new to farming... need a bit of help

newfarmer2012

Hey guys, im taking over a dairy farm, and havent a clue about calving - grew up on a farm so not totally alien to it,:) but have little or no experience of calving. Been working in banking for 13 years after college so big changes ahead! Going back to the cows in a few months so have alot to learn, spring calving herd so a bit of time to learn a few things. Would anyone with an autumn calving herd be willing to show me the ropes so to speak anywhere around meath? Cheers lads.

just do it

I'm no use to you but if you post what county you're in you might have better luck . Best of luck with it.

2 pieces of advice: get to know your neighbours, and until you're comfortable call the vet whenever you're worried. You'll only ever regret not calling him and he'll help educate you.

newfarmer2012

thanks for that.... oops yeah... it would help i suppose if lads knew where I am!

jimmydkid

Get an easy calving bull and invest in a calving jack, you will make mistakes as you go but life is all about learning, Good luck with it

49801

Feed cow s minerals 6 weeks prior to calving start.
Don't over feed cows... Over fat cows have difficulty calving.
Fit cows are less likely to have difficulty so excercise is a bonus.
So try to avoid having them locked in the shed for a long winter in an over stocked pen.

For the calving itself it's all about progress. I have a 2hr rule of thumb.
2hrs from water blister to calving. And 2hrs from calving to suckling calves.

Get to know your neighbours and vet. Don't be afraid to call either of them.

pakalasa

The big one is not to overfeed. You're more likely to do that when you haven't the experience.

Here's a bit of the theory but nothing like actually doing it.
http://www.cvmbs.colostate.edu/ilm/proinfo/calving/notes/home.htm
Here's the full Table Of Contents
http://www.cvmbs.colostate.edu/ilm/proinfo/calving/notes/table.htm

Timmaay

Are you in a discussion group at the minute? Not every farmer I know share the same opinion as me here, but Teagasc have been of great help to me, and my local discussion group has been a great source of information, I can throw out any questions as such and I'll get an answer quick enough pointing me in the right ballpark from my Teagasc adviser and the other local farmers. Surely one of them are in winter milk and willing to let you see they pan out things.

In terms of calving, by now this wont help you for cows calving next spring, but keeping as tight a calving pattern as possible makes everything way easier, the early calves are generally all grand, but the later born calves in April/May often end up not doing nearly as well as the early calves for two main reasons, any diseases that have build up in the sheds, like scour etc from the earlier calves will still be present often and the later calves will be more likely to come down with something, and then also, you are usually just sick of dealing with calves by then ha so give them less attention then the earlier ones!

Black Smoke

And you are clear that farming is better than banking :eek: It's just a question, caus one thing is absolutely certain, the work load, hardship, long hours, unpredicatable income, crap weather, have to be balanced against the good aspects of farming and the comfortable job of banking.
And you will need an understanding, accomodating bank manager:cool:
But I guess you have that covered:P

bob charles

Are you serious, you don't know much about calving cows yet you are due to start your own herd milking next spring

just do it

How about hiring an experienced farm hand for 6 months? Forget about drawing money for the first year until you get a handle on things

bob charles

just do it wrote: »

How about hiring an experienced farm hand for 6 months? Forget about drawing money for the first year until you get a handle on things

forget about drawing money, most years in farming

farmboy1130

There are a couple of good calving books out there, i will give you links to both. I own both of them and the advice given in them is good, with plenty of pictures and illustrations. one of them is written by a English vet, the other is written by an American women that owns a large cattle ranch in America, both are very experienced cattle people and know what they are talking about, although the two books have different approaches and remedy's on certain things ; i think its worth having both. although, the go to book for me most of the time would be the American book ( called the essential guide to calving).
There is also interesting chapters in the books about cattle reproduction and dealing with the different challenges and problems new calf's can sometimes bring. Although reading about calving is very useful, practical experience is vital as well, so before you start calving the cows, try and maybe get some old quiet cull cow and do an interval examination,(ie: stick your hand in her vagina, and have a good feel about !) get used to the territory ; so to speak. Also get some of your neighbors or relatives that are good at calving cows and get them to show you how to use a jack etc, but be careful, a man can do a lot of damage with a jack, and plenty of men that have misused them have killed calves or maybe have broken legs of calves getting them out, become knowledge about jacks, and buy the best one you can afford, a vink calving jack is one of the best. but remember the old saying ; "an ounce of lubrication is worth a ton of pressure." stay curious and keep asking questions; if you find a man that's very knowledgeable about calving, beat a path to his door and if he has any cows having problems calving; tell him to ring you, so you can go down to his yard and see him in action getting the calf out, just don't ask him questions about the event and his technique until he is finished doing the job, because you might disturb his concentration while he is working. he wont mind you being there,because the more hands available when calving a cow, the better ; you would be a good help to him.

http://www.bookdepository.co.uk/Essential-Guide-Calving-Heather-Smith-Thomas/9781580177061

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Calving-Cow-Care-Calf-5th/dp/1861264798/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1347050249&sr=1-1

JohnBoy

easy bob, sometimes in life things change unexpectedly.

