Is it normal for Insurance companies to rip you off when you change your car?

Snake Plisken

Have been driving a 02 Punto 1.2ltr and renewed my insurance last month, but decided to trade it in last week and bought a 2010 1.6ltr tdci deisel. The insurance on the punto fully comp was 350 6 years no claims bonus,through chill.ie insurance provide is wrightway and name on disc is Zurich. Anyway in the garage finalizing paperwork and we ring the insurance company to transfer over the insurance value on the Focus is 15000, now I though it would be at max 100 euros extra, but no €205 extra bringing it up to €555:eek:
Anyway needed the insurance so had to pay. Went home got a quote online on chill for same car €386. So I ring them and they tell me nothing you can do as no mid-term changes allowed in other words tough luck.
So just checking to see if this is the case, and there's nothing I cand do before renewing next summer.

Thanks

Skuxx

Tbh it's a big change! The value of the punto would have been about €1000, up to a car worth €15000!! Also a 1.2 up to a reasonably pokey 1.6 diesel I wouldn't feel you were ripped off! I wouldn't have expected it to be anymore than 200ish at the same time!
Also how long is left on the policy??

Just saw your renewal is next summer, so at least 9/10 months away!! Don't think you got ripped off at all!!

Also...if your not happy you don't have to pay, your entitled to cancel the insurance and go to someone else afaik!!

bazz26

It varies on the car that you are upgrading to, you have gone from a 10 year old 1.2 supermini to a 2 year old 1.6 small family car. There is both a decent increase in power and substantial increase in value of the car you are insuring, there was bound to be a fair difference in the premium between both.

Personally I think you got off lightly with just an increase of €205 given the difference in both cars. Next time though it is more prudent to look into these things prior to buying the car as it gives you more options rather than after the event.

Schorpio

I'm sorry, what?! No way should the price have gone up that much! The OP has 6 years claim free driving. Just because she's gone from a 1.2 petrol to a 1.6 diesel does not warrant such an increase. I'd imagine the diesel isn't much more powerful anyway. And also, just because her new car is more valuable also doesn't justify the increase. It's only €15k after all. Plus the OP is likely to be more careful with his/her new car imo.

A €15k 1.6 diesel focus on a policy with 6 yrs no claims should not cost half a grand to insure. Also, when the OP checked online they got a quote of €386 which is far more reasonable.

If I were you OP I'd be looking to see if you can cancel your current policy and get the money for your remaining term refunded. I'm not sure if you can do that, but the only way these insurance companies are going to learn is if people like yourself vote with your feet.

Skuxx

Schorpio wrote: »

A €15k 1.6 diesel focus on a policy with 6 yrs no claims should not cost half a grand to insure. Also, when the OP checked online they got a quote of €386 which is far more reasonable.

How can you say that when you know nothing about the OP!! I have a €2k 1.9 diesel golf with 4 years no claims and it costs €1600 to insure, going by your logic it shouldn't cost that much to insure, but it does, cause I'm a 21 year old lad and I get shafted!!
We don't know the OP's age/ job/ where she lives etc so it's crazy to say how much it should cost!!

the_syco

Snake Plisken wrote: »

So I ring them and they tell me nothing you can do as no mid-term changes allowed in other words tough luck.

I would email them, and query the excessive markup, compared to the price that you had gotten on the website.

djimi

First question would be did you not think to check with your insurance how much the car was going to cost to buy before you went ahead and bought it?

If youre only a month or two into the new year of the policy and you know that you can get it significantly cheaper elsewhere then Id cancel the policy now and get a refund. Youll lose the month or two of NCB that you have build up this year but if it means saving a couple of hundred quid then its worth it. Youre not tied into an insurer once you take out a policy.

john.west

I think my own scenario is just as extreme as OP's if not even more extreme. I am a 31 year old guy and have 5 years NCB in my own name and a full clean license held for over 10 years.

I took out insurance at the start of March with 123.ie. A 1997 Carina E 1.6 litre valued at €1k. Premium was €315 for TPF&T. Not an excessive premium. Bought a 01' 1.6 VVTI Avensis and going to change over the insurance at the start of September. It'll cost me €130 extra to change. I'm keeping the level of cover the same and car value the same at €1k.

Considering I am more than half way through the insurance year and my initial premium was only €315 I think its perhaps more extreme than the OP's scenario. To change to a 2001 1.4 litre VW Golf valued at a grand also 123.ie were looking for an additional €140!

I appreciate that there was always going to be a €40 admin fee charge with them if I wanted to change the car or a particular on the policy part way through the year. Knew this when I was taking out insurance with them and partly guessed I would have to change the car part way through the year. I do think the additional €90 is a bit of a p!sstake though. For brokers such as 123.ie and chill.ie I think here is where the real gravy is for them...

