Solicitor witholding my settlement 7 months on...

Aggers · 21-09-2012 6:15pm #1

Folks I was wondering would someone be able to give me some advice here.

I recently settled a personal injury case in court for 100k plus party and party costs. A couple of weeks later my solicitor gave me a 60k and said he would give me the rest when the bill of costs was sorted.

7 months on the bill of costs is still not sorted. Is this the norm? My solicitor is saying he is waiting on the defendants insurers to finalise what they will pay on the party and party costs. Every time I contact my solicitor they say its with the Defendants and they'll contact them to hurry it on but I never hear anything back from them.

Does it usually take this long? (It hasn't gone to taxation.) Should he hold onto the 40k while we wait for this to be sorted or should i have it and then be invoiced by my solicitor for costs out of party and party (eg PIAB application etc).

I'm getting fed up now but want to get some general advice before I contact my solicitor again. Thanks.

MagicSean · 21-09-2012 9:40pm

Depends on what you mean by the norm. Is it the norm for solicitors to keep clients money in high interest accounts for as long as possible? In my experience yes.

Is it right? No. Tell him you'll be looking for the interest he's been gaining on it and you'll probably get it sharpish.

James Jones · 21-09-2012 9:58pm

Tell him he has to pay you the complete amount you were awarded. He obviously didn't send you a Section 68 letter and so you owe him nothing. Tell him that if he doesn't pay up within 7 days, you will make a complaint to the Law Society.

ResearchWill · 21-09-2012 10:34pm

MagicSean wrote: »

Depends on what you mean by the norm. Is it the norm for solicitors to keep clients money in high interest accounts for as long as possible? In my experience yes.

Is it right? No. Tell him you'll be looking for the interest he's been gaining on it and you'll probably get it sharpish.

Client account usually less than 1% so 40k in one year would get the solicitor €400. Ya that's high interest.

ResearchWill · 21-09-2012 10:40pm

OP fact is yor solicitor got awarded party and party not solicitor client. As your award was 100k I assume it was difficult case. I assume he has paid for reports that he may or may not get from the defendants.

Insurance companies are very slow to pay at the moment. Your solicitor is prob slow to Tax as the taxing master is new, and your solicitor will have to pay out a fair amount of money up front to tax costs.

If your solicitor pays you all the award before he knows how much of your costs including reports he is going to get from the other side then while you are a honest guy you would be surprised at the amount of people who don't pay their bills to solicitors.

I know if costs that are settled in a matter of weeks and others that can take years. If you want to know what's happening arrange appointment to ask solicitor what's happening.

ResearchWill · 21-09-2012 10:42pm

James Jones wrote: »

Tell him he has to pay you the complete amount you were awarded. He obviously didn't send you a Section 68 letter and so you owe him nothing. Tell him that if he doesn't pay up within 7 days, you will make a complaint to the Law Society.

What happens if the solicitor pays the client all the money and then does not get say 5k of outlays he paid out on behalf of client. What about the solicitor client costs.

TouchingVirus · 21-09-2012 10:45pm

ResearchWill wrote: »

What happens if the solicitor pays the client all the money and then does not get say 5k of outlays he paid out on behalf of client. What about the solicitor client costs.

The solicitor charges the client. If the client does not pay then the solicitor takes legal action to recover costs. The solicitor has no right to hold the money, it isn't his.

ResearchWill · 21-09-2012 10:53pm

TouchingVirus wrote: »

The solicitor charges the client. If the client does not pay then the solicitor takes legal action to recover costs. The solicitor has no right to hold the money, it isn't his.

The money is not in the solicitors account it's in the Client account. Can you show me any law that says a solicitor must pay money to the client before he has received all money due from defendant. Remember the money is in client account not office account.

James Jones · 21-09-2012 11:38pm

ResearchWill wrote: »

James Jones wrote: »

Tell him he has to pay you the complete amount you were awarded. He obviously didn't send you a Section 68 letter and so you owe him nothing. Tell him that if he doesn't pay up within 7 days, you will make a complaint to the Law Society.

