Embassy hasnt paid staff in months

stephendona

Hi guys,just need some advice.I have a "friend" {SNIP} who is employed by {AN} embassy in Dublin.He has been working with them for a few years I believe.He is due to get paid every month but has not received anything for a few months now.He has no family here in Ireland and he is living by borrowing money from friends.

It's not just him by the way no staff have received any payment for months.These are both Irish and {SNIP} european.They continually get promised payment by the ambassador but nothing.There is one guy working there who now lives in a homeless shelter as he couldnt pay his rent.The ambassador claims that the {FOREIGN} government dont have any funds and no embassies or consulates have been paid.

My question is where should my friend go to seek help.Would it be the department of foreign affairs etc.. Thanks for your help

Solair

A good place to start would be : http://www.employmentrights.ie/en/

ANXIOUS

Solair wrote: »

A good place to start would be : http://www.employmentrights.ie/en/

Would that ply seeing as how it is technically a different country?

Solair

I suppose it would depend under which legal system the contracts were drawn up.

If they're technically not in Ireland, then I'm not sure what they could do other than perhaps go on strike and look for other work?

Do they have any kind of trade union ?

coylemj

The staff need to join a trade union and probably go on strike, there is no way they can take any kind of legal action because of diplomatic immunity.

A diplomat in the same embassy crashed into an Irish guy a few months ago, the incident was reported to the Gardai who arrived whereupon the diplomat (from the safety of the embassy garden) publicly berated the crash victim and the Gardai, played the race card (effectively any white man who accuses a black man of anything is a racist) and basically told them all to eff off. The cops needless to say could do nothing and by all account the locals (Leeson Park, D4) can't wait to see the back of them.

Joe Duffy program ( 8 minutes).....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzd4eBaR7h8

Not a nice bunch of people to deal with.

mikemac1

Dodgy Nigerians :eek:



http://www.citizensinformation.ie
Very helpful website and there are offices your friend can go into
http://centres.citizensinformation.ie/county.php?county=dublin


If he doesn't feel confident making phonecalls to NERA and other agencies then the staff in the office are happy to make a call on his behalf

stephendona

thanks,yea they think they can get away with anything.From what I hear the old ambassador was decent enough but she left and was replaced by this new guy.There are only 1 or 2 staff in the embassy all week as the rest cant afford to even travel to work.They are planning a protest but I doubt whether that will make any difference.

I find it inconceivable that a government embassy can do this.One thing i'm sure of is that the ambassador himself is doing just fine

mikemac1

Write to a newspaper?

It's a controversial topic, might shame them into sorting it

At the same time it might get your friend suddenly let go so maybe not the best idea

But a newspaper would definitely cover it

MadsL

coylemj wrote: »

The staff need to join a trade union and probably go on strike, there is no way they can take any kind of legal action because of diplomatic immunity.

A diplomat in the same embassy crashed into an Irish guy a few months ago, the incident was reported to the Gardai who arrived whereupon the diplomat (from the safety of the embassy garden) publicly berated the crash victim and the Gardai, played the race card (effectively any white man who accuses a black man of anything is a racist) and basically told them all to eff off. The cops needless to say could do nothing and by all account the locals (Leeson Park, D4) can't wait to see the back of them.

Joe Duffy program ( 8 minutes).....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzd4eBaR7h8

Not a nice bunch of people to deal with.

That incident says more about diplomatic immunity than Nigerians.

mikemac1 wrote: »

Dodgy Nigerians :eek:



http://www.citizensinformation.ie
Very helpful website and there are offices your friend can go into
http://centres.citizensinformation.ie/county.php?county=dublin


If he doesn't feel confident making phonecalls to NERA and other agencies then the staff in the office are happy to make a call on his behalf

Since embassies are technically not Irish soil, the contracts probably do not reference Irish law. If this case comes up to the courts it will be an interesting case.

As your friend has not been paid, I would also advise them to ring Revenue to see if PRSI has been paid properly.

stephendona

Thanks lads,we were in contact with 2 journalists on friday.Spoke to one of them today and they have been unable to make any contact with the embassy.Just to add,the staff are not in any trade union.They were told on friday that 100% they would be paid first thing this morning but as per normal received nothing.I drove my friend from here in Meath to Dublin this morning,we waited around for 3 hours and no sign of ambassador.Outside there was an irish sub contractor who is owed in excess of 10g

coylemj

MadsL wrote: »

That incident says more about diplomatic immunity than Nigerians.

Complete tosh, it says a lot about about how the Nigerians abuse diplomatic immunity.