Stoolbend

In all fairness with 123.ie its basically an administration charge for everything. That's how they can offer it so cheap in the first place.

Bohrio

Well difference just in power is going from 62 hp to 88-110 hp. So that's an increase of around 25-45% give or take.

Also a 1.2 10 year old Punto its probably value around 1000 euro if not less whether the 1.6 is probably 10-15 times more expensive.

Before I got my RS4 I had a Peugeot 1.0 1996. I had 3 year no claim bonus as a main driver, insurance went up from 540 to 2250 euro. The RS4 was valued on 32000 euro.

Funny enough my insurance has gone down from 2250 to 770 this year. I was expecting an increase but here it is. Now I am very happy (and suspicious) but my main question is, why, when the only difference between last year and this year is that I have 4 year no claim bonus instead of 3, has my insurance gone down more than 1400 euro? Why was I charged so much? ... oh well

Schorpio

alan1990 wrote: »

How can you say that when you know nothing about the OP!! I have a €2k 1.9 diesel golf with 4 years no claims and it costs €1600 to insure, going by your logic it shouldn't cost that much to insure, but it does, cause I'm a 21 year old lad and I get shafted!!
We don't know the OP's age/ job/ where she lives etc so it's crazy to say how much it should cost!!

It's not crazy because we know how much they were paying to insure their previous car, and we know what the previous car is and the relevant details about it, so it's actually pretty easy to come up with a ball park idea of where his/her premiums should be at for the future car. The fact that they got an online quote of much lower than the €500 vindicates this.

sean1141

Schorpio wrote: »

It's not crazy because we know how much they were paying to insure their previous car, and we know what the previous car is and the relevant details about it, so it's actually pretty easy to come up with a ball park idea of where his/her premiums should be at for the future car. The fact that they got an online quote of much lower than the €500 vindicates this.

Online quotes are usually for a first time customer plus there is usually a 40 euro charge to change details mid policy

bazz26

Schorpio wrote: »

I'm sorry, what?! No way should the price have gone up that much! The OP has 6 years claim free driving. Just because she's gone from a 1.2 petrol to a 1.6 diesel does not warrant such an increase. I'd imagine the diesel isn't much more powerful anyway. And also, just because her new car is more valuable also doesn't justify the increase. It's only €15k after all. Plus the OP is likely to be more careful with his/her new car imo.

A €15k 1.6 diesel focus on a policy with 6 yrs no claims should not cost half a grand to insure. Also, when the OP checked online they got a quote of €386 which is far more reasonable.

If I were you OP I'd be looking to see if you can cancel your current policy and get the money for your remaining term refunded. I'm not sure if you can do that, but the only way these insurance companies are going to learn is if people like yourself vote with your feet.

Schorpio wrote: »

It's not crazy because we know how much they were paying to insure their previous car, and we know what the previous car is and the relevant details about it, so it's actually pretty easy to come up with a ball park idea of where his/her premiums should be at for the future car. The fact that they got an online quote of much lower than the €500 vindicates this.

Do you have any insight into how insurance companies appraise a risk when calculating premiums? If you really believe someone can insure a 2 year old Focus diesel for similar money as a 10 year old Punto then I don't think you do. The Focus has a higher market value meaning it will cost the insurance company more if they have to pay out or replace it so the risk is higher resulting in a higher premium.

Snake Plisken

ok just some clarification I'm 43 year old male. Policy was up on 22'nd of August but had pre-paid a few weeks earlier but due to issues with punto decided to change out, also as I drive a company vehicle I do very little milage in this car and my old car. I know the punto is low value to insurance, but surely I'm low risk ok live in County Dublin which might load it a bit.
From what some of the posters have said I might be within my rights to cancel the policy and get a quote which obviously is available through other companies that chill work with. Chill never gave me that option, probably like 123 they probably stuck an extra 40-50 euros on as administration fee as well.

bazz26

This is how these online brokers like chill and 123 operate. They undercut more established insurance companies or brokers but then charge administration fees, temperary transfers, etc. This is how they can afford to undercut their rivals. Call it the Ryan Air approach.

If the policy started a week ago then you will probably get alot of it back minus an administration fee. Just make sure that the new policy is like for like and you are not compromising the level of cover for the sake of a cheaper premium especially on a car of higher value.

SniperSight

Bohrio wrote: »

Before I got my RS4 I had a Peugeot 1.0 1996. I had 3 year no claim bonus as a main driver, insurance went up from 540 to 2250 euro. The RS4 was valued on 32000 euro.

