House plan drawings

jocotty

Hi,

I am about to build a storey and a half house, approx 2000sq ft, and an easy/cheap build . . . . Ie . Square in shape, and simple "A" shaped roof.

Can anyone tell me a good place to get the autocad drawings for the house, at a good price?

Thanks ,

Jo

Casati

Plan a Home.ie - have loads of existing drawings- cheaper than starting from scratch. Not sure if they do technical building drawings though.

You might need to get a cad technician- of which a good few hang out on this site and will likely IM you

BryanF

jocotty,
It would help you said what part of the country your in. generally a local architect/arch tech is who you want

Mellor

jocotty wrote: »

Hi,

I am about to build a storey and a half house, approx 2000sq ft, and an easy/cheap build . . . . Ie . Square in shape, and simple "A" shaped roof.

Can anyone tell me a good place to get the autocad drawings for the house, at a good price?

Thanks ,

Jo

Do you have planning permission?
Who did your plans for the application.

jocotty

Mellor wrote: »

Do you have planning permission?
Who did your plans for the application.

i dont have planning permission yet - but its a site that i am looking to buy, in a zoned settlement region. so planning should not be too much of a problem.
i am about to get a guy to do up the site maps, etc, but plan on getting the house drawings from the internet , as they will be cheaper...no???

muffler

jocotty wrote: »

...no???

Correct.

sydthebeat

jocotty wrote: »

i dont have planning permission yet - but its a site that i am looking to buy, in a zoned settlement region. so planning should not be too much of a problem.
i am about to get a guy to do up the site maps, etc, but plan on getting the house drawings from the internet , as they will be cheaper...no???

do you not want the single most expensive item you will ever pay for to be specifically designed to suit you, your (future?) family, and the site requirements?

Casati

sydthebeat wrote: »

do you not want the single most expensive item you will ever pay for to be specifically designed to suit you, your (future?) family, and the site requirements?

Its down to your preference- most people live in a house they had zero input to the design of. If you want to build it as cheap as possible, I would as you said keep it v simple, limit the number of rooms and keep it as a rectangle. Make sure you talk to the local planning office to see what stipulations they have, in some areas certain features are not liked, equally they might want a stone cladding which will be more expensive on some designs versus others.

My advise is to review online plans like plan a home, and draw it up yourself using pen or paper, or basic drawing package, and then get a tech drawer to convert to auto cad- agree a rate per hour and sit with him/ her while they are do the drawings.


edit: this poster clarifies below that they do not condone copyright infringement, which could be construed from above. Boards.ie do not condone copyright infringement in any way.

sydthebeat

sydthebeat

Casati wrote: »

Its down to your preference- most people live in a house they had zero input to the design of. If you want to build it as cheap as possible, I would as you said keep it v simple, limit the number of rooms and keep it as a rectangle. Make sure you talk to the local planning office to see what stipulations they have, in some areas certain features are not liked, equally they might want a stone cladding which will be more expensive on some designs versus others.

My advise is to review online plans like plan a home, and draw it up yourself using pen or paper, or basic drawing package, and then get a tech drawer to convert to auto cad- agree a rate per hour and sit with him/ her while they are do the drawings.

the part in bold is exactly the wrong type of information that leads to bad houses.
These are not units to build and leave... they are homes for families to live in and as such should be treated with the respect they deserve.

The OP should go to his designer and tell him/her what the proposed budget is and let them then design a home that suits all his requirements to that budget.

The days of looking at a budget and saying "how big can i go for that" are, thankfully, dead with the celtic tiger excess.

as designer we now look seriously at running costs of the house, maintenance costs, extendability etc. The current building regulations are so onerous as the idea of building "as big as i can" is simply an uneconomical use of money.

and the last paragraph which you posted can be construed as condoning copyright theft... please clarify that point ASAP or i will have to edit it out.

sinnerboy

Casati wrote: »

Its down to your preference- most people live in a house they had zero input to the design of.

I think most people in this situation find they would like to alter and/or extend their homes. If you have the chance to literally tailor the building why pass it up.
Plenty of time for regrets later.

But yes you will "buy house plans" quite cheaply.

Mellor

jocotty wrote: »

i dont have planning permission yet - but its a site that i am looking to buy, in a zoned settlement region. so planning should not be too much of a problem.
i am about to get a guy to do up the site maps, etc, but plan on getting the house drawings from the internet , as they will be cheaper...no???

