Focus ST or MK5 Golf GTI

Intensive Care Bear

Im planning on buying one of these two as a weekend car in the next couple of months, problem is deciding which one to get. I've seen a few 2007 model st3 for about £7000, the equivalent spec GTI's are about 2-3 grand more expensive. So my questions... Is the Golf worth the extra money? Also which one would be more reliable? Cheers.

Matt Simis

You should get plenty of opinion as both have their fans here, however personally I think the ST is a more interesting options:


- Sounds better as its a 5pot
- Less ordinary (get one in Orange!)
- Strongly suspect more reliable as Ford in general are more reliable than VAG
- Better power delivery as the engine is larger but turbo the same
- The fact its cheaper and better (IMO) kinda makes this an easy recommendation!


In your case the lower MPG on the ST is a moot point as its weekend only. Had plenty of VAG cars and a GTI (mk4) briefly but never owned an ST (but been a passenger and occasional driver).


PS: Note you are in the UK, so Motor tax wont be an issue for you either then?

George Dalton

What I would like to know is why are you buying a 3dr hatch as a weekend car???

omb0wyn5ehpij9

George Dalton wrote: »

What I would like to know is why are you buying a 3dr hatch as a weekend car???

Agreed. They are both suited as daily drivers, but as a weekend car I would pick something a bit more out here......a convertable, or a lotus etc

Intensive Care Bear

George Dalton wrote: »

What I would like to know is why are you buying a 3dr hatch as a weekend car???

I have been living in London for 4 years without a car so i lost my no claims bonus, therefore i am been treated as a first time driver and i am getting insane quotes, the cheapest quote i got for an m3 was £6800. I am willing to pay what i got quoted for the focus or the golf.

omb0wyn5ehpij9

1210m5g wrote: »

I have been living in London for 4 years without a car so i lost my no claims bonus. Therefore i am been treated a first time driver and i am getting insane quotes, the cheapest quote i got for an m3 was £6800. I am willing to pay what i got quoted for the focus or the golf.

Ouch :eek:

-Corkie-

I would have the Focus, one of the lads here has a lovely one for sale. His username is draffodx..

Intensive Care Bear

Matt Simis wrote: »

You should get plenty of opinion as both have their fans here, however personally I think the ST is a more interesting options:


- Sounds better as its a 5pot
- Less ordinary (get one in Orange!)
- Strongly suspect more reliable as Ford in general are more reliable than VAG
- Better power delivery as the engine is larger but turbo the same
- The fact its cheaper and better (IMO) kinda makes this an easy recommendation!


In your case the lower MPG on the ST is a moot point as its weekend only. Had plenty of VAG cars and a GTI (mk4) briefly but never owned an ST (but been a passenger and occasional driver).


PS: Note you are in the UK, so Motor tax wont be an issue for you either then?

Yeah tax wont be a big issue, neither will fuel and if i did go for the focus i would have an extra 3 grand to go towards petrol. My head is telling me to get the focus but my heart says GTI because i have always wanted one even though the VW i had before was a money pit.

passatman86

focus - it's a ford = enough said
golf - they are everywhere at this stage

solution - get an Opel Astra OPC (edit vxr in uk) - test drive one at least before you knock it

Supergurrier

Buy a well specced 06/07 ST and spend the change over buying a MK5 on a CP320 upgrade and an RS clutch/Quafe diff

Best of both worlds

Intensive Care Bear

Supergurrier wrote: »

Buy a well specced 06/07 ST and spend the change over buying a MK5 on a CP320 upgrade and an RS clutch/Quafe diff

Best of both worlds

Cheers i'm not really into modifying cars though, if they were both the same price i would probably choose the Golf but the 3 grand difference and reliability issues are starting to turn be off them, i do think the Golf is a nicer looking car though.

gollywog

1210m5g wrote: »

Supergurrier wrote: »

Buy a well specced 06/07 ST and spend the change over buying a MK5 on a CP320 upgrade and an RS clutch/Quafe diff

Best of both worlds

Cheers i'm not really into modifying cars though, if they were both the same price i would probably choose the Golf but the 3 grand difference and reliability issues are starting to turn be off them, i do think the Golf is a nicer looking car though.

I own a gti and i think the Focus is better looking!
Go figure lol!

Supergurrier

gollywog wrote: »

I own a gti and i think the Focus is better looking!
Go figure lol!

Personally i think the MK5 GTI looks alot better than the ST, the ST looks weird from some angles and way too high/narrow at the back.

ST is very spacious inside though with great visability though GTI has much more creature comforts.

Also as to reliability issues, alot of the parts for the ST can be got from Volvo even cheaper than from ford which already do very cheap parts

Also make sure and drive both and maybe the Astra OPC too, i know the minute i drove an ST i fell in love with it

Intensive Care Bear

gollywog wrote: »

I own a gti and i think the Focus is better looking!
Go figure lol!

