Doing 20k miles a year, have a diesel, but want a petrol

Burt Lancaster

Hi I'm doing 20k a year in miles. I know that is coming into diesel territory, and I've driven diesels for years, also had a few petrols. I prefer petrol overall, especially with all this DMF and DPF etc. etc. bullshyte that comes with modern diesels.

I'm driving a diesel corrolla, with 120k miles on it, and its worth about 4k.
I've had it for three years and I need a change.

For example : I can buy an 08 petrol avensis with 40k miles for 8 grand, or a 08 diesel avensis with 70k on it for about 12 grand.

Very approx. a petrol will cost me approx. €20 extra a week in fuel (€1000 over a year), but I'll have a cheaper to buy, less used car. The drawback is that it might depreciate a bit more than the diesel, and be a bit harder to sell next time round.

I'd like the petrol one, but, in pure money terms, would I be mad to go with the petrol ?

Anan1

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

but I'll have a cheaper to buy, less used car. The drawback is that it might depreciate a bit more than the diesel, and be a bit harder to sell next time round.

As a general principle, cheaper cars lose less money in depreciation.

bazz26

Buy it cheap and sell it cheap.

colm_mcm

Maybe save money by not buying an avensis?

Jimbob 83

All i read was

bazz26

Yep, buy a similar year Mazda 6 petrol, fresher design too.

Burt Lancaster

colm_mcm wrote: »

Maybe save money by not buying an avensis?

I hear ya, the cheapest would be to keep the car I have (if thats what you mean), but I need a change.

Or had you something else in mind ?

Burt Lancaster

Jimbob 83 wrote: »

All i read was

eh ???

L-M

Alot of those Volvo S40 1.8's seem to have high mileage on them, could be a good indicator.

Can't imagine it having a better residual value than the Avensis in three years, but that's just ireland.

Burt Lancaster

Limerick man wrote: »

Alot of those Volvo S40 1.8's seem to have high mileage on them, could be a good indicator.

Can't imagine it having a better residual value than the Avensis in three years, but that's just ireland.

Sorry, I'm a bit slow, what volvo S40's ?, and a good indicator of what, and a better residual value than a petrol or diesel avensis ?

L-M

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/3308881

Something like the above.

That model is out nearly 8 years and there are still some 12's floating about, so give it four years and a few more S60's are it will become fairly out dated.

Burt Lancaster

Limerick man wrote: »

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/3308881

Something like the above.

That model is out nearly 8 years and there are still some 12's floating about, so give it four years and a few more S60's are it will become fairly out dated.

Thanks for that, I like the idea, so do you think something like that would be a good enough buy for driving 20k miles a year, rather than paying 4 grand more for a diesel avensis or similar diesel ?

colm_mcm

It's a zillion times more comfortable than petrol avensis,and I doubt it'd use more fuel, probably less.

L-M

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

Thanks for that, I like the idea, so do you think something like that would be a good enough buy for 20k miles a year, rather than paying 4 grand more for a diesel avensis or similar diesel ?

That's completely up to yourself. i personally would rather hand out the extra few bob and save weekly.

Why buy a 08? Are you looking for the "cheap" tax?

i'd imagine you'd buy a 07 Avensis diesel a few bob cheaper than a 08, the tax will more than likely be the same in the long run anyway.

You could look at Saabs and the likes if you were up for a wild card.

Those Volvos can give a bit of trouble, but at this stage of the game everything has it's woe's. They're out 8 years so i'm sure there are plenty of them aorund for parts etc. That model Avensis there are plenty of around.

Burt Lancaster

colm_mcm wrote: »

It's a zillion times more comfortable than petrol avensis,and I doubt it'd use more fuel, probably less.

Cheers for the advice. So would you say buying an lower mileage 08 petrol, for 4 grand less than a higher mileage 08 diesel, for driving 20k miles a year is a good enough idea ?

Burt Lancaster

Limerick man wrote: »

That's completely up to yourself. i personally would rather hand out the extra few bob and save weekly.

I hear ya, sometimes its hard to know. Pay up front, or pay as you go.