Well in that case you aren't about to start building, you are about to start planning.
Saving some money on the plans is a really bad idea and it will be reflected in the design, which will ultimately affected the value of the house.

Casati wrote: »

then get a tech drawer to convert to auto cad- agree a rate per hour and sit with him/ her while they are do the drawings.

Why would he have to sit with him?

Casati

sydthebeat wrote: »

the part in bold is exactly the wrong type of information that leads to bad houses.
These are not units to build and leave... they are homes for families to live in and as such should be treated with the respect they deserve.

The OP should go to his designer and tell him/her what the proposed budget is and let them then design a home that suits all his requirements to that budget.

The days of looking at a budget and saying "how big can i go for that" are, thankfully, dead with the celtic tiger excess.

as designer we now look seriously at running costs of the house, maintenance costs, extendability etc. The current building regulations are so onerous as the idea of building "as big as i can" is simply an uneconomical use of money.

and the last paragraph which you posted can be construed as condoning copyright theft... please clarify that point ASAP or i will have to edit it out.

Firstly, I would not condone copyright infringement, I simply meant one should look at other drawings for inspiration, and then go and draw your own based on what you want.

Feel free to delete my post if you wish, I was only trying to put across a point of view, where as you are trying to impose your thoughts as if they are facts.

Post Celtic Tiger, the facts are that most people are trying to limit costs in all areas

sydthebeat

im disagreeing with your viewpoint by offering an alternative...

theres a difference between gaining 'inspiration' from a plan and

review online plans like plan a home, and draw it up yourself

which is actually breach of copyright, but as youve said you dont condone it, ill add that note.

and in the days of post celtic tiger people are looking at the bigger picture... did you ever hear the saying "penny wise, pound foolish"?

building a shoe box might be cheaper but that certainly does not means its better, or best use of "bang for buck".

jonniebgood1

Casati wrote: »

Firstly, I would not condone copyright infringement, I simply meant one should look at other drawings for inspiration, and then go and draw your own based on what you want.

Feel free to delete my post if you wish, I was only trying to put across a point of view, where as you are trying to impose your thoughts as if they are facts.

Post Celtic Tiger, the facts are that most people are trying to limit costs in all areas

You may have been putting your point of view across but it was rightly challenged by people with more experience in this area than you obviously have. Thats what the forum is for.

Your contention that the OP should sit with an Architectural Technician as they draw up the plans suggests that you have no idea of the time that it takes to prepare plans to a reasonable standard.

Your contention that it is more cost effective to get plans off the internet and use them shows that you have no knowledge of how a dwelling evolves from a design process involving things like site location, boundaries, views, direction of sunlight, development guidelines, energy requirements, local needs requirements, etc.

Your contention that a house that ignores the above will limit costs is wrong- it will cost alot more in the long run and possibly even the short term.

archtech

It's generally best and most cost effective to get a house designed which takes into account the site features. It might initially cost a few bob more but over the course of the lifetime of the house you should reap the rewards and will being long term value, be it energy saving, making the best of solar gain/site orientation, capturing the views or even the positioning of the house on the site, something a 'generic' set of plans seldom achieve.

Also by engaging (through meetings) with an experienced design professional you will get guidance and ideas on what will work for you in terms of layout etc.

No6

I have frequently come accross clients who want plan no x from certain books etc, but when I sit them down and talk to them what actually happens is they like this bit and that bit but havnt a clue about the rest so designing a house from scratch while incorporating a few features from the plans or elevations they like actually gives them the house they really want but cannot express.

A lot of the designs in pattern plan books and on the internet are now unsuitable for a lot of locations where they have housing design guides and to achieve compliance with the building regs without serious redesign anyways so be very careful using them.

jocotty

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

Your contention that the OP should sit with an Architectural Technician as they draw up the plans suggests that you have no idea of the time that it takes to prepare plans to a reasonable standard.....

Your contention that it is more cost effective to get plans off the internet and use them shows that you have no knowledge of how a dwelling evolves from a design process involving things like site location, boundaries, ...

Your contention that a house that ignores the above will limit costs is wrong.

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

sinnerboy

Cost is always an issue. In recession , money is tight and in boom you fear being ripped off. Both valid and sensible reactions.

