rules question

dball

Am i allowed to make notes about a course and bring them with me onto a course in my bag and read them during the game.

Instead of handwritiing out notes I have taken a photograph of some notes about a course and stored them on my phone - can i use this during a game.

I know these are 2 similar questions but i am unsure of the ruling - is it the notes or the technology that might be against the rules.

Thanks anyone

Jaysoose

I really dont see what the problem would be, surely its the same as getting handed a course guide in the pro shop.

Im open to correction but i think your fine.

charlieIRL

am not sure on the notes but I reckon using the phone wouldn't be allowed. If you do a search here we discussed the use of phones as a GPS in great detail a few times.

dball

charlieIRL wrote: »

am not sure on the notes but I reckon using the phone wouldn't be allowed. If you do a search here we discussed the use of phones as a GPS in great detail a few times.

Im not using it for gps purposes - i have literally taken a photograph of the notes from the course website and want to know if i can look at these during play

jtown

dball wrote: »

Im not using it for gps purposes - i have literally taken a photograph of the notes from the course website and want to know if i can look at these during play

Mahonys Point

L.O.F.T

dball wrote: »

I have literally taken a photograph of the notes from the course website

Just buy a course planner?

jtown

L.O.F.T wrote: »

Just buy a course planner?

Ya they are only €5.. you have it again if you play. Plus better than a one liner from the website.

IITYWYBMAD

dball wrote: »

Im not using it for gps purposes - i have literally taken a photograph of the notes from the course website and want to know if i can look at these during play

Doesn't matter what you are using it for. If the device is capable of giving you wind direction or has a compass installed, or is capable of having a compass installed you cannot use it on a golf course in Ireland under the present rules. Anyone who tells you any different is talking s**te.

dball

IITYWYBMAD wrote: »

Doesn't matter what you are using it for. If the device is capable of giving you wind direction or has a compass installed, or is capable of having a compass installed you cannot use it on a golf course in Ireland under the present rules. Anyone who tells you any different is talking s**te.

Thank you

makes sense

PARlance

If you're hell bent on using a phone, text yourself the notes on this

MP62

dball wrote: »

Am i allowed to make notes about a course and bring them with me onto a course in my bag and read them during the game.

Instead of handwritiing out notes I have taken a photograph of some notes about a course and stored them on my phone - can i use this during a game.

I know these are 2 similar questions but i am unsure of the ruling - is it the notes or the technology that might be against the rules.

Thanks anyone

If it's a casual round you can do whatever you like, if it's a competitive round and have a look here and you'll figure out if you can or can't use your model of phone, btw those notes are pretty useless buy a strokesaver (only €5) and you'll have it for life.

paulos53

As long as the phone is not being used as a distance measuring device the the OP should be allowed to access any photographs or notes stored on his phone

The following is from the R&A Rules Explorer with the relevant sections highlighted:

14-3/16 Use of Electronic Devices

As provided in the Etiquette Section, players should ensure that any electronic device taken onto the course does not distract other players.
The use of an electronic device such as a mobile phone, hand-held computer,calculator, television or radio is not of itself a breach of Rule 14-3. For example, the following uses of an electronic device during a stipulated round are not a breach of the Rules:

• Using the device for matters unrelated to golf (e.g. to call home);

• Using the device to access information on advice-related matters that was produced prior to the start of the player’s round (e.g. an electronic yardage book, swing tips);

• Using the device to access (but not interpret or process) playing information from previous rounds (e.g. driving distances, individual club yardages, etc); or
• Using the device to obtain information related to the competition being played (e.g. the leader board or projected “cut”).

However, examples of uses of an electronic device during a stipulated round that are a breach of Rule 14-3, for which the penalty is disqualification, include:

• Using the device (e.g. a television or radio) to watch or listen to a broadcast of the competition being played;
• Using the device to ask for or give advice in breach of Rule 8-1 (e.g. calling a swing coach);
• Using the device to access information on advice-related matters that was not produced prior to the start of his round (e.g. analysis of strokes made during that round); or
• Using the device to interpret or process any playing information obtained from current or previous rounds (e.g. driving distances, individual club yardages, etc.) or to assist in calculating the effective distance between two points (i.e. distance after considering gradient, wind speed and/or direction, temperature or other environmental factors).

