Accountancy Work in Melbourne/Sydney

Diddlydoubt

Going to Australia at the beginning of February 2013 via a couple of weeks in Thailand on the way.

I completed my ACA 3.5 year training contract with one of the Big 4 firms in Dublin where I worked in the Audit Financial Services department.

I passed the Core element of the FAE exams in 2011 and resat the elective element in September 2012 with results due in November 2012.

I am currently working for a bank in Dublin.

I was hoping somebody might know whether there might be much work available for me in Melbourne/Sydney or may have went through the same as me and could pass on some advice to me?

I would prefer Melbourne but I would appreciate any advice anybody could provide me about either there or sydney

The_Hustler

Just register with a load of recruitment agencies and you will get a job in either city within a few weeks. Robert Walters, Robert Half, Hays, FourQuarters, hjb and some smaller ones like TwoScots and Charterhouse. I registered with about 10 the day I got there and arranged to meet with half of those within my first 2 or 3 days.

Your experience may get you a role fast because I wasn't put forward for a fair few jobs because they wanted FS and audit.

Also, January is very quiet for hobs but it picks up again in February.

Pisco Sour

The_Hustler wrote: »

Just register with a load of recruitment agencies and you will get a job in either city within a few weeks. Robert Walters, Robert Half, Hays, FourQuarters, hjb and some smaller ones like TwoScots and Charterhouse. I registered with about 10 the day I got there and arranged to meet with half of those within my first 2 or 3 days.

Your experience may get you a role fast because I wasn't put forward for a fair few jobs because they wanted FS and audit.

Also, January is very quiet for hobs but it picks up again in February.

I'm part qualified ACA. Used agencies for the best part of a year and a half and all they would get me would be Accounts Payable jobs. Eventually took matters into my own hands and started applying directly (omitting my visa status in my cover letter of course) and within a week landed a pretty decent full time Financial Accounting role, with a very strong chance of sponsorship.

Will obviously be easier for you being fully qualified, but my advice would be not to just go with the agencies but also apply directly and never mention you are on a working holiday visa in your cover letter. Don't tell them until they ask about your visa status in the interview. By that stage they may be impressed by you to overlook the visa status, but if you say it in the cover letter then your application will end up in the bin.

You'll find work here (Melbourne) no bother though and the money is pretty good.

Diddlydoubt

Thanks for both replies guys.

I am currently part-qualified and obviously whether i pass the elective or not will dictate whether or not i will be fully qualified when i arrive in Oz.

In terms of salary for part-qualified work, what are you earning in Melbourne if you dont mind me asking? (PM me if you dont want to post it on the main thread).

Also then in terms of being fully qualified what could i typically expect to earn in Melbourne?

I intend on being in Australia at the very end or start of february so hoping to avoid the quiet part of january on the job front.

what type of roles are most common? ideally would rather not get into another audit practice role. Also what are typical working hours and practices in relation to overtime etc?

Pisco Sour

Diddlydoubt wrote: »

Thanks for both replies guys.

I am currently part-qualified and obviously whether i pass the elective or not will dictate whether or not i will be fully qualified when i arrive in Oz.

In terms of salary for part-qualified work, what are you earning in Melbourne if you dont mind me asking? (PM me if you dont want to post it on the main thread). My role is more of a part qualified role so I'm on 60k full time, so that would be around $35 an hour if you are casual (taking into account no pay for public holidays and days off etc).


Also then in terms of being fully qualified what could i typically expect to earn in Melbourne? Being full qualified you would certainly earned a good bit more. There was a time a couple of years ago where accountants just out the door from Big 4 could waltz into a 50 per hour financial accountant role out here. Think those days are gone now. Probably 40-45 maybe as a casual employee. So if you got a full time role being fully qualified maybe you could manage 80k. I'm not sure though as I have never gone looking for fully qualified roles as I knew I wouldn't get them. Maybe somebody else might have a better idea.

