I hate people using the steering wheel like this

keithclancy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKG3jhJiWlg

FFS !! Let me out !!!! You'd swear she was driving an Artic or something.

Otherwise ... I'm Interested in taking a test drive, a Tesla Dealership opened up locally in Eindhoven.

Viper_JB

Man....that's one hell of a big touch screen.

langdang

Thinks she's on a tri-bike or TT bike I'd say. A bit irritating/unsettling alright, especially the weird underhand thing she does (about 1:30).

Where To

You can steer an artic with your wee finger.

Anan1

Looks like a very cool car.

Tallon

Are her glasses especially for that car so she can take in the whole of the Nav screen at once?

keithclancy

Viper_JB wrote: »

Man....that's one hell of a big touch screen.

Thats the only thing that would put me off tbh .... Touchscreens aren't really all that great to operate when driving, my Sat Nav is testament to that.

Maybe if it has Voice Control, but i've never had that work properly either.

Its a very American way to steer, especially that underarm turn at :40. Maybe if they had to user a gearstick they wouldn't be at it.

Stallingrad

Anan1 wrote: »

Looks like a very cool car.

Agreed, very impressive for their first 'mainstream' car.

Alanstrainor

What a bizarre way of steering! Wtf?

Awesome looking car though.

Matt Simis

cisk wrote: »

Its a very American way to steer, especially that underarm turn at :40. Maybe if they had to user a gearstick they wouldn't be at it.

Looking at the comments on the Youtube video from what I assume are Americans, many of them dont like her approach either.

I remember when learning to drive I was told Id fail the test if I crossed arms/hands trying to steer, she does this multiple times.

tossy

I honestly thought this thread was going to be about people who hold it like this



"the poser" look,now that annoys me,it's usually employed by 'flutes' in 'high powered saloons'

keithclancy

OSI wrote: »

With their arse on the floor pan barely able to see over the steering wheel.

You can usually see a baseball cap peeking over the steering wheel

corktina

the airbag would mash her brains in an impact... if she has any

CiniO

Matt Simis wrote: »

Looking at the comments on the Youtube video from what I assume are Americans, many of them dont like her approach either.

Because she has completely no clue about steering.

I remember when learning to drive I was told Id fail the test if I crossed arms/hands trying to steer, she does this multiple times.

I did driving test last week, and I was absolutely astonished, when instructor told me I couldn't cross hands.
I had to train to 2 weeks before the test to make sure I will be able to use push-and-pull steering technique only, and withhold from using any other techniques.
I still can't understand why do they require that for a driving test.
Crossing hands during steering is absolutely normal thing.

Matt Simis

CiniO wrote: »

Because she has completely no clue about steering.

Yes Im aware of this!

CiniO wrote: »

I did driving test last week, and I was absolutely astonished, when instructor told me I couldn't cross hands.
I had to train to 2 weeks before the test to make sure I will be able to use push-and-pull steering technique only, and withhold from using any other techniques.
I still can't understand why do they require that for a driving test.
Crossing hands during steering is absolutely normal thing.

Seriously? Yes its a normal thing, but its a bad normal thing. You simply cannot get the same twisting torque or fine motor control if you cross your arms, you remove a good chunk of your leverage. Im glad to hear this is still assessed on the test.

CiniO

Matt Simis wrote: »

Seriously? Yes its a normal thing, but its a bad normal thing. You simply cannot get the same twisting torque or fine motor control if you cross your arms, you remove a good chunk of your leverage. Im glad to hear this is still assessed on the test.

In short - rotational steering technique.
It's showed f.e. in this video, among other ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ0vLK1zbkg

Imagine someone trying to recover from a skid using push-and-pull technique... IMHO impossible, while using rotational steering, shouldn't be any problem.

Matt Simis

CiniO wrote: »

In short - rotational steering technique.
It's showed f.e. in this video, among other ones.

Imagine someone trying to recover from a skid using push-and-pull technique... IMHO impossible, while using rotational steering, shouldn't be any problem.

Umm... your video shows someone doing the thing you want to do. What exactly are we meant to take from this? Also, a much more relevant link since you are suggesting people spinning out and this being "better"... this Track focused site does not agree at all:
http://www.trackpedia.com/wiki/Steering_techniques#Rotational_Steering

Rotational Steering
Hand-over-hand steering, the most intuitive manner of steering, but generally speaking - the least efficient one either (with the exception of turning the wheel one-handed with the palm). Can be quick if used in large enough steering motions, but is likely to make for steering that is less smooth and accurate than desired, split into too many hand movements and operated with excessive effort due to the use of upper body strength, and maybe result in the wheel breaking loose from the grip of the hands or the hands getting entangled.