I'd agree, get onto teagasc and find out about your local discussion group, and ask about the autumn calving herds, you're bound to find someone local who'd take the help.

newfarmer2012

Black Smoke wrote: »

And you are clear that farming is better than banking :eek: It's just a question, caus one thing is absolutely certain, the work load, hardship, long hours, unpredicatable income, crap weather, have to be balanced against the good aspects of farming and the comfortable job of banking.
And you will need an understanding, accomodating bank manager:cool:
But I guess you have that covered:P

Hey thanks for your message and thanks to everyone else... yeah lots of people think im mad, but I'm getting a pretty decent farm and a good dairy herd. The man who is currently farming is going to Australia with his family and I have bought the lot! I'm really looking forward to taking it on, yes its a big change from banking, but sitting in the IFSC in a suit everyday, trading currencies just doesnt do it for me! So bring its good bye to the suits, hello to the wellies ........... well from December onwards!

bob charles

newfarmer2012 wrote: »

Hey thanks for your message and thanks to everyone else... yeah lots of people think im mad, but I'm getting a pretty decent farm and a good dairy herd. The man who is currently farming is going to Australia with his family and I have bought the lot! I'm really looking forward to taking it on, yes its a big change from banking, but sitting in the IFSC in a suit everyday, trading currencies just doesnt do it for me! So bring its good bye to the suits, hello to the wellies ........... well from December onwards!

A top farm manager is what you need for the first 12 months to show you the rops. otherwise things could very quickly decent into disaster for man and beast. Best of luck

dar31

get into teagasc asap.

have a talk to the dairy adviser, get him to source a few autumn herds to contact, plenty up that neck of the woods.
get into a discussion group through teagasc,you will get a bit of jeering and strange looks mostly friendly, as the new guy to farming, but if you have the balls to move from good job in the bank to milking cows, then this wont be a problem to you.

there will be probably be a few discussion groups around, try get your self into the better of them. some were only set up for the DEP scheme, and the flow of information might not be as good.
see if one of the members would be willing to mentor you for the first year, you would have to prove your self fairly quick, or you will get left to the way side.
good luck

there is always boards.ie and a pinch of salt.

dar31

bob charles wrote: »

A top farm manager is what you need for the first 12 months to show you the rops. otherwise things could very quickly decent into disaster for man and beast. Best of luck

good idea, but will depend greatly on the size of the farm

Viewtodiefor

dar31 wrote: »

bob charles wrote: »

A top farm manager is what you need for the first 12 months to show you the rops. otherwise things could very quickly decent into disaster for man and beast. Best of luck

good idea, but will depend greatly on the size of the farm

Keep your job and rent the land!!! Your mad to do anything else!! Unless it's over 150acres of good land with a good layout,cows and no debt already in place. Oh ya if you do u will need a manager for first year!

whelan1

newfarmer2012 wrote: »

Hey guys, im taking over a dairy farm, and havent a clue about calving - grew up on a farm so not totally alien to it,:) but have little or no experience of calving. Been working in banking for 13 years after college so big changes ahead! Going back to the cows in a few months so have alot to learn, spring calving herd so a bit of time to learn a few things. Would anyone with an autumn calving herd be willing to show me the ropes so to speak anywhere around meath? Cheers lads.

what part of meath are you in? pm me if you want,i am near collon

dar31

Viewtodiefor wrote: »

Keep your job and rent the land!!! Your mad to do anything else!! Unless it's over 150acres of good land with a good layout,cows and no debt already in place. Oh ya if you do u will need a manager for first year!

think thats already a given,

newfarmer2012

farmboy1130 wrote: »

