Winners & Losers from Recession

talla10

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/revealed-the-winners-and-losers-in-the-wages-stakes-3229743.html

From yesterdays Irish Independent i didn't see a thread on this already but i think its interesting reading. Some professions down some serious money and more pain to come for everyone.

Zascar

Anyone who is in the same job and has not taken a pay cut is a serious winner - a lot of things are cheaper and the amount of deals etc to be had is fantastic now.

GerM

Zascar wrote: »

Anyone who is in the same job and has not taken a pay cut is a serious winner - a lot of things are cheaper and the amount of deals etc to be had is fantastic now.

It's a serious minority but the recession has actually been fantastic for some people. For those that came into the recession with no financial commitments and managed to keep their jobs, it has made life much more affordable.

Grumpypants

Zascar wrote: »

Anyone who is in the same job and has not taken a pay cut is a serious winner - a lot of things are cheaper and the amount of deals etc to be had is fantastic now.

Lots of things are cheaper except food, petrol, oil, electricity, gas, home & car & health insurance, medicine and clothing.

But you can get an hours paint balling for a tenner so its swings and roundabouts.

Gary The Gamer

GerM wrote: »

It's a serious minority but the recession has actually been fantastic for some people. For those that came into the recession with no financial commitments and managed to keep their jobs, it has made life much more affordable.

I don't believe that.

The past 4 years have seen prices increase, inflation is running at 2% this year. Somebody in the same job, earning the same money will have seen a drop in net income due to changes in bands and newer levies. So the overall picture is of higher prices reduced income. This is going to get a lot worse in the coming years.

Jellicoe

Grumpypants wrote: »

Lots of things are cheaper except food, petrol, oil, electricity, gas, home & car & health insurance, medicine and clothing.

But you can get an hours paint balling for a tenner so its swings and roundabouts.

lol +1, great

risteard7

Grumpypants wrote: »

Zascar wrote: »

Anyone who is in the same job and has not taken a pay cut is a serious winner - a lot of things are cheaper and the amount of deals etc to be had is fantastic now.

Lots of things are cheaper except food, petrol, oil, electricity, gas, home & car & health insurance, medicine and clothing.

But you can get an hours paint balling for a tenner so its swings and roundabouts.

I agree with everything bar food and clothing. I think they have become cheaper

ejmaztec

Grumpypants wrote: »

Lots of things are cheaper except food, petrol, oil, electricity, gas, home & car & health insurance, medicine and clothing.

But you can get an hours paint balling for a tenner so its swings and roundabouts.

A big downside is that if you want anybody to do any proper building work, you have to pay for the tradesmen's return ticket from Australia.

RossyG

Recessions create low expectation. Most people will accept pay freezes, redundancies, price increases without much fuss and governments will introduce a load of laws to stifle trade unions and make firing people easier in order to "kick start the economy".

Winners - the rich

Losers - the poor

68Murph68

Losers - Union officials - had sfa to do prior to the recession, picking up money for jam. Now they are busy trying to justify the free money they got in the Celtic tiger days and everyone hates them.

up for anything

68Murph68 wrote: »

Losers - Union officials - had sfa to do prior to the recession, picking up money for jam. Now they are busy trying to justice the free money they got in the Celtic tiger days and everyone hates them.

Too true. €600 per annum Union dues got my ex exactly nothing!

Sir Pompous Righteousness

Someone with a lot of money who decided to go on a property buying spree after house prices dropped dramatically. That individual was a winner. The best time to buy is when the markets are down not when they're high in the sky.

Haelium

A recession is always good for a person who has lots of money and knows how to invest. The very people who destroyed the country have great opportunities because of it.

3ndahalfof6

The winners were the losers as everything stopped.

Gary The Gamer

Sir Pompous Righteousness wrote: »

Someone with a lot of money who decided to go on a property buying spree after house prices dropped dramatically. That individual was a winner. The best time to buy is when the markets are down not when they're high in the sky.

