Discuss Salary with Co-workers?

FaberCastel

I have been asked in the past, by a co-worker what i get paid. I found it pretty awkward, a deer in the headlights kind of moment, coupled with some non intelligible mumbling. I didn't give him an answer but I know he'll try revisit the issue again. The salary gap is about 15K.

Some background info, we work for a large multinational company, we do similar work, I've a hons degree while he has a diploma. Both same age. Now our roles have a different discription but they overlap. That being said, I do more technically difficult work and I sign off on stuff which he isn't qualified to do.

Normally I'd just say I'd prefer not to discuss it, but I'm pretty friendly with the guy and I don't want offend or isolate myself by refusing to answer his question. Equally I don't want to create hassle for management.

Also he's got contacts in our accounts department, so there is a good chance he'll find out anyway.

Just wondering what peoples opinions on the matter are?

Smcgie

When he asks you what you are getting salary wise next time: ask him how much money he has in his bank account, or when's the last time he had sex with the wife!

Seriously, friendly or not its a horrible question to ask anyone and extremly personal. I would hazard a guess that his "contact" in accounts has already informed him and he's likely just double checking with you to confirm.

I wouldn't tell him, it could lead to him developing an inferiority complex and its not an easy thing to do, working next to someone and getting €15k less (not saying you dont deserve the extra though)

Stick to what you where saying but make it clear and be assertive about it next time - its not up for discussion.

AngryHippie

Respond with : "I had this weird orgasm last night"
Take advantage of the silence to wander away

Brokentime

A baleful look usually works for me

Eoin

That's absolutely none of his business. Doesn't matter how friendly you are with him. It's up to him and his manager to work it out.

FaberCastel wrote:

Also he's got contacts in our accounts department, so there is a good chance he'll find out anyway.

I'd be surprised if that wasn't a sackable offence; or at least a very severe disciplinary issue. If you think it has or will be leaked, then I'd raise that with your boss/HR very quickly.

brennarr

You must have an idea of his salary if you know the salary gap is about 15k?

bbam

I worked in a MN for years and it was a common thing due to the pay structures it's not uncommon for this to become a hang up for some people. The two best replies I've seen we're either,

" jebus, I'd slap a guard if he asked me that"
Or
Grossly exaggerate your salary and hell either go ball headed for a manager over the ridiculous pay difference, or get the message that you don't want to tell him.

Ive had employees come to be after being spun a line on a co workers pay. I'd politely point out that they were being wound up and the person wanted to keep their salary private.

Mrs OBumble

FaberCastel wrote: »

... That being said, I do more technically difficult work and I sign off on stuff which he isn't qualified to do.

Why not just tell him?

It's obvious to him that you earn more (see the quote above) - maybe he's wondering whether it's worth getting qualified.

And besides, you know what he earns.

helimachoptor

FaberCastel wrote: »

Normally I'd just say I'd prefer not to discuss it, but I'm pretty friendly with the guy and I don't want offend or isolate myself by refusing to answer his question. Equally I don't want to create hassle for management.

Also he's got contacts in our accounts department, so there is a good chance he'll find out anyway.

Just wondering what peoples opinions on the matter are?

Honestly I never do it, I've had colleagues ask me previously. My stock response is I'm paid to do a job and at this point I'm happy with it, what other people are earning is irrelevant to me.

My positions have been unique-ish int he companies so I've never really have a direct equal but still I wouldnt be telling anyone.. in saying that some people are happy to tell everyone what they get paid

mitosis

I've had that very situation. Tell him it's less than you'd like it to be, and leave it at that. There's a reason payslips are in sealed envelopes - it's nobodies business what you get paid.

I am pie

Tell him you are not going to discuss it. I have never, and would never, ask anyone how much they were paid. If he has an issue he should discuss with his line mgmt / HR. It's pretty easy to benchmark a salary against job ads, internet searches. His comparison should be to the market, and not you.

Doesn't sound like much of a colleague, asking personal and uncomfortable questions.

Manach

Under various equal pay statues, a disparity in wages might not be linked to performance etc. but other unfair factors (gender etc.). So gathering this information might have been a way to check for this type of practice.

Faolchu

personally i'd sure i love what i do so much i do it for free. either that are ask him his wife's preference, if he replied that it was none of my damn business. i'd smile politly and say "exactly" at the end of teh day its none of his business

Eoin

JustMary wrote: »

Why not just tell him?

It's obvious to him that you earn more (see the quote above) - maybe he's wondering whether it's worth getting qualified.

Because it's none of his business and the OP isn't happy to do so. Some people think that it only benefits an employer to be private about your salary and will tell anyone who asks - fair enough. But if you consider it a private thing, then you should feel under no obligation at all to discuss it.

Let the other guy talk to HR and/or his manager to find out what sort of salary he could expect if he was more qualified or whatever. It's not up to the OP to do that.

