of the current Junior Cert programme over the next three years.
It will be replaced by a school-based model of continuous assessment.
The new programme will see 40% of examination marks being based on course-work and 60% being based on a final written assessment.
Examination papers will be set by the State Examination Commission (SEC) but will be administered and corrected by teachers for the most part.
However, English, Irish and Maths examination papers will be corrected by the SEC for the first couple of years.
Schools will be allowed to develop short courses of their own that are particularly relevant to their students and local communities.
Mr Quinn said the SEC is to begin planning for its phased withdrawal from the Junior Cycle exams, saying there is a need to move beyond exams to a process of generating evidence of learning.
Speaking at the launch of the reform plans, Mr Quinn said too many students "switch off" in second year and never reconnect to learning.
He said the experience of third year students is dominated by exam preparation, where the focus narrows to the performance in the exam rather than the quality of learning.
Under the new plans, students can substitute two short courses for one full subject to allow for courses such as Chinese or Digital Media Literacy to be taken.
Schools will also be able to offer their own short courses in accordance with specifications provided by the National Council for Curriculum and Assessment.
Pupils currently in fifth class in primary school will be the first students not to sit the Junior Cert as we know it, as the new programme is due to begin in 2014.
Also from 2014, second year students will sit standardised tests in English reading and Maths, and Irish reading in Irish-medium schools. Standardised testing in Science will be included from 2016.
Today's announcement follows the publication of "Towards a Framework for Junior Cycle - Innovation and Identity" by the NCCA last November.
The Economic and Social Research Institute said the overhaul will lead to improved educational standards among students.
Speaking on RTÉ's Morning Ireland, the ESRI's Dr Emer Smyth said the variety of teaching methods and the new structures will result in teenagers engaging more with learning.
Research by the ESRI among Junior Cert pupils has found that the exam promotes an over-emphasis on exam preparation, rather than the active learning "that young people find engaging".
However, the Association of Secondary Teachers of Ireland said the manner of today's announcement, which it said is being made without consultation with the education partners, is profoundly disappointing.
ASTI said education reform is a serious matter and "not something which should be used for eliciting shock and awe and grabbing headlines".

Not sure if this is a good or bad idea tbh

Whatsernamex33

I think it's awful, probably more practical in this day and age, but to me, awful. More emphasis on numeracy and literacy, etc. Not a word on how Irish is being changed or updated, Science now compulsory, Chinese being taken up, everything being common level besides English, Irish and Maths...

Like I said, it's a lot more practical in this day and age, just I wouldn't have liked to take this new exam. In my opinion, the whole Junior and Leaving Cert. exams are really starting to wear down and become easier for 15 year olds, I think the whole education system in this country is getting worse.

Again, only my opinion...

Neewbie_noob

Whatsernamex33 wrote: »

I think it's awful, probably more practical in this day and age, but to me, awful. More emphasis on numeracy and literacy, etc. Not a word on how Irish is being changed or updated, Science now compulsory, Chinese being taken up, everything being common level besides English, Irish and Maths...

Like I said, it's a lot more practical in this day and age, just I wouldn't have liked to take this new exam. In my opinion, the whole Junior and Leaving Cert. exams are really starting to wear down and become easier for 15 year olds, I think the whole education system in this country is getting worse.

Again, only my opinion...

It's a good move. Memorising nonsense and regurgitating it in the exam is a pointless exercise. It should be more career and life orientated. This goes especially for the arts, especially English poetry.

The standard has be massively dumbed down. I even noticed a difference in standard from the time I did my LC 4 years ago until the exams the commission set today.

The Junior Cert and Leaving should be based heavily on applied numeracy (+1 for making science mandatory, it's about time). European languages should be mandatory too. Irish should be massively overhauled.

I believe the course should be drastically changed, it should only be the language that is taught. I find it far-fetched that I attended 8 years of primary school and 5 years of secondary and my French from 5 years of secondary is better !

Neewbie_noob

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056772324

Bazinga_N

As, a Junior Cert student, I feel like the department should be attempting to fix the flaws in our system rather than completing scrapping it! It makes no sense to me!

The whole point of the Junior Cert is to prepare us for our Leaving Cert. Making a new type of exam deletes this whole point!

+1 on making Science Mandatory! I will give them that! I also agree with the point made regarding the 'losing interest in learning during second year'. I agree with this, but I feel like they should make subjects more interesting and more project-based, or orals for languages.

How can someone like Ruairi Quinn just decide to change a system that's been around like 87 years or something :L (The Inter Cert started in 1925 right? This could be outrageously wrong.. Well it's at least been around since 92'!) Also AFAIK, he has a background in architecture rather than education! How is it possible for someone to completely run our country's education with no background in education? It seems to be all statistics and figures to him!

spurious

Bazinga_N wrote: »

The whole point of the Junior Cert is to prepare us for our Leaving Cert.

It's not though. The purpose is to give young people skills they will need as adults, nothing to do with exams.