What happens if the solicitor pays the client all the money and then does not get say 5k of outlays he paid out on behalf of client. What about the solicitor client costs.

Thats why the solicitor should have written the Section 68 letter. He has a legal obligation to do so and has no right to charge if he does not.

ResearchWill · 22-09-2012 4:29am

James Jones wrote: »

Thats why the solicitor should have written the Section 68 letter. He has a legal obligation to do so and has no right to charge if he does not.

Maybe I missed it but did the OP say he never got a section 68 letter. This is about a situation where the OP is aware that certain costs are to be paid out of the award example he mentions PIAB application. Also say there are 3 doctors reports each charged at 500 so 1500 paid to doctors but only 350 recoverable until costs agreed how does the solicitor know what the client owes.

BTW non compliance with section 68 does not mean solicitor can not get his costs. http://www.courts.ie/Courts.ie/library3.nsf/(WebFiles)/93BF3339EAF73382802571C5003BE1C6/$FILE/Taxation%20of%20Costs%202006%20-%20english.pdf
Page 25

From the Colthurst case

A & L Goodbody Solicitors -v- Charles Colthurst and Tenips Limited unreported Peart J. [2003] IEHS 74 @ 95.

"In relation to the other submissions under this heading, I do not believe that section 68 was intended to deprive the solicitor, who has failed to send a section 68 letter, of his right to recover his costs when taxed, in spite of the fact that the section is worded in mandatory terms. I agree with Counsel for the plaintiff that if such were to be the consequence of failure to send the letter, it would have said so in clear terms given the seriousness of the consequence of failure to do so."

seb65 · 22-09-2012 9:40pm

ResearchWill wrote: »

OP fact is yor solicitor got awarded party and party not solicitor client. As your award was 100k I assume it was difficult case. I assume he has paid for reports that he may or may not get from the defendants.

Insurance companies are very slow to pay at the moment. Your solicitor is prob slow to Tax as the taxing master is new, and your solicitor will have to pay out a fair amount of money up front to tax costs.

If your solicitor pays you all the award before he knows how much of your costs including reports he is going to get from the other side then while you are a honest guy you would be surprised at the amount of people who don't pay their bills to solicitors.

I know if costs that are settled in a matter of weeks and others that can take years. If you want to know what's happening arrange appointment to ask solicitor what's happening.

Not even in a contingency agreement in the US, with the scabbiest of lawyers, would a 40% rate be allowed to stand.

40 k for reports? Let's be real here.

ResearchWill · 22-09-2012 10:05pm

seb65 wrote: »

Not even in a contingency agreement in the US, with the scabbiest of lawyers, would a 40% rate be allowed to stand.

40 k for reports? Let's be real here.

Where have I or the OP said that there is a 40% contingency. Please read the OP and my posts. At this stage the solicitor has not received any payment for his work or for the money he or she has paid out in outlays. In the USA a lawyer would usually keep 33% of any award plus any outlays.

Is this a med neg case, if it is its normal for reports to cost several thousands of euro.

Also remember in this case the solicitor has NOT been paid anything yet from anyone.

seb65 · 22-09-2012 10:18pm

ResearchWill wrote: »

Where have I or the OP said that there is a 40% contingency. Please read the OP and my posts. At this stage the solicitor has not received any payment for his work or for the money he or she has paid out in outlays. In the USA a lawyer would usually keep 33% of any award plus any outlays.

Is this a med neg case, if it is its normal for reports to cost several thousands of euro.

Also remember in this case the solicitor has NOT been paid anything yet from anyone.

40% of €100,000 is €40,000, which is what he has held back.

You are assuming quit a bit in your posts. First, that the funds are in a client account. Second, that the solicitor has not been paid anything. You know what they say about assumptions....

ResearchWill · 22-09-2012 10:30pm

seb65 wrote: »

40% of €100,000 is €40,000, which is what he has held back.

