Irish Rail - Air Conditioning overload

panda100

I have been getting the Limerick to Dublin train almost every weekend for the last year. I generally love getting the train, as I can read my book, relax and If I book in advance the prices are always quite reasonable. There is just one thing that puts me off travelling with Irish rail, and that is their trains are FREEZING!

The air conditioning is always blasting at my feet and around the middle of the seat for the whole journey. What country do they think they're living in?
I am usually someone who prefers the cold, and likes air circulating, but Irish Rail just take it to another extreme. I know I am not the only one whom feels this way as I have often been on the train and seen people move carriages because they think its too cold. Then they invariably arrive back to their original seats when they find out the air conditioining is blasting all throughout the train.

I thought maybe it was just the Dublin to Limerick train, but I got the train to kilkenny at the weekend, and myself and my friends were shivering the whole way down.

Anyone else noticed this?

Jamie2k9

It can be very varied on trains but currenty all the ICR are having the air con set on timers. It will come on every 20 minutes for around 10 minutes before cutting out again. It will save a lot fuel to say the least. It will take time for every train to have it changed.

Victor

Are you saying that it is cold on ordinary days or on cold days?

If there are staff on board, ask for the setting to be changed.

You can report the issue here: http://www.irishrail.ie/index.jsp?p=117&n=227

Zoney

It's certainly odd to have the polar opposite to how I remember many trips between Dub and Limk back when it was the Mark IIIs (always seemed to be roasting).

I do prefer too cold to too hot, nothing makes a trip longer than slowly melting to death in a sort of heat-induced semi-sleep/coma. (Again, memories...!)

Jamie2k9

If there are staff on board, ask for the setting to be changed.

Thaugh the driver dosn't have control of it and it can only be changed at Portlaois.

parsi

Often think they should have cool coaches and warm coaches - I'd prefer it to be cool but sure the old dears getting on at the Junction would wear their topcoats on a sunny day so need it warmer.

bazza1

Temp is set at 19 degrees in summer and 21 degrees for winter.

Red Alert

Why the interval timing? Surely it should be thermostatic?

goingnowhere

It is thermostatically controlled, like any AC system it kicks in runs and then switches off when the temperature hits the target. Household fridges behave the exact same way

Compared to the sauna experiences of a Mk2 or Mk3, the new trains are vastly better

end of the road

ah the good old days of traveling on the mark iis and IE having the heating on in the summer and off in the winter, you couldn't make it up. was that done specially for us rosslare line passengers? wouldn't surprise me if it was <snip>

panda100

Victor wrote: »

Are you saying that it is cold on ordinary days or on cold days?

Its cold on ordinary days during the Summer. Its usually from March to September there is this issue, and then they, thankfully ,turn of the air con for the winter.


There is no way the temperature is set to 19 degrees, more like 14. I asked the trolley man the last time I was on the train about the air con, and he said they get a whole load of complaints about it, especially from the older population.

I must be the only person on this thread who yearns for the sauna experience of the old days??

AngryLips

I wish I had this problem on Luas

foggy_lad

Was on a bus today with no reconditioning and it felt like the heating was on so the fans were just blowing out hot air much like the powers that be in the department of transport and C.I.E. management;)

The bus was LC12 or LC13 and the air-con grill was hanging from the roof inside the bus.

end of the road

foggy_lad wrote: »

Was on a bus today with no reconditioning and it felt like the heating was on so the fans were just blowing out hot air much like the powers that be in the department of transport and C.I.E. management

The bus was LC12 or LC13 and the air-con grill was hanging from the roof inside the bus.

that bus was put on specially for you foggy lad, they heard you were traveling.

How Strange

I was just thinking the same today about the air con on Irish rail trains. This afternoon was gorgeous but as soon as I got on the Newbridge train I had to put my jacket on because it was freezing.it's not usually that cold but it seems as soon as the outside temp rises to over 20oc they set the the train aircon temp to artic.

Atlantic Dawn

Atleast when its too cold you can put additional clothes on, when it is too hot you can't strip down to your boxers. I much prefer the cold especially in the prisoner spec carriages where the windows can't be opened.

ardmacha

t can be very varied on trains but currenty all the ICR are having the air con set on timers.

