Minor Cycling Accident

BarneyMc

I was near the end of a cycle about 6 weeks ago when a learner driver pulled out in front of me. I had to brake suddenly and came off the bike. Luckily I sustained nothing more than a bit of bleeding from my palms.

Luckily a pedestrian caught up with the car and told the driver to stop (they didn't even know what happened). A young girl was driving and her father was in the passenger seat. I was a bit shocked from the fall and worried about my bike which I had bought for €1,600 about a month previously.

Anyway I told the father that I was ok but it was a new bike and I would have to see what way the gears were and if the wheels needed any work. He was fine with that and even wrote down his name, reg no., phone number and address.

The daughter was totally distraught and was in tears. I felt sorry for her and told her not to worry. The father was nice about things also. If they had of been nasty about it then I might have lost it as I was initially very angry with the driver pulling out in front of me. I was wearing a full luminous yellow top so I'm still not sure how she didn't see me BTW.

Anyway as it turned out the gears need a bit of work and the back wheel needs a small bit of work also. It's probably €50 worth. I rang him today and explained that the repair cost would be very minor... maybe €50 tops. He then shouted down the phone at me saying that he would not pay for it. He said:

- I must have been going too fast as she didn't see me
- Because there was no contact (I had to brake suddenly) they were not at fault
- If I was driving a car and crashed into him from behind then it would be me at fault (surely if a car pulls out from a parking position and causes the bike to crash then it's them at fault?)

It's not about the money at this stage, I'm just really vexed about the way he has turned the tables so it seems like my fault I didn't brake carefully enough to avoid her car pulling out in front of me. Surprised how sickened I feel about this and if I had of known I would have got the Gardai on the scene.

Does anyone know who's in the wrong here?

Captain Havoc

We've seen this happen a few times here. I would assume she was driving dangerously, having read posts like this, I think it's best just to report it on the night or at least take the name and number of a witness.

Beasty

BarneyMc wrote: »

- I must have been going too fast as she didn't see me
- Because there was no contact (I had to brake suddenly) they were not at fault
- If I was driving a car and crashed into him from behind then it would be me at fault (surely if a car pulls out from a parking position and causes the bike to crash then it's them at fault?)

None of those arguments have any credibility

She should always check before pulling out. You cannot cycle faster than the speed of light, so she could have seen you if she had looked properly

The fact there was no contact is down to you taking evasive action. Based on you version of events (which is all we have to go on), she caused you to take that evasive action, so on the face of it is to blame

Fault for hitting another vehicle from behind is all about driving too close, nothing to do with pulling out in the path of another road user unexpectedly.

BarneyMc

Thanks guys. I guess it's too late now reporting it to the Gardai. I have the reg. so it's possible I could get his insurance details and contact them?

Anyway I know I won't get a cent out of this but feel sick from his attitude towards me on the phone. I just want him to know he was in the wrong and for his daughter to take care in future... it could have been much, much worse!

Beasty

BarneyMc wrote: »

Thanks guys. I guess it's too late now reporting it to the Gardai.

TBH, I would be tempted to ask him for those arguments in writing, and once you have it say you are taking it to the Guards

Of course he may not provide it, in which case report it, stating what he said to you over the phone - I can't imagine the Guards will accept any of them as valid and may take it further - if he (and the driver) stick to their line they could be digging a hole for themselves

clog

Contact their insurance company directly and get a claim form fill in the details and send it in. The insurance company can settle the claim on the balance of probability even if the policyholder does not aggree. In practice though it would be so much hassle for a learner driver to have a claim registered that you will prob find that they settle soon as the company gets involved. You do not need to have any direct contact with the person themselves.

ratracer

Do you have the witness' details? If so it should be relatively straight forward. Perhaps a call from the gardai will make the idiot see the error of his ways. You're right tho, I'd be so annoyed by his attitude I'd be doing my damndest to make him pay.

BarneyMc

I think I'll go to the Garda station tomorrow and see where I stand. I'll have to go there anyway to get their insurance company from his car reg. I'll contact them and see what happens.