Limerick man wrote: »

Why buy a 08? Are you looking for the "cheap" tax?

Not really just trying to move up the years

Thanks for the advice so far lads, if I was doing 40k a year in miles, diesel would be a no brainer, but at 20k a year, whatever choice is made its a compromise in some area !

Jimbob 83

Why the fixation on Toyotas ?

Awful boring yokes tbh

If buying a Jap petrol for 20k a year i would be buying a Mazda 6

Burt Lancaster

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

.....................
For example : I can buy an 08 petrol avensis with 40k miles for 8 grand, or a 08 diesel avensis with 70k on it for about 12 grand.

Very approx. a petrol will cost me approx. €20 extra a week in fuel (€1000 over a year)............................
I'd like the petrol one, but, in pure money terms, would I be mad to go with the petrol ?

In pure monetary terms you'd be far from mad to spend €8000 on a petrol as opposed to €12000 on a diesel if the fuel costs are €1000 year more on the petrol.

If you want a petrol it's a no brainer.

As mentioned though nicer cars out there than the Avensis.

colm_mcm

I meant the Volvo

bazz26

That is the flexi fuel S40 that used to run on E85 biofuel sold by Maxol. The FlexiFuel models were heavier on fuel than the standard 1.8 litre petrol but because E85 was cheaper per liter it still worked out cheaper. However, the Government withdrew the reduced duty on E85 biofuel in 2009 meaning it no longer was financial viable for Maxol to sell it and the appeal of the FlexiFuel cars died a sudden death. These days FlexiFuel models are selling for peanuts.

The one that LM linked to is a basic model too, better off going for a SE with the more comfortable full leather interior and cruise control, note though that the S40 is a small car and no bigger than the Corolla space wise.

L-M

bazz26 wrote: »

That is the flexi fuel S40 that used to run on E85 biofuel sold by Maxol. The FlexiFuel models were heavier on fuel than the standard 1.8 litre petrol but because E85 was cheaper per liter it still worked out cheaper. However, the Government withdrew the reduced duty on E85 biofuel in 2009 meaning it no longer was financial viable for Maxol to sell it and the appeal of the FlexiFuel cars died a sudden death. These days FlexiFuel models are selling for peanuts.

The one that LM linked to is a basic model too, better off going for a SE with the more comfortable full leather interior and cruise control, note though that the S40 is a small car and no bigger than the Corolla space wise.

i have to say i linked the first S40 that came up just to show what an S40 was.

colm_mcm

Was the 1.8f heavier on fuel than a 1.8 when running on normal petrol bazz?

bazz26

Limerick man wrote: »

i have to say i linked the first S40 that came up just to show what an S40 was.

Probably guessed that.

colm_mcm wrote: »

Was the 1.8f heavier on fuel than a 1.8 when running on normal petrol bazz?

Yes they were but at the time it didn't matter as bi-ethanol was about half the price of regular unleaded per litre. They will run fine on regular unleaded too but they are a bit more thirsty.

Burt Lancaster

Jimbob 83 wrote: »

Why the fixation on Toyotas ?

Awful boring yokes tbh

If buying a Jap petrol for 20k a year i would be buying a Mazda 6

Agreed, but the day you buy is the day you sell, and I have to keep in mind what the next buyer wants to buy off me. Thats the joys of living in Ireland, and Ireland is Toyota group think obsessed
I'll look at the Mazda6 as well.

Jimbob 83

Meh buy 4-5 year old and sell then rebuy 4-5 years old.

Fact is owning a new car in Ireland is stupidly expensive due to vrt which results in sparsely specced cars, i would rather have a 4-5 year old luxobarge than a new car, thats just me though.

Huge market of decent cars out there if you are brave enough to ignore all the nonsense Irish people talk about cars.

bazz26

Old shape petrol Avensis are going cheap these days so I would not say they are overly desireable. Supply definatley outstrips demand especially around 08/09 petrol models as Toyota had a pile of these left when the tax system changed to Co2 emmissions. The petrol models became expensive to tax.

colm_mcm

You could buy those 08 1.6 avensiss new with zero mileage for under 19k at one stage.