This is plain wrong. Heating/Cooling should on thermostats, which adjust to the temperature, not some notion of fixed amount of time which ignores the weather. Why am I not surprised?

panda100

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Atleast when its too cold you can put additional clothes on, when it is too hot you can't strip down to your boxers. I much prefer the cold especially in the prisoner spec carriages where the windows can't be opened.

It shouldn't be a case of either hot or cold. They should just have it at an average, neutral temperature. Its at the stage now where I have to have a special train outfit consiting off heavy, warm coat and change from sandals to socks and trainers.I see lots of other people shivering away with their coats on.

As Howstrange said, on those very few days when the weather is nice outside they lower the air coniditoning to baltic levels. Is this really necessary, when our weather is never that warm anyway, and we're all sedentary throghout the journey meaning body temp is going to drop anyways

steamengine

panda100 wrote: »

It shouldn't be a case of either hot or cold. They should just have it at an average, neutral temperature. Its at the stage now where I have to have a special train outfit consiting off heavy, warm coat and change from sandals to socks and trainers.I see lots of other people shivering away with their coats on.

As Howstrange said, on those very few days when the weather is nice outside they lower the air coniditoning to baltic levels. Is this really necessary, when our weather is never that warm anyway, and we're all sedentary throghout the journey meaning body temp is going to drop anyways

As Bazza 1 has stated the recognised temperature for air conditioned spaces in factories, offices and presumably railway carriages is 20 deg C, give or take 1 or 2 degrees. There should be thermostats in each carriage to regulate the temperature within those limits. Any cooler and fuel is being wasted to power the units. It is not the idea of air conditioning to have people shivering with their coats on. It should feel comfortable when you're dressed normally for indoors.

Solair

I've always suspected that someone is fiddling with the temperature settings on the trains.

They should be set and locked at 20C. The thermostats will compensate automatically for outside temp!


It's not a 3 bar electric fire! It's climate control!!

foggy_lad

Solair wrote: »

I've always suspected that someone is fiddling with the temperature settings on the trains.

They should be set and locked at 20C. The thermostats will compensate automatically for outside temp!


It's not a 3 bar electric fire! It's climate control!!

I worked with a person in the past who would go around turning boxes around so the contents would not be easily visible without extra work by the manager/boss when he was stocktaking, could something similar be happenning on the new trains? Would a staff member be trying to make the new trains feel uncomfortable?

Maybe there is some idle staff member who wants us to remember the days of frosty winter mornings when inside the train was colder than outside and when the sweltering summer heat was complimented by the full throttle heating in the mark3 carriages?

Solair

I suspect the issue is most likely that someone's not really aware of how air conditioning / modern climate control and heating systems work.

A lot of people have a tendency to turn the heat up on a cold day and down on a hot day. This is totally unnecessary and should not be done in a building or on public transport systems.

If you board the train on a cold day, and it's 20C on board, your body temperature might be low so you will feel too cold. Turning the heat up for the whole train is pointless as it's a waste of fuel and will make other passengers uncomfortable.

Same goes for a hot day. If you don't know better, you might think "oh it's hot out side, I'll turn the air conditioning on full". That's not how it works!

I think the most likely scenario is that someone on board the train with access to the controls is fiddling with them because they / some passengers feel it's too warm or cold.

There shouldn't really be any access to those controls at all. Irish Rail should have a policy-set temperature that's maintained automatically across all trains.

Otherwise, you're just wasting fuel and fiddling with settings for no reason.

The other issue on Irish Rail's fleet is that on the MK4s (And the MK3s before them) the sliding doors at the ends of the coaches were always out of service. These are a vital part of the air conditioning / heating system's ability to maintain a steady temperature.

If those doors are stuck open, then the carriage is losing hot/cold air to the outside via the join between the coaches which is not intended to be insulated / air tight.

I have no idea why Irish Rail seems to have an almost unique ability to leave those doors locked open. I've never seen it anywhere else.
It increases noise levels and it also causes serious issues for the air con and thus passenger comfort. It can even cause toilet smells to enter the cabin.

Simple measures to educate crews on how to operate the air conditioning / climate control correctly and ensure that those doors are operating correctly would probably save them a lot of wasted fuel and make passengers feel a lot more comfortable too.

LXFlyer

The air con can only be altered in the depot - on board staff have no access to the control system.

dowlingm

foggy_lad wrote: »

Maybe there is some idle staff member who wants us to remember the days of frosty winter mornings when inside the train was colder than outside and when the sweltering summer heat was complimented by the full throttle heating in the mark3 carriages?