I intend on being in Australia at the very end or start of february so hoping to avoid the quiet part of january on the job front.

what type of roles are most common? ideally would rather not get into another audit practice role. Also what are typical working hours and practices in relation to overtime etc? Have a look on seek.com.au to get an idea of jobs that are available. February things will start picking up again after the quietness of December and January. You'd waltz into a sponsored job out here in audit (if sponsorship is what you are after) but screw that. Life is to be enjoyed and practice is horrible. You aren't flying around the world to do that rubbish. Typical working hours are around 37.5 hours a week, and overtime is rare. The stereotype about Australians being laid back is true. Have found working here to be less stressful than working in Ireland (so far)

.

Diddlydoubt

Pisco Sour wrote: »

.

Yeah i was wondering about the working culture as in whether it is as laid back as people say it is, good to hear that is actually the case.

Worst case scenario I will be going part-qualified but i will have 3.5 years experience behind me along with a further 6 months experience in a large banking environment in an analyst type role.

Please God I will pass this Elective exam and I will then be going fully qualified with the potential to earn more than if I go only part-qualified.

What is the deal with Superannuation? a few recruitment agencies i have been in touch with quoted hourly rates for example of $45 plus superannuation but i wasnt sure what this amounted to overall.

And roughly off the 60k you earn gross, how much do you take home after tax say per week/month?

How do you find the cost of living in Melbourne in terms of rent/living expenses etc? Did you spend any time in Sydney at all or try to source work there?

It is really hard to know what to believe from the various stories you hear about "Accountants are earning a fortune in Australia" etc without actually speaking to genuine people who are in the same position or went throguh the same process and know the drill so really appreciate this feedback

The_Hustler

I don't know whether I just got screwed with wages but I'm fully qualified with almost a year post qualification experience and I'm on under $37 an hour. In fact the recruiter told me it was $40 and pushing for $45 and then when the offer came in it was $35!

Had to fight for a slight increase. If you can get one without a recruiter taking their chunk you'll be laughing.

Diddlydoubt

Is it worth my while registering with any of the recruiters now before I actually leave to go over to Australia?

How would I go about sourcing work over there without the help of a recruitment agency, given the fact that I would'nt have any knowledge of the job market or where to even start about looking etc?

What would my chances be of getting set up with some work before I go? I would imagine unlikely as I am initially going on the WHV.

fancyanosh

Hi,

Hope you don't mind me jumping in with a few questions of my own. Best of luck with the elective, diddlydoubt. The wait for the results is such torture.

I just qualified as an ACA back in Ireland this year. I trained in a smallish firm and work there was in a range of areas. Moved to Melbourne 3 weeks ago and have started looking for work. I've applied to 10 -15 jobs on Seek so far and have met with 3 recruiters. They're very quick to get me in the door for a face-to-face meeting but after that no contact from them. Bit annoying but early days yet I suppose. Like the OP I'm hoping to get a job in a company and not a firm. Do you have any further advice for dealing with recruiters?

Pisco Sour solid advice about leaving out visa info in cover letter. How did you go about targeting companies directly? What type of roles did you look at?

The_Hustler

Yeah I heard nothing from some of my recruiters and Robert Half used to ring me every week basically telling me they have nothing but checking was I still looking. Better than no contact though.

I found Robert Walters good apart from a couple of weeks of nothing but then a different person from their office contacted me twice about two different roles, the second time asking me to customise my CV a bit for a certain role, later confirming an interview, the interview happened Monday and they let me know I got it on Tuesday. So after weeks of nothing it all happens fast.

And I agree on the visa status, I sent my CVs by PDF (which I don't recommend, recruiters change your CV layout. I didn't want them to but maybe I would have been put forward more if they could change it) but when I customised it above I sent it by Word. At the interview I saw they had completely changed the layout, and on the cover it said I was Australian resident! The interviewers questioned that and I told them I was just on a working holiday visa, they were fine with it but maybe I wouldn't have got the interview without that lie from the recruiters.

Have thick skin when dealing with recruiters, they lie a lot. They told me my role was a longer contract and for better pay just to get me to the interview. They also ask questions about your other interviews etc, just trying to find out who is recruiting. Some wanted the names of the people I met with so they could make contacts I assume.