You will hopefully live in this house long beyond this recession and you will pay for it for most of your working life ( assumption ) . Many have tried to open your mind to the folly of undertaking this with "cheap drawings" . Look around the site a bit deeper you will see this advice is very "real world"

However Someone did post a site reference at post no 2.

archtech

jocotty wrote: »

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

1. establish your budget for the build, if you haven't already done so
2. arrange to meet 3 or so design professionals (architect/arch tech etc)at the site
3. give them an outline of what you would like included in the house (number of bedrooms etc) (referred to as the design brief) and discuss it with them, you will get some ideas of what will/won't work on the site from that discussion. Ask questions.
4. seek referrals and let them come back with a price and list of services they are going to provide for their fee
5. appoint one and let them develop a sketch design for review
6. progress it from there

rayjdav

jocotty wrote: »

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

Have you actually got a quote from an AT/Arch as of yet for the actual deisgn service or is Billy down the pub dispensing "knowledge" again? I'm a bit confused reading here.
If you get a generic design, build as cheap as possible and when your circumstances possibly change in due course and you need to move on, don't be surprised if your house does not pay for itself on any future sale due to lack of thought. Generic houses are just that and do not compliment the site and natural features.
You will need someone who knows what they are doing either way to submit the package and reply to probable RFI's so why not engage for the full service? The overall cost would most probably cover itself during the build as potential issues would be seen now and fixed as opposed to paying twice and more on trades to remedy on site.

jonniebgood1

jocotty wrote: »

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

Post 19 gives how you could start the process.

I would suggest you consider some of the things you need from a house. Personal traits will determine alot of a layout. With cost being an important consideration you may want to place more importance on say a main bedroom and a kitchen/ living room. You don't sit with a technician, that was a comment that the person didnt know the reality of the design process> thats what you are deciding about by the way. If you take a plan from a book you will be eliminating the design process from you house. The design process is essentially what makes the house suitable for you to live in. It need not cost a prohibitive sum to you either. You can talk to people to get estimate of costs before you agree with paying over anything. I think from your comments you will want a service to planning permission as this is cheaper than a full architectural service (a full service might include technical detail drawings of construction). In the whole context of the financial outlay of a house the design cost is likely to cost in or around 2% of the total cost. This will of course vary depending on where you are based and is a very rough figure given in case you have no idea of planning costs. Hope that is helpful.

New build in sight

jocotty wrote: »

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

Hi jocotty, I sense you are starting to get frustrated with the comments here... and I completely understand where you are coming from. You need to remember when you come on boards.ie there are plenty of professionals that will advise you....

However I am going to go against the grain here and provide you with our experience, and believe me, we are learning on the job, and we are saving lots!
We did go to an architech to get our plans drawn up, however I feel it is only fair to tell you that he litterally took some plans he had drawn up for someone else previously and switched it to catputre south facing etc. he handed them to us and luckily i liked them and we paid him €1200 for teh privileage! So yes by all means it is feasable to get plans online and either way you have to get an engineer to sign off on each stage payment, so get a good engineer who can advise you. We havent seen our architech since we got our planning. We are 1/4 of the way through our direct labour build and I reckon were doing just fine.
I have come on to boards.ie to search for advice and i end up feeling like an idiot for not doing this that and the other but at the end of the day we have yet to hit any major dilemas and if we do we will deal with them.
Had i known that i could of bought plans online and saved myself €1200 i would of done it!!!

So heres my amateur advice "go for it! " No matter what route you take you will make mistakes and have regrets. Don't be intimidated into one option of contacting a pro all the time.

Best of luck!!!

sinnerboy

.... and you would buy a house that you built ?

archtech

New build in sight wrote: »

Hi jocotty, I sense you are starting to get frustrated with the comments here... and I completely understand where you are coming from. You need to remember when you come on boards.ie there are plenty of professionals that will advise you....

The same professionals whom you have sought and accepted advice from

New build in sight wrote: »

either way you have to get an engineer to sign off on each stage payment

Not technically correct there are a number of different professional types whom can sign off on stage payments. One of the key requirements for certification of works is the certifier needs to hold Professional Indemnity Insurance.

New build in sight wrote: »

We havent seen our architech since we got our planning.

You might clarify if that is that because they haven't bothered to come near you or because you haven't engaged him/her to provide services post planning stage.

New build in sight wrote: »

We are 1/4 of the way through our direct labour build and I reckon were doing just fine.

Maybe you are doing fine in your opinion, however there are many people whom built houses and they too thought they were doing just fine until problems were discovered went it was too late. Engaging the services of an engineer of other to visit the site at the time of certification for the bank won't pick up on everything.

