Does God Exist? Matt Dillahunty versus Jay Lucas

dlofnep

Many of you may be familiar with Matt Millahunty from the Atheist Experience show. He's been engaging in debates for some time now - here is his latest. An absolute master-class against Jay Lucas.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_6NrFWDTLc

xerces

Cool, I watch The Atheist Experience every week and although I find what they talk about in general very interesting, the debates with callers can be very short and one sided, with the caller often struggling to construct an intelligible argument for their beliefs or falling foul of the classic fallacies found in theistic thought. I've never heard of Jay Lucas, but I presume he will present a more honed form of apologetics than your average Sunday afternoon caller. This should be interesting.

stevejazzx

Not more than a minute into his opening argument Jay Lucas confirms his stupidity


"God has made himself know through the human moral conscience"

He then goes to state that

"Matt will [inadvertently I presume?] give evidence of his suppressed theism..." only to immediately follow with the contradictory words

"But I have no desire to needlessly offend anyone"

At this stage the Matt has secured an early victory.

[edit at around 22 mins he claims that atheists can be liars without having moral consequences - agghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....he's moving towards the stalin thing now....I hate this guy; he is a complete moron]

fitz0

I'm only 0:20 in and already annoyed by the mono audio.

dlofnep

I think Matt's question at the 1:19:00 mark pretty much cleans house on the topic of 'objective morality'... 1:21:20 is pretty much game over.

nozzferrahhtoo

I do tend to lose respect for people... even people I have never heard of before such as the theist in this debate.... who open a debate by declaring their side of the argument is "obvious" to everyone.

I have a long history with debate, as a watcher, a debater and a moderator and in all three roles I know the second you hear an opening line like that... the game is over already.

Even more boring however is that there is two "matts" in this debate. The Matt who showed up, and the Matt Slick who Lucas spent most of this opening argument ripping off.

Edit: I do not want to listen to the opening again so if anyone reads this BEFORE watching the video can you give me a count on how many times Jay uses the word "liar" in his opening?

joseph brand

At 1:48 in his closing speech, Matt really brings out the 'big guns'.

I was waiting on Jay to ask "where's my stapler?" (Office Space)

Jay is a typical christian debater. Full of hot air and 'what if's?'

fitz0

I wonder, and this is mainly directed to any Christians or deconverts reading, has listening or partaking in a debate like this ever actually influenced or changed your beliefs?

I ask because I came to my non-faith stance before I had ready access to the internet and in a place where there was (and still isn't) no open debate or talk about the veracity of religion in generals claims. I came to it through my own thoughts and doubts and only afterwards, through debates and such, reinforced my views.

mewso

After watching this I was browsing YouTube and watched the Hitch debating Turek (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVZnwZdh-iM). The similarity in arguments from the Christian side is striking. These guys seem to have a fixed game plan with the same 2/3 key points that they seem to believe win every time. So while it's fun seeing these guys get beat up in these debates you know they'll be back in the next youtube video pouring forth again with stuff that has been torn to shreds over and over again.

Jimoslimos

Watched it. Poor from Jay Lucas, and I mean that from a debating point of view, not an atheist one. Spent the entire debate waffling about morals and how they couldn't exist without Christianity.

Sorry Jay? Topic of debate: Does God exist? not Can morals exist without God? nor Do we get our morals from Christianity. It is a pretty weak argument to prove the existence of God, and one which most theists would shy away from or at least not lean so heavily on. Groan moment: Soviet Russia/Stalin

Favourite moment: At the beginning of Matt's second speech/rebuttal;

"I didn't really come here prepared to do an entire dissertation on morality.".....(leans into microphone)...."but I will":D

Malpaisian

Of course I exist!

Turtwig

Malpaisian wrote: »

Of course I exist!

Do you? Can you prove it?

Maphisto

Jimoslimos wrote: »

Watched it. Poor from Jay Lucas, and I mean that from a debating point of view, not an atheist one. Spent the entire debate waffling about morals and how they couldn't exist without Christianity.

Sorry Jay? Topic of debate: Does God exist? not Can morals exist without God? nor Do we get our morals from Christianity. It is a pretty weak argument to prove the existence of God, and one which most theists would shy away from or at least not lean so heavily on. Groan moment: Soviet Russia/Stalin

Favourite moment: At the beginning of Matt's second speech/rebuttal;

"I didn't really come here prepared to do an entire dissertation on morality.".....(leans into microphone)...."but I will":D

Yeah I caught that recently on Tube - it was good