One of my friends was put forward for a job, and when another recruiter asked to put him forward for the same one and was told not to, the recruiter rang the employer and said to disregard my friend's application as they had already got him a role! Horrible tactics.

Lastly, try not to have your CV put forward by different recruiters to the same company.

Diddlydoubt

Got my WHV this week and I have decided that I am going to go to Melbourne first and try to source work there in February.

Has anybody any contacts for recruitment agencies etc in Melbourne which they may be able to pass on to me?

I am currently awaiting result of my ACA FAE Elective exam so I am currently part-qualified with 3.5 years Big4 audit FS experience and 6 months experience in Financial Analysis role in large bank.

Greatly appreciate any help.

Cheers

Belt

Hey guys, anyone got an update on how they are getting on trying to source accounting work in Melbourne?

I'm fully qualified and I've been here since before Christmas and am finding it hard to get anything sorted! I've met most of the main recruiters but they all seem to be saying the market is very quiet at the moment. Anyone got any advice?

Diddlydoubt

Pisco Sour wrote: »

I'm part qualified ACA. Used agencies for the best part of a year and a half and all they would get me would be Accounts Payable jobs. Eventually took matters into my own hands and started applying directly (omitting my visa status in my cover letter of course) and within a week landed a pretty decent full time Financial Accounting role, with a very strong chance of sponsorship.

Will obviously be easier for you being fully qualified, but my advice would be not to just go with the agencies but also apply directly and never mention you are on a working holiday visa in your cover letter. Don't tell them until they ask about your visa status in the interview. By that stage they may be impressed by you to overlook the visa status, but if you say it in the cover letter then your application will end up in the bin.

You'll find work here (Melbourne) no bother though and the money is pretty good.

When you say apply directly what exactly do yu mean? Apply speculatively to places where there may not be a role advertised or do you mean apply directly to companies who are advertising a role?

I have found it tough enough so far, met about 8-10 recruiters and all are saying the same thing, tough market, not long after holidays, month end etc.

all have said i will definitely get a role but it is just a matter of waiting for something that i am suitable for. it is pretty frustrating as i am very keen to get working

Diddlydoubt

Belt wrote: »

Hey guys, anyone got an update on how they are getting on trying to source accounting work in Melbourne?

I'm fully qualified and I've been here since before Christmas and am finding it hard to get anything sorted! I've met most of the main recruiters but they all seem to be saying the market is very quiet at the moment. Anyone got any advice?

Hi, i am in similar position to yourself. Who all have you contacted in terms of recruiters?

What sort of roles have you been applying for?

Do you have any post-qual experience? where did you do your training contract?

Pisco Sour

Diddlydoubt wrote: »

When you say apply directly what exactly do yu mean? Apply speculatively to places where there may not be a role advertised or do you mean apply directly to companies who are advertising a role?

I have found it tough enough so far, met about 8-10 recruiters and all are saying the same thing, tough market, not long after holidays, month end etc.

all have said i will definitely get a role but it is just a matter of waiting for something that i am suitable for. it is pretty frustrating as i am very keen to get working

What I mean is I went onto Seek and applied to jobs listed which were put up by the companies themselves. Basically ignored agencies and any job advertised on SEEK by an agency as more often than not they are just fake jobs designed to get more CVs.

Agencies are hopeless.

Diddlydoubt

Pisco Sour wrote: »

What I mean is I went onto Seek and applied to jobs listed which were put up by the companies themselves. Basically ignored agencies and any job advertised on SEEK by an agency as more often than not they are just fake jobs designed to get more CVs.

Agencies are hopeless.

okay i see what you mean aright about the agencies.

is there a way to actually customize your search on seek to search for jobs which is only advertised by companies themselves and not via agencies? i tried to check this out myself but it seems the only way to do it is to go through each individual job and check that way

Pisco Sour

Diddlydoubt wrote: »

okay i see what you mean aright about the agencies.

is there a way to actually customize your search on seek to search for jobs which is only advertised by companies themselves and not via agencies? i tried to check this out myself but it seems the only way to do it is to go through each individual job and check that way

I dont think there is. But it's fairly obvious when you look at the list of jobs. If you see a job advertised with "Michael Page", "Hays" or whatever then that's a fairly strong indication that it is not a real job so dont waste your time. If you are registered with the agencies then there is no need to go applying for "jobs" they have listed on SEEK.

monariek

Belt wrote: »

Hey guys, anyone got an update on how they are getting on trying to source accounting work in Melbourne?

