Velomobile

RHJ

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Tonyandthewhale

Personally I use a normal bicycle (or rather a small fleet of bicycles) as an alternative to owning a car.
I reckon a velomobile could be a viable alternative (but I'd really want to try you to be sure) but I don't think a lot of people will choose the velomobile alternative. They seem to be very expensive, they'd have to offer a marked improvement over a normal bicycle while still being considerably cheaper to own and run than even the cheapest car before people would consider switching in large numbers.

I might buy one some day if I have the money but there's no getting away from the fact that normal bikes are so much cooler looking.

RHJ

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RHJ

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Wishbone Ash

Reminds me of Clive Sinclair's C5 - a commercial flop in the 1980s.

RHJ wrote: »

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I don't know any cyclists who would consider protection from rain to be important!


Count me out!

RHJ

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AltAccount

RHJ wrote: »

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I'm interested in where this thread is going, but to be honest when you post things like the above, I instinctively brace myself for zealotry, soapboxing or trolling.

RHJ

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AltAccount

Yes, and the velomobile is the best selling, most cost effective, best looking vehicle you can buy that's called a velomobile

AltAccount

RHJ wrote: »

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Question in return: what would you consider the advantages of a car to be, as a form of transport?

For me it's likely to be ability to cover long distances at speed, load carrying ability, passenger carrying ability, relative safety and protection from the elements.

I don't think a velomobile addresses any of these concerns in a meaningful way. Certainly not to the extent where it justifies such a massive premium over the cheaper competition (e.g. a bicycle, scooter or motorcycle) or over the car it's looking to replace.

For those reasons I'd then answer your second question with a "no, not at the expense of more realistic car-replacement options".

Darkglasses

I'll go into this in detail eventually, but to be honest i'd love to have one. I don't think they're the answer for everyone, but they would suit me great if they weren't so prohibitively expensive. Would probably stick to a normal bike for commuting though, parking for me is one of the main reasons i cycle. Velomobile is too large to chuck into the corner at work.

Wishbone Ash

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They are not cyclists - only potential cyclists.

RHJ wrote:

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That's not really a valid argument. It may have been the only electric vehicle available and therefore would automatically make it a best seller in it's class. It would be a bit like me claiming that, in 1982, the S Class Merc was the best selling car in the world with ABS.

RHJ

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RHJ

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kincsem

I like the idea of a velomobile but see negatives.

• high purchase cost
• straight line aero speed, not commuting stop/start
• parking problems as need an almost car size space
• can not use car lanes easily as slow acceleration

AltAccount

RHJ wrote: »

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A bike or motorbike and some raingear?

RHJ

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AltAccount

RHJ wrote: »

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And what do you think that'll do to the price?

RHJ

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g0g

For the benefit of simpletons like me who needs pictures rather than links.....:)

kenmc

RHJ wrote: »

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Get a road bike so and/or pedal faster. I commute 13 km each way. Stopping at lights. It rarely takes me over 30 mins door to door, fastest to date is 26mins.

If there were no lights it would be even less. You said you live rurally, so you should certainly be able to get sub 30 mins for your 12km trip to the nearest town - an average of 30km/h is very doable on a road bike

CramCycle

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They are quite fast on down hills having seen them in France but if you are living in hilly country, your reduced speed on the uphills lead to a significant increase in time in the saddle. In a country like the netherlands it might hugely increase your speed but in Ireland, IMO, no, you will be slower overall. 5x or more longer to climb a hill for less than 2x faster on the downhill. Climbing is where you spend most of your time on a bike in Ireland (for the majority, not all) and anything that increases that time is a humongous negative.

Why not save yourself 6000 and get a recumbent and a rain cape with a bag on board to carry a change and some baby wipes/towels.

seeing_ie

Fecking love the whole velomobile concept.

If you sat higher and they were cheaper, I'd have on here.

They're a no-brainer in Holland, considering the great cycle lanes and flat landscape.

They're still a runner here imo - electric motor assist for the hills is quite viable according to what I've read.

Anyone seen one here?

petethedrummer

seeing_ie wrote: »

Anyone seen one here?

yes I had one as a child but it didn't have the electric assist.


If these are pedal powered they should be called Ped-O-Mobiles.

RHJ

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RHJ

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RHJ

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AltAccount

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They should put an electric motor on their bike

eoin88

As has been previously said, a velomobile sounds like a good idea for flat terrain, but I don't think it would make any sense in Ireland. Sure it might be suitable for a handful of people commuting from the Curragh, but I don't see it ever taking off really. I would be opposed to Government subsidies for it at the expense of electric vehicles as velomobiles are far less practical and can only accommodate one person. I can't imagine many people buying them as anything other than a toy for the weekends. (Incidently, would a velomobile currently be covered under the bike-to-work scheme?)

I wouldn't be very comfortable travelling alongside fast moving traffic due to its height, it could quite easily be missed. Narrow, potholed cycle lanes may also prove awkward. Manoeuvring through city traffic and parking would be a big turn off for me too. I'd be far happier on my hybrid. If my commute ever ends up significantly longer than the 10 km I currently cycle, I would be far more inclined to spend a bit of cash on a motorbike or something like a Smart or Renault Twizy. (For anyone unfamiliar with the Twizy, it's a weird little tandem-seated electric car! )

mcgratheoin

RHJ wrote: »

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I can imagine it would add a huge amount more than €200 to the sale price... A conversion kit to add an electric motor to a standard push bike can come in at over €500 (link) so I don't see how you could add a (bigger and more powerful) motor to a velobike for €200.