JustMary wrote: »

And besides, you know what he earns.

Maybe he volunteered that information to the OP without being asked to.

Katgurl

Don't tell him. I've made really really good friends with colleagues over the years without ever imparting this information.

The "less than I'd like" suggestion is good as its lighthearted but pretty clear you don't want to say. If he persists you can then be firm "Listen, I'm not comfortable discussing my wages."

caff

Should just make it like Sweden and Norway, tax records are public if someone wants to check how much they earn they can just look it up online. Would cut down on a lot of gossip.

C.D.

I don't understand the Irish fixation with being secretive with regards to how much you are paid. I have no problem discussing salary, income, savings, pensions with my friends and have done so. With colleagues, it depends a little on who. My reasons are:

• I talk about and seek advice from friends on other important personal matters in my life. Some of them are wealth of information and I value their advice
• It is an important means by which to assess if you are compensated adequately. It is advantageous for an employer to employ people who never discuss salary
• Understanding the pay structure and associated responsibilities is important if you wish to maximise your potential earnings
• If somebody is particularly good at negotiation or knows how to "work the system" you can extract valuable advice.

If you find out you are paid more than your colleagues- good for you, you probably earned it. In my experience a lot people upon finding out they earn less than their colleagues develop a chip on their shoulder about it- all it means is that there is an opportunity for you to earn more if you play your cards right. I did a lot of research and it culminated in earning 30% more than my peers. I then started looking abroad and relocated for a 50% increase. None of which would never have happened if I was not able to have a mutually beneficially and open dialogue with my colleagues on pay and benefits.

FaberCastel

And besides, you know what he earns.

I didn't ask him, he just said it. I think he thought once he told me I was obliged to tell him.

I'd be surprised if that wasn't a sackable offence; or at least a very severe disciplinary issue. If you think it has or will be leaked, then I'd raise that with your boss/HR very quickly.

In an ideal world privacy rules mean something, but we all know it's not the case. With a big accounts dept, any of which could access that info, you could never pin point the source.

Tbh, I don't care if everyone knows what I earn, it's more I don't want to be the source of the information. I don't what the scenario where he busts into the managers office saying Mr X told me he's getting x amount. It would sound like I was going around boasting about it.

Thanks for the advice, I think i'll just say I'd prefer not to discuss it and if he gets in a huff, let him off.

Sea Filly

brennarr wrote: »

You must have an idea of his salary if you know the salary gap is about 15k?

He might have told the OP his salary, then asked what the OP's salary was.

Mrs OBumble

I am pie wrote: »

It's pretty easy to benchmark a salary against job ads, internet searches.

Really? Please tell me how .. the vast majority of job ads do not have salary info these, AFAIK.

Q_Ball

JustMary wrote: »

Really? Please tell me how .. the vast majority of job ads do not have salary info these, AFAIK.

Ring a recruitment agency and ask.

antodeco

Just be aware, some companies consider discussing salaries as a breach of policy, so you could get hit with a verbal warning.

Mr. Loverman

You could do a good deed and tell him a salary which is smaller than his one... he'll go home happy.

doolox

Its your private business and your boss may have reason to question your judgement if you let this private information out too easily.

It is important to promote harmony in the workplace and by divulging your salary to a junior colleague all you will do is cause jealousy and disturb this harmony, not good from your bosses point of view.

Doom

FaberCastel wrote: »

I have been asked in the past, by a co-worker what i get paid. I found it pretty awkward, a deer in the headlights kind of moment, coupled with some non intelligible mumbling. I didn't give him an answer but I know he'll try revisit the issue again. The salary gap is about 15K.

Some background info, we work for a large multinational company, we do similar work, I've a hons degree while he has a diploma. Both same age. Now our roles have a different discription but they overlap. That being said, I do more technically difficult work and I sign off on stuff which he isn't qualified to do.

Normally I'd just say I'd prefer not to discuss it, but I'm pretty friendly with the guy and I don't want offend or isolate myself by refusing to answer his question. Equally I don't want to create hassle for management.

Also he's got contacts in our accounts department, so there is a good chance he'll find out anyway.

Just wondering what peoples opinions on the matter are?

I work with a large company, I am paid 23k less for the same job as my workmates, I do more work than some of them too.... Companies are using this recession to keep wages lower and push through changes that they would never get any other time, even when they are making profits....bastards

Mr. Loverman

Doom wrote: »

I work with a large company, I am paid 23k less for the same job as my workmates, I do more work than some of them too.... Companies are using this recession to keep wages lower and push through changes that they would never get any other time, even when they are making profits....bastards

Your workmates would argue the problem is your poor negotiation skills. I guess learn from it for your next job?

Doom

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

Your workmates would argue the problem is your poor negotiation skills. I guess learn from it for your next job?