If a US or UK diplomat behaved like that they would be packed off home pronto.

coylemj

stephendona wrote: »

Thanks lads,we were in contact with 2 journalists on friday.Spoke to one of them today and they have been unable to make any contact with the embassy.Just to add,the staff are not in any trade union.They were told on friday that 100% they would be paid first thing this morning but as per normal received nothing.I drove my friend from here in Meath to Dublin this morning,we waited around for 3 hours and no sign of ambassador.Outside there was an irish sub contractor who is owed in excess of 10g

You might consider contacting the Dept of Foreign Affairs or better still, visit the minister at one of his clinics and talk to him face to face....

http://www.gilmore.ie/clinics.html

Grolschevik

Fortuitously, I was just reading this report of a European Court of Justice ruling. I'll bold the good parts:

Case C-154/11, Ahmed Mahamdia v Algeria, 19 July 2012

The applicant has both Algerian and German nationality. He worked for the Algerian state as a driver at its embassy in Berlin. He was dismissed and contested this before the German courts, claiming compensation. Algeria argued that, as a foreign state, it enjoys immunity from German jurisdiction. It also relied on a clause in his contract providing that, in the event of a dispute, only the Algerian courts were to have jurisdiction. This appeared to conflict with regulation 44/2001, which allows an employee to sue an employer domiciled outside the EU in the courts of the member state in which the employer’s ‘establishment’ in which the employee works is situated.

The CJEU held that the regulation applied to a contract of employment with an embassy where the functions carried out by the employee do not fall within the exercise of public powers. It then found that an embassy of a non-EU state is an ‘establishment’ within the meaning of the regulation. Like any other public entity, the embassy can acquire rights and obligation of a civil nature. This is the case where it concludes contracts of employment with persons who do not perform functions that fall within the exercise of public power. An embassy may be equated with a centre of operations that has the appearance of permanency, as required by the regulation. An employment dispute has a sufficient link with the functioning of the embassy with respect to the management of its staff. State immunity is not absolute. It is generally recognised where the dispute concerns sovereign acts. It may be excluded, by contract, if the legal proceedings relate to acts that do not fall within the exercise of public powers. Thus, state immunity does not preclude the application of regulation 44/2001 to an employment dispute, where the court before which the case is brought finds that the functions carried out by the employee do not fall within the exercise of public powers.

The court held that an agreement on jurisdiction concluded before a dispute arises cannot prevent an employee from bringing proceedings before the court that has jurisdiction under the special rules for employees in the regulation. If it were otherwise, the objective of protecting the employee as the weaker party to the contract would not be attained.

coylemj

I repeat that if a diplomat standing in the grounds of his embassy can shout at and verbally abuse the local cops over a minor traffic accident which he refuses to acknowledge was his fault (the other car was parked at the time), what hope does the OP's friend have in taking an action in the civil courts under employment legislation?

Like, if he wins the case, what happens next?

MadsL

coylemj wrote: »

Complete tosh, it says a lot about about how the Nigerians abuse diplomatic immunity.

If a US or UK diplomat behaved like that they would be packed off home pronto.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/diplomat-charged-with-drink-driving-2405084.html

Care to also have a rant about Ukranians?

Goose81

coylemj wrote: »

The staff need to join a trade union and probably go on strike, there is no way they can take any kind of legal action because of diplomatic immunity.

A diplomat in the same embassy crashed into an Irish guy a few months ago, the incident was reported to the Gardai who arrived whereupon the diplomat (from the safety of the embassy garden) publicly berated the crash victim and the Gardai, played the race card (effectively any white man who accuses a black man of anything is a racist) and basically told them all to eff off. The cops needless to say could do nothing and by all account the locals (Leeson Park, D4) can't wait to see the back of them.

Joe Duffy program ( 8 minutes).....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzd4eBaR7h8

Not a nice bunch of people to deal with.

He should have smashed the Nigerians car to bits that night.

coylemj

MadsL wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/diplomat-charged-with-drink-driving-2405084.html

Care to also have a rant about Ukranians?

This thread is about the Nigerian Embassy, stop deflecting the issue to suit your agenda.

You can call it a 'rant', I say that the general behaviour and contempt for local laws shown by the staff of the Nigerian Embassy is a relevant issue for me to raise in the context of the thread topic.

Delancey

Nigeria is a byword for corruption , nothing their diplomats do would surprise me.

Procrastastudy

Where is Danny Glover when you need him?

MadsL

coylemj wrote: »

suit your agenda

Which would be what exactly?

my friend

MadsL wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/diplomat-charged-with-drink-driving-2405084.html

Care to also have a rant about Ukranians?

your whataboutery is actually revealing your inner racist.

wise up.

MadsL

my friend wrote: »

your whataboutery is actually revealing your inner racist.

wise up.

Lol, seriously. Poster makes comment basically saying if a diplomat from UK or US tried this they would be expelled. I posted a similar incident from a different embassy and invited comment. Pissed up and ignorant diplomats are not the issue of this thread, nor are they restricted to the Nigerian nation.

Inner racist, me hole.

ABajaninCork

Not being funny, but the Nigerian Embassy are notorious for not paying parking tickets or the Congestion charge in London too.

Another embassy that doesn't like paying parking tickets or charges is the US embassy oddly enough.