I'm fully qualified and I've been here since before Christmas and am finding it hard to get anything sorted! I've met most of the main recruiters but they all seem to be saying the market is very quiet at the moment. Anyone got any advice?

i arrived in melbourne two weeks ago. I have PQE of 3 years. i'm having trouble even getting a response from any of the recruiters.

makes a change from back home when i couldnt get them to stop ringing me. i'm getting desperate from a phone call

Are there are websites where employers advertise directly? i'd rather not have to deal with recruiters bull****

edit - i'll give seek a look so

Belt

Diddlydoubt wrote: »

Hi, i am in similar position to yourself. Who all have you contacted in terms of recruiters?

What sort of roles have you been applying for?

Do you have any post-qual experience? where did you do your training contract?

Hey I trained with one of the big four! No post qual experience but I have a couple of fin acc and internal audit secondments which I thought might count for something! I have been applying for any sort of accounting and auditing positions - no luck yet though!

I'd agree about the agencies, seem to advertise for jobs that don't exist!! I've heard the time of year, holidays etc excuses but I'm not 100 % confident it's going to pick up!

monariek

bear with it, we'll get something. once you have one job it'll be easier to get your next gig

Diddlydoubt

I got a gig doing sales yesterday which is starting now on monday.

its basically door to door sales for a company.

and how much i make per week is based off how many people i get signed up.

quite risky i know in terms of weekly wage not being guranteed but at least it gives me a bit of motivation to try and make as many sales as i can to make as much money as i can.

its better than sitting in the house anyway

emclau

Hi,
Having worked in Sydney in finance for the past 4.5 years, it has certainly got much tougher since I got arrived. Candidates used to have their pick of jobs - however times have changed and its now much more competitive to get jobs. Companies are off shoring a lot of work, and are trying to retrench internal candidates rather than going external.

The following report gives a good summary of current market trends:
http://www.ambition.com.au/resources/market-and-salary-reports
(Finance market trends)

I would consider applying directly to companies- especially the large Australian financials as they tend to hire the most. Check out vacancies directly on company websites - the big 4 - ANZ,NAB,Westpac and CBA.

Good luck!

FernandoTorres

How is the accountancy/finance job hunt going for people? I'm in Melbourne a month now and finding it pretty difficult and so is my girlfriend. I'm in wealth management and my girlfriend is a fully qualified accountant. We both have 4 years experience in a Big 4 firm at home.

The WHV visa seems to be pretty worthless. Doesn't seem to get you anywhere in finance nowadays according to recruiters. We're applying for the skilled independent visa now but that takes around 7 months to come through. I'd like some temporary work in my field til then but even going down to administration jobs I'm finding it tough to get a response!

Anyone had better luck?

Kiith

FernandoTorres wrote: »

The WHV visa seems to be pretty worthless. Doesn't seem to get you anywhere in finance nowadays according to recruiters. We're applying for the skilled independent visa now but that takes around 7 months to come through. I'd like some temporary work in my field til then but even going down to administration jobs I'm finding it tough to get a response!

Anyone had better luck?

I'm not in accountancy (IT), so this isn't directly related, but the WHV seems to be a massive negative for pretty much every recruiter i've talked to. I've had loads of calls from people saying that my CV is perfect and i've great experience, but as soon as they see the WHV, it's pretty much jog on.

Definitely limits the options you have over here.

Belt

Anyone got an update on how they are getting on? Activity seems to have picked up a bit with their year end approaching!