Funny enough my insurance has gone down from 2250 to 770 this year. I was expecting an increase but here it is. Now I am very happy (and suspicious) but my main question is, why, when the only difference between last year and this year is that I have 4 year no claim bonus instead of 3, has my insurance gone down more than 1400 euro? Why was I charged so much? ... oh well

Perhaps, and this is pure speculation, you had a very expensive premium because of the obvious power and speciality of the RS4 compared to the previous Peugeot, but then once you went a year without any problems it showed them you could handle the car, and having a years experience of the car, you are less likely to stick it in a shop window so to speak...therfore they felt comfortable enough that the risk was far more reduced and so reflected that in a much cheaper premium.

Oh....and I HATE YOU!!:-P

Schorpio

bazz26 wrote: »

Do you have any insight into how insurance companies appraise a risk when calculating premiums? If you really believe someone can insure a 2 year old Focus diesel for similar money as a 10 year old Punto then I don't think you do. The Focus has a higher market value meaning it will cost the insurance company more if they have to pay out or replace it so the risk is higher resulting in a higher premium.

You seem to have a very simple idea of the calculation of risk.

Obviously the Focus is more expensive than the Punto, and while that has a bearing on the premium, you seem to overestimate how much of a bearing it has. There are a vast number of factors taken into account, and each factor is individually weighted. The insurance company scores an individual (and their circumstances) to calculate weights for each factor, which then calculates the statistical probability of them having to pay out sums of money in a particular year. This is then used to calculate the premium. How a specific company weights it's factors is kept secret for obvious reasons.

It's because this probability is taken in yearly intervals that no claims bonus is so important. If the OP hasn't made a claim in 6 consecutive years then, statistically speaking, he is unlikely to claim in the next year. The rise in engine power weakens the effect of the no claims, but we're talking about a cicra 100 bhp car here being driven by an experienced 46 year old, not a 550 bhp M5.

Also with regards to the value of the car - the insurance company has to factor in the cost of damage to others, not just to your car. This cost would be roughly the same for the old punto and the new focus. The potential costs to third parties far, far, (far!) exceeds the cost of replacing the car. The cost of the car is of course used, especially when considering the cost of insuring minor accidents.

All in all, I reckon the OP was bang on in expecting a rise of €100 in the cost of their premium, provided it's fully comp. Third party should see a smaller rise. I think the OP should shop around and look into cancelling. If admin fees make it more expensive to switch to a cheaper insurer, then stick with it this year but don't renew.

Mar4ix

i had to pay 140 extra (on top of 350 ) for insurance from punto, 1.1 ' 96 to toyotata avensis 1.8 '98. found it reasonable for male 33, 5 ncb, my wife has 2010 vw polo,1.6 tdi,went from rover 414 '97, when changed a car(scrappage scheme), paid extra 180 euro... for another 10 or so months.... has full clean license, over 5 NCB, still paying 550 directly to insurance company... but all bells and whistles included though ..shes 31.

Snake Plisken

Schorpio wrote: »

You seem to have a very simple idea of the calculation of risk.

Obviously the Focus is more expensive than the Punto, and while that has a bearing on the premium, you seem to overestimate how much of a bearing it has. There are a vast number of factors taken into account, and each factor is individually weighted. The insurance company scores an individual (and their circumstances) to calculate weights for each factor, which then calculates the statistical probability of them having to pay out sums of money in a particular year. This is then used to calculate the premium. How a specific company weights it's factors is kept secret for obvious reasons.

It's because this probability is taken in yearly intervals that no claims bonus is so important. If the OP hasn't made a claim in 6 consecutive years then, statistically speaking, he is unlikely to claim in the next year. The rise in engine power weakens the effect of the no claims, but we're talking about a cicra 100 bhp car here being driven by an experienced 46 year old, not a 550 bhp M5.

Also with regards to the value of the car - the insurance company has to factor in the cost of damage to others, not just to your car. This cost would be roughly the same for the old punto and the new focus. The potential costs to third parties far, far, (far!) exceeds the cost of replacing the car. The cost of the car is of course used, especially when considering the cost of insuring minor accidents.

All in all, I reckon the OP was bang on in expecting a rise of €100 in the cost of their premium, provided it's fully comp. Third party should see a smaller rise. I think the OP should shop around and look into cancelling. If admin fees make it more expensive to switch to a cheaper insurer, then stick with it this year but don't renew.

Thanks think I'm going to hold off just not use this crowd again tbh I haven't claimed or had a claim against me in over 10 years but I think it's capped at a certain point. Gonna cut out chill next time. And shop around before hand.

Thanks