New build in sight wrote: »

Had i known that i could of bought plans online and saved myself €1200 i would of done it!!!

And the price for plans bought on line are? Not withstanding buying the plans on line you still need someone to prepare a site layout plan, os maps etc and prepare and complete the application documentation, so I don't think you would have saved much if anything. From your account of your experience with your "architect" all you did was buy a set of plans and the associated services and not a purpose designed house.

BryanF

New build in sight wrote: »

Had i known that i could of bought plans online and saved myself €1200 i would of done it!!!

Can we have someone comment who in the last 3 years HAS ACTUALLY bought internet plans and gotten PLANNING approved for 1200 or less THANKS

jocotty

[QUOTEHowever I am going to go against the grain here and provide you with our experience, and believe me, we are learning on the job, and we are saving lots!
We QUOTE]


thaks for that "new build in sight"....fair play to you for the encouragement

New build in sight

archtech wrote: »

The same professionals whom you have sought and accepted advice from

...And to which I am very grateful for. I didnt realise everyone on boards.ie are professionals, I know I certainly never claim to be even in my "profession". I thought boards.ie is a sounding board for opinions.


Not technically correct there are a number of different professional types whom can sign off on stage payments. One of the key requirements for certification of works is the certifier needs to hold Professional Indemnity Insurance.

...our bank insisted on a certified engineer, I am not disagreeing with you, I am simply sharing our experience.


You might clarify if that is that because they haven't bothered to come near you or because you haven't engaged him/her to provide services post planning stage.

...Why you need this clarified is beyond me, but here goes... we offered him the opportunity to quote for the project manage the build and he came back with a quote that was way out of our budget. And yes we received several quotes from others too which were also outside our budget. Hence we are doing direct.



Maybe you are doing fine in your opinion, however there are many people whom built houses and they too thought they were doing just fine until problems were discovered went it was too late. Engaging the services of an engineer of other to visit the site at the time of certification for the bank won't pick up on everything.

.... And many people had reputable builders build houses and have serious issues too. I am not sure what exactly you are implying here. We may be doing direct labour but that certainly doesnt mean were idiots. We've done our research.



And the price for plans bought on line are? Not withstanding buying the plans on line you still need someone to prepare a site layout plan, os maps etc and prepare and complete the application documentation, so I don't think you would have saved much if anything. From your account of your experience with your "architect" all you did was buy a set of plans and the associated services and not a purpose designed house.

.... you can easily ifnd out how much to buy plans online are, just by a quick google search. My first search tells me €500 approx for very decent set of plans in my opinion.

And just to finish my response. I wanted to offer my personal opinion/experience to the OP.

New build in sight

archtech wrote: »

The same professionals whom you have sought and accepted advice from


Not technically correct there are a number of different professional types whom can sign off on stage payments. One of the key requirements for certification of works is the certifier needs to hold Professional Indemnity Insurance.


You might clarify if that is that because they haven't bothered to come near you or because you haven't engaged him/her to provide services post planning stage.



Maybe you are doing fine in your opinion, however there are many people whom built houses and they too thought they were doing just fine until problems were discovered went it was too late. Engaging the services of an engineer of other to visit the site at the time of certification for the bank won't pick up on everything.



And the price for plans bought on line are? Not withstanding buying the plans on line you still need someone to prepare a site layout plan, os maps etc and prepare and complete the application documentation, so I don't think you would have saved much if anything. From your account of your experience with your "architect" all you did was buy a set of plans and the associated services and not a purpose designed house.

jocotty wrote: »

[QUOTEHowever I am going to go against the grain here and provide you with our experience, and believe me, we are learning on the job, and we are saving lots!
We QUOTE]


thaks for that "new build in sight"....fair play to you for the encouragement

I wish you all the best, it's hard work but so worth it when you see it coming together. Do keep us posted on how you get on and which route you end up following.....

New build in sight

BryanF wrote: »

Can we have someone comment who in the last 3 years HAS ACTUALLY bought internet plans and gotten PLANNING approved for 1200 or less THANKS

Technically I could almost say we did, since we did simply buy a set of pre approved plans from our architech. These plans were approved by someone else in another county, so he made a few changes so they were not exact and this is what we sent in to our planners. The plans themselves were never questioned, we were refused on other reasons which we eventually overcame.

archtech

New build in sight wrote: »

it's hard work but so worth it when you see it coming together.