I'm so angry when I think back and how nice I was to him and his daughter who was in tears. So much for being Mr. Nice Guy!

ratracer

Do you have the witness' details? If so it should be relatively straight forward. Perhaps a call from the gardai will make the idiot see the error of his ways. You're right tho, I'd be so annoyed by his attitude I'd be doing my damndest to make him pay.

BarneyMc

ratracer wrote: »

Do you have the witness' details? If so it should be relatively straight forward. Perhaps a call from the gardai will make the idiot see the error of his ways. You're right tho, I'd be so annoyed by his attitude I'd be doing my damndest to make him pay.

Unfortunately didn't get the witness' details.... didn't even consider legalities because they seemed so reasonable at the time. I've nothing against her as she was obviously distraught. It's not about the money either, I just feel angry and somewhat embarrassed with the attitude of a fellow Irishman

Dermot Illogical

Why not call him back and ask him for the insurance details?
If he has half a brain he'll see where it's going and cop on to himself. A claim on his policy will be expensive for him.

BarneyMc

RT66 wrote: »

Why not call him back and ask him for the insurance details?
If he has half a brain he'll see where it's going and cop on to himself. A claim on his policy will be expensive for him.

Yes maybe. A "sorry" would have done the trick and few pound towards the damage (not considering the scrapes to the bike which now makes it hard to sell, if I was to). Anyway will let you know how it goes with the Gardai tomorrow.

Cee-Jay-Cee

If she was pulling out from an exit or side road then you had right if way and she was in the wrong. It is irrelevant whether you were on a bike, on foot or in a car, she should have looked and gave way. His argument about speed is ridiculous as you were on a bike and couldn't possibly have been traveling so fast that she didn't see you. Simply say she never even looked and drive straight out.

Ring him back and very simply tell him without getting angry or raising your voice that you want compensated for the damage to your bike otherwise you are reporting the matter to the guards. You have 6 months from the date of the incident before it becomes statute barred so don't be thinking its too late. You can explain to the guards that her father changed his attitude once you told him about the damage and that's why you didn't report it at the time.

She was driving without due care or attention and if you make a written complaint about her driving then the guards are obliged to investigate it. If the daughter got upset on the roadside can you imagine how upset she'd be if she thought the guards would be calling to see her. Her father, if he's any sort of father won't want that to happen.

Even though you didn't impact with her car it is technically a traffic collision. You were injured too which makes it a minor injury collision, if you report it and make a formal complaint, it has to be investigated. You can withdraw it then at any time if they settle up for the damage to your bike. You have absolutely nothing to lose. You are also entitled to take a personal injury claim against her insurance company. If she's a learner she won't want a claim so early in her driving career.

size5

The main reason that he was aggressive on the phone was to get rid of you I.e. frighten you. It usually happens with accidents both parties are nice to each other. One party goes home thinks about the accident(or takes advise) and their attitude completely changes.

Don 't forget you were hurt (even though minor ) and your bike was damaged.

(1) First get a written quote from bike shop-

(2) ring father stating you have written quote for repair and you would like compensation. He says "no" you saycan I have your insurance details please". He says no, you say"I am now heading down to the Garda station to report the incident". And report it

Let's not forget his daughter will be "****ting a brick" if guards are going to be involved and she might start putting pressure on him to settle.

Head to guards and report but my advise get written quote from bike shop as everything is then in black and white. Write everything you can remember bout the accident and subsequent conversationdown on sheet of paper before heading to guards (. Just means your clear consise and won't forget anything).

Best of luck

BarneyMc

Went down to the Garda station yesterday and the following happened...

The Garda said that because I didn't report the accident at the time it might be difficult getting the driver's insurance details. He said that it was not always accurate and there were data protection issues.

The most interesting thing was when I showed him the name and address of the driver's father. He raised an eyebrow, smiled and said "yes, we've had a number of incidents regarding that guy"!

Anyway he's going to try and speak with him and see if he's willing to come to his senses. I hope he does but somehow don't think he will!