Put it to a poll, I beg to differ as seemingly do many. I have a feeling you arent going to want to admit you drive like the girl in the video though and would defend this to the end of time..

milltown

Matt Simis wrote: »

Seriously? Yes its a normal thing, but its a bad normal thing. You simply cannot get the same twisting torque or fine motor control if you cross your arms, you remove a good chunk of your leverage. Im glad to hear this is still assessed on the test.

In the days before power steering, fair enough. Even some small cars took herculean effort for small steering inputs. These days I don't see much sense in focusing on it. Fair enough, if the power assistance fails you probably need the extra grunt of the push me-pull you technique, but I'd wager most people would either have pulled over or crashed before they figure out what's gone wrong with their car. Regardless of how they were holding the wheel.

Matt Simis

Its not (solely) about power steering or steering effort, there are so many reasons its considered wrong, just look at the link in my last post.

delad

keithclancy wrote: »

Thats the only thing that would put me off tbh .... Touchscreens aren't really all that great to operate when driving, my Sat Nav is testament to that.

Maybe if it has Voice Control, but i've never had that work properly either.

It uses google voice control, I've seen a few youtube videos of it and it works perfectly.

CiniO

Matt Simis wrote: »

Umm... your video shows someone doing the thing you want to do. What exactly are we meant to take from this? Also, a much more relevant link since you are suggesting people spinning out and this being "better"... this Track focused site does not agree at all:
http://www.trackpedia.com/wiki/Steering_techniques#Rotational_Steering

That's actually quite interesting material.
However you can see guy presenting proper steering on the videos shown there, still crosses his hands, which is a fail on driving test.
So something is wrong anyway.

Put it to a poll, I beg to differ as seemingly do many. I have a feeling you arent going to want to admit you drive like the girl in the video though and would defend this to the end of time..

No need to wonder how I drive as you can see on my video here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF7-MWMFFmA

I know this is very far from being good steering, but believe me I really do care about steering technique and would like to do it as correct and efficient as possible.

Matt Simis

CiniO wrote: »

No need to wonder how I drive as you can see on my video here:

I know this is very far from being good steering, but believe me I really do care about steering technique and would like to do it as correct and efficient as possible.

Is he shouting at you everytime you cross your hands on the wheel?

CiniO

Matt Simis wrote: »

Is he shouting at you everytime you cross your hands on the wheel?

Haha... yeah.. That's my driving instructor

Greyfoot

Push pull steering called milking the cow back home

Just take the push out of the sentence and hold your hands at 9:15 and yer good to go.

mb1725

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHvheQ1flwc&feature=channel_video_title

CiniO

mb1725 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHvheQ1flwc&feature=channel_video_title

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

I must say I'm converted by now. I though it would be impossible, while video clearly shows it is possible.

However what's the point?

mb1725

John Lyon ran one of the most respected advanced driving courses in the Uk and he always advocated keeping your hands at 'quarter to three' especially while steering in to a bend. His logic was that you were always prepared to steer away from or around an unexpected hazard.

galwaytt

CiniO wrote: »

mb1725 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHvheQ1flwc&feature=channel_video_title

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

I must say I'm converted by now. I though it would be impossible, while video clearly shows it is possible.

However what's the point?

With crossed hands, you have no control, as your arms are at full extension. You have no recourse to react. With push/pull, your hands are always able to go in either direction.

Just watch F1 or WRC, the experts in car control. Except in rare cases, you won't see crossed hands there......

CiniO

galwaytt wrote: »

With crossed hands, you have no control, as your arms are at full extension. You have no recourse to react. With push/pull, your hands are always able to go in either direction.

Just watch F1 or WRC, the experts in car control. Except in rare cases, you won't see crossed hands there......

F1 and WRC is completely different thing, as their steering ratio is way higher.
F.e on the video below you can see, that it's only about 180 degrees each side max. With such ratio, there is no really any need to take your hands off original position (3 - 9) from your steering wheel.
Anyway - when doing 180 degree steering wheel turn, your hands cross anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwtvlxFIWUU

But it normal cars, ratio is way lower, and therefore you have to turn a steering wheel quite a lot to turn.
And this results in doing things like that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mg5f2GL5oTs

dr.fuzzenstein

I'm with Colin McRae.
I don't care how many people come up with how many statistics that push-pull is the greatest steering method in the world, it simply is daft.
It is awkward, clumsy, slow and I would refuse to do it for a driving test.
In fact I didn't have to refuse it, my driving instructor just told me "Don't cross your hands" and that was all. Other than that it was hand-over-hand all the way.
No problem and I passed without looking like I was milking cows.
It is a relic of a bygone era that for some reason stuck with people, beyond all sense and reason.
Especially the UK seems to have developed a death grip this steering method that was useful if you had a Humber Hawk in 1954.
More on this:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/road-safety/2748533/Bad-and-unnatural-steering-practices.html

Now that Lady in the OP's video doesn't seem to have a discernible style, other than that of someone who has never driven a car before.

dr.fuzzenstein

To cut a long post short, this is how you steer unless you are 90 years old or drive a 2 ton car from the 50's:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16SoOOfftkE

Fast and precise.
There's always the "Oh, you could hit a stone and the wheel whips round", but it hasn't happened in 20 years and 1 million km.