Trollin' trollin' trollin', RAWHIDE!

DoesNotCompute

I have the same problem - I get the Sligo train from Kilcock to Dublin every day and it's consistently baltic.

Victor

Solair wrote: »

I have no idea why Irish Rail seems to have an almost unique ability to leave those doors locked open. I've never seen it anywhere else.

Many of them are broken, allegedly from having the catering trolley run into them.

bk

Victor wrote: »

Many of them are broken, allegedly from having the catering trolley run into them.

Could they not replace them with non glass doors or even better yet, half glass doors. *

A simple solution I know.

* I should probably specify that the glass is on the top half and the metal on the bottom half. With IR you might never know what you'd get :eek:

cbb1982

I thought it was just me!
I get the Longford to Dublin every day, and I freeze every morning and evening, I have to wear a scarf and wrap my coat around me to keep warm!
It is ridiculous!
I complained twice this week via their website but no response as yet.

panda100

I'm glad to see it's not just me.

I have to admit the consistently freezing temperature on Irish Rail trains is turning me off them big time. I was going to get the train down to Portlaoise to Limerick-Kildare match tommorow evening, but think I will drive instead. The weather is due to be warm to tommorow, which means sub zero air con temperatures on Irish Rail.Just not worth freezing for an hour and half.

bazza1

I say again...Summer setting locked in at 19 degrees and winter setting set for 21 degrees. Cannot be changed onboard. Aircon is set in each car. Hvacs may be reduced in power if an engine is shut down , due to load shedding. I have seen people complain that the temp is too cold and another in the same car claimed to be boiling! Sensation of temp is subjective, based on humidity and air flow within the carriage. Moving air at 19 degs feels cooler than still air at 19 Degs!

Windchill on ICR's Scandal!!! :D:D

end of the road

cbb1982 wrote: »

I complained twice this week via their website but no response as yet.

and i wouldn't expect one either if i were you. you were probably wasting your time complaining.

ardmacha

Summer setting locked in at 19 degrees and winter setting set for 21 degrees.

Is this not arseways? Why not have it the other way around?

bazza1

ardmacha wrote: »

Is this not arseways? Why not have it the other way around?

Needs to be a bit warmer in winter.

Actually, if 19-20 degrees is regarded as perfect, why change at all?

Solair

There's one issue on the Cork-Dublin train that may be to do with the positioning of air vents rather than the temperature too.

You get the sense that air's blowing across your legs from the air conditioning system.

I'm not sure if that applies on the other intercity trains, but it definitely does on the Cork train in places. I know people who have resorted to putting their legs on the seat beside them to avoid the could air.

I also find that the Cork-Dublin train's window tints are too dark. The other new trains in the fleet seem way brighter.

You get onto the Cork train on a nice day and you're looking out at this blue-tinted dull landscape while having your legs chilled It's always a bit of a shock when you get out and discover OMG! It's warm and bright.

They seem a bit more like they were specified for crossing Spanish semi-desert landscapes.

For almost 99% of the time, Ireland doesn't have sufficient sun to justify that level of tinting. There's a happy medium which the Mitsui-Rotem coaches seem to have just right.

end of the road

to be honest i don't think we need our trains tinted at all. whats the point?

panda100

Solair wrote: »

There's one issue on the Cork-Dublin train that may be to do with the positioning of air vents rather than the temperature too.

You get the sense that air's blowing across your legs from the air conditioning system.

I'm not sure if that applies on the other intercity trains, but it definitely does on the Cork train in places. I know people who have resorted to putting their legs on the seat beside them to avoid the could air.

That is very true. It's the same with the Limerick trains. The vents are located at your feet, and around the middle of the seat. Maybe It wouldn't be as cold if the vents were located somewhere else, and weren't so concentrated to parts of your body that have a tendency to get cold anyways.

Solair

end of the road wrote: »

to be honest i don't think we need our trains tinted at all. whats the point?

Not in a country where the whole sky is tinted a nice shade of grey to avoid glare

Untinted windows with slide-blinds like the French trains would make more sense.

Victor

bazza1 wrote: »

Needs to be a bit warmer in winter.

No, as people will be wearing winter clothing.