This is going to get complicated ha ha

gollywog

Supergurrier wrote: »

gollywog wrote: »

I own a gti and i think the Focus is better looking!
Go figure lol!

Personally i think the MK5 GTI looks alot better than the ST, the ST looks weird from some angles and way too high/narrow at the back.

ST is very spacious inside though with great visability though GTI has much more creature comforts.

Also as to reliability issues, alot of the parts for the ST can be got from Volvo even cheaper than from ford which already do very cheap parts

Maybe it's just we both see them every day, hence we find the other more attractive, like same with girlfriends and other girls ha!

Supergurrier

What GW is trying to say is he didn't go for the ST as it didn't come in Pink

gollywog

Supergurrier wrote: »

What GW is trying to say is he didn't go for the ST as it didn't come in Pink

Absolutely!

But OP, if you decide on the St, get the orange... It's beautiful in my opinion, suits the car perfectly!

Saying all this I love my gti, its just alot of fun to drive, makes me smile every time in it. I love the seats, there snug and very comfortable, although there a snug fit, one of my friends is a little on the "stocky" size lol, and he doesn't get on with them!
The thing I love most however is the DSG box (when it's working!) effortless to drive and love the farts and pops from revving through it!

Supergurrier

...what makes the ST unsuitable as a daily driver?

Matt Simis

OSI wrote: »

It's not unsuitable as a daily driver. But if I was weighing up which I wanted for a daily vs a weekend drive, the GTI would be my choice as daily, and the ST for a weekender.

But why? Even on the tax front it should be the other way around (why pay more tax on a car you arent driving).

IrishZeus

I was in the exact same position as you at the start of the month - was looking at the ST, GTi and the Astra OPC. (Astra VXR in the UK). I test drove them all, worked out the costs etc on them all.

In the end I plumped for the Astra OPC. Extremely comfortable to sit in - better than the other two in my opinion. The power delivery is phenomenal for the type of car it is - you feel every bit of the 240BHP.

Tax and MPG were a factor for me as I was trying to get something cheaper to run than my previous car. These aren't factors for you if its a weekend car but for interests sake, my MPG is coming back at average 28mpg. And I would have a reasonably heavy right foot.

Now that being said, if running costs were not an issue and I wanted just a weekend car, I would have taken the Orange ST just for looks and the sound of the engine. Head won over heart this time I'm afraid.

IrishZeus

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Too much of wuss for a 200bhp+ car with a clutch pedal are we :pac:

Did the pink not give that away?!

Marcusm

What were the insurance quotes? Depending on where you live in London, it would not surprise me if they were fairly different based on a friend's experience - he was swapping down from a 911CS and broker advised him that ST had much higher rating as regards theft. His GTi quote was 2/3rds of the ST quote.

.Longshanks.

For the simple fact that the OP lives in London id go for the golf with DSG. You will be stuck in traffic all the time and the DSG will come into its own.
Otherwise id have the ST.

Supergurrier

+1 On that, ST gets 6-9 mpg in stop start traffic

Henry Ford III

Both nice cars imho.

In the OP's circumstances I'd go for the ST. It'll be a bit thirstier on fuel, but parts and servicing will be cheaper, and it'd cost a good bit less to buy.

Then of course there's the engine sound which is both addictive and fantastic...

George Dalton

I have to disagree with the posters who say the ST will be cheaper to service and repair than the GTI. The GTI is a much more mainstream car than the ST and as such should be much cheaper for routine maintenance and repairs.

Henry Ford III

George Dalton wrote: »

I have to disagree with the posters who say the ST will be cheaper to service and repair than the GTI. The GTI is a much more mainstream car than the ST and as such should be much cheaper for routine maintenance and repairs.

Hi George.

I had a Focus ST a couple of years ago from new. I availed of Ford's main dealer fixed menu servicing which meant that an annual service cost slightly over €100 - same as a bog standard 1.6 petrol.

I suppose you could say it was a glorified oil change, but I can't see a GTI being any less expensive.

George Dalton

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Hi George.

I had a Focus ST a couple of years ago from new. I availed of Ford's main dealer fixed menu servicing which meant that an annual service cost slightly over €100 - same as a bog standard 1.6 petrol.

I suppose you could say it was a glorified oil change, but I can't see a GTI being any less expensive.

A 5 year old car and a brand new car are very different propositions in terms of maintenance. Oil change costs are only a small part of the story at that stage in a car's life.

In any case, all things being equal, a GTI oil change should cost less than an ST because of the fact it takes less oil than the ST engine. Even cost of spark plugs will be 25% more on the Ford because of the extra cylinder.

What about other maintenance items such as brake discs and pads, clutch, timing belt etc? All will be more expensive on the Ford I would imagine.