CiniO

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I'm with Colin McRae.
I don't care how many people come up with how many statistics that push-pull is the greatest steering method in the world, it simply is daft.
It is awkward, clumsy, slow and I would refuse to do it for a driving test.
In fact I didn't have to refuse it, my driving instructor just told me "Don't cross your hands" and that was all. Other than that it was hand-over-hand all the way.
No problem and I passed without looking like I was milking cows.
It is a relic of a bygone era that for some reason stuck with people, beyond all sense and reason.
Especially the UK seems to have developed a death grip this steering method that was useful if you had a Humber Hawk in 1954.
More on this:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/road-safety/2748533/Bad-and-unnatural-steering-practices.html

Now that Lady in the OP's video doesn't seem to have a discernible style, other than that of someone who has never driven a car before.

I can only say, that I've done my car and bus driving test outside Ireland or UK, and I was never really aware of push-pull technique. I probably heard about it somewhere, but I don't think I ever used it before.
Now when I came about doing my truck test in Ireland, I had to learn to use this technique to pass the test. I did it, but straight after the test I stopped doing it, and I consider this technique no good at all.

dr.fuzzenstein

CiniO wrote: »

I can only say, that I've done my car and bus driving test outside Ireland or UK, and I was never really aware of push-pull technique. I probably heard about it somewhere, but I don't think I ever used it before.
Now when I came about doing my truck test in Ireland, I had to learn to use this technique to pass the test. I did it, but straight after the test I stopped doing it, and I consider this technique no good at all.

Because it isn't.;)
Never heard of it in Germany either.

dr.fuzzenstein

This is what happens when you shuffle:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7y7Mfi2nCE

_Kaiser_

power steering + cruise control + auto/DSG = me steering mostly left handed with my hand positioned just below the left/middle "bar" on the steering wheel.

I actually find trying to drive 2 handed gives me less control, but that's me

Matt Simis

CiniO wrote: »

I can only say, that I've done my car and bus driving test outside Ireland or UK, and I was never really aware of push-pull technique. I probably heard about it somewhere, but I don't think I ever used it before.
Now when I came about doing my truck test in Ireland, I had to learn to use this technique to pass the test. I did it, but straight after the test I stopped doing it, and I consider this technique no good at all.

Im going to have to actually look at how I drive myself, but from memory I think I feed it at 180degree points rapidly, kinda what you are saying but without crossing hands. I know I dont do push pull properly.

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

power steering + cruise control + auto/DSG = me steering mostly left handed with my hand positioned just below the left/middle "bar" on the steering wheel.
I actually find trying to drive 2 handed gives me less control, but that's me

When Im driving Autos I try limit that behaviour, steering with one hand cannot be that great an idea, considering you have another perfectly good hand doing nothing! With one hand you wont have the same turning ability one side vs the other.

uberalles

Each to their own on this one it seems

dr.fuzzenstein

uberalles wrote: »

Each to their own on this one it seems

This will never be resolved.
Push-Pull vs Hand over Hand are two completely entrenched camps that will accuse each other of doing it wrong and doing it the stupid and dangerous way till the end of time.
Of course the Hand over Hand camp is the right one...:p

Alanstrainor

uberalles wrote: »

Each to their own on this one it seems

Except for the person in the video that started this...their way of using a steering wheel was nothing short of ridiculous!

dr.fuzzenstein

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Except for the person in the video that started this...their way of using a steering wheel was nothing short of ridiculous!

That much is agreed. She needs driving lessons.
I grimaced at the bit where the guy said "get off the gas, no, no, don't go on the brakes, keep your foot off the brake" and she says "that takes a bit of getting used to", like WTF?
How hard is it to take your foot off the gas and let the car coast?

guil

CiniO wrote: »

I can only say, that I've done my car and bus driving test outside Ireland or UK, and I was never really aware of push-pull technique. I probably heard about it somewhere, but I don't think I ever used it before.
Now when I came about doing my truck test in Ireland, I had to learn to use this technique to pass the test. I did it, but straight after the test I stopped doing it, and I consider this technique no good at all.

Did you do the rigid or artic? if it was the rigid you will have some fun trying to steer like that for the artic