are all people with kids happy?

dannyc31

wondering what peoples take is on this. i know its the social norm to settle down get married & have children, but do all people actually want this or do alot of people just do it because of social pressures from family and because its whats expected of them?

as a man in my early 30's i've never had a drive to have children and cant see any advantages to it. in fact i see the opposite of it being a positive thing. anybody i know with kids seem to have it really hard financially and in every other way. now i know we all love our kids etc, but would we of been better off if we didnt have them in the first place?

are all couples who have kids happy or are alot of them just putting on a show because it wouldnt be excepted to say your life was better before you had them?

i think its the loss of freedom that bothers me the most and its kinda the end of you chasing your own dreams and ambition because children take up pretty much all your time & efforts from what i can see.

am i in the minority here or is there many women & men out there who also believe that having children is a bad idea?

Ellsbells

Of course not all are happy. In here you will probably find lots of people who think it's a bad idea to have kids and then you could find the opposite on the parenting forum.

It's not for everyone so don't get badgered into it if you don't want kids. You should though, if you have a partner, inform them straight away if you don't as it's not fair to waste people's time who do.

My 2c worth is that's it's different for women and men as parenthood seems to gave more of an impact careerwise for women than men as whether or not people will admit it, employers would rather not employ or promote women who are likely to be out on maternity leave.

Lorna123

dannyc31 wrote: »

wondering what peoples take is on this. i know its the social norm to settle down get married & have children, but do all people actually want this or do alot of people just do it because of social pressures from family and because its whats expected of them?

as a man in my early 30's i've never had a drive to have children and cant see any advantages to it. in fact i see the opposite of it being a positive thing. anybody i know with kids seem to have it really hard financially and in every other way. now i know we all love our kids etc, but would we of been better off if we didnt have them in the first place?

are all couples who have kids happy or are alot of them just putting on a show because it wouldnt be excepted to say your life was better before you had them?

i think its the loss of freedom that bothers me the most and its kinda the end of you chasing your own dreams and ambition because children take up pretty much all your time & efforts from what i can see.

am i in the minority here or is there many women & men out there who also believe that having children is a bad idea?

It's human nature to want to settle down and have children for most people, but not for everyone. I always wanted children from an early age and I would never have felt fulfilled if I didn't have them. Now I have them and while I would never swop them, they bring a lot of heartache as well as joy. They are a constant worry. They are a constant responsibility. You can't get away from them, they are always there to be attended to. Sometimes I wish I never had them but I know that deep down I would feel that life would be a bit emptier if I didn't have them. We can get tired of doing our own thing, with no responsibilities and it can be rewarding to feel that we are teaching another human being how to fit in in life. The family unit is very strong and the feeling that you have a little family all of your own is a nice feeling. Children can be a pain by times but then they grow up and you have caring adults to relate to, grandchildren etc. and that can be very rewarding and pleasant at a time when you might be fed up of everything else life has to offer. In other words they have their advantages, so don't just think about how you feel about them now, but think about the future and how you might feel if you leave it too late to have them. To sum it up I think that it is not all a bed of roses with children but it is not a bed of roses without them either. Everything has to be worked at, including having children but the rewards are great.

Pessimist

Mmm... For me, having kids makes you happier than you could ever imagine but then there is the potential for infinite sadness as well. To feel such a deep love which you can't switch off is beautiful and I would never want to go back to my world before kids.

With so much in life there is choice - you can choose marriage or divorce or being single, you can choose to move house, jobs, countries, to change your looks (to an extent :-)), what to spend your money on, whether to abide by the law etc, but once you're a parent you can't switch it off - ever. If something ever happened to my child I don't know how I'd survive.

So I think my answer is that kids make you happier but potentially sadder too. Oh, and a whole lot busier!'

Esoteric_

Not all people with children are happy, just like not all childless people are happy.

That said, I can understand why lots of people want kids. I'm sure it's totally rewarding and fulfilling.

It's not something I want or envision in my future, though. I'm 100% certain that I'd have a happier life without kids, so I won't be having any. Settling down with a partner, I totally want, but not children.

Big Bag of Chips

It's one of those questions that's too general to answer. I'm sure all people with kids aren't happy! I have kids.. my life isn't perfect and there is plenty I'd love to change.. but none of those things have anything to do with my kids!

It all depends on your priorities. Having kids means having to sacrifice spontaneous nights out, or "dirty weekends"! But to me that's not the most important thing in my life, right now.