You are assuming quit a bit in your posts. First, that the funds are in a client account. Second, that the solicitor has not been paid anything. You know what they say about assumptions....

I can assume those facts based on the rules of the law society. A solicitor is paid last even interim payments can not be taken by a solicitor until a fee note is raised such cannot be raised in this situation as sgainst the client as the OP has not agreed how much of his bill is to be paid by the defendant. If the solicitor has put this 40k in his office account he faces being struck off.

Can you point at any evidence to contradict my statements.

Reloc8 · 23-09-2012 10:03pm

MagicSean wrote: »

Depends on what you mean by the norm. Is it the norm for solicitors to keep clients money in high interest accounts for as long as possible? In my experience yes.

Is it right? No. Tell him you'll be looking for the interest he's been gaining on it and you'll probably get it sharpish.

I'd be interested to hear the source of your experience - you're not a lawyer - so where have you come across this ?

MagicSean · 23-09-2012 11:05pm

Reloc8 wrote: »

MagicSean wrote: »

Depends on what you mean by the norm. Is it the norm for solicitors to keep clients money in high interest accounts for as long as possible? In my experience yes.

Is it right? No. Tell him you'll be looking for the interest he's been gaining on it and you'll probably get it sharpish.

I'd be interested to hear the source of your experience - you're not a lawyer - so where have you come across this ?

Family property purchase and a personal injury case. One of the solicitors was struck off by the law society. Don't think anything was done with the second complaint.

Aggers · 24-09-2012 12:28am

Thanks for the replies lads.

I did get a section 68 letter outlining my costs when my case started.

It says there may be a considerable lapse of time between the final settlement and the receipt of any cheque and that they will give me a reasonable interim payment.

What exactly is a considerable lapse of time though? I personally think 7 months is excessive.

Although its not their money to hold, can they hold it until the final costs are finalised? Or can I just demand it now?

RE the intrest, I see from the Solicitors accounts regulations that I am entitled to any intrest earned on the money held in the client account.

I've always had a good working relationship with my solicitor, but just get the impression he is fobbing me off now and want to know whats generally acceptable before I contact him.

Milk & Honey · 24-09-2012 7:51am

He has a lien on the money until you pay his bill. The only way to get the money from him is to pay his bill yourself. It can sometimes take a long time to agree costs after an action. If he has to employ a cost accountant and negotiate with the other side it can take months and if it has to go to taxation it can take years.

Aggers · 24-09-2012 11:23am

He hasnt employed a cost accountant. He said the Defendents insurers are going through the costs and the delay is their side - but 7 months? Surely he should be on to them saying this is not acceptable?

I just want to know exactly where I stand before I get back onto my solicitor to press this further with him, as everytime I contact him for an update I'm sure its costing me money.

ResearchWill · 24-09-2012 12:04pm

Aggers wrote: »

He hasnt employed a cost accountant. He said the Defendents insurers are going through the costs and the delay is their side - but 7 months? Surely he should be on to them saying this is not acceptable?

I just want to know exactly where I stand before I get back onto my solicitor to press this further with him, as everytime I contact him for an update I'm sure its costing me money.

I have waited for in excess of a year in some cases to get paid, because the Defence solicitor took an age to agree costs. I can assure you your solicitor wants to get this done as fast as you because he wants to get paid, your 40K in his client account is doing neither of ye any good. Also the Taxing master changed recently and costs are being cut way down, the less your solicitor gets from the other side the more of his bill you have to pay. Its in his and your interest to get as much of his costs paid by the Defence, but remember the more desperate you are the bigger advantage you are giving them.

Arrange a meeting with solicitor and agree a time frame to taxation, but be aware taxation could add a lot more time to the issue.

SajanZayn · 21-10-2023 8:42am

Consider consulting another legal professional for advice on whether it's standard practice for your solicitor to withhold funds pending resolution of party and party costs, especially if the process has been delayed for seven months.