Bpmull

If you prefer petrols go with the petrol as long as mpg and fuel efficiency does not bother you. I suppose the petrol is 4 grand cheaper which is a lot for the same car. In general the less you pay for a car the less you will loose plus you don't have huge money tied up in it. I would look around and not just be set on an avensis as I'm sure theres plenty of desperate people who want to sell their petrols and you want to buy a petrol. you should get a good deal.
Best of luck with your purchase.

Burt Lancaster

Whats the 08 1.6 petrol mondeo like, i see a few of those for sale, too slugish ?

Jimbob 83

1.8 Mondeo maybe, 1.6 is underpowered, 1.8 mazda 6 all the way or buy Meitz's one

bazz26

big cars with small engines are a false economy. The engine has to work harder just to move the big, heavy body around which means they use more fuel.

Zubeneschamali

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

Agreed, but the day you buy is the day you sell

Yes, buy a Toyota and you'll be really happy on the day you finally get rid of it.

rebel.ranter

As you mentioned yourself when comparing costs of petrol v diesel you should at least consider & do some research on the following for the diesel variants:

- Injector issues
- EGR valve
- turbo failure
- DPF recommended replacement interval
- DMF replacement costs

Diesel is not as clear cut as comparing fuel costs, all of the above are big money jobs that can wipe out any fuel savings.

Whatever car you choose half the recommended oil service interval as modern service intervals are too long, change the oil much more regularly than stated.

L-M

bazz26 wrote: »

big cars with small engines are a false economy. The engine has to work harder just to move the big, heavy body around which means they use more fuel.

Bazz this is such a bollox arguement.

My sister has a 316i, 1.8 and she's getting 40mpg.

A 320i (2.2) was returning under 30.

cadaliac

Limerick man wrote: »

Bazz this is such a bollox arguement.

My sister has a 316i, 1.8 and she's getting 40mpg.

A 320i (2.2) was returning under 30.

3 series = small car:)

Larger car with small engine = poorer mpg than larger car with normal or big engine. (less Laboured)
I would be of the same belief tbh.
I don't know of anyone who thinks a 530i will return the same mpg as a 530d to be fair.

A lot of the 1.4tsi jobbies pulling around Jettas/Passats and the like.
I'm sure there are other examples but you know what I mean.

bazz26

Limerick man wrote: »

Bazz this is such a bollox arguement.

My sister has a 316i, 1.8 and she's getting 40mpg.

A 320i (2.2) was returning under 30.

Try driving a 1.6 litre Mondeo so and see how much more fuel efficent it is over a 2.0 litre version.

L-M

cadaliac wrote: »

3 series = small car:)

Larger car with small engine = poorer mpg than larger car with normal or big engine. (less Laboured)
I would be of the same belief tbh.
I don't know of anyone who thinks a 530i will return the same mpg as a 530d to be fair.

A lot of the 1.4tsi jobbies pulling around Jettas/Passats and the like.
I'm sure there are other examples but you know what I mean.

3 series is a small car as opposed to what? An E46 is a heavy car.

My father has a 1.4 TSi and it's perfect on fuel, plenty of power too. The 1.6 Passat and the number 1.6 saloons he's had before it have all been good on fuel.

As a pure example i have a 1.6 Peugeot, is that better on fuel than a 1.4? No, than a 1.1? No.

Completely different issues from for a different thread but this argument constantly comes up and it just seems to be from people who haven't actually had the cars to compare.

40mpg from a 1.8 e46 316i when a 2.2 320i returned under 30mpg? Same sort of spins and driver with proper calculations?

cadaliac

Limerick man wrote: »

Completely different issues from for a different thread but this argument constantly comes up and it just seems to be from people who haven't actually had the cars to compare.

Well I'm bowing out of this one so.
I'm not engaging in an argument about that.

Burt Lancaster

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Yes, buy a Toyota and you'll be really happy on the day you finally get rid of it.