Before I had kids I can't say I was happier (or sadder!) than I am now. My life was different, but not better (or worse!)

My friend is mid to late 30's never wanted kids, still doesn't want them and doesn't bow to the pressure of "it's the done thing".. for her sponataneous weekends away in various European cities is what she wants. And she's happy.

For me, I'm not that bothered.. and if I really want a weekend away that badly - with a little organisation - I can do it... and I'm happy!

My children drive me scatty. They make me laugh. They bring me to tears. They make me sad. They make me proud. They cost me a fortune in diesel! But as for the "if you didn't have children you'd have more money" argument; I liken it to smoking! I never smoked.. my friends who did were constantly being told, "think of how much money you'd save if you didn't smoke"... I was never significantly richer than them, I just spent my money on other things!!

CathyMoran

I did the going on semi-spontaneous holidays, sex all weekend etc but I could not be happier that we have our children - they make us happy in ways that i never thought possible, both of us have always wanted them and are thrilled that tthey are here - yes, it is tough at times, our youngest had her vaccinations at the weekend and it was upsetting but getting a hug from your child, seeing them develop as people is priceless and I do not regret for a second having them, though I might have preferred them a bit younger - I love them and my husband.

dannyc31

Not all people with children are happy, just like not all childless people are happy.

That said, I can understand why lots of people want kids. I'm sure it's totally rewarding and fulfilling.

It's not something I want or envision in my future, though. I'm 100% certain that I'd have a happier life without kids, so I won't be having any. Settling down with a partner, I totally want, but not children.

i have to take my hat off to women who make this decision especially since from a very early age girls are conditioned by society to become mothers even thru the toys that are made for them dolls, prams etc.

for a woman to go against all societies pressures and norms and say its not something they want is very admirable. that said i also think its a very brave thing to do as when a woman decides this in their 30's or later, that could be it forever due to fertility. on the other hand when i man feels this way in his 30's he can revisit this again in his 50's or so were he may feel different about starting a family. its a pity nature hasn't caught up with modern society as i think its hard on women especially career woman who maybe only getting the career off the ground in their mid 30's.

i've always wondered were the drive to have children comes from in a man since there is nothing in our early lives that encourages fatherhood. i mean even when you see the so called role models that are seen as cool for men they are always the james bond sports car driving womaniser type and not some loving father happy to drive his people carrier full with 4 kids back and forth to school. or maybe it comes from the want to take after our fathers.

from my own point of view i just cant see a time were i'll wake up one morning and all of a sudden and the idea of having kids sounds wonderful or maybe it comes with meeting the right partner first?

Ellsbells

I think it can come with meeting the right partner. I was thinking about this earlier and I think you will never meet parents who will say thru regret it as not only do you feel great love for your child you feel great loyalty too.

I used to always want a girl if I ever had kids and we had a boy but would not change him for the world. Now if someone asks me if I would still have prefered a girl my loyalty to my son kicks in and I think no way. It's the same when it comes to admitting you would rather not have had kids. I can't imagine ever thinking that about my son as it would be so unfair on him and once those words are said they never go away. People may think it from time to time but never admit it.

Live your life as you want but as I said earlier if you don't want kids make sure your partner knows as soon as.

Esoteric_

dannyc31 wrote: »

i have to take my hat off to women who make this decision especially since from a very early age girls are conditioned by society to become mothers even thru the toys that are made for them dolls, prams etc.

for a woman to go against all societies pressures and norms and say its not something they want is very admirable. that said i also think its a very brave thing to do as when a woman decides this in their 30's or later, that could be it forever due to fertility. on the other hand when i man feels this way in his 30's he can revisit this again in his 50's or so were he may feel different about starting a family. its a pity nature hasn't caught up with modern society as i think its hard on women especially career woman who maybe only getting the career off the ground in their mid 30's.

i've always wondered were the drive to have children comes from in a man since there is nothing in our early lives that encourages fatherhood. i mean even when you see the so called role models that are seen as cool for men they are always the james bond sports car driving womaniser type and not some loving father happy to drive his people carrier full with 4 kids back and forth to school. or maybe it comes from the want to take after our fathers.

from my own point of view i just cant see a time were i'll wake up one morning and all of a sudden and the idea of having kids sounds wonderful or maybe it comes with meeting the right partner first?