People would argue that you have your head well and truly jammed up your ass, if you think the above statemnt is the reason.
Companies are refusing to pay increments and slashing pensions and increasing demands from employees regardless of the stress and money problems this is causing and their Unions are gone soft, probably from backhanders.......
In other words they are jumping on the bandwagon.

Mr. Loverman

Doom wrote: »

People would argue that you have your head well and truly jammed up your ass, if you think the above statemnt is the reason.
Companies are refusing to pay increments and slashing pensions and increasing demands from employees regardless of the stress and money problems this is causing and their Unions are gone soft, probably from backhanders.......
In other words they are jumping on the bandwagon.

If you are paid 23k less than your workmates for the same job, the problem is your negotiation skills.

Demonique

antodeco wrote: »

Just be aware, some companies consider discussing salaries as a breach of policy, so you could get hit with a verbal warning.

I'd be suspicious of any company which considered discussing salaries as a breach of policy, my first instinct would be that they're engaging in illegal gender-based salary policies

If they don't have anything to hide, why would they consider it a breach of policy?

Doom

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

If you are paid 23k less than your workmates for the same job, the problem is your negotiation skills.

Salary negotiation and suspended salary increments are not the same thing :rolleyes:

Mr. Loverman

Doom wrote: »

Salary negotiation and suspended salary increments are not the same thing :rolleyes:

They were still paid 23k more than you for the same job prior to the pay freeze.

Mrs OBumble

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

If you are paid 23k less than your workmates for the same job, the problem is your negotiation skills.

If there were plenty of job vacancies around, that would be true.

But you know as well as the rest of us that this just isn't so at the moment: people are stuck in all sorts of odd situations, with no ability to leave if the answer to all negotiation approaches is "no".

Mr. Loverman

Ah I interpreted his post as some of his workmates started before him, at the same time as him, and after him, rather than they all started before him and he is the new guy who got hit with a lower starting wage due to the recession.

So maybe I misunderstanding.

mikemac1

Don't discuss salaries, bonuses, religion or politics with co-workers

Life is much simpler that way

TheTurk1972

A good manager has everyone believing they are getting paid more than the rest. As long as they don't discuss it with each other they are all happy to go around smug in the knowledge that they are doing better than the other guy.

I had a conversation in the pub with on of the guys I work with last month.
Everyone in the company got between a 10 and 15% bonus that week.
The co-worker said to me (bragging) that our head of dept told him that he had done really well and that got he biggest % bonus in the whole company and keep up the good work. He went on to tell me he got 12%. I got 15% and he was the only one i'd spoken to who got less than 15%, so told I him and it was like his whole world fell apart. He thought he was better than everyone else only to find out he had just been played like a fiddle. Hilarious.

Mrs OBumble

mikemac1 wrote: »

Don't discuss salaries, bonuses, religion or politics with co-workers

Life is much simpler that way

And employee salaries are, on average, lower. No, I don't have a link, but I've seen research before along those lines.

Markets require perfect information to work. That means that employees need to share salary information to help them make informed decisions about their terms and conditions, and whether to stay/go.

bfocusd

I don't recommend telling them at all!

I work contract in an office, but I was permanent before and let go, when I was first there it was my first job and I was on 21k, my work mate was on 48k and never hesitated about rubbing it in, yet she claimed she was still struggling and was a penny pincher, and always forgot her purse so she didn't have to spend her 48k. (no loans or mortgage either)

The months before I was made redundant I was cut to minimum wage, about 1400 per month, then I was let go.

I started contracting and im so happy with it.

I've gone back to the office and im on an hourly rate, I can claim lunch etc. And on average its costs approx 1200 per week to hire me, where as my now colleague has a bee in their bonnet, an invoice was accidentally sent to their email and since then I've been treated like dirt.

I know from the sobbing and complaining that their money has gone from 48k to 19k (over 4 years)! It's a major hit I know, but because the shoe is on the other foot, the whole world hates her and everyone's out to get her.

I've yet to hear the end of it, the whole office was told by her in an attempt to get my pay slashed and cause uproar, yet everyone else, who I get on great with, said fair play to me, id been getting slave driven for so long (3years) now it's my turn to earn a proper living for myself! Not just survive.

Every day I get a lecture about something she can't afford, she has lunch at family's houses so it doesn't cost money, yet she bought a car.. It's all just looking for sympathy, I never once complained when I was being paid min wage, because I was gaining the experience, which in the long run was worth more than a few quick quid.

so while I sit and have my 6 euro a day lunch which I earned fair and square, she can toddle off to her free lunch and kiss my ass while she passes!

Don't tell them op, Money means a lot more to some people over friendship, like I said when the shoes on the other foot, it was nothing short of a nightmare for me, trying to make me feel guilty for what I've earned.