Yawn. Horses for courses. This is for a functional, low key workcar. I've owned dozens of cars in my life, from Lada's to BMW's to Jags, to sportcars to vauxhall viva's, every car has its purpose, and every car is a compromise in some area, so don't waste my time and yours, there's a good lad.

Leonard Hofstadter

Limerick man wrote: »

Bazz this is such a bollox arguement.

My sister has a 316i, 1.8 and she's getting 40mpg.

A 320i (2.2) was returning under 30.

Ah come on now, you know full well that a 320i is a six cylinder, no-one ever said that a six cylinder engined car is more efficient than its four cylinder counterpart! Talk about manipulating data just to suit your argument! Plus the 316 is a 1.8 not a 1.6 either.

Bazz's general point still stands.

Speaking from personal experience, a 1.6 Avensis will use more fuel than a 1.8 on a motorway, and you can use all the words you like, but I've driven both engines on the same roads and I am happy that that is the case, as much as 3 mpg.

That does not mean that by extension that a 2.0 will use less than the 1.8 or even the 1.6, but a 1.6 non-turbo petrol engined anything in an Avensis/Mondeo sized car is a total waste of time even on fuel economy grounds.

Burt Lancaster

At the end of the day, you have to compare like with like. Yes a 1.8 litre avensis, by most accounts I've heard, is a slightly better buy than a 1.6 litre one, but a 1.6 litre petrol Passat is not a better buy than a 1.4 petrol Passat. It depends entirely on the particular model and engines your talking about.

Leonard Hofstadter

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

At the end of the day, you have to compare like with like. Yes a 1.8 litre avensis, by most accounts I've heard, is a slightly better buy than a 1.6 litre one, but a 1.6 litre petrol Passat is not a better buy than a 1.4 petrol Passat. It depends entirely on the particular model and engines your talking about.

The 1.4 Passat is turbocharged, the 1.6 is not - that's why the 1.4 is a lot faster (and therefore better) than the 1.6 !

Burt Lancaster

captainspeed wrote: »

The 1.4 Passat is turbocharged, the 1.6 is not - that's why the 1.4 is a lot faster (and therefore better) than the 1.6 !

Exactly my point you have to compare like with like, and it depends on the model and engines

galwaytt

captainspeed wrote: »

The 1.4 Passat is turbocharged, the 1.6 is not - that's why the 1.4 is a lot faster (and therefore better) than the 1.6 !

....LOL, while it has a warranty, maybe.

Remember VAG got their fingers very badly burned with that 1.4TFSI already......fwiw, I like the idea, but they'll never last as long as the larger engined cars: as they get older, they'll get less, and worse, servicing, and they'll be stacked on top of one another in breaker's yards.......ditto for all those small-bore diesels currently commuting around at 40mph......

Zubeneschamali

Burt Lancaster wrote: »

I've owned dozens of cars in my life, from Lada's to BMW's to Jags, to sportcars to vauxhall viva's

And yet here you are, asking our advice about a humdrum 1.8 Avensis?

[checks Burt's boards.ie posting history]

Ah, I see. Good day to you, sir.

Leonard Hofstadter

galwaytt wrote: »

....LOL, while it has a warranty, maybe.

Remember VAG got their fingers very badly burned with that 1.4TFSI already......fwiw, I like the idea, but they'll never last as long as the larger engined cars: as they get older, they'll get less, and worse, servicing, and they'll be stacked on top of one another in breaker's yards.......ditto for all those small-bore diesels currently commuting around at 40mph......

It's only the twincharger models that give problems (the 140 and 170 bhp models), the 1.4 in the Passat only has a turbocharger and is a lot more reliable than the more powerful 1.4 TSIs, which have a turbo and supercharger.

VAG reliability is pretty dire these days anyway.

MuppetCheck

captainspeed wrote: »

VAG reliability is pretty dire these days anyway.

It's hardly dire, just not at the level it once was or the price often implies.

cadaliac

MuppetCheck wrote: »

It's hardly dire, just not at the level it once was or the price often implies.

Nah, it's dire.
Engine and gearbox failures are dire. Cv joints suspension parts and normal wear and tear I can take, but major component failures which seem all too common on vag products, I would classify as dire.