GreeBo

^ Those rules are what allow the likes of a PDA, kindle or old school phone to be used.

This still does not allow you to use a Smart Phone that has the capability to measure wind, direction, slope, etc, etc.

paulos53

I haven't seen any rule that makes a distinction between a smartphone and any of the devices that you listed.

This link seems to be the general reference point in determining what can and cannot be used:
http://www.randa.org/en/randa/news/news/2012/march/distance-measuring-devices.aspx


It specifically says that a device that can measure wind/slope/temperature etc. is illegal as a DMD but can still be used "as a communication or reference tool".

The OP wants to use his phone as a reference tool.

BigChap1759

paulos53 wrote: »

I haven't seen any rule that makes a distinction between a smartphone and any of the devices that you listed.

This link seems to be the general reference point in determining what can and cannot be used:
http://www.randa.org/en/randa/news/news/2012/march/distance-measuring-devices.aspx


It specifically says that a device that can measure wind/slope/temperature etc. is illegal as a DMD but can still be used "as a communication or reference tool".

The OP wants to use his phone as a reference tool.

Seems to make sense

GreeBo

paulos53 wrote: »

I haven't seen any rule that makes a distinction between a smartphone and any of the devices that you listed.

This link seems to be the general reference point in determining what can and cannot be used:
http://www.randa.org/en/randa/news/news/2012/march/distance-measuring-devices.aspx


It specifically says that a device that can measure wind/slope/temperature etc. is illegal as a DMD but can still be used "as a communication or reference tool".

The OP wants to use his phone as a reference tool.

it also specifically says that if the device is capable of measuring wind, slope, etc then the device is non conforming whether these features are used or not.it's a very poorly worded rule that clearly was not really thought through.

BigChap1759

I think the key here is that the previous posters link would seem to suggest it's non-conforming as a DMD, which seems to make sense.

I'm still amazed how frequently this is debated - just shows what a poor job the R&A/USGA have done around the wording :cool:

GreeBo

BigChap1759 wrote: »

I think the key here is that the previous posters link would seem to suggest it's non-conforming as a DMD, which seems to make sense.

I'm still amazed how frequently this is debated - just shows what a poor job the R&A/USGA have done around the wording :cool:

This is taken from the same link:

Q. What about multi-functional devices, such as a mobile phone, with a distance measuring application?

A. On the course, subject to any club or course regulations, a multi-functional device may be used to phone, text or email – provided the purpose is not a breach of the Rules, e.g. you are not asking for advice.

When an application that measures distance has been downloaded to the device, the application must be restricted to providing only distance information in order to conform to the Local Rule. If there are any other features or applications on the phone that gauge or measure other conditions that might affect a player’s play, such as a temperature gauge, compass or anemometer, this would render the device non-conforming regardless of whether these other features or applications are used or not.

To me thats quite clear. Smart Phones (with compasses, gyroscopes etc) are non conforming and cannot be used on the course, for any reason.

paulos53

As BigChap pointed out the wording is very poor as I get a different meaning from that Q&A. i.e. the device can't be used as a DMD but can be used as a communication tool and by extension as a reference tool.

The last part of the Q&A on the website refers back to the flowchart which seems clear to me.

Luckily it is irrelevant to me as I always leave my phone in the car and my Golf Buddy is 100% legal

GreeBo

paulos53 wrote: »

As BigChap pointed out the wording is very poor as I get a different meaning from that Q&A. i.e. the device can't be used as a DMD but can be used as a communication tool and by extension as a reference tool.

The last part of the Q&A on the website refers back to the flowchart which seems clear to me.

Luckily it is irrelevant to me as I always leave my phone in the car and my Golf Buddy is 100% legal

based on the part i bolded i don't see how it can be used at all tbh.