Nobody here has ever said its easy however there are times when some of the hard work could have been avoided having sought and taken the advice of experience beforehand. A definition of Experience is learning from prior mistakes

New build in sight wrote: »

.Had i known that i could of bought plans online and saved myself €1200 i would of done it!!!

New build in sight wrote: »

.... you can easily ifnd out how much to buy plans online are, just by a quick google search. My first search tells me €500 approx for very decent set of plans in my opinion.

You might clarify how buying your plans on line would have saved yourself €1200 , if you only spend €1200, as you have stated in response to BryanF's question. You found that you can buy a set of plans for approximately €500, fair enough but did that include the relevant marked OS Map Extracts, and surveyed Site Plan for inclusion as part of the planning application. Then there's a site suitability test for most rural applications also.

New build in sight wrote: »

I wanted to offer my personal opinion/experience to the OP.

And what opinion/experience did you want to offer the OP, other than not to listen to the advice of the professional posted here.

New build in sight

sinnerboy wrote: »

.... and you would buy a house that you built ?

What do you mean? Is this question directed at me? If so then of course I would.

New build in sight

archtech wrote: »

Nobody here has ever said its easy however there are times when some of the hard work could have been avoided having sought and taken the advice of experience beforehand. A definition of Experience is learning from prior mistakes





You might clarify how buying your plans on line would have saved yourself €1200 , if you only spend €1200, as you have stated in response to BryanF's question. You found that you can buy a set of plans for approximately €500, fair enough but did that include the relevant marked OS Map Extracts, and surveyed Site Plan for inclusion as part of the planning application. Then there's a site suitability test for most rural applications also.



And what opinion/experience did you want to offer the OP, other than not to listen to the advice of the professional posted here.

The €1200 was for the plans only. We had other expenses on top of that for site maps and planning applications etc. Percolation test etc was also an extra fee, our architech could not complete this test, we needed to get someone else to do it.
Read my post again and you can see for yourself what opinion/experience i provided the OP with. MY experience.
I dont see how you costantly trying to belittle me or catch me out with my posts is benefiting anyone, i never belittled you or any other professionals, i simply gave my personal experience. We all live and learn and if i could do it all again, i would personally have perhaps given more thought to buying plans online. When we were with our Architech I flicked through a load of his plans "online" and then choose one, it had previously been approved in another county, he flipped the design so it was more south facing to capture sun etc. That was it. €1200 for this in my opinion was high now that i have learnt a lot more. I would love to say this happened once, but it didnt, we bought about 3 other designs of him before too, no point me going into the reasons of the history of this, but please jsut accept my explanation and my opinion as is. If you want to offer the OP some advice then go ahead, but I never asked for your advice, I only responded to the OP. I never asked for this debate.

rayjdav

New build in sight wrote: »

What do you mean? Is this question directed at me? If so then of course I would.

I assume that what was meant was that if you knew an inexperienced self builder built the house, learning on the job, would you be confident as a probable purchaser to pay a hugh sum of money for what is probably not 100% correct. Nothing personal but I have yet to meet a newbie who got all the important issues right 1st time out...

Just like a doctor, I have no problem with the student standing there and learning, but beside and under professional instruction from a more experienced doctor. Otherwise he/she aint sticking any type of needle in me, anywhere.........

New build in sight

rayjdav wrote: »

I assume that what was meant was that if you knew an inexperienced self builder built the house, learning on the job, would you be confident as a probable purchaser to pay a hugh sum of money for what is probably not 100% correct. Nothing personal but I have yet to meet a newbie who got all the important issues right 1st time out...

Just like a doctor, I have no problem with the student standing there and learning, but beside and under professional instruction from a more experienced doctor. Otherwise he/she aint sticking any type of needle in me, anywhere.........

It isn't like we are out there with our bare hands doing this all ourselves, we are project managing incredibly skilled and reputable builders to work for us. We have been researching this for 6 long years. This is not something we have taken lightly. I certainly would not spend all this money I thought wouldnt end up absolutely perfect. And yes I do in fact expect it to be 100% perfect 1st time, i do not intend to do it again

I am updating in live self builds thread. So you can follow my posts there as i feel we are now pulling this thread off topic

I am not feeling the love anymore on here......

rayjdav

New build in sight wrote: »

I am not feeling the love anymore on here......

Group hug then:D

muffler

New build in sight wrote: »

I am not feeling the love anymore on here......