Property fell by 16-20% last year and continue to fall. I don't think there are any property investors who have made a killing post crash. Its still very hard to find any value in Irish property.

sock puppet

RossyG wrote: »

governments will introduce a load of laws to stifle trade unions and make firing people easier in order to "kick start the economy".

These laws must be awfully complex if governments have spent the last 4 years drafting them.

talla10

Gary The Gamer wrote: »

I don't believe that.

The past 4 years have seen prices increase, inflation is running at 2% this year. Somebody in the same job, earning the same money will have seen a drop in net income due to changes in bands and newer levies. So the overall picture is of higher prices reduced income. This is going to get a lot worse in the coming years.

According to the article some professions have had wage increases since the recession began

msg11

up for anything wrote: »

Too true. €600 per annum Union dues got my ex exactly nothing!

So the Union failed to get the two of yous'e back together

68Murph68

Sir Pompous Righteousness wrote: »

Someone with a lot of money who decided to go on a property buying spree after house prices dropped dramatically. That individual was a winner. The best time to buy is when the markets are down not when they're high in the sky.

On this - know a couple of older folks with family all grown up who sold close to the top of the market and traded to small house who made a killing. They keep fairly quite about it though - coming back from their third trip to Portugal this year is a bit of a give-away though.

I'd imagine that there were quite a lot of four and five bed family homes sold for insane prices where older couples moved into small places and freed up some serious cash especially in some of the suburbs around Dublin.

Also winners - a lot of farmers who sold farmland to real estate developers for insane prices. They are able to buy it back for a fraction of the money they received before.

I have heard of one smart property guy who sold out of all property before the crash is sitting pretty on a mountain of cash.

Worth remembering - in any of the cases where someone overpaid for something someone had to end up with that cash. While some of these people possibly got caught in the boom as well, there has to be someone at the end of the chain who ending up benefiting.

You can be damm sure that any of these winners are keeping things damm quiet though. These are the individuals who would be too smart to fall for the conspicuous consumption nonsense that drove the tiger.

68Murph68

up for anything wrote: »

Too true. €600 per annum Union dues got my ex exactly nothing!

With the labour laws in Ireland I don't know why anyone would pay union dues.

Complete waste of money in my eyes.

Personally I don't know anyone who has got any benefit from being a member of a union.

poeticseraphim

68Murph68 wrote: »

On this - know a couple of older folks with family all grown up who sold close to the top of the market and traded to small house who made a killing. They keep fairly quite about it though - coming back from their third trip to Portugal this year is a bit of a give-away though.

I'd imagine that there were quite a lot of four and five bed family homes sold for insane prices where older couples moved into small places and freed up some serious cash especially in some of the suburbs around Dublin.

Also winners - a lot of farmers who sold farmland to real estate developers for insane prices. They are able to buy it back for a fraction of the money they received before.

I have heard of one smart property guy who sold out of all property before the crash is sitting pretty on a mountain of cash.

Worth remembering - in any of the cases where someone overpaid for something someone had to end up with that cash. While some of these people possibly got caught in the boom as well, there has to be someone at the end of the chain who ending up benefiting.

You can be damm sure that any of these winners are keeping things damm quiet though. These are the individuals who would be too smart to fall for the conspicuous consumption nonsense that drove the tiger.

It pays to be clever...

Jellicoe

Unsecured billionaire bondholders are the real winners, getting their risky private investments guaranteed by a cronie governments and then paid for by the ordinary Irish worker, while they're ordinary wages and standard of living falls.

Jellicoe

68Murph68 wrote: »

Personally I don't know anyone who has got any benefit from being a member of a union.

All it's good for is to make it harder for better connected union members to shaft you

GerM

Gary The Gamer wrote: »

I don't believe that.

The past 4 years have seen prices increase, inflation is running at 2% this year. Somebody in the same job, earning the same money will have seen a drop in net income due to changes in bands and newer levies. So the overall picture is of higher prices reduced income. This is going to get a lot worse in the coming years.