There are a couple of good calving books out there, i will give you links to both. I own both of them and the advice given in them is good, with plenty of pictures and illustrations. one of them is written by a English vet, the other is written by an American women that owns a large cattle ranch in America, both are very experienced cattle people and know what they are talking about, although the two books have different approaches and remedy's on certain things ; i think its worth having both. although, the go to book for me most of the time would be the American book ( called the essential guide to calving).
There is also interesting chapters in the books about cattle reproduction and dealing with the different challenges and problems new calf's can sometimes bring. Although reading about calving is very useful, practical experience is vital as well, so before you start calving the cows, try and maybe get some old quiet cull cow and do an interval examination,(ie: stick your hand in her vagina, and have a good feel about !) get used to the territory ; so to speak. Also get some of your neighbors or relatives that are good at calving cows and get them to show you how to use a jack etc, but be careful, a man can do a lot of damage with a jack, and plenty of men that have misused them have killed calves or maybe have broken legs of calves getting them out, become knowledge about jacks, and buy the best one you can afford, a vink calving jack is one of the best. but remember the old saying ; "an ounce of lubrication is worth a ton of pressure." stay curious and keep asking questions; if you find a man that's very knowledgeable about calving, beat a path to his door and if he has any cows having problems calving; tell him to ring you, so you can go down to his yard and see him in action getting the calf out, just don't ask him questions about the event and his technique until he is finished doing the job, because you might disturb his concentration while he is working. he wont mind you being there,because the more hands available when calving a cow, the better ; you would be a good help to him.

http://www.bookdepository.co.uk/Essential-Guide-Calving-Heather-Smith-Thomas/9781580177061

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Calving-Cow-Care-Calf-5th/dp/1861264798/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1347050249&sr=1-1

look like good books alright, have a few already, have been on to Teagasc and am still looking for someone around to help out when I move onto the place. Want to have a bit of practice before I do all that though - can give anyone a hand a few weekends and all that...... not finishing at the bank until end of November as I'm on a few months notice period!

Bizzum

newfarmer2012 wrote: »

look like good books alright, have a few already, have been on to Teagasc and am still looking for someone around to help out when I move onto the place. Want to have a bit of practice before I do all that though - can give anyone a hand a few weekends and all that...... not finishing at the bank until end of November as I'm on a few months notice period!

Maybe the previous owner can tell you who to talk to locally and who to avoid! Had he maybe somebody locally that he used to get to lend a hand?

Best of luck with your venture.

newfarmer2012

Bizzum wrote: »

Maybe the previous owner can tell you who to talk to locally and who to avoid! Had he maybe somebody locally that he used to get to lend a hand?

Best of luck with your venture.

thanks very much, im afraid, that the nearest working farm is about 4 miles away and the man is getting on in years there,have a Teagasc contact now and getting places!

Farfield

Well, newfarmer - just joined ur link. I am an accountant fulltime and started dairying back in feb this year and love it. Yes there are bad days and it can have serious disappointments, but its a real good life. Now i have not given up the day job, i have kept both going and basically have a full time (part time) worker who is a very good help and knows all about the show.

Best of luck. Get yourself an experienced helper though.

How many acres/cows u going to milk??

just do it

Newfarmer
The more I think of you newfarmer the more I think fair duece to you. You've jacked in a job you obviously hate and taken a lifestyle choice that you know will for the first few years take up every waking minute of your day (and a good few of the sleeping ones as well!). Don't be too concerned about jumping in at the deep end, it is ultimately the best way to learn. Your putting the pieces together now well in advance of the Spring and whilst it will be mayhem I think you'll enjoy it.
Best of luck and keep milk this forum for what it's worth. I took over the family farm in '08 after it been rented for near on 30yrs and don't regret it. This forum has been hugely helpful, regardless how simple or stupid a question might seem. Keep a regular eye on sticky threads like farming chit chat and livestock pictures and you'll be constantly picking up tips.

1chippy

I say fair play to both of you. Do what you love. i'm still getting stick for working both and hopefully will be able to make the farming more full time as time goes on. I can guarantee you nearly all the part timers here would rather be fulltime if their circumstances were right.

just do it

Some tips:

• From a financial perspective making a profit out of farming I believe is all about cost control. One tip I picked up from an article in Journal a few years ago was before you buy anything, ask yourself will it make any return for you? (4 rail stud fencing comes to mind;))
• Avoid debt as much as possible. A mate of mine switched into dairying last year and put up a simple parlour with all the gear for ~€35k max at a guess. I know another lad who've saddled themselves with a loan of €120k for an equivalent, but shiner, parlour
• Be patient with cattle, they're more intelligent that most give them credit for
• As you get to know you're new farm be slow to make changes. Instead ask yourself why was it set up this way in the first place? (On my own place a particular trench comes to mind that I thought my dad was mad to have placed where it is. Only last year the penny dropped as to it's value. I'm just glad I hadn't gotten around to changing it)
• Don't spend a penny on machinery, get contractors to do all that for you. You need to concentrate on getting the most out of your cows and that takes time