WH BONNEY

Two rules questions,

1. Can you accidentally ground your club in a bunker before you play a shot out of the bunker ?

2. During a strokes competition can I practice put on a green that I have just holed out on ?

MP62

WH BONNEY wrote: »

Two rules questions,

1. Can you accidentally ground your club in a bunker before you play a shot out of the bunker ?

2. During a strokes competition can I practice put on a green that I have just holed out on ?

The simple answer is yes to both, but there is abit more to it than that.

GreeBo

WH BONNEY wrote: »

Two rules questions,

1. Can you accidentally ground your club in a bunker before you play a shot out of the bunker ?

2. During a strokes competition can I practice put on a green that I have just holed out on ?

1. only to prevent yourself from falling
2. yes

WH BONNEY

Being more specific on point 1

Two balls lie side by side in as bunker, I mark mine to allow opponent play. Whilst replacing mine I accidentally ground my club. Is there a penalty ?

I use my club to retrieve a rake from a bunker before I play out of the bunker. In the proceeds of retrieving the rake I touch the sand with my club. Is there a penalty ?

kiers47

WH BONNEY wrote: »

Being more specific on point 1

Two balls lie side by side in as bunker, I mark mine to allow opponent play. Whilst replacing mine I accidentally ground my club. Is there a penalty ?

I use my club to retrieve a rake from a bunker before I play out of the bunker. In the proceeds of retrieving the rake I touch the sand with my club. Is there a penalty ?

I am no rules expert, **but i believe you are not allowed to move a rake in the bunker unless it impedes your shot/stance until after you play your ball. So there would be a penalty for this i think.
And if it does impede your ball you should not use a club to move it.

Not sure about the first part but i would also think yes.

Ok it seems as though i made that first part(**) up as i cant seem to find it in the rule book. :-/

Actually i think 13-4 covers what i was trying to say first about the rake. Perhaps someone can clarify for me?

"a. Test the condition of the hazard or any similar hazard;
b. Touch the ground in the hazard or water in the water hazard with his hand or a club; or
c. Touch or move a loose impediment lying in or touching the hazard. "

G1032

GreeBo wrote: »

WH BONNEY wrote: »

Two rules questions,

1. Can you accidentally ground your club in a bunker before you play a shot out of the bunker ?

2. During a strokes competition can I practice put on a green that I have just holed out on ?

1. only to prevent yourself from falling
2. yes

Just a note on question two there.....
You can only practice if you are not holding up play by doing so. So if there are people waiting to hit their approach to the green you cannot then practice.

charlieIRL

G1032 wrote: »

Just a note on question two there.....
You can only practice if you are not holding up play by doing so. So if there are people waiting to hit their approach to the green you cannot then practice.

naturally enough.

Same would go for anytime in my book!

antoobrien

GreeBo wrote: »

This still does not allow you to use a Smart Phone that has the capability to measure wind, direction, slope, etc, etc.

I haven't seen a smartphone with a temperature or wind sensor, so it sounds legit.

GreeBo

antoobrien wrote: »

I haven't seen a smartphone with a temperature or wind sensor, so it sounds legit.

if it has the ability to measure any of the banned items then its non conforming. 99% have a digital compass and so are non conforming.

GreeBo

kiers47 wrote: »

I am no rules expert, **but i believe you are not allowed to move a rake in the bunker unless it impedes your shot/stance until after you play your ball. So there would be a penalty for this i think.
And if it does impede your ball you should not use a club to move it.

Not sure about the first part but i would also think yes.

Ok it seems as though i made that first part(**) up as i cant seem to find it in the rule book. :-/

Actually i think 13-4 covers what i was trying to say first about the rake. Perhaps someone can clarify for me?

"a. Test the condition of the hazard or any similar hazard;
b. Touch the ground in the hazard or water in the water hazard with his hand or a club; or
c. Touch or move a loose impediment lying in or touching the hazard. "

You can always move the rake and you can never test the surface.
The two are not related unless you are using the rake the test the surface.

kiers47

GreeBo wrote: »

You can always move the rake and you can never test the surface.
The two are not related unless you are using the rake the test the surface.

Cheers, clears up some doubt I had. :-)