Is AppleCare worth it?

DylanII

Hi,

I bought the rMBP and the sales person at Compub really tried to push applecare on me. I refused it, but now Im wondering do I need it? Aside form the phone technical support is there any benefit? Would I not be protected by law if it breaks within the next 3 years anyway (If I still have it) after all its not something that should break that soon.

Thanks

docentore

you are protected by EU law for 2 years.

Zapp Brannigan

I think it's worth it personally. Too much hassle to chase Apple down if it does break.

But what I've discovered about Applecare is that it just doesn't cover failures. For example, after 2 1/2 years your battery life is gonna be worse than it was. If it's less than 50% of expected life then you can get that replaced under your Applecare agreement. So for the Retina, which has the soldered battery I believe, it could be worth it for that alone.

AlmightyCushion

Zapp Brannigan wrote: »

I think it's worth it personally. Too much hassle to chase Apple down if it does break.

But what I've discovered about Applecare is that it just doesn't cover failures. For example, after 2 1/2 years your battery life is gonna be worse than it was. If it's less than 50% of expected life then you can get that replaced under your Applecare agreement. So for the Retina, which has the soldered battery I believe, it could be worth it for that alone.

That's only true for iOS devices, not for MacBooks. With MacBooks the battery is only covered when it's a manufacturing fault.

Zapp Brannigan

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

That's only true for iOS devices, not for MacBooks. With MacBooks the battery is only covered when it's a manufacturing fault.

I thought it was true for Mac, but upon reading the agreement you are completely correct. Turns out I was lied to!

uncle_sam_ie

Yes

opinion guy

1,000 times yes.

whiterebel

docentore wrote: »

you are protected by EU law for 2 years.

Never implemented in Ireland, due to the govt believing the sale of Goods Act provides better protection.

DylanII

Would a MacBook not be expected to last near 3 years? And so be protected under law. . .

Zapp Brannigan

DylanII wrote: »

Would a MacBook not be expected to last near 3 years? And so be protected under law. . .

All I know is that when I had a logic board failure on my first macbook after 2 years I had to pony up the cash as I was getting nowhere with Sale of Goods act.

On the Retina with everything being soldered and nothing user replaceable (yet) it really does make sense to have full, hassle free cover on it.

docentore

whiterebel wrote: »

Never implemented in Ireland, due to the govt believing the sale of Goods Act provides better protection.

Irish Government doesn't have to implement anything - any manufacturer selling electronic goods in EU has to honour 2 years warranty. If consumer wants to use sale of goods act or whatever other local legislation - is up to them, not government. just 2c

whiterebel

docentore wrote: »

Irish Government doesn't have to implement anything - any manufacturer selling electronic goods in EU has to honour 2 years warranty. If consumer wants to use sale of goods act or whatever other local legislation - is up to them, not government. just 2c

Of course they have to implement an EU directive for it to have effect. They didn't. Go on to the NCA website or ring them and ask why they don't quote it, and why they don't tell anyone that they have a 2 year warranty.

Solair

The EU directive most certainly does apply in Ireland.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=70423295&postcount=3

Johnmb

Solair wrote: »

The EU directive most certainly does apply in Ireland.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=70423295&postcount=3

EU directives don't apply to individuals/companies anywhere, only local laws do. The government can be fined for not translating the directive into local law, but no individual or company can be charged with not fulfilling the terms of any EU directives.

docentore

As an employee of legal firm I have a right for free legal advice - on Monday I am going to check this. Just to clarify

holystungun9

docentore wrote: »

As an employee of legal firm I have a right for free legal advice - on Monday I am going to check this. Just to clarify

Please do and leave us know the outcome. Do you need anything other than a receipt and do companies actually abide by this or will they go 'yeah, take us to court', knowing that must people won't pony up the money for that kind of thing.

whiterebel

Solair wrote: »

The EU directive most certainly does apply in Ireland.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=70423295&postcount=3

According to your own quote it doesn't:
"There is a common misunderstanding that Directive 99/44/EC gives consumers a minimum two years guarantee for all goods purchased, but this is not the case"

Sad Professor

The EU Directive was translated into Irish law, so it does apply here. The Irish Sale of Goods Act does provide better protection, it's just not as convenient to quote to retailers.

This has been discussed to death. There's so much confusion about consumer rights in this country. The problem isn't with the law itself, it's the lack of awareness of the law. The government needs to put pressure on retailers to make consumers aware of their rights and to comply with claims. The Italian government sued Apple last year for not doing so in their retail stores.

docentore wrote: »

Irish Government doesn't have to implement anything - any manufacturer selling electronic goods in EU has to honour 2 years warranty. If consumer wants to use sale of goods act or whatever other local legislation - is up to them, not government. just 2c

Everything about this is incorrect. The government does have to implement EU Directives. And it's got nothing to do with the manufacturer. This is a widely held misconception which shows a very basic misunderstanding of consumer law on the part of Irish consumers. Your contract is with the seller - they are the ones who are legally obliged to cover the item for faults, etc, not the manufacturer.

docentore

Sad Professor wrote: »

The EU Directive was translated into Irish law, so it does apply here. The Irish Sale of Goods Act does provide better protection, it's just not as convenient to quote to retailers.