You know I'm a bit jealous of you!

kerryjack

For fuc.k sake farming is not rocket science and an old poker saying comes to mind you will learn as you loose as for calving let them out side give them plenty of time and 95% of them will calve no bother , My ould lad use to keep them in watching them , checking them, and going in too early and causing all kinds of problems and he was an experienced farmer with no patience

newfarmer2012

Farfield wrote: »

Well, newfarmer - just joined ur link. I am an accountant fulltime and started dairying back in feb this year and love it. Yes there are bad days and it can have serious disappointments, but its a real good life. Now i have not given up the day job, i have kept both going and basically have a full time (part time) worker who is a very good help and knows all about the show.

Best of luck. Get yourself an experienced helper though.

How many acres/cows u going to milk??

Hey there.... currently there is 120 acres and going to milk 95 cows, its a well laid out place and the current owner rents about 25 acres next door. have a good slatted house built about 4 years ago and a nice set-up for rearing calves. i will try and find some help, but with the recession and that, alot of lads have gone overseas to work and not much help around the area i'm told. I suppose i should find a good accountant as well!!

pakalasa

kerryjack wrote: »

....For fuc.k sake farming is not rocket science and an old poker saying comes to mind....

...Has to be one of the funniest posts on here.

Farfield

Holy Sh1t New Farmer, you are defo going for baptism of fire big time - that must have cost a fortune to buy all that. I am at about 40 cows now and want to get to 60-70 ish, but thats probably about it. I also rear the beef calves from the herd and intend to sell them in the spring mostly as forward stores, though theres a lot of work to rearing them.
Are you intending to sell your calves? 95cows on 150ish acres will be tight enough and get all your silage of it as well.

newfarmer2012

Farfield wrote: »

Holy Sh1t New Farmer, you are defo going for baptism of fire big time - that must have cost a fortune to buy all that. I am at about 40 cows now and want to get to 60-70 ish, but thats probably about it. I also rear the beef calves from the herd and intend to sell them in the spring mostly as forward stores, though theres a lot of work to rearing them.
Are you intending to sell your calves? 95cows on 150ish acres will be tight enough and get all your silage of it as well.

Hey there... holy sh1t, yeah thats what everyone at work says! Not sure about how many cows going forward...... might take them down, the current owner has an out farm as well but has sold that to someone else. So I'm working out what winter/spring 2013/2014 might look like at the moment. There is no set up really for keeping calves on so the plan would be to sell them. I also need to get my head around breeding/bulls/AI and all that.......but my priority is to calve all the cows, without loosing any of em to my lack of skills.......... I'm actually thinking of starting a blog..... im sure I will have plenty of time on my hands during the winter as i swop dublin city for the countryside!

49801

newfarmer2012 wrote: »

Hey there... holy sh1t, yeah thats what everyone at work says! Not sure about how many cows going forward...... might take them down, the current owner has an out farm as well but has sold that to someone else. So I'm working out what winter/spring 2013/2014 might look like at the moment. There is no set up really for keeping calves on so the plan would be to sell them. I also need to get my head around breeding/bulls/AI and all that.......but my priority is to calve all the cows, without loosing any of em to my lack of skills.......... I'm actually thinking of starting a blog..... im sure I will have plenty of time on my hands during the winter as i swop dublin city for the countryside!

fair play to you!!!
just remember that calving is a totally natural occurrence and any intervention should be undertaken if there is evidence there is need of it.

I'd suggest you use a stock bull/s for the first year or so. you dont want the headache of AI while your learning everything else. The Bulls have more than a financial incentive to do the job right;)

tiger21

Fair play newfarmer, best of luck. I hope to take over the home farm in the next 4 or 5 yrs, so this thread is of interest. The blog should make interesting reading if you do it

Farfield

New farmer, the blog would be of interest to me, count me in:).

Username John

he he - a blog is a nice idea... but I would say you might have some long hard days ahead of you... and the idea of having to sit down for a while to write up your day, well, I wouldn't be long dropping it I'd say... and just sitting down having a beer or a cup o tea or something instead

newfarmer2012

tiger21 wrote: »

Fair play newfarmer, best of luck. I hope to take over the home farm in the next 4 or 5 yrs, so this thread is of interest. The blog should make interesting reading if you do it

cheers tiger..... i hope to have some time to do it... will only take it on if I can give it enough attention!

tippgal84

Any updates new farmer? Would love to know how youre getting on and if you are blogging?