If you're female I'll sort you out

Ah listen, dont take it personally. Any comment posted here or in any forum can and often is dissected and scrutinised responded to especially if its in contrast to what the majority of other posters are saying.

There is nothing wrong with the route you have chosen if you are happy enough with it at the end of the day. What the guys here (including myself) are saying in response to the OP is that its more beneficial in the long run to have your house designed to suit you, the site and to comply with various regulations.

sinnerboy

rayjdav wrote: »

I assume that what was meant was that if you knew an inexperienced self builder built the house, learning on the job, would you be confident as a probable purchaser to pay a hugh sum of money for what is probably not 100% correct. Nothing personal but I have yet to meet a newbie who got all the important issues right 1st time out...

Just like a doctor, I have no problem with the student standing there and learning, but beside and under professional instruction from a more experienced doctor. Otherwise he/she aint sticking any type of needle in me, anywhere.........

Got it in one rayjdav.

I expect everyone to answer "yes" to the question as I put. But then - would you buy a house of a total stranger who self built like this ?

archtech

New build in sight wrote: »

The €1200 was for the plans only. We had other expenses on top of that for site maps and planning applications etc. Percolation test etc was also an extra fee, our architech could not complete this test, we needed to get someone else to do it.
Read my post again and you can see for yourself what opinion/experience i provided the OP with. MY experience.
I dont see how you costantly trying to belittle me or catch me out with my posts is benefiting anyone, i never belittled you or any other professionals, i simply gave my personal experience. We all live and learn and if i could do it all again, i would personally have perhaps given more thought to buying plans online. When we were with our Architech I flicked through a load of his plans "online" and then choose one, it had previously been approved in another county, he flipped the design so it was more south facing to capture sun etc. That was it. €1200 for this in my opinion was high now that i have learnt a lot more. I would love to say this happened once, but it didnt, we bought about 3 other designs of him before too, no point me going into the reasons of the history of this, but please jsut accept my explanation and my opinion as is. If you want to offer the OP some advice then go ahead, but I never asked for your advice, I only responded to the OP. I never asked for this debate.

So to clarify you could have saved in the order of 50-60% of what you paid your designer, had you bought a set of plans online based on current prices. I note you started the process a number of years ago when everything was more expensive. It was unclear initially as to whether the €1200 was the all in price for preparing the drawing and planning application or just the plans of the house. At least now the OP understands that he still has to add more to the €500 or so for a set of plans should he choose to buy them online, if he wants to go that route.

The fact that you have ended up spending a considerable amount of money on plans, (3 or 4 different designs in total) has that not illustrated to you that buying a set of "pre-drawn plans" may not be not as cost effective as it appears. Admittedly it might have been 6 years ago. I assume all drawings relate to the same site. Certainly what you've ended up paying on top of the other monies relating to the site drawings etc would have brought you a bespoke design with full design service (design, tender, inspection,certification) for at least one house and number of sketch designs.

At the end of the day it highly unlikely that I'm going to benefit from the route the op takes however for the op to make an informed decision its best to have as many of the facts as possible from both sides of the argument so that they can see all the pit falls. Based on your first post one could have easily assumed that it cost you €1200 for all the drawings necessary for you planning application and construction, and that it could be done even cheaper by buying online, however it has transpired that this is not the case. I'm not suggesting that you intended to imply that was the fact, so teasing out the matter was of benefit to the op.

Innish_Rebel

Seeing as there seems to be two totally opposing points of view on this discussion. Currently in the middle of a build where we did hire an Arch to do the designs.

He did a design to our requirements, don't know if he did it from scratch or not - to be honest I don't care to much as we reviewd it numerous times with him with plenty of modifications along the way and it was what we wanted. He suggested and knew things I would never have even considered. He did the planning submission etc apart from percolation test. With maps, photocopying/printing and associated stuff total was less than €2k.

I look at it as 2 things.

1. As a percentage of overall build cost it is small to get a house that was what we wanted. If you can get the same from online plans - that is great, we didn't see anything for us that ticked all the boxes.
2. Within a five mile radius of where I got my planning. I know numerous people who've had major hassle getting planning, ours went through without a problem.

I suppose I wanted to put the point as opposed to "new build" I, if I had the time back, would still definitely go the route I have gone down.

As an aside I work as an engineer in the electronics industry, and I know how much my time is charged out at by my employers. Now I know I don't get that money myself but to do the work my arch did I would consider with the time involved in meeting with me plus drawings etc that there was value for work done - up to individuals to decide if that is also value for money...

