Heaven?

safarigirl

What the bible teaches , at Death humans cease to exist. The dead are conscious of nothing at all, states Ecclesiastes 9.5, since the dead cannot know feel or experience anything the cannot harm or help the living, Psalm 1463.4

???????????

Ok so i just had the Jehovahs witnesses round and they gave me a leaflet. If Humans cease to exsist at death, why does the bible teach of heaven ,????

deathbot

Heaven begins at baptism. Christ plants the seed of the kingdom of God. Most people think heaven will be something completely new. Of course this doesn't make sense, because heaven is already here, working through Christians, that is the Kingdom of God.

From what I understand, heaven for us is a total fulfillment of the kingdom of God, which we have a taste of here on earth.

I hope that makes sense.

Run_to_da_hills

bexstar wrote: »

What the bible teaches , at Death humans cease to exist. The dead are conscious of nothing at all, states Ecclesiastes 9.5, since the dead cannot know feel or experience anything the cannot harm or help the living, Psalm 1463.4

???????????

Ok so i just had the Jehovahs witnesses round and they gave me a leaflet. If Humans cease to exsist at death, why does the bible teach of heaven ,????

The Jehovah Witnesses are a Satanic organization, based upon the occult of Freemasonry. Charles Taze Russell was a 33rd Degree Freemason.

safarigirl

Oh i was thinking anything bad about the jehovahs, It was written in the bible so whatever christian religion you are it still states there is no after life. So Heaven isnt a place we go to after we die? I am more than confused now. If we cease to exsist then why is the threat of going to Hell if we die when we are bad possiable?

Run_to_da_hills

bexstar wrote: »

Oh i was thinking anything bad about the jehovahs, It was written in the bible so whatever christian religion you are it still states there is no after life. So Heaven isnt a place we go to after we die? I am more than confused now. If we cease to exsist then why is the threat of going to Hell if we die when we are bad possiable?

Our lord says quite a few things about heaven.

"Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him" 1 Corinthians 2:9

"In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you". John 14:2

It also says in scripture that only a few will make it to heaven which would definitively rule out any doctrine on "Baptism salvation".

Many Will Seek to Enter Heaven, But Few Will Enter.

"And someone said to Him, "Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?" And He said to them,"Strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able". Luke 13:24 -

philologos

Jesus very clearly teaches of eternal life in the Scriptures. One of the obvious references where Jesus advocates the afterlife is in Mark's Gospel when he is talking with the Sadducees a Jewish sect who did not believe in the afterlife:

Mark 12:18-27 wrote:

And Sadducees came to him, who say that there is no resurrection. And they asked him a question, saying, “Teacher, Moses wrote for us that if a man's brother dies and leaves a wife, but leaves no child, the man must take the widow and raise up offspring for his brother. There were seven brothers; the first took a wife, and when he died left no offspring. And the second took her, and died, leaving no offspring. And the third likewise. And the seven left no offspring. Last of all the woman also died. In the resurrection, when they rise again, whose wife will she be? For the seven had her as wife.”
Jesus said to them, “Is this not the reason you are wrong, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God? For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven. And as for the dead being raised, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the passage about the bush, how God spoke to him, saying, ‘I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not God of the dead, but of the living. You are quite wrong.”

I could show you reference upon reference that backs this up. Let's quote the passages and see if they say anything about there being no afterlife.

Ecclesiastes 9:1-6:

Ecclesiastes 9:1-6 wrote:

But all this I laid to heart, examining it all, how the righteous and the wise and their deeds are in the hand of God. Whether it is love or hate, man does not know; both are before him. It is the same for all, since the same event happens to the righteous and the wicked, to the good and the evil, to the clean and the unclean, to him who sacrifices and him who does not sacrifice. As the good one is, so is the sinner, and he who swears is as he who shuns an oath. This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that the same event happens to all. Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead. But he who is joined with all the living has hope, for a living dog is better than a dead lion. For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and forever they have no more share in all that is done under the sun.

Psalm 146:1-4 -

Psalm 146:1-4 wrote:

Praise the LORD!
Praise the LORD, O my soul!
I will praise the LORD as long as I live;
I will sing praises to my God while I have my being.
Put not your trust in princes,
in a son of man, in whom there is no salvation.
When his breath departs, he returns to the earth;
on that very day his plans perish.)

Both of these passages don't mention anything about an afterlife, rather what they do is mention the futility of this life. Personally, I recognise that I will be returning bodily to this earth when I am buried, equally I recognise that I will be raised spiritually to new life through Jesus Christ. I recognise that I probably won't be remembered on the face of the earth for anything that I may have done, but I recognise that if I remain faithful to Jesus, that I will be in the book of life at the last day.

It was written in the bible so whatever christian religion you are it still states there is no after life.

Jesus says, that anyone who denies eternal life is "quite wrong". Throughout the Gospels He advocates the idea that there will be eternal life, and eternal judgement.

philologos

deathbot wrote: »

Heaven begins at baptism. Christ plants the seed of the kingdom of God. Most people think heaven will be something completely new. Of course this doesn't make sense, because heaven is already here, working through Christians, that is the Kingdom of God.

From what I understand, heaven for us is a total fulfillment of the kingdom of God, which we have a taste of here on earth.

I hope that makes sense.

I see your reasoning, but ultimately it's both flawed and unbiblical. The Kingdom of God (God's dominion) is in this world in so far as He is at work in it as well as the next. However, this does not mean that the New Earth and the New Jerusalem (Revelation 21) are in the here and now. Jesus makes clear that there will be a time of tribulation between His departure and His return (Matthew 24, Mark 13 for example). He does make clear that He will be returning in judgement. The New Testament makes clear that there will be a new earth and a new Jerusalem after this judgement has taken place.

If you could let me know Biblically why you think there will be no such thing as an afterlife, I'll be happy to discuss it with you. The heaven on earth narrative is mistaken IMO.

FISMA

bexstar wrote: »

Ok so i just had the Jehovahs witnesses round and they gave me a leaflet. If Humans cease to exsist at death, why does the bible teach of heaven ,????

Because the spirit of the human goes to heaven, not the body.

Fanny Cradock

I think there is compelling evidence that the NT teaches about a physical existence after this one, and that heaven is only part of the story. Philologos hint at this when he mentions the New Earth and the New Jerusalem.