vrt to be scrapped? (no link)

pjwhite99

Any1 hear is the vrt to be scrapped? last week someone won a case about the vrt or something?

Eric Cartman

id more than likely say increased rather than scrapped.

mgbgt1978

Source....or some people might not believe you.;)

bazz26

Even if it was to happen (which I doubt) all they would do is call it something else.

Jimbob 83

If anything it will become even tighter and personally i think having it may be a small annoyance but not having it would be plain lethal.

Jammy Donut

A flat fee of €250 would be nice for pre 00 cars. But it will NEVER happen because our goverment are money hungry *****!

corktina

reduce tax in one place and you have to increase it elsewhere or cut something....

dr.fuzzenstein

corktina wrote: »

reduce tax in one place and you have to increase it elsewhere or cut something....

And right now they're increasing existing taxes and inventing new ones.

ShadowHearth

Tits or gtfo, I mean pics or gtfo, damn I mean prove or gtfo! Here, I got it!

michellie

It's bringing in millions of revenue, not a hope it will be scrapped.

NIMAN

Didn't hear that. Only story I have seen recently re: vrt was up here in Donegal where a judge fined a woman €2500 for failing to get out of her car for a Customs official. He slagged off the VRT Campaigners who, via mobile, told her to stay in the car. He said their irresponsibility cost her dearly.

Jesus Shaves

It is being scrapped due to a European law being brought in, link was posted here before

EDIT:Just googled it and see posts going back 6 years about it being scrapped

......'tis like the 90s again :rolleyes:

colm_mcm

It's the vrt on used cars that bugs me, the new car ones are fair enough I think, they could look at narrowing the gap between band a and g rates, bu it's not the worst

johnayo

RoverJames wrote: »

......'tis like the 90s again :rolleyes:

Remember that one well. People holding off changing their cars, waiting for the import duty to go.:eek:
Any chance of universal service charge going as well.:rolleyes:

Jimbob 83

It's an illegal tax in the tax harmonized euro zone, the government gets fined annually by the eu for having it but still make enough of a profit to not care

Fiskar

Are you guys just brainstorming for the government?

They have enough ideas for taxing the motorist off the road without giving them any more.

slimjimmc

pjwhite99 wrote: »

Any1 hear is the vrt to be scrapped? last week someone won a case about the vrt or something?

You might be thinking of the EU Courts interest in how VRT is imposed on used cars. This was reported in the media back in Jan that the EU wanted Ireland to scrap the policy of treating cars less the 3mths old as new cars. It doesn't abolish VRT, it just means that VRT on cars < 3mths old will be based on the cars lower 2nd hand value, not the brand new value.

Jimbob 83 wrote: »

It's an illegal tax in the tax harmonized euro zone, the government gets fined annually by the eu for having it but still make enough of a profit to not care

It has never been declared illegal despite numerous EU court cases
Eurozone taxes are not harmonized, even VAT is different across the EU ans Eurozone. VRT is a registration tax not an import duty (though it may have the same effect).
Please show where and when the Government is fined for a legal VRT. Other EU countries impose similar and higher registration taxes.

AltAccount

I heard they're making all taxes opt-in. Free puppies and hugs for everyone too.

Sunshine and lollipops, here we come!!!

mickdw

colm_mcm wrote: »

It's the vrt on used cars that bugs me, the new car ones are fair enough I think, they could look at narrowing the gap between band a and g rates, bu it's not the worst

So you want the new car buyer to pay a lump of VRT and then for it to disappear when they come to sell it. This would be the effect if slightly used cars could be brought into the country vrt free. I cant see how that would work, nobody would volunteer to buy the new car as they could escape it by buying the car alittle used. As it is now we have a tax calculated against car value which imo has to be the fairest way, a residual vrt value if you like. Sure there are issues with some of the car valuations but thats an other argument really.
There does appear to be a certain group of people - a percentage of those who import used who feel hard done by over vrt. They seem to think that they are the only ones who pay vrt and that in some way the people buying here used are not paying it. Of course, everyone is paying in some form or other whether it be directly to the revenue on an import or included in new car price when buying new or by simply buying a used car here, where there is again a residual vrt value associated with the cars used price and the seller is simply getting some of the initial vrt outlay back.

colm_mcm

mickdw wrote: »

So you want the new car buyer to pay a lump of VRT and then for it to disappear when they come to sell it. This would be the effect if slightly used cars could be brought into the country vrt free. I cant see how that would work, nobody would volunteer to buy the new car as they could escape it by buying the car alittle used. As it is now we have a tax calculated against car value which imo has to be the fairest way, a residual vrt value if you like. Sure there are issues with some of the car valuations but thats an other argument really.
There does appear to be a certain group of people - a percentage of those who import used who feel hard done by over vrt. They seem to think that they are the only ones who pay vrt and that in some way the people buying here used are not paying it. Of course, everyone is paying in some form or other whether it be directly to the revenue on an import or included in new car price when buying new or by simply buying a used car here, where there is again a residual vrt value associated with the cars used price and the seller is simply getting some of the initial vrt outlay back.