This has been discussed to death. There's so much confusion about consumer rights in this country. The problem isn't with the law itself, it's the lack of awareness of the law. The government needs to put pressure on retailers to make consumers aware of their rights and to comply with claims. The Italian government sued Apple last year for not doing so in their retail stores.


Everything about this is incorrect. The government does have to implement EU Directives. And it's got nothing to do with the manufacturer. This is a widely held misconception which shows a very basic misunderstanding of consumer law on the part of Irish consumers. Your contract is with the seller - they are the ones who are legally obliged to cover the item for faults, etc, not the manufacturer.

Thank you for correcting me. Looks like you are right sir.

cnocbui

Sad Professor wrote: »

The EU Directive was translated into Irish law, so it does apply here. The Irish Sale of Goods Act does provide better protection, it's just not as convenient to quote to retailers.

I think the clue is in the name - 'directive'. If compliance was optional I think it would have been called a 'suggestion'.

As for Applecare - not for me.

I recently acquired a MBP Retina and never even considered it. This is my third Apple laptop. The PowerBook Ti died after 8 years daily use and the Unibody 13" is still in perfect working order after 4 years daily use. It did have a fault with the optical drive not reading dual layer discs, but luckily I discovered it within 12 months and they fitted a replacement. The battery expanded a bit last December due to altitude but it hasn't affected it's functioning.

Apple make a killing on Applecare which means those who buy it are lining their pockets. They were recently in the dung in Italy for misrepresenting Applecare and were fined €900 K for failing to inform buyers that products were covered by 2 years by law and that this legal protection overlapped Applecare policies. http://techcrunch.com/2011/12/27/italy-fines-apple-1-2-million-over-applecare-sales/

So if you buy three years worth of Applecare, you are only getting one year of benefit.

Now if Applecare kicked in for three years AFTER the mandatory 2 year warranty coverage expired, that might be slightly better value, though I still wouldn't personally.

Zapp Brannigan

I don't understand how they make a killing off of Applecare? My first Mac had a logic board failure and I had to pay around 400 euro to get that fixed, whereas if I had bought Applecare for around 200 quid I wouldn't have paid any more. So they've made an extra 200 off of me?

cnocbui

Zapp Brannigan wrote: »

I don't understand how they make a killing off of Applecare? My first Mac had a logic board failure and I had to pay around 400 euro to get that fixed, whereas if I had bought Applecare for around 200 quid I wouldn't have paid any more. So they've made an extra 200 off of me?

It's like any insurance. Apple are betting that most people won't have a claim. You had a claim. If I had bought Apple care for my gear they would have made several times the cost of paying to replace your motherboard out of me, so with just two customers they have turned a profit.

Hopefully Apple products have a much better than 25% chance of failure inside three years, so the scope of their profit is likely much greater.

With sales of iPads and iPhones at over 100 million units a year, if they sold Applecare at just €20 per unit that's an extra € 2 Billion a year in revenue, probably over 80% of which would be profit.

Jofspring

So what does the 2 years cover you for?
Is it just manufacturing faults and if so how do you prove a problem was a manufacturing fault and not one you caused?
You are told in store you are only covered for 1 year and need to pay for extra cover. Is that false advertising and false information printed on their products and products by other companies too?

For example:

You: hi I am having a fault with my MacBook pro (some manufacturing fault for example).
Compub/apple sales staff: o that will cost you 200euro to fix.
You: am I not covered by the 2 year warranty by EU law?
Sales staff: no you only get 1 year warranty with the MacBook from apple, I have never heard of 2 years, sadly you have that laptop 15months. If you bought AppleCare you would be covered though.
You: pretty sure it's law to supply me with 2 years.
Sales staff: No its definitely 1 year and it will be 200euro to fix it. This is why we advise AppleCare.
You: ahhhhh ok so here is the money please fix it ( i don't know if it's a problem caused by me or manufacturing and I'm not 100% sure on the law so have to believe the staff member who is supposed to be the professional)

I'm sure a lot of people not technically minded nor sure of the exact law have been in a similar situation to that one. Where do you stand? Are you in the right or not and how so you prove it when the staff convince you you are in the wrong? Always thought it was tough lucky your year warranty was up.

Zapp Brannigan

I think the other thing that makes me buy Applecare is turn around time. Much quicker to have Apple fix it than take them to court, and considering I need my computer for work and day to day use that's a massive bonus.

docentore

Apple explains it a bit here. According to this we are still covered for (minimum) 2 years.

whiterebel

docentore wrote: »

Apple explains it a bit here. According to this we are still covered for (minimum) 2 years.

And yet Apple will tell you, if you call them now, that their manufacturer warranty of 1 year applies, not 2 years, even if bought through the AppleStore.
We bought a full set of white goods last year, washing machine, dishwasher, fridge freezer. Also a new TV and everywhere we were told one year warranty applies. Bought a PS Vita for the young lad yesterday and told the same. I know they are usually badly trained in a lot of these places, but they can't all be flouting it, if it was implemented. Again, going back to the NCA, and (Conor Pope) - If EU law is present that the seller must stand over it for 2 years, why don't they say this, rather than both quoting the Sale of Goods and Supply of services Act. This is a much easier way rather than having to go through SCC.

Again, as Sad Prof says, it has been done to death, but the conclusion I saw is that we enacted some of the EU Directive, but not all. I have spoken to the NCA and they told me months ago that we didn't enact the 2 year part of the Directive, and that SoGA applies.