Non Big 4 Recently Qualified Accountant

Francesco10

Hi guys,

I started work with a small firm this week and was surprised at the lack of qualified accountants in place here. We have a manager and six trainees in the accounting department but no qualified accountant (bar the manager and partners). Seemingly it's a case of once you qualify then they let you go. My friend also started a training contract this summer with a similar sized firm but he was telling me that they have two qualified accountants other than the manager and partners. I was just wondering what the opportunities are for a non big 4 recently qualified accountant with no post qualification experience? I have CAP 1 exemptions so will be sitting CAP 2 exams next summer and I have heard from those at work of how tough the work they entail. I fully intend to work to the bone for the next three years or so and get my exams but I was curious as to what my prospects are. I know a lot can change in 3 years but I'm currently feeling a bit anxious about my career prospects.

Do many firms operate like this, where they limit their qualified employees and instead use trainees? And if so will it not make things very tough for qualified accountants, especially those without PQE and from non big 4 and non big 10 firms? Do the big 4 ever take on accountants that qualified with small firms?

Thanks.

tommyjin83

Francesco10 wrote: »

Hi guys,

I started work with a small firm this week and was surprised at the lack of qualified accountants in place here. We have a manager and six trainees in the accounting department but no qualified accountant (bar the manager and partners). Seemingly it's a case of once you qualify then they let you go. My friend also started a training contract this summer with a similar sized firm but he was telling me that they have two qualified accountants other than the manager and partners. I was just wondering what the opportunities are for a non big 4 recently qualified accountant with no post qualification experience? I have CAP 1 exemptions so will be sitting CAP 2 exams next summer and I have heard from those at work of how tough the work they entail. I fully intend to work to the bone for the next three years or so and get my exams but I was curious as to what my prospects are. I know a lot can change in 3 years but I'm currently feeling a bit anxious about my career prospects.

Do many firms operate like this, where they limit their qualified employees and instead use trainees? And if so will it not make things very tough for qualified accountants, especially those without PQE and from non big 4 and non big 10 firms? Do the big 4 ever take on accountants that qualified with small firms?

Thanks.

Currently working in one of the big 4, from what i know big 4 do hire a lot of qualified accountants coming from non-big 4 background. They will usually join as assistant managers or the equivalent. From your prospective, again in my own opinion you will get a well-rounded experience training in the smaller firm. Just my 2 cents anyway.

ted2767

Francesco10 wrote: »

Hi guys,

I started work with a small firm this week and was surprised at the lack of qualified accountants in place here. We have a manager and six trainees in the accounting department but no qualified accountant (bar the manager and partners). Seemingly it's a case of once you qualify then they let you go. My friend also started a training contract this summer with a similar sized firm but he was telling me that they have two qualified accountants other than the manager and partners. I was just wondering what the opportunities are for a non big 4 recently qualified accountant with no post qualification experience? I have CAP 1 exemptions so will be sitting CAP 2 exams next summer and I have heard from those at work of how tough the work they entail. I fully intend to work to the bone for the next three years or so and get my exams but I was curious as to what my prospects are. I know a lot can change in 3 years but I'm currently feeling a bit anxious about my career prospects.

Do many firms operate like this, where they limit their qualified employees and instead use trainees? And if so will it not make things very tough for qualified accountants, especially those without PQE and from non big 4 and non big 10 firms? Do the big 4 ever take on accountants that qualified with small firms?

Thanks.

Probably a case of getting rid of people once they qualify so as not to have to pay them the going rate I'd say many firms are profitable on jobs owing to having low paid trainees.
CAP2's are doable if you keep on top of things and don't let it all till the study leave or at the least have your notes ready and organised when you're going on study leave and don't spend the first week or two organising your notes.
As for job opps cannot help you there just a trainee 2 myself!!

Sunny Dayz

Op - it depends on the firm. When I started my training contract in 2006, there were two trainees to every qualified. By the time I left (or rather was let go at the end of my contract) there was one actually qualifed and the rest were at various stages of training. Qualified accountants were let go cos they cost too much, firms get away with paying very little to trainees. That's why I was let go, my jump from trainee salary to qualified salary they didn't want to deal with. Most accountants who qualify in small firms that I know have gone onto another similar sized practice or into industry.

Ensure that the lack of qualified people in your office does not impeed on your training experience.

LiamACA

Francesco10 wrote: »

Hi guys,

I started work with a small firm this week and was surprised at the lack of qualified accountants in place here. We have a manager and six trainees in the accounting department but no qualified accountant (bar the manager and partners). Seemingly it's a case of once you qualify then they let you go. My friend also started a training contract this summer with a similar sized firm but he was telling me that they have two qualified accountants other than the manager and partners. I was just wondering what the opportunities are for a non big 4 recently qualified accountant with no post qualification experience? I have CAP 1 exemptions so will be sitting CAP 2 exams next summer and I have heard from those at work of how tough the work they entail. I fully intend to work to the bone for the next three years or so and get my exams but I was curious as to what my prospects are. I know a lot can change in 3 years but I'm currently feeling a bit anxious about my career prospects.

Do many firms operate like this, where they limit their qualified employees and instead use trainees? And if so will it not make things very tough for qualified accountants, especially those without PQE and from non big 4 and non big 10 firms? Do the big 4 ever take on accountants that qualified with small firms?

Thanks.

It's the way of the world at the moment. Nightmare to get paid, fees are being squeezed to the bone and there is always some accountant out there who will take on the business even knowing that you have outstanding fees and so we have to cut our cloth to match the environment we operate in.
I would look at your possibilities from the other point of view. You will have responsibility to prepare the accounts and audit all the way to partner level fairly quickly assuming you manager is buried in work from around the office. This will include taxation, accounts prep and audit so you should look at this as being thrown into the deep end and if you roll up you sleeves you will be able to market yourself very nicely in a couple of years time.

Morte

It's the way most firms will work. An awful lot of the work is very basic and a junior can do it easily. Most of the more complicated work a senior trainee could do or at least make the first attempt at it. A lot of the work of managers and partners is to review the work of those below. You don't say how many partners your firm has but there's at least 2 so with the manager that means each only has two trainees to keep track of. It's not economical to be paying the high salaries for qualified staff when trainees can do it almost as well with guidance. The business model is geared towards people qualifying and leaving and then new trainees taking their place. You're either moving up or moving out.

It's much the same in the Big 4 too by the way. The specialist departments might have a lot of qualified staff but the bread and butter audit departments will have a high proportion of trainees to qualified staff. I remember being told the firm I trained in had a 10% retention rate for qualifying staff at the time. Now granted that was during the boom and they would have wanted to keep more if they could. But it gives you an idea that if they were able to function on 10% staying how absurd the idea of everyone getting to stay on would be. And most of that 10% would have left in the next few years as well. Most of the places these folk go to will be the same as where you end up.

The accountancy industry probably would benefit from people not getting such a big pay jump on qualifying and having people with more of an idea of what they're doing working on stuff. But as long as industry keeps poaching staff at high rates that won't work.