I think you misunderstand what I'm saying, what I mean is that some vrt figures on used cars are crazy where the car is over valued, cars that don't have a cert of conformity pay the top rate, so if you go to the uk and pick up a cheap old car like a jap import or just an old car, and reg it you're paying around €700 as a minimum.


The new rates for new cars are geared towards low emissions and in a lot of cases are unbelievably low, the govt didn't anticipate the progress that would be made with low emissions cars.

Buying an older car means you don't get the low rate as the technology wasn't there when those cars were launched,

Jimbob 83

slimjimmc wrote: »

It has never been declared illegal despite numerous EU court cases
Eurozone taxes are not harmonized, even VAT is different across the EU ans Eurozone. VRT is a registration tax not an import duty (though it may have the same effect).
Please show where and when the Government is fined for a legal VRT. Other EU countries impose similar and higher registration taxes.

http://www.dtdirl.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-47672.html

Jimbob 83

Jimbob 83 wrote: »

http://www.dtdirl.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-47672.html

Is that the only source you can find to support your claim that VRT is illegal?

slimjimmc

RoverJames wrote: »

Is that the only source you can find to support your claim that VRT is illegal?

And it's not even an example of the EC taking a case to ban VRT, it's merely an objection to how VRT is calculated on used cars.

Perhaps the OP could tell us the outcome of that case.
He can check here
I can find only 2 VRT related requests in the past 3 years (1 & 2), and none of them calling for a ban or declaring it illegal.
In fact the latest ruling says quite the opposite:

Subject to certain exceptions, the taxation of motor vehicles has not been harmonised. According to EU case law, the Member States have the right to levy a registration tax - at a rate as high as they see fit - when a vehicle is registered for the first time in the State. This tax can be levied even if the transfer of the vehicle is linked to a change of residence and even if a similar tax has already been levied in another Member State.

Pity OP decided to raise all our hopes like that without researching it first :D:(

Guy:Incognito

slimjimmc wrote: »

It has never been declared illegal despite numerous EU court cases
Eurozone taxes are not harmonized, even VAT is different across the EU ans Eurozone. VRT is a registration tax not an import duty (though it may have the same effect).
Please show where and when the Government is fined for a legal VRT. Other EU countries impose similar and higher registration taxes.

I seem to remember someone on the last VRT thread declare they had proof of the fines but couldnt show us for a few weeks as it was classified or some other horse****e. Predicably the proof never surfaced.


Plus, without fail, in every VRT thread somone comes in authorititively and proclaims that VRT is illegal without any proof whatsoever. Despite the fact that the EU has said its legal.

L1011

Jimbob 83 wrote: »

It's an illegal tax in the tax harmonized euro zone, the government gets fined annually by the eu for having it but still make enough of a profit to not care

No its not.

No they don't.


How many times do people have to be told this is untrue?

CiniO

slimjimmc wrote: »

And it's not even an example of the EC taking a case to ban VRT, it's merely an objection to how VRT is calculated on used cars.

VRT is calculated in very sneaky way, making real vrt rates higher than they appear.
It's all due to fact, that VRT is percentage of open market selling price, which price already includes VRT. (In other words if there was no vrt, then omsp would be smaller).

Example:
Car worth 5000 euro in Ireland. The same car abroad worth 3400 euro. Higher market price in Ireland is due to VRT.

Now you buy car abroad for 3400. You go to pay VRT and it's calculated f.e. as 32% of 5000 which is 1600 euro. Total of 5000 and that matches what the car is worth in Ireland - all grant so far.

But you paid 1600 euro tax on a vehicle worth 3400, so the tax rate was 47%.
And that's the real VRT rate you are paying, even though revenue is saying it's only 32%.

colm_mcm

But it was worth 3400 in the other country. You've still ended up with a €5000 car that's "worth" €5000

As long as you know how much the vrt is and you're happy to import, what's the issue?

CiniO

colm_mcm wrote: »

But it was worth 3400 in the other country. You've still ended up with a €5000 car that's "worth" €5000

As long as you know how much the vrt is and you're happy to import, what's the issue?

Oh no there's no issue with that. VRT calculator on revenue website shouldn't leave any doubt for people willing to import.

But it's just interesting how revenue is using a simple math's trick to fool people. Surely 32% VRT looks better than 47% while in reality you pay the bigger one