I have to say I've never heard of them not paying the staff though. I'm no expert, but I don't think a court case will work either as diplomatic privilege will be claimed.

As a matter of interest. When working in the Diplomatic Corps are contracts drawn up under local law or do the laws of the country's embassy you're working for apply?

Our man in Havana

When working in the Diplomatic Corps are contracts drawn up under local law or do the laws of the country's embassy you're working for apply?

What ever law that suits them applies, generally it will be the law of the country you are working for as it is their sovereign territory.

MadsL

15. Wages shall become due and payable at the end of each period for which the contract is expressed to subsist, that is to say, daily, weekly or at such other period as may be agreed upon:

Provided that, where the period is more than one month, the wages shall become due and payable at intervals not exceeding one month.

http://www.nigeria-law.org/LabourAct.htm

Also some interesting provisions here;

44. Where a worker is recruited for employment outside Nigeria, it shall be the duty of the employer to provide facilities at his own expense to enable the worker's family (not exceeding two wives and such of his children under the age of sixteen years as he wishes to accompany him) to accompany him to the place of employment and to remain there for the full duration of the contract:

Provided that, if the contract is for less than one year, provision may be made for the family to remain for less than the full duration of the contract.

Enforcement provisions
.

45. (1) No person shall by fraud, falsehood, intimidation, coercion or misrepresentation induce any worker to enter into a contract under this Part, and any contract entered into by reason of any such inducement shall be void, save that the employer or his agent shall be liable to pay wages due under the contract and to provide for the return to his place of abode of any worker engaged thereunder, together with any members of his family who have accompanied him.

(2) If the employer or his agent fails to pay the wages in question or to provide for the return of the worker and the members of his family in accordance with subsection (1) of this section, the wages shall be paid, and the expenses of the return shall be borne, by the Federal Government, and real be recovered by that Government from the employer or his agent by deduction from any deposit or security given under section 24 (7) of this Act or by civil proceedings.

81. (1) Where-
(a) an employer or worker neglects or refuses to fulfil a contract; or

(b) any question, difference or dispute arises as to the rights or liabilities of a party to a contract or touching any misconduct, neglect, ill-treatment or injury to the person or property of a party to a contract,

any party to the contract feeling himself aggrieved may make complaint to a court having jurisdiction, which may thereupon issue a summons to the party complained against (the aggrieved party, the court, the party complained against and the complaint being hereafter in this section and in sections 82 to 85 of this Act referred to as "the complainant", "the court", "the respondent" and "the complaint" respectively).

IrishAm

The new lad in charge is probably on the stroke. Encourage your pals to get legal representation and spook him. Once they get their hard earned cash, they should probably leave and find other employment.

Victor

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Not being funny, but the Nigerian Embassy are notorious for not paying parking tickets or the Congestion charge in London too.

Another embassy that doesn't like paying parking tickets or charges is the US embassy oddly enough

All embassies are immune from such things. So pay, some don't. Regardless, it is the obligation of the host country to vindicate the rights of the embassy.

Magic Pips

Now i feel guilty... i didnt help the king of nigeria move his money out of his country...

ABajaninCork

Victor wrote: »

All embassies are immune from such things. So pay, some don't. Regardless, it is the obligation of the host country to vindicate the rights of the embassy.

Yes and no. According to the Mayor of London and the FO, the embassies ARE liable for the charges. But The Americans apparently take the view the charges are not applicable because of the diplomatic privilege.

That's why parking tickets and tow charges aren't paid by them either.

coylemj

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Yes and no. According to the Mayor of London and the FO, the embassies ARE liable for the charges. But The Americans apparently take the view the charges are not applicable because of the diplomatic privilege.

That's why parking tickets and tow charges aren't paid by them either.

The US Embassy in London refuses to pay the London congestion charge which they regard as a tax from which they are exempt, they claim that they do pay parking tickets and speeding fines.....

A US statement said: "The US Embassy in London conscientiously abides by all UK laws, including paying fines for all traffic violations, such as parking and speeding violations.

"Our position on the direct tax established by Transport for London in 2003, more commonly known as the congestion charge, is based on the 1960 Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, which prohibits the direct taxation of diplomatic missions."

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3592594/US-owe-us-5m-parking-fines.html

silverharp

I came across this in a google search, obviously not just Dublin


http://www.vanguardngr.com/2012/08/paucity-of-funds-stalls-pay-of-nigerian-embassy-officials-in-switzerland/

OFFICIALS and staff of Nigerian embassy in Geneva, Switzerland have not been paid their salaries since January, following alleged failure of the Federal Government to release funds to ministries including Foreign Affairs.

Investigation revealed that the fall out of this development is that families have had their insurance stopped even as landlords are threatening to evict them.

A source in the ministry of labour attributed the situation to lack of funds. The source confirmed that the ministry’s representative at the International Labour Organisation, ILO, Mr. Peter Ajuzie has not been able to secure funds since he arrived Abuja from Geneva in June.