It sounds as if you're already convinced that what you need is a velobike, in which case just go and buy one. Everyone here will be delighted to hear about it and we'll all fancy a go if we're in your neck of the woods. You won't be able to convince most of us that it's the best way to get around in Ireland though. You can buy an electric scooter (I know a guy who has one) for €2400 and the running costs are minimal - €31 road tax, less than €1 per charge which lasts 60km. You'd have to run that for a long time to recoup the purchase price of your velomobile. Even charging it fully every night would give you annual running costs under €500.

seamus

I'd like one for the novelty value, but only if it was given to me. I wouldn't pay for it unless I had more money than I knew what to do with.

As others have been saying here, the primary problem is that the velomobile is attempting to address gap in the market by creating a car/bike hybrid. But instead of taking all of the good things about both it seems to have mostly taken the bad from both, with a dash of the good.

So it's expensive upfront, it's not ultra-mobile, so you'll still largely have to wait in traffic and have to try find somewhere to park it, it doesn't look great, and it's got poor visibility (both seeing out and seeing the bike).

The idea is sound, IMO. You're looking for something which addresses what non-cyclists see to be the biggest issues with cycling - the elements, the effort and the luggage. The problem is that it throws out many of the benefits of cycling, cost being the major one, but simplicity and mobility too.

I think there is a market for a bike which addresses these issues, but only so long as it doesn't cause issues of its own. I actually think if you can address the "effort" issue - that people see cycling as a sweaty activity - then you can make some headway on it.

tomasrojo

http://bikesnobnyc.blogspot.ie/2012/08/pod-people-infiltrating-world-of-cars.html

Lumen

With all due respect to people with crazy futuristic ideas, and bearing in mind I've never pedalled one, I think the idea is stupid.

They're expensive, heavy and less maneuverable that a conventional bike (or recumbent for that matter).

Not only that but I imagine they get very hot inside if you pedal hard, or of you live somewhere that has any kind of season that isn't deep winter.

Cycling is an outdoor activity. That's actually one of its most appealing aspects.

Mr. Grieves

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Have you ridden (driven?) one of these before? I struggle to believe the above is true. Is that what the manufacturers claim?

Lumen

Mr. Grieves wrote: »

Have you ridden (driven?) one of these before? I struggle to believe the above is true. Is that what the manufacturers claim?

Pro: the world hour records are about 50kph and 90kph for the "conventional" bicycle and HPV respectively, so the HPV is undoubtably more efficient.

Con: riding something named after a sexually transmitted disease.

seeing_ie

Just to revisit this....(groans all round)

As a transport, not recreational, cyclist, there's plenty of scenarios where one of these would suit me , and replace a car.

I do semi-regular 85km trips from Dublin to the midlands.

On a wet, windy, cold winter's evening a velomobile would be a hell of a lot more attractive than cycling into a headwind for 85km.
The mango quest can cruise comfortably for the average cyclist at approx. 40 km/hr on the flat apparently.


Clearly you'd keep the bike for trips to the local shops, but longer trips in wet and windy weather would suit the velomobile.

There's also the advantage of the recumbent riding position.
It's easier on the back and on the body, a different set of muscles is used to upright cycling.

There are some major drawbacks obviously, the low riding position and price mainly. These are being addressed though with new designs like the US model below, and economies of scale should make them affordable.

Petrol ain't getting any cheaper either.



http://columbiacycleworks.com/

Anyone know of anywhere you could test a recumbent or velomobile in Ireland?

fastbrano

Well, the idea isn't new as some posters indicate - velomobiles have been around for ages. The earliest I've heard of was 1930's Europe. They have remained niche items because of several drawbacks, the largest of which is perception; that is, because the approach is unconventional, it attracts ridicule and is unlikely to be adapted into the mainstream. Cost and weight are other drawbacks.

In response to the OP, a few bits you might find useful:

To the best of my knowledge, velomobiles are not commercially available in Ireland. They are produced in small numbers on the European mainland in countries like Germany. Some American companies are beginning to build them now.

A velomobile is typically a recumbent trike/quad with a aerodynamic fairing attached. Due to the high cost and lack of availability, alot of diy'ers in the States build recumbents at home from scrap bicycles or from scratch. This significantly reduces the cost, and plans are available along with support if you have some mechanical ability.
http://www.atomiczombie.com/default.aspx
The fairing is a bit trickier, I would prefer to use a lightweight fabric rather than plastic for weight and cost reasons.

Electric motors for bikes, in my opinion aren't really there yet. The range and performance are poor and the cost of a good battery is too high. Also, those systems do not like hills which are everywhere here. If you have the money, (around €500 plus) and your journey is flat and short - electric. If not, a petrol helper motor for half the cost might be better. The legality of the petrol motor is another topic, I've got one on my mountain bike with about 100 mpg and no problems so far.

You mentioned the Sinclair C5, have you heard of the X-1 project on hiatus? It was meant to be released last year, may not happen at all, but the idea, cost and weight are good.
http://www.sinclairzx.com/spec-x-1.html