BryanF

New build in sight wrote: »

Technically I could almost say we did, since we did simply buy a set of pre approved plans from our architech. These plans were approved by someone else in another county, so he made a few changes so they were not exact and this is what we sent in to our planners. The plans themselves were never questioned, we were refused on other reasons which we eventually overcame.

technically nothing! consider re reading your own posts in this thread please

Casati

jocotty wrote: »

So , where do i start so....im not a architect, i dont have any house drawings and am living in the real world, trying to build a house in a recession. obviously cost is an issue. just want cheap drawings, which i can look at , and change myself to what i like. we cant all afford the luxury to "sit with an Architectural Technician "....

I said to sit with somebody drawing the house as thats what I did. The experts on the site don't like to admit that self builders generally do great jobs as it doesn't help their chances of getting work. Too often on this site the vested interest from the experts comes to the surface as they dismiss out of hand posters like myself whiteout having a clue about what we have done, and what you are capable of doing yourself with time and effort.

To clarify, the approach I think you should take is to basically design the house yourself to your own requirements, using whatever existing plans you can see for inspiration. Considering site aspect is very important but its not rocket science- think about how you will use the house and what rooms its more important for you to have more natural light in etc. If you want to use solar you should ideally have roof space south facing to stick them on. Keeping it simple will reduce building costs- if you have a 'fancy' design then builders/ tradesmen will see the dollar signs at every single stage in the process. Note- if the site is very complex, e.g. on the side of a steep hill then get an architect familiar with such problems.

I drew out my design on A3 sheets, and brought it to somebody good with cad and got them to turn my drawing into a proper drawings, taking into account such things as building regs and local planning regulations. I literally sat with him as he drew the main 'plan' view on auto cad - I left them to do the contiguous evalations etc by themselves. Somebody sharp with auto cad and experienced in this work should easily draw up your house in half a day assuming you keep it simple. They might be an arch tech, a architect or indeed an engineer or technician

Note- once you get though planning, you can re-jig the internal layout of the house as long as you keep within the planning reg's so its not locked in stone. Prior to starting building works, you will need your drawing converted to technical drawings to give to each of the trades you have on site, some of this you can do yourself but you will probably need to revisit your. Also in order to meet building reg's you will need to spend a lot of time ensuring you insulate/ heat your house efficiently- I think you need to get an A3 rating from next year at a minimum so this will take a lot of research on your part.

Good luck and enjoy the process.

rayjdav

Casati, that process worked for you. Great. But for the most part a decent AT/Arch/Tech does not need you sitting looking over their shoulder. A basic sketch/notes/chat usually does the trick.

Makes no differnce to me personally how you built but I, like most others here, give out (FREE) advice gained over many years doing the work so know a thing or 2 about the process. Most are happy to get the advice. Few gain a lot of work from it so where's the vested interest??

We do advise that you get someone who knows what they are doing for at least the technical aspects of the work, planning submission etc. as other wise it will cost more in the long run, eg invalid applications etc. but once again, I don't care if you(anyone) takes heed or not.

Wouldn't be much of a site if it consisted of general opinion only, free for all akin to After Hours quoting Wikipedia as fact..

muffler

Casati wrote: »

The experts on the site don't like to admit that self builders generally do great jobs as it doesn't help their chances of getting work. Too often on this site the vested interest from the experts comes to the surface as they dismiss out of hand posters like myself whiteout having a clue about what we have done, and what you are capable of doing yourself with time and effort.

I find those comments a tad insulting especially coming from someone who was happy enough to seek and get free advice in the past from professionals on this forum.

sinnerboy

Meh ... thats what the ignore function is for. My list grows.....

New build in sight

muffler wrote: »

I find those comments a tad insulting especially coming from someone who was happy enough to seek and get free advice in the past from professionals on this forum.

Well if we are continously attacked and our posts are torn to shreds everytime we post on here, you can see how some people can start to feel like this. Look at how BryanF seems to respond to every post i post with some kind of insult, albeit subtle but still insulting to us amateurs as i was called previously. Perhaps it would help if these experts indicated which fields they were experts in then we would know where to go for this advice. But currently it seems everyone on this site are experts in every aspect of building. It is great that we can all share our experiences etc. and i love to hear everyones elses tales, but I am starting to think its not worth feeling this bad when all i wanted to do was share my experience. I never asked for adice on this thread whatsoever but i was attacked from all angles and my opinions were slated by all these experts.