It was an easy decision for me. I never wanted them because I basically raised my younger sisters, so never wanted children as a result. When I was 16, I was told I was most probably infertile, so it's not like I have much choice in the matter really, but I'm actually glad not to have that choice.

I know some people think that when you meet the right partner, you can reconsider, but I met someone in the past that I thought I'd spend my life with, and children still never crossed my mind. It's just not something I ever wanted. I must be missing some maternal gene.

I love kids, I like minding them for friends and family and I worked in environments where I was surrounded by kids, but it all reinforced in my mind that while I love children, I don't and never will want my own.

If I could have a sterilisation now, to get rid of the very small chance of me conceiving, I'd have it in a heartbeat.

Rosy Posy

I love being a mother and am infinitely more happy since having kids, but I have always wanted a family and am prepared to put in the hard yards that that takes. I can see the OP's point of view in that, knowing how much work and responsibility and potential frustration and heartache is involved it does surprise me that the majority of people want and go on to have children. If I didn't love kids and have an amazing supportive husband I don't know how I'd do it. I don't get how so many people are not fussed or actively dislike children and yet will plan a family. It also depends a lot on how much outside help you have, such as child care and extended family. I also think that the early years with children can put a big strain on a relationship and only the strong will survive it.

Beruthiel

dannyc31 wrote: »

am i in the minority here or is there many women & men out there who also believe that having children is a bad idea?

Yes, there are.
Like everything else in this life, everyone's different.
Some people have a strong urge to have children, some don't.
Some fall into parenthood by accident.

Is this something that bothers you Danny, and if so, why?

MaxyJazz

To me having children is better than winning the euro millions jackPot 3 times in a row!!..there's no better pleasure in bringing up your offspring!!
Yes they bring tears and laughter and you spend lots of time and money on them ....but for me it's the best thing that happend to me!!
I can understand that some people don't want to have children and all the commitments that comes with them ... But the joy they bring to my life is amazing

Neyite

For my partner and I, it's very much having a child with the right person. For us, it felt right with each other, yet pregnancy scares with our respective exes brought us out in a cold sweat of fear at the time.

bouncebouncey

If you don't feel the urge to have kids then don't have kids. It's not for everyone. It's certainly not for me. No particular reason. It just doesn't interest me.

What I'd wonder about is why you are asking about peoples state of happiness when they have kids. People will tell you having kids is the best (and I'm not arguing that they don't think it's all that and a bit more) but I certainly wouldn't consider increased 'happiness' if thinking about a kid. It wouldn't be something I'd suggest anyone do to try and feel happier.

Whether or not women are conditioned to want kids by society is neither her nor there. Just do your own thing and let other people worry about their own wants and needs! Look after yourself and don't worry about the rest

dannyc31

Yes, there are.
Like everything else in this life, everyone's different.
Some people have a strong urge to have children, some don't.
Some fall into parenthood by accident.

Is this something that bothers you Danny, and if so, why?

i guess it bothers me a couple of ways. one way is often feel i'm being unfair to the woman in the relationship because i'm thinking that for them the whole point of a relationship is that eventually it leads to marriage & children something which i'm not sure i want. but then i think, am i being unfair to myself in that who knows how i'd feel a couple of years down the road with the right person. so i do be kinda torn.

i guess what i'm saying is i'm definitely not one of those people who says that thay always wanted a family and have the drive to have children even before they've met the right person. i dont think this can be a good thing being honest, because it can cause people to have chirldren with the wrong person for the sake of having a baby but with the eventual breakdown of the relationship.

maybe i'm wrong in saying this but i reckon there are alot of men out there who go along with their other halves when it comes to this subject of whether to start a family or not, and i dont think men often realise that the relationship will change drastically forever. i read in a book once that having a baby is like throwing a hand grenade into a relationship. it can be a good thing or it can be an extremly bad thing for the couples relationship. it probably explains why most marriages that end will end in the first 5years as this is often when a child is introduced.

i think if people really understood what they were getting themselves into in the first place there would be alot less single mothers out there being left to bring up children by themselves.

the other point is everyone i know so far who've had babies they all seemed to be unplanned. seems to me babies seem to have a habit of coming along when you least expect it

mr_edge_to_you

I recently became a Dad for the first time. We are truly blessed with our daughter.