I've said it before, but if they had introduced the 'new' (1992) Junior Cert. properly in the first place, we wouldn't need this, because every language subject, including English, would have an oral test, every subject would have a practical test or project component, all externally monitored and moderated. No chance for accusations of 'teachers correcting their own students', no pressure being applied to teachers from over-enthusiastic parents, everything transparent and fair.

This however, costs money, as someone has to spend time doing orals, travelling around schools checking project work etc.. The people who drew up the JC syllabi were educators, the people who decided they would do away with the assessment were bean counters, who only saw financial criteria.

The bean counters are still there, so I'm afraid this 'new' JC will either go the cheapskate route or the route of piling extra work on teachers - both ways are doomed to failure unfortunately.

Bazinga_N

spurious wrote: »

It's not though. The purpose is to give young people skills they will need as adults, nothing to do with exams.

I've said it before, but if they had introduced the 'new' (1992) Junior Cert. properly in the first place, we wouldn't need this, because every language subject, including English, would have an oral test, every subject would have a practical test or project component, all externally monitored and moderated. No chance for accusations of 'teachers correcting their own students', no pressure being applied to teachers from over-enthusiastic parents, everything transparent and fair.

This however, costs money, as someone has to spend time doing orals, travelling around schools checking project work etc.. The people who drew up the JC syllabi were educators, the people who decided they would do away with the assessment were bean counters, who only saw financial criteria.

The bean counters are still there, so I'm afraid this 'new' JC will either go the cheapskate route or the route of piling extra work on teachers - both ways are doomed to failure unfortunately.

Completley agree with what you're saying about the orals and project work! It's totally unfair. I go to one of those school were all the teachers are big into extra-curricular activities and projects, even though they don't get paid any extra for it! A lot of my teachers now are afraid that their workload would be so high that they wouldn't be able to continue all this work!

My teacher was mentioned something about Finland's education system being brilliant, and they have no formal assessment or something? She didn't know much about it, but she said our Principal is/was in work with some Finnish Secondary Schools recent enough! Anyone know anything about their education system?

I'm actually embarrased that I'm living in such a cheap country. It's absolutley awful. I mean why can't Ireland look at Britains mistake of their reform? They tried to change and now they're going back again! :rolleyes: Makes no sense, and it's messing up the generation before mines' education!

EmmetOT

Don't really get all the naysayers to be honest - it's a great idea. It encourages the teaching of more practical skills that relate more closely to university subjects. I've been saying for a while that schools should more often look at subjects such as computer science, sociology, etc. It may foster interest in more skills, which would lower dropouts across the board. Not just before the junior cert but also in university, where people would be more likely to choose subjects they know they'll like.

The system is also similar enough to the Finnish system, which is one of the (if not THE) best in the world, despite having very low hours and a generally relaxed outlook on education.

To whatsernamex33; your comment seems to imply that you believe the system needs to be difficult to be successful, to which I say, shouldn't the goal of education be to promote discussion, interest, and self-guided learning, rather than rote-learning, stress, and teaching to exams?

Whatsernamex33

EmmetOT wrote: »

To whatsernamex33; your comment seems to imply that you believe the system needs to be difficult to be successful, to which I say, shouldn't the goal of education be to promote discussion, interest, and self-guided learning, rather than rote-learning, stress, and teaching to exams?

Not at all, it doesn't need to be difficult to be successful. But it is going to be dumbed down a lot. Every subject common level, besides the main three? What about variety of choice? I don't agree with that. Atm, CSPE is common level which I do agree with. I think Business Studies should be common level too. Anything that will be of relevance to later life should be common level.

What I don't agree with also, is having short courses in subjects such as creative digital media, entrepreneurship, the ones mentioned. I can tell you offhand if I was doing the Junior Cert again in 3 years, I honestly wouldn't like to be taking media, and especially not entrepreneurship or Chinese Studies. I love media based things, but not as a school subject, it's a hobby and interest to me.



Again as I say, it's only my opinion. I'd rather sit for 3 years and study a whole 10 subjects again for a few weeks in June, than what's being brought in in a few years. Maybe I'm just kind of sad that it's changing, more emphasis on European languages etc. I really would have liked to have more emphasis on Irish studied in school, never gonna happen though.

Slow Show

I think the problem is that they're not really bringing it in to give a more well-rounded education, but to cut costs, which it will, as I'm sure teachers won't be getting a huge increase in their salaries for all this extra correcting and it'll mean a lot of saving on paying correctors over the summer/invigilators for exams (I'm assuming that they'll be scrapped at any rate).

I certainly agree that it'd be worthwhile to bring in new, relevant subjects like Computer Science. However, perhaps I'm pessimistic but the way things are today, I really can't see anything like that being implemented properly.

I've always thought the Junior Cert was fine myself but then again I've never had a standard to compare it to. I'm certainly glad I've had the experience of sitting an exam like it now that I'm facing the prospect of doing my LC in June, but I suppose the experience aspect is surmountable too.

Tl;dr: This would probably be a good idea if it was implemented properly (with unbiased third parties correcting rather than a teacher), but it most likely won't be, so I reckon it'll be a bit of a shambles in the end. But we'll see.