Apollo_Creed

Hey, I'm also 95% certain of emigrating to Sydney in June on a WHV. Just finishing up my ACA contract at end of April with Big 4 firm. Hope to start work as soon as possible after moving over (although I do know it will take time). If anyone could give any tips on where to live, where to work, what recruiters to deal with and any info about the general accountancy scene in Sydney, I would really appreciate it.

mandrake04

Apollo_Creed wrote: »

Hey, I'm also 95% certain of emigrating holidaying to Sydney in June on a WHV. Just finishing up my ACA contract at end of April with Big 4 firm. Hope to start work as soon as possible after moving over (although I do know it will take time). If anyone could give any tips on where to live, where to work, what recruiters to deal with and any info about the general accountancy scene in Sydney, I would really appreciate it.

Fixed your post.

FernandoTorres

If I was you I'd look into the Skilled Independent Visa 189 or state sponsored 190 visa. The WHV gets you nowhere in accounting/finance now and very few companies are sponsoring. It costs a bit but a worthwhile investment from what I can see.

Apollo_Creed

FernandoTorres wrote: »

If I was you I'd look into the Skilled Independent Visa 189 or state sponsored 190 visa. The WHV gets you nowhere in accounting/finance now and very few companies are sponsoring. It costs a bit but a worthwhile investment from what I can see.

Any idea how long the 189 visa takes. Apologies if asked already, can't find it.

My_Sharona

The official timeline for a 189 is 12 months.

I qualified as an ACA last year and applied for a 190 visa. It took 3 months for it to be approved.

Edit: took me 3 months, not 4

FernandoTorres

I think it's taking around 6 months at the moment. July is the year end and the accounting quota is still nowhere near being reached so if you could get an application in before then 60 points should see you through. The process is a bit of a pain but once you get the visa you have permanent residency so would command a much better starting salary and could get a permanent job. As well as that you don't need to limit yourself to employers who will sponsor you who seem to be few and far between these days. So all in all the visa pays for itself if you're planning on staying here a while.

My_Sharona

Bear in mind that you will need a 7 in the academic IELTS for the skills assessment by ICAA. Don't make the same mistake I did and do the general training like everyone else!

Also you will need a copy of your membership cert when applying for the skills assessment. This is a bit of a pain to get as it has to be signed by several people after a meeting where you are admitted to membership. I got mine about 6 weeks after my training contract finished. Make sure you have your CA diary sorted out and remember that you can't submit it until after your official training contract finish date.

DeclanClune

I was speaking with one of the global accounting firms in a major town outside Perth and they are having difficulty getting qualified charetered accountants.

Maybe look beyond Sydney / Melbourne...

Declan

monariek

anyone have any updates on the job market at the moment?


i'm now on a de-facto 457 rather than WHV. Would this be more appealing to employers? I would have thought so, but suppose it doesnt make a difference if there is no jobs out there

Legend100

should make a difference alright

When my girlfriend went defacto this time last year, the recruiters were much more positive with her as she could be put forward for most jobs whereas alot of jobs previously she would have been immediately disregarded as the companies were not willing to take on a whv

She got a job very soon after going defacto (but i guess the job market now may not be similar to this time last year)

monariek

well im working but just not in the type of job i would have wanted, so might look again.

think id have a case of irish guilt leaving an employer after three months though

purcela

I'm working in Sydney in a role for last 4 months and sponsorship process is underway. I know a lot of accountants here, some recently arrived and others have been here a few months now, and all are working or getting interviews at the minimum. The contract accounting market seems good right now, but then again it is coming up to year end so that will have a big impact.

Lis9

Hi there, I was looking for info on moving to Sydney as a CA w 1.5yrs PQE & came across this thread. I notice the info was posted a couple of yrs ago & wondering if ppl can tell me whether the market is better for jobs now? I'm thinking of saving now & moving over in Sept. I don't know anybody over there & would be going on my own. I'm 31. Not sure about which visas I'm able to or should apply for. Any advice greatly appreciated & happy new year!

emclau

From what I gather, the market is okay at the moment. You are in a good position- with especially with two years pqe when you get here.

If you are moving to one of the big cities, the majority of jobs are in financial services - banks, insurance etc. If you have experience in that area you should not have a problem. When i moved here my background was industry but I had to change as it would have been difficult to get a job otherwise.