Is everyone on boards.ie a professional? When i come to boards.ie i expect to get a diverse range of opinions and experience not vested interests in their own business.

sydthebeat

lads, lets take a step back here for a minute.... we've gone wild off topic... and its a topic that very pertinent to the majority of frequent posters here.

Whether or not 'direct labour builds' can be successful is like anything else in life... if the effort is put into it then theres a better chance of success. However like every professions, you can have good self builders and some really bad ones. In my experience the good self builders are those with a background in either construction and / or some sort of project management.
key to the success is also the skills and professionalism of the tradespersons on site.

One of the best self builders who frequents here is SAS... a guy who self built and project managed a 'certified' passive house build (well... on the way to being anyway). He can tell you the hours upon hours thats needs to research and plan... and still mistakes will be made.

In my opinion, a 'self builder' who doesnt have prior knowledge of a construction site is totally dependent on the skills of his tradespeople and the success of the build is in their hands. A novice self builder simply will not be able to spot pit falls and / or the best way to resolve issues simply because these require experience.

a novice self builder and 'fly by night' tradespeople is a recipe for disaster.
Unfortunately on public forums like this more often than not you only hear the good news stories.. the €'s saved etc.... posters dont come on and tell the horror stories of budgets being over run, building reg non compliance.. of build schedules doubling etc. In fact most of the time we here advise self builders of non reg compliance is the first time they hear of such.


But back on topic.... and ill still revert back to my other post in this thread.... do you really think its a good idea to purchase the plans for your most expensive investment in your life from an impartial on line source?

to 'new build in sight' ... sorry the description of how you obtained your plans are not what the OP is asking about in regard to

plan on getting the house drawings from the internet

sinnerboy

sydthebeat wrote: »

do you really think its a good idea to purchase the plans for your most expensive investment in your life from an impartial on line source?

.... note the number of times the OP uses the word "cheap" . Left to his own devices all will be cheap but for his borrowings.

Casati

rayjdav wrote: »

I assume that what was meant was that if you knew an inexperienced self builder built the house, learning on the job, would you be confident as a probable purchaser to pay a hugh sum of money for what is probably not 100% correct. Nothing personal but I have yet to meet a newbie who got all the important issues right 1st time out...

Just like a doctor, I have no problem with the student standing there and learning, but beside and under professional instruction from a more experienced doctor. Otherwise he/she aint sticking any type of needle in me, anywhere.........

On the other hand would you buy a house that a builder built simply to make a profit on? Some builders are great, and have brilliant attention to detail, but others will do the bare minimum and 'plaster over the cracks'

Casati

rayjdav wrote: »

Casati, that process worked for you. Great. But for the most part a decent AT/Arch/Tech does not need you sitting looking over their shoulder. A basic sketch/notes/chat usually does the trick.

Makes no differnce to me personally how you built but I, like most others here, give out (FREE) advice gained over many years doing the work so know a thing or 2 about the process. Most are happy to get the advice. Few gain a lot of work from it so where's the vested interest??

We do advise that you get someone who knows what they are doing for at least the technical aspects of the work, planning submission etc. as other wise it will cost more in the long run, eg invalid applications etc. but once again, I don't care if you(anyone) takes heed or not.

Wouldn't be much of a site if it consisted of general opinion only, free for all akin to After Hours quoting Wikipedia as fact..

I have received some good advise from the construction & planning forum, thats really why I read the comments now and might offer my experience. Its a shame that some posters dismiss out of hand some of the comments made by the self builders like myself.

You are 100% correct that it can be tricky to get planning submissions through, and needs a lot of time an effort studying the relevant documentation to meet all the requirements- professionals should be able to get this stuff right first time, and as such can play a really valuable part if you are tight on time or simply not able nor interesting in going through planning guidelines and the like. If the OP wants to keep the cost low, then he can help to do so by doing as much of the work himself as possible, but as other posters have said if you do stuff without adequate research it can cost you money in the long run

New build in sight

Casati wrote: »

On the other hand would you buy a house that a builder built simply to make a profit on? Some builders are great, and have brilliant attention to detail, but others will do the bare minimum and 'plaster over the cracks'

One of the reasons we didn't buy a house as we simply couldnt find one as good a quality i would expect for the money i am paying. Thankfully we also felt like this in the boom!