Too say life has changed is an understatement. Your own wants/desires/worries immediately drop down the pecking order. At the start I'd never get full nights sleep again. If I sit down with her she roars and settles again when she's being carried around the house. I haven't been able to go out for a drink with my friends yet as I live far away and couldn't leave my wife in her own yet. I changed a nappy twice in 10 minutes on Saturday morning at half 5 in the morning. We've spent a pile of money on stuff for her. Our cost of living had shot up. Can't just head out for a meal or trip to the cinema. We had to bring her back to the hospital every week for 6 weeks after he was born. It is mental and unrelenting!!!!

Then she's lying down in her pen and laughs back at me and nothing else matters.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with not wanting children, each to their own. it's a different story when people have children and think that life carries on regardless and neglect their children.

Its a huge commitment.

Beruthiel

dannyc31 wrote: »

i guess it bothers me a couple of ways. one way is often feel i'm being unfair to the woman in the relationship because i'm thinking that for them the whole point of a relationship is that eventually it leads to marriage & children

What makes you assume that all women think that way?
Also, why are you not being up front from the start?
When I got involved in my current relationship I told him very early on that I had no intention of having children and if he did, then we should discontinue the relationship.

If you are getting involved with women and not telling them that you have no intention of having children, you are wasting their precious time if they want them.
Make an effort to be more upfront and honest from now on.

but then i think, am i being unfair to myself in that who knows how i'd feel a couple of years down the road with the right person. so i do be kinda torn.

You are in your early 30's, surely you have worked out at this stage what you do and don't want in life?

i read in a book once that having a baby is like throwing a hand grenade into a relationship. it can be a good thing or it can be an extremly bad thing for the couples relationship. it probably explains why most marriages that end will end in the first 5years as this is often when a child is introduced.

Having a child changes everything.
For the next 18 years ++ you have the responsibility of another human being and all that it entails. Your needs will come second to those of the child.

If you and your partner are not on the same page, the strain can be huge.
If you are on the same page, it can be the most rewarding thing that you will ever do in life.

Jack B. Badd

dannyc31 wrote: »

i'm thinking that for them the whole point of a relationship is that eventually it leads to marriage & children

Damn I must be doing it wrong, I always thought the whole point of being in a relationship was to be with someone who makes you happy. Imo you make what you want out of your relationships.

If you don't want children and/or marriage, have you considered seeking out childfree/marriage-free women to date? We do exist (:)) & there are a number of great resources online for finding like-minded friends & partners - check out thechildfreelife for starters or just google "childfree meetups". Sometimes it even happens by pure luck - my OH & I have no interest in marriage & are definitely childfree & we met without having to seek each other out. Good luck

Ellsbells

dannyc31 wrote: »

i have to take my hat off to women who make this decision especially since from a very early age girls are conditioned by society to become mothers even thru the toys that are made for them dolls, prams etc. ?

So do you take your hat off to men who don't grow up to shoot others and drive trains???

I find it's an easier decision not to have kids than to have kids. It's easier to take no action than to make a decision which will have such an impact on your life forever.

LegacyUser

Jack B. Badd wrote: »

....... there are a number of great resources online for finding like-minded friends & partners - check out thechildfreelife for starters or just google "childfree meetups". .....

Unfortunately, there are no Irish specific childfree forums or meetups as yet for like minded childfree people to meet up.
Even on the internet dating sites in Ireland, it is extremely hard to find find men who don't want children. I'm reluctant to even date someone who has not stated definitely in their profile 'does not want kids'. They are very few and far between.

ash23

I had an unplanned pregnancy when I was 20. It was a shock and I'd had no desire to have children.
I won't say it's been easy but I adore my child. She has given me purpose that I was lacking before this. I'm not into religion and I suppose I felt that I was a nothing, just another human on this planet. But now I have a reason for being, some part of me that will go on. I work and I have family who love me but being a mother fulfilled me.

Having said all that, while I know I want another child, I won't be doing it solo again. The desire is not so strong that I would consider having a child outside of a committed relationship with someone who also wants children.

So I am happy and my child brings me great happiness. But on balance, I'm not sure the joy another child would bring would be enough to outweigh the work and negative changes(financially, physically, personally, career wise etc) it would bring to my life.