Re visa. You have a couple of options.
1. Working holiday visa - will cover you for one year but you can't work with same employer for more than six months. If you work for a company for 6 months, they may elect to sponsor you on a 457 4 yr visa at the end of the sponsorship.

2. Permanent Resident visa: this costs thousands of dollars and takes months to process. However, it lasts for 5 yrs, no employment restrictions and you are eligible for Medicare when you arrive in Australia. You should be eligible (30pts for age, 10 for work experience, and 20 for sitting the English exam).
immi.gov.au/Visas/Pages/189.aspx

Legend100

emclau wrote: »

F

Re visa. You have a couple of options.
1. Working holiday visa - will cover you for one year but you can't work with same employer for more than six months. If you work for a company for 6 months, they may elect to sponsor you on a 457 4 yr visa at the end of the sponsorship.

2. Permanent Resident visa: this costs thousands of dollars and takes months to process. However, it lasts for 5 yrs, no employment restrictions and you are eligible for Medicare when you arrive in Australia. You should be eligible (30pts for age, 10 for work experience, and 20 for sitting the English exam).
immi.gov.au/Visas/Pages/189.aspx

Just to note, I think the OP has missed the boat for the WHV being 31 years old. I believe (but may be incorrect) that you cannot have turned 31 to qualify for the first WHV so sponsorship or PR would be the only way in.

Oh and I've sat the English exam......getting the 20 points is much harder than it may seem going in so I'd advise people to study before it. I could only manage a 7 in the reading and even though I had an average of 8.5, you need an 8 in each of the four sections to get the 20 points

whatif...

Ya thanks, did a bit more research today. Had started filling in the Expression of Interest Form to apply for the skilled 189 visa without realising the extent of requirements. My qualification as a Chartered Accountant is recognised by the Institute Chartered Accountants Australia but I think I need to get onto them to first process my Irish application in order to apply. Seems like such a difficult process! One step at a time I guess.

FernandoTorres

whatif... wrote: »

Ya thanks, did a bit more research today. Had started filling in the Expression of Interest Form to apply for the skilled 189 visa without realising the extent of requirements. My qualification as a Chartered Accountant is recognised by the Institute Chartered Accountants Australia but I think I need to get onto them to first process my Irish application in order to apply. Seems like such a difficult process! One step at a time I guess.

Did you expect they'd just grant you permanent residency by just filling out a form!? Of course it's a difficult process. And also an expensive one. I'd recommend you read the entire body of information on the IMMI website before even going near the Expression of Interest.

whatif...

Yes thanks that's why I'm on Boards looking for info

DeclanClune

Hi there Whatif,

The WHV is not an option because the cutoff age is 31 when applying for this visa.

The other options are either
Sponsorship (457) if you have a job offer from an employer that is willing to sponsor you. This takes about 2 - 3 months to process. However you are tied to the employer that is sponsoring you. If you wish to switch employers, you will need to apply for a new sponsorship visa and pay more immigration fees. This will not give you PR and you will need to apply for this as a separate visa if you want this in any case.

Alternatively, the permanent residency visa (a few different routes through this) gives you the opportunity to live and work in Australia for life - independent of any employer. Initially you have a 5 year window to come and go but if you have lived in Australia for 4 years, you can then apply for your citizenship and get the Australian passport. You won't need to worry about Australian visas again.

There is a lot involved in getting the PR visa sorted out as the other posters have said and many people get an agent to sort it out for them because the immigration requirements change regularly and you need to be on top of these changes to ensure your application remains a valid application.
The process does take about 8 months to process so if you were thinking of heading over in Sept, then starting the process now would be the right thing to do. The cost depends on the number of people you bring with you but the current fees from Immigration are AUD 3520 for the main applicant. Then you have the fees to the assessing body, medicals, English test and possible state nomination along with agent fees. All in, this would come to approx EUR 6295 at the moment (compared with EUR 3200 for a temporary 457 sponsorship visa).

So if your end game is to get PR, then it might be wiser to apply for the PR visa from the beginning as it would save you costs in the long run.

I am a registered agent so the information provided is correct at this point in time. I hope this information helps.

Declan Clune