My rent dropped dramatically and the apartment is about €250 lower a month than a similar property would have been 5 years ago. There are deals to be had in a variety of areas. Eating out is dirt cheap compared to where it was. Clothing is cheaper. Cars are cheaper. Yes, utilities and fuel are higher but overall they're balanced and some by other reductions. There are people who are were lucky enough not to get stuck with a mortgage during the boom that are now able to afford a mortgage and get a house without moving miles away. People were spending plenty of money during the boom but the money wasn't theirs quite often. There's a higher percentage of income being saved now than ever before.

Gary The Gamer

GerM wrote: »

My rent dropped dramatically and the apartment is about €250 lower a month than a similar property would have been 5 years ago. There are deals to be had in a variety of areas. Eating out is dirt cheap compared to where it was. Clothing is cheaper. Cars are cheaper. Yes, utilities and fuel are higher but overall they're balanced and some by other reductions. There are people who are were lucky enough not to get stuck with a mortgage during the boom that are now able to afford a mortgage and get a house without moving miles away. People were spending plenty of money during the boom but the money wasn't theirs quite often. There's a higher percentage of income being saved now than ever before.

If only there was a statistical measure we could use that would take a basket of common goods and services and compare the price changes over time.

plumbball

I know a few winners most and they are engineers. They have the same income as before the recession but have more spending power due to the deflation.

I also have a family member in the market for a house. He is still holding off, he reckons they will come down a further 30% next year. I hate to say so, but I think he is right. He rented when everyone else couldn't wait to get on the property ladder. He is a clear winner.

Brain Stroking

I got a pay rise today

Fromthetrees

Energy prices have gone crazy but everything else feels cheaper.
You can eat and drink in or out for very modest sums.
I saw a house a few weeks ago on daft that I was renting before the crash and it's 450 per month less today, even by the time we had moved out a few years ago we were paying 250 less per month.
You can go look for a deal on anything now, over half price vacuum cleaners, 150 off tvs, PS3s for 200 odd, 70% off shirts and jeans, savage stuff out there if you look.
If you have a job and no debt things are grand.

plumbball

Fromthetrees wrote: »

Energy prices have gone crazy but everything else feels cheaper.
You can eat and drink in or out for very modest sums.
I saw a house a few weeks ago on daft that I was renting before the crash and it's 450 per month less today, even by the time we had moved out a few years ago we were paying 250 less per month.
You can go look for a deal on anything now, over half price vacuum cleaners, 150 off tvs, PS3s for 200 odd, 70% off shirts and jeans, savage stuff out there if you look.
If you have a job and no debt things are grand.

I notice that to, when I was buying my new tele up in Airside I went into the 3 electrical shops and told them the previous are giving it to me for 100 less, I eventually got 350 of the asking price. I also got 70 quid of my headphones in Peats a while ago, (Seinheister).

Also I got a brilliant bargain on my car. It the boom times they would have told you to F-off.

Zebra3

Zascar wrote: »

Anyone who is in the same job and has not taken a pay cut is a serious winner - a lot of things are cheaper and the amount of deals etc to be had is fantastic now.

Except they pay higher taxes now.

Lawrence1895

Winners: The Blueshirts, Labour, Bankers and Bondholders
Losers: The rest of the country

Mr Benevolent

Gary The Gamer wrote: »

I don't believe that.

The past 4 years have seen prices increase, inflation is running at 2% this year. Somebody in the same job, earning the same money will have seen a drop in net income due to changes in bands and newer levies. So the overall picture is of higher prices reduced income. This is going to get a lot worse in the coming years.

2% is nothing in terms of inflation.

plumbball

The inflation figure or 2% is due to energy increases. But this is set to get worse, next year because of poor worldwide harvests there will be at least 5% food inflation.

Gary The Gamer

Confab wrote: »

2% is nothing in terms of inflation.

What is it meant to be? It's an increase of 2% when gross and net wages are going backwards. 3 years of that and you will find a lot of people struggling badly.

Pottler

68Murph68 wrote: »

With the labour laws in Ireland I don't know why anyone would pay union dues.