CathyMoran

dannyc31 wrote: »

i guess it bothers me a couple of ways. one way is often feel i'm being unfair to the woman in the relationship because i'm thinking that for them the whole point of a relationship is that eventually it leads to marriage & children something which i'm not sure i want. but then i think, am i being unfair to myself in that who knows how i'd feel a couple of years down the road with the right person. so i do be kinda torn.

i guess what i'm saying is i'm definitely not one of those people who says that thay always wanted a family and have the drive to have children even before they've met the right person. i dont think this can be a good thing being honest, because it can cause people to have chirldren with the wrong person for the sake of having a baby but with the eventual breakdown of the relationship.

maybe i'm wrong in saying this but i reckon there are alot of men out there who go along with their other halves when it comes to this subject of whether to start a family or not, and i dont think men often realise that the relationship will change drastically forever. i read in a book once that having a baby is like throwing a hand grenade into a relationship. it can be a good thing or it can be an extremly bad thing for the couples relationship. it probably explains why most marriages that end will end in the first 5years as this is often when a child is introduced.

i think if people really understood what they were getting themselves into in the first place there would be alot less single mothers out there being left to bring up children by themselves.

the other point is everyone i know so far who've had babies they all seemed to be unplanned. seems to me babies seem to have a habit of coming along when you least expect it

Firstly you can just be honest with your feelings all along.

Secondly there is no point in having a baby with the wrong person. In my case I knew my husband's opinion on having children before we started dating seriously. I knew that he would be a great daddy and that was one of the things that attracted me to him.

Lots of people plan their children in as much as you can - we were trying (and miscarrying) until we were lucky to concieve our son, we were lucky straight away with our daughter.

Yes, children are hard on a relationship but they also are brilliant fun.

dannyc31

thanks for all replies. i think i opened a can of worms with this one, i feel there is no right or wrong answer to whether it is a good idea or not to have kids. it just is what it is.

You are in your early 30's, surely you have worked out at this stage what you do and don't want in life?

i dont buy this argument. there are people who know from the age of 18 that they want to be mothers or fathers or if they want to be a priest or a racing car driver then there are others who are still not sure in their 40's what they want to do everyone is different so to place an age stage on it is a bit simplified imo. from a goals & career point of view i know exacly what i want to do and i'm doing it but its more complicated when it comes to the type of relationship i may want.

Having a child changes everything.
For the next 18 years ++ you have the responsibility of another human being and all that it entails. Your needs will come second to those of the child.

this is exactly my point, do people actually go in with their eyes wide open that this is the case? its not like getting a puppy that you can give away if its not working out and its forever. 18years and the way things are going in this country, 30years plus. and you can forget about putting your own needs and ambitions first because that wont be the case ever again.

maybe its the selfish gene in me but i cant see this as something i'd be happy with but perhaps i may feel different in a number of years when i've accomplished all i'd like to accomplish.

i started this thread cause i felt in my own life i was only getting one argument and that was that "its the thing to do" and everyone does it. it nice to know we've moved on from catholic Ireland and people see there can be more to life than just doing whats expected of you.

CathyMoran

dannyc31 wrote: »

this is exactly my point, do people actually go in with their eyes wide open that this is the case? its not like getting a puppy that you can give away if its not working out and its forever. 18years and the way things are going in this country, 30years plus. and you can forget about putting your own needs and ambitions first because that wont be the case ever again.

I was petrified that I would not be a good parent - even stupid things like could I change a nappy of my child. The fact that you are thinking about it seriously shows that you could potentially be a good parent.

My one year old is looking at me with her big blue eyes, she has hickups and is laughing and smiling and saying ma ma...having said that she has not slept the night since she was born...examples of parenthood, having said that I would not get rid of her or her big brother for anything in the world.

LegacyUser

Some people are and some people aren't OP.
It totally depends on the type of person you are.
Other things like finances/ support from from family/strength of relationship going in are a big factor too. If you aren't sure it's for you, you shouldn't feel bad.
It's not selfish as you mentioned,it's simply another kind of life.
There are women out there that don't want children too, they just may take longer to find.
Have a look at some childfree websites and you will see there's a world of people out there just like you.

dannyc31

interesting article about this very issue in todays independent.

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/parenting/stay-at-home-mothers-more-unhappy-than-those-who-work-3163057.html

Ickle Magoo

Okay Danny, I'm going to lock this thread now as this is an advice forum for getting specific advice for issues you are experiencing, rather than a discussion forum to debate linked articles and the like.

If you wish to have such a discussion, somewhere like Humanities would be more appropriate.

All the best.