Holidays in Work

LegacyUser

We get 4 weeks of holiday a year in work. I have already booked 2 of those weeks off, but now my manager is telling me I have to confirm with him when I want to take the last two weeks off by next month. I need to keep those last 2 weeks until I know when my college exams are scheduled. My manager said if I don't confirm with him those last two weeks by July, I will be randomly assigned two weeks off whenever it suits the company.
Is this legal?
I have not been given my contract yet even though I've been with the company since last autumn, but that is a separate issue. I mainly want to know if this act is legal or if I can hold onto those 2 weeks until I want to use them?

Eoin

From this page:

Taking annual leave
It is for your employer to decide when annual leave may be taken, but this is subject to a number of conditions. Your employer must take into account your family responsibilities, opportunities for rest and recreation that are available to you and to consult with you (or your union) at least one month before the leave is to be taken.

The conditions are all a bit vague unfortunately.

You don't know even to within a couple of weeks when the exams will be?

wmpdd3

We all have to book all our holidays for the year before the end of jan. Its def legal. Its up to your employer to ensure you get you holiday entitlement, when you get the holidays are an agreement between both of you.

InReality

wmpdd3 wrote: »

We all have to book all our holidays for the year before the end of jan. Its def legal. Its up to your employer to ensure you get you holiday entitlement, when you get the holidays are an agreement between both of you.

An agreement doesn't mean you should have to book your years holdays in jan

Stheno

InReality wrote: »

An agreement doesn't mean you should have to book your years holdays in jan

Apart from the odd day or two it might.

In my world we know almost six months in advance what our schedules are.
Builders know they have to take certain holidays (end of July, Christmas)

My office asks staff in January to block out significant holidays to ensure they get them.

It works really well, means a bit of planning but it works.

edellc

OP talk to your manager and tell him what you have written on here, that you want them for exams and you dont know when they are, I'm sure he is not a monster and might be understanding either that or you ring in sick for two weeks

can you also speak to your college and maybe they can give you a hint as to when exams are?? they usually fall around the last week nov or first few wks of december from my experience so maybe those two weeks pencil in?? but your college should know when the exams are sat as its roughly the same time every year.

tatli_lokma

edellc wrote: »

either that or you ring in sick for two weeks

I would strongly recommend against this - especially if you want to keep your job. He already knows you will need time off for exams, and then coincidently you ring in sick for those very two weeks?? unless he's a dimwit he'll know what you are up to and you could end up on a disciplinary - not to mention the fact you will need to get a sick cert for 2 weeks leave, so it will cost you at least one visit to the doctor. Most companies insist that if you are off sick for more than a week you make a claim to social welfare. So pulling a sickie for 2 weeks really isn't a very practical solution.

As others said, contact college and at least get a fair idea of when the exams will be held. Then speak to your manager, remind him you have exams, although the dates are not confirmed. Explain you are happy to provisionally pencil in the leave you expect to need, but that you would appreciate some flexibility from him as the dates may change slightly. If he is not prepared to be flexible, then tell him you will need to request time off without pay to attend exams. If he realises that you are trying to be cooperative and that to the best of your ability you will try to take time off at a specified time, then he might be more willing to meet you halfway.

edellc

Obviously I wasn't serious about ringing in sick

tatli_lokma

edellc wrote: »

Obviously I wasn't serious about ringing in sick

good to know! unfortunately some people would actually recommend this, and when its written its not always easy to tell if someone says it in jest! OP could have blamed you, yes you Edellc, on the whole sorry mess and ti would be all your fault entirely when they got the sack! We all love someone to blame!

fasttalkerchat

If you made clear about your education commitments when you started then its part of your contract.

JustAddWater

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

If you made clear about your education commitments when you started then its part of your contract.

The one he hasn't got yet?!

fasttalkerchat

JustAddWater wrote: »

The one he hasn't got yet?!

I assumed he doesn't have a hard copy but that he did sign one when he joined. I'll need the OP to clarify that.

tatli_lokma

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

If you made clear about your education commitments when you started then its part of your contract.

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

I assumed he doesn't have a hard copy but that he did sign one when he joined. I'll need the OP to clarify that.

This would only apply if OP's contract explicity states that due to OP's education committments they will be granted time off, and I doubt that would be the case.

LegacyUser

Hi, thanks for all the replies.
I made my employers aware of my education commitments when I first started but since then, the company has changed around quite a bit and nobody has received contracts yet the company continues to change rules. My manager is very much aware of my exams and that I do not know when they fall. My college can't provide any information because although the exams fall around the same time, they span over four weeks and I have four exams which could fall literally on any days of those four weeks.
I was made book the holidays so I made my best guess as to when they would be and if there is a problem when they occur I'll have to discuss it then I suppose. I'm a little crestfallen that it is legal for them to ask in advance for this since there are people like me who cannot do that as they are not in control of other commitments.
This company seems to be a bit lackadaisical where rules are concerned and I'm currently seeking new, more stable employment.

tatli_lokma

NeedingAdvice wrote: »

I'm a little crestfallen that it is legal for them to ask in advance for this since there are people like me who cannot do that as they are not in control of other commitments.

I'm sorry that things are awkward for you and that your employer is not prepared to be flexible. However you have to be realistic - an employer hires you to do a specific job. Your other committments are not always a concern for them. They are trying to run their business and in order to do so it makes absolute sense for them to ensure that holidays etc are taken in a structured manner so that they can plan ahead with this in mind. Although you have other committments, this is not really their problem. Your college, children, sick cat, preferred holidays...... none of that is their issue to be concerned about.

I know it sounds harsh, and we would all love employers who are understanding and flexible, but in the real world it doesn't always work like this. Being 'flexible' an 'accommodating' can cause so much hassle....it can be seen as favouring certain employees, it can result in an unorganised business, it can result in additional admin. Employees often don't think of this when they accuse their employer of being unfair and unreasonable - often saying no and insisting on across the board and planned behaviour is the fair and reasonable thing to do. We all know that an understanding boss is a great thing to have, and most people are more inclined to go above and beyond their normal job for a good boss, but equally I am sure we have all seen staff who take advantage of a good boss and use their understanding nature as a tool to get away with murder.

I do sympathise OP, but your personal committments are not of their concern. As you say, if they are not very understanding, and not keen on enforcing rules unless they are in their own favour, it probably is best to look elsewhere. I hope you are successful in finding a new job.