Joxer_S

BarneyMc wrote: »

The most interesting thing was when I showed him the name and address of the driver's father. He raised an eyebrow, smiled and said "yes, we've had a number of incidents regarding that guy"!

Even if nothing more comes of it it was worth reporting for this alone. If there's a pattern of behaviour there that the guards are aware of and a similar incident happens again, he won't have much credibility.

Dermot Illogical

BarneyMc wrote: »

Went down to the Garda station yesterday and the following happened...

The Garda said that because I didn't report the accident at the time it might be difficult getting the driver's insurance details. He said that it was not always accurate and there were data protection issues.

Go to the address and take a pic of the insurance disc. Then stick a claim against his policy using the info you get from it.

Undercover Elephant

BarneyMc wrote: »

The Garda said that because I didn't report the accident at the time it might be difficult getting the driver's insurance details. He said that it was not always accurate and there were data protection issues.

The most interesting thing was when I showed him the name and address of the driver's father. He raised an eyebrow, smiled and said "yes, we've had a number of incidents regarding that guy"!

That's mad, Ted.

Glad to see the Gardai are sympathetic and hope you get sorted.

BarneyMc

RT66 wrote: »

Go to the address and take a pic of the insurance disc. Then stick a claim against his policy using the info you get from it.

Yes that did occur to me! It's a small town so I'm sure to spot his car about sometime soon:D

BarneyMc

Joxer_S wrote: »

Even if nothing more comes of it it was worth reporting for this alone. If there's a pattern of behaviour there that the guards are aware of and a similar incident happens again, he won't have much credibility.

Yes indeed, I feel much better about this now. I was very disappointed about the way he turned the tables on me and that's what really annoyed me. Now that I know he has a history of being a ____ it's restored my faith in the good people of this country :P

enas

Good luck with that BarneyMc, as everyone else here, I wish to encourage you to keep pursuing. As others told you too, there's absolutely nothing unusual in their reaction: most people would be apologetic at the time of the accident, but turn aggressive and defensive from the day after, after the emotion has settled down. You don't want to deal with them at all anymore. Just deal with the Gardaí they way you're doing.

clog

If you are having diffucilty finding out their insurance company i would try contacting the companies directly if you have the reg. If it was a young driver i would say that they are prob insured by axa or liberty(was quinn) try these first. Ask for claims dept and give them the reg. There are only about 8 actual underwriting companies in the state.
You are legally entitled to their insurance details it does not matter weather you take them at the time or later. It is not a choice they must supply them when asked. There are no data protection issues as all you are asking for is a number which relates to their policy. The insurance company is the entity that is doing the data protection.

Cee-Jay-Cee

BarneyMc wrote: »

Went down to the Garda station yesterday and the following happened...

The Garda said that because I didn't report the accident at the time it might be difficult getting the driver's insurance details. He said that it was not always accurate and there were data protection issues.

The most interesting thing was when I showed him the name and address of the driver's father. He raised an eyebrow, smiled and said "yes, we've had a number of incidents regarding that guy"!

Anyway he's going to try and speak with him and see if he's willing to come to his senses. I hope he does but somehow don't think he will!

Yeah the guards can ask her to produce her insurance within 1 month of the date of incident so technically they cant obtain the details.

If the father still doesnt want to play ball after the guard speaks with them then tell him you want to make a written complaint about the girls driving. The guards will then have to go to her and inform her a complaint has been made and that it will be investigated and a file prepared on it for court. Her father wont want that to happen unless he's a complete tool and may settle up for the damage caused. Simply keep the pressure on them as you have nothing to lose in this case. A solicitors letter informing them you are taking an action against her for injuries caused would work too.

BarneyMc

Got a phone call from his wife about an hour ago. She said he was in England so she was making the call :pac: She was actually very nice and simply said that she would pay for the cost of repairing the bike. I'll have to see if she does but I'm quite sure she will.

Looks like his wife has more sense and manners than he has!

Thanks everyone for your encouragement and advice throughout and I hope this helps others who find themselves in this situation. My advice is to report an incident at the time, get witness details and don't take anyone at their word!