De facto relationships.

atkin

Hi,
Reading the INIS website I am interested in De facto relationships.
What does one need to prove them does anyone have experience of residence or a tourist visa based on them.

johnnyskeleton

Would you not consider speaking to a solicitor instead of going through all this stuff in a public forum?

atkin

I have 12 years experience of dealing with immigration and solicitors.
Solicitors make applications and just follow procedure that is already explained in detail on INIS or other offical web sites .They have no magical formula despite what you might make yourself believe.

ResearchWill

atkin wrote: »

Hi,
Reading the INIS website I am interested in De facto relationships.
What does one need to prove them does anyone have experience of residence or a tourist visa based on them.

It seems pretty clear on the website

"Non EEA nationals who wish to remain the State and are in a de facto relationship with an Irish National must be in a position to provide evidence of a durable attested relationship of at least 2 years. The following documents must be provided to General Immigration, INIS, 13-14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2
Copies of current passports of both parties.
Evidence of finances of both parties
Evidence of relationship of at least 2 years duration (i.e. tenancy agreement, utility bills, bank statements, etc)

Subject to the immigration status of the non EEA national permission to remain may granted. This permission will exempt the non EEA National form work permit condition.
The above is not an exhaustive list, and you may be asked for additional documentation in support of your application"

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/WP07000278

atkin

The question here is would a tourist visa be more acceptable than applying for a long stay visa.
The relationship is almost 3 years.
I can show passport stamps and only a few photos not dated for evidence.
Phone records ,e mails and chat messages are now not accepted.Irish Embassy. Manila.

ResearchWill

atkin wrote: »

The question here is would a tourist visa be more acceptable than applying for a long stay visa.
The relationship is almost 3 years.
I can show passport stamps and only a few photos not dated for evidence.
Phone records ,e mails and chat messages are now not accepted.Irish Embassy. Manila.

Of course such records are not accepted by an Embassy as they do not grant stamp 4 permissions that is the a department of justice. Embassy's are the department of Foregin Affairs they only grant visas to enter the country. The application process for defacto is set up for situations where the people have lived together, not saying that permission has not been granted for people in your situation but it is more complicated. They do not refuse to accept email etc. what they say is that such evidence on its own is not good enough you must have proof of multiple meeting face to face over time.

Defacto relationships are complicated enough permission to get when living together even more difficult when not even living in the same country. So I would go back to the advice of another poster get a lawyer involved who has applied for such permission.

In your circumstances I think getting a long stay visa will be a no no, also a refusal has to be explained on every other application, you will need to Showa number of visits to each others country for as long a duration as you can afford each time, then that together with electronic communication maybe enough to apply for long term visa and then stamp 4.

Again from INIS

"A full account of relationship history – when and where you met, evidence of this such as visas, entry/exit stamps on the passport of your partner. Please note that for Immigration purposes it is not sufficient for a relationship to have developed solely over the internet or by telephone/sms. A relationship must include a number face to face meetings (excluding webcam) between the parties. You must satisfy the visa officer that the relationship is bona-fide."

atkin

I find the Immigrant Council more helpful than paying solicitors .
Yes logically what you say is true about De Facto relations .
I think I will opt for a tourist visa for now.

ResearchWill

atkin wrote: »

I find the Immigrant Council more helpful than paying solicitors .
Yes logically what you say is true about De Facto relations .
I think I will opt for a tourist visa for now.

Your options are

1 number of visits to each other over time then apply
2 you go and live with her for some time then apply for defacto
3 she gets a stamp 2 permission to study here ye live together then apply

walrusgumble

atkin wrote: »

I have 12 years experience of dealing with immigration and solicitors.
Solicitors make applications and just follow procedure that is already explained in detail on INIS or other offical web sites .They have no magical formula despite what you might make yourself believe.

Well, they probably still know the answer to your specific question and know what to say, and emphasis on. Funny, considering your 12 years experience, you have a need to seek advice from strangers here.

Answer , any documentation to prove that you and the partner live, akin to husband and wife for the past 2 years. Evidence of financial commitment to each other etc

atkin

Well its an ongoing changing situation based on a lot of luck.

IrishAm

atkin wrote: »

Hi,
Reading the INIS website I am interested in De facto relationships.
What does one need to prove them does anyone have experience of residence or a tourist visa based on them.

You were the dude that was bitching about de-facto relationships cause your ex used you to get one and eventually obtain Irish citizenship, right?

You started numerous threads on the issue.

And now your current squeeze is a Thai ladyboy, if I remember correctly?

Please tell me this ain't real life:pac:

walrusgumble

atkin wrote: »

Well its an ongoing changing situation based on a lot of luck.

Yes and No

Yes, in the sense that the Minister of the day might be more understanding. Shatter for instance is an expert in Family Law, and one who would realise that not all families are based on marriage. Moreover, particularly in the marriage cases, where, marriage alone may not have saved an immigrant (if they were illegal) the Judges like Hogan J take the Constitution very seriously (of course, as you know, Article 41 is irrelevant in de facto cases)

No. in the sense , that the department are pretty clear as to what they want. Evidence that you lived with the partner like husband and wife. Clear documentary evidence that you live together for a period of 2-4 years (where ever that was).

In genuine cases, this will not be too difficult to prove. Sometimes, there might be a child born to the family, there may be finanical commitments like a mortgage or car finance etc.

Anything less than that, eg internet relationships abroad (where you have not lived together) was not what was intended under this administrative scheme.

If a couple are starting out, but don't have the basic documents for a period of 2 + years, they have no real business making the application. THey should bide their time and build their case. It is not enough to be simply boyfriend and girlfriend

You know this of course

atkin

Hi Walrusgumble .Thanks for the reply its informative.