Complete waste of money in my eyes.

Personally I don't know anyone who has got any benefit from being a member of a union.

David Begg might argue otherwise. Or pretty much any other Union Leader...:) Good red ties cost money you know.

Magenta

I'm earning €10k a year more now than I was in 2008, wooo!

plumbball

Magenta wrote: »

I'm earning €10k a year more now than I was in 2008, wooo!

You must be a repo man or a debt collector.

Fromthetrees

plumbball wrote: »

I notice that to, when I was buying my new tele up in Airside I went into the 3 electrical shops and told them the previous are giving it to me for 100 less, I eventually got 350 of the asking price. I also got 70 quid of my headphones in Peats a while ago, (Seinheister).

Also I got a brilliant bargain on my car. It the boom times they would have told you to F-off.

My friend needed a suit for a wedding there a few weeks ago, he was going to rent one but sauntered into a suit shop to have a look, tried one on, said, I'll give ya a ton for it, the manager said fine, he got it nearly half price.
I wouldn't be able for haggling but love a good deal nowadays. I still spend the same, just get more bang for the buck.

Magenta

plumbball wrote: »

You must be a repo man or a debt collector.

Nope, I work in tech!

NegativeCreep

Delighted to see pharmaceuticals still going strong hope it stays that way though :P

Jellicoe

Lars1916 wrote: »

Winners: The Blueshirts, Labour, Bankers and Bondholders
Losers: The rest of the country

+ 1, but don't forget Seanie, Fitzie, Bertie, Quinn, Dunner and pals are laughing at us all the way to their tax free cayman Island bank a/c's as well. The corrupt wealthy scum of this country just get richer and richer at eveyone elses expense, and now FG and Labour are looking after them instead of FF.

woodoo

Grumpypants wrote: »

Lots of things are cheaper except food, petrol, oil, electricity, gas, home & car & health insurance, medicine and clothing.

But you can get an hours paint balling for a tenner so its swings and roundabouts.

I have found food and clothing have got a lot cheaper. I don't have health insurance, homes are cheaper to buy, lots of deals on cars.

plumbball

Fromthetrees wrote: »

My friend needed a suit for a wedding there a few weeks ago, he was going to rent one but sauntered into a suit shop to have a look, tried one on, said, I'll give ya a ton for it, the manager said fine, he got it nearly half price.
I wouldn't be able for haggling but love a good deal nowadays. I still spend the same, just get more bang for the buck.

I never would have tried it in a clothes shop. But why not, I know they get the gear for as little as nothing.

washman3

Winners : the rats that left the sinking ship that was the Fianna Fail/Greens/ corrupt independents and did'nt bother to seek re-election as they knew the game was up anyway. so they "retired" on massive pensions and lump sums.
One former minister from Waterford has retired to sunny Florida on a pension of €120,000 a year. So if the average property tax is €500 per houshold next year this means that 240 households will be paying for this guys pension.
Or put another way, every cent collected in some village in his native county will fund his pension. Of course these people will be told that this tax will help provide "services" Mind boggling indeed.

Losers : people who were on a fixed income before and during the "Celtic Tiger".
those that had to pay top dollar for almost everything because of the "demand". Not only did the boom bypass these people,it actually cost them money. And the ultimate kick in the teeth to these unfortunate citizens is that many of them are now unemployed.

woodoo

68Murph68 wrote: »

With the labour laws in Ireland I don't know why anyone would pay union dues.

Complete waste of money in my eyes.

Personally I don't know anyone who has got any benefit from being a member of a union.

If there had been no unions now the PS wages would have been butchered.

Jellicoe

woodoo wrote: »

If there had been no unions now the PS wages would have been butchered.

Why do you really think the cuts are over for ordinary employees in the public service ? How will the corrupt fat cats in the golden cirlce continue to divert attention from themselves and save their own necks otherwise ?

All employees wages must be driven down to ensure the rich get richer.
They can't drive down the private sector wages any further without driving down the ordinary public sector wages first.

The cuts have only begun.