I don't mean this is a criticism of the ST, the fact that is is less of a mainstream model than the GTI is probably its strongest feature. I am just pointing out the facts as I see them.

dar83

George Dalton wrote: »

I have to disagree with the posters who say the ST will be cheaper to service and repair than the GTI. The GTI is a much more mainstream car than the ST and as such should be much cheaper for routine maintenance and repairs.

Not quite the case. The Filters etc... are pretty cheap for the ST, as they are standard enough ones Ford used. The only thing you'd really be looking to put into the ST that costs more is the oil and possibly the Plugs, but even at that it's up to yourself how much quality you'd want to put into it (obviously the higher the better).

Jim I'm not sure where you're getting 6-9MPG in traffic from, I've never seen the trip computer/mpg calculator that low and I've sat in Dublin city centre roadworks on the Quays traffic. Maybe if you rev it constantly to listen to the exhaust?

Supergurrier

Surely a 5 litre can would do both regardless.

Most of the ST's consumables are either from a normal focus or Turbo/T4/T5 Volvo's so there are lots about, it's hardly a bespoke car and yes the parts are cheaper than the VW equivilant.

I certainly wouldn't decide over the cost of a spark plug tbh, drive both see which you prefer

Supergurrier

dar83 wrote: »

Not quite the case. The Filters etc... are pretty cheap for the ST, as they are standard enough ones Ford used. The only thing you'd really be looking to put into the ST that costs more is the oil and possibly the Plugs, but even at that it's up to yourself how much quality you'd want to put into it (obviously the higher the better).

Jim I'm not sure where you're getting 6-9MPG in traffic from, I've never seen the trip computer/mpg calculator that low and I've sat in Dublin city centre roadworks on the Quays traffic. Maybe if you rev it constantly to listen to the exhaust?

Nah was stuck on the tuam toad to headford road duel carrageway a couple days ago and reset the trip computer for the laugh, it hovered between 8-11mpg mainly when literally crawling stop/start, then back up to a happy 23mpg

Also im tempted to buy my plastidip from cleancar.ie today but i have to pick up my new doggy

George Dalton

Supergurrier wrote: »

Surely a 5 litre can would do both regardless.

Most of the ST's consumables are either from a normal focus or Turbo/T4/T5 Volvo's so there are lots about, it's hardly a bespoke car and yes the parts are cheaper than the VW equivilant.

I certainly wouldn't decide over the cost of a spark plug tbh, drive both see which you prefer

The ST takes 5.8 litres of oil according to Autodata.

We work on Ford and VW cars every day of the week and buy loads of parts from both Ford and VW. There is little or no difference in the cost of most parts. If anything I would say Ford are a little more expensive than VW.

dar83

Supergurrier wrote: »

Also im tempted to buy my plastidip from cleancar.ie today but i have to pick up my new doggy

Interesting, didn't realise they sold it now...

€15.95 a can. Not too much of a mark up either. It would still be cheaper in the Group Buy, but let me know if you go ahead with it.

CUPimus

Purely on looks..... as standard, I think the ST looks better. But there are some gti's out there with simple, subtle changes to the appearance that really sets them off. So if you are not planning on adding any extra touches to the appearance, then I would go for the ST (which I think looks great btw) but, the gti can look awesome if you add some extra touches to it.

Intensive Care Bear

kev_Longshanks100 wrote: »

For the simple fact that the OP lives in London id go for the golf with DSG. You will be stuck in traffic all the time and the DSG will come into its own.
Otherwise id have the ST.

I could think of nothing worse than driving in central london so that wont be a big issue, i live on the outskirts and use public transport for travelling into the city so DSG isn't a priority.

Marcusm wrote: »

What were the insurance quotes? Depending on where you live in London, it would not surprise me if they were fairly different based on a friend's experience - he was swapping down from a 911CS and broker advised him that ST had much higher rating as regards theft. His GTi quote was 2/3rds of the ST quote.

I'm getting the same quotes (fully comp) for the ST and the GTI of about £1900 :eek: now this is very high but its only about £600 a year more than i'd be paying for a regular 1.4 golf or focus so i'd rather pay it and have some fun.

Thanks for all the feedback even if i am even more undecided than ever

Henry Ford III

Supergurrier wrote: »

Nah was stuck on the tuam toad to headford road duel carrageway a couple days ago and reset the trip computer for the laugh, it hovered between 8-11mpg mainly when literally crawling stop/start, then back up to a happy 23mpg

My 1.6TDCI econobox will do exactly the same in urban stop/start traffic.

gollywog

Not one that's mentioned so far but Honda s2000 maybe?

Intensive Care Bear

gollywog wrote: »

Not one that's mentioned so far but Honda s2000 maybe?

I definitely need a car with a back seat and i couldn't see myself driving a s2000 cheers for the suggestion though.

gollywog

1210m5g wrote: »

I definitely need a car with a back seat and i couldn't see myself driving a s2000 cheers for the suggestion though.

Sound so! no bother