School-how was it for you?

lazygal

Kind of inspired by something another poster said in the scouting thread.


I went to Catholic primary (mixed) and secondary (girls convent) schools. The sacraments of communion and confirmation were done in school time, we had the usual school masses and church-based memorial services. Teaching of religion was pretty mixed and depended on which teacher you had. There were a couple of nuns knocking about the secondary school, one of whom happened to be a science teacher!

Overall, I didn't get a huge amount of what might be called doctrine drummed into me, now obviously we had prayers and talk of God and all that jazz, but nothing too fire and brimstone. I'm a child of the 80s and 90s so maybe the church decided to tone it down a bit.

This is an issue for our family as we'll need to decide on schooling. We'd ideally like the local ET but its always oversubscribed and we might have to be pragmatic and go for the local Catholic school I attended and which is a very good school-if it was ET I'd have no qualms about it as the social and academic results are very good and its only over the road.

Despite my Catholic education, I'm now atheist/nothing really, also my husband would have been in more aggressively Catholic schools and would be even more atheist than I. So maybe the school influence shouldn't worry us as much as it does? I hate the patronage system but we can't wait for things to change before our children are educated, but maybe they might follow our lead and take all the God stuff as fairytales.

Would be interested in hearing others' experiences.

Dades

This thread might serve well for personal anecdotes - but I would suggest request that posters who reply not attempt to dig trenches when it comes to the question itself. This is discussed in enough threads already.

So basically, school - how was it for you?

Penn

Pretty mild experience. In Primary school we had religion about twice a week, and a few choir type things occasionally. Lots of religious items in the school too. Said prayers every day at 12 (I was an altar boy, which meant I got to go out and ring the huge Angelus bell, which to this day is still my second favourite part of my Catholic upbringing, No.1 being an altar boy and holding the incense). Plus being an altar boy meant if there was a mass on (the church was next to the school) and I was serving that week, we'd have to, y'know, stop learning so we could serve mass. Priest came in occasionally and there was confirmation and communion stuff. Other than that it was pretty mild. Though, it's hard to remember now. And when I consider how I was in a different primary school recently as part of my work, the amount of religious items around the place was unbelievable. Yet chances are there was an equal amount in my old school and I never paid any attention to it then.

Secondary school was a Christian Brothers school but they were never around. In fact I think the only time I ever met one was when he visited our house because they were selling a book about the school (aka getting money from parents). Had a school priest but rarely saw him unless there was a Mass on for something. Other than that, usual thing of religious items around the place. I suppose (our class at least) were lucky because for the first three years, our religion class mostly consisted of discussions and lessons about ethics with little religion. After that, religion class pretty much became "Do your homework and be quiet" class.

Overall, I was lucky enough. Religion was never really forced down my throat in either school, but was always definitely in the background (especially in primary school). That's pot luck though. Like I said, another school I was in recently, the amount of pictures of the Pope, Mary, crosses, St.Brigid crosses, things of holy water, posters with prayers on them.... Right inside the front door of the school was a small table with framed pictures of Mary, Jesus, Mother Theresa, some crosses and a thing of holy water to bless yourself. Even if your child has to go to a Catholic school and you ask for them to be excused from religion classes, there is no escaping the religion. It's everywhere.

Ellis Dee

Pretty awful in general. First Presentation nuns, who were a bunch of sadistic bitches for the most part, then the Screechin Butchers' school. A couple of them were decent enough, but others were irritable, nasty pricks who were always ready with the leather or stick. One bastard even had an ash plant that he had nicknamed "The Holy Ghost" ... "and the Holy Ghost shall descend upon you!" And all, including the laymen there, were lousy teachers and a couple were alcoholics who were more or less permanently pissed.:(

Fortunately, I was bright enough to sit and pass the Leaving Cert at 16 and was then able to leave and get myself an education, mostly outside Ireland.:)

Not that I'm entirely ungrateful, because school gave me a lifelong immunity to religion at a very early age, and that remains one of my most treasured possessions.:D

gaynorvader

I was quietly indoctrinated, I probably would never have noticed if it wasn't for the fact that I was an extremely enthusiastic reader. At about 8-9 years old I read the bible cover to cover and started asking questions. Most of which the school/sunday school teachers/priests failed to give me a satisfactory response to. By the time I was 11, I was agnostic (though I didn't know there was a word for it) and thought of as 'weird' by my classmates.
It wasn't bad though, and my parents would have to share some of the blame for taking me to church, etc. I think as long as the teachers aren't too dogmatic and the parents are willing to educate their child in the matter of religion, any school is fine.
As for secondary schools, if a child has been brought up knowing about religion and are not indoctrinated, it's unlikely anything said to them in secondary school will convert them.

OldNotWIse

Primary school was great. Secondary was full of middle class, stuck up bitchy c*nts with hockey sticks and babyG watches

I was wondering why everyone was focusing on the religious aspect of their education and then slowly realised that was the topic - duh! Sorry about my (irrelevant) rant

despite my otherwise cynical nature, it was just so accepted in the school that i tended to believe it was all true
remember there being loads and loads of religion and trips to the church and of course communion and confirmation
and art about religion etc etc

luckily my mother sent me to a non/multi denom secondary - no more of that

doctoremma

I went to non-denominational primary school and a Catholic secondary school (11-18 years) in the UK so this is for comparison only... Catholicism was hastily forced upon me at a later age in order to secure said place at secondary school so I didn't have much exposure to it growing up (apart from I knew my Mum was Catholic).

My school was OK. There was a once a term "big mass" for the whole school, followed by confession if you wanted (I only went to get out of a lesson). All of our morning assemblies were religious in nature, but not particularly preachy, no biblical reciting or anything. I was taught by a mixture of priests, nuns, ex-nuns and regulars. The priests let us swear but not blaspheme, the nuns were pretty cool.

1. Science was all taught by regulars and there was never any encroachment of religion into science (evolution is fact, etc). I'm sure this is just coincidence - not suggesting a Catholic nun can't teach science properly.

2. RE classes (compulsory) were twice a week and divided into two sections: gospel studies and social studies. The gospel component was literally "What Mark said", so it was a no-brainer exam - read the stories the night before, regurgitate as necessary. The social studies component was focussed a little on other religions (compare and contrast) and about two standard ethical questions; in my group, abortion and euthanasia. Although I didn't really agree with most of what we were taught for this, it's fair to say we were taught that "XYZ is what Catholics believe" rather than "This is right". I didn't believe what I was writing in the exam but I wasn't going to fail on principle!

3. Social development stuff (sex ed, etc) was dealt with as and when necessary in biology or in form class. We learned all about contraception. No discussion of homosexuality that I remember.

I went into school an atheist and came out an atheist. I wouldn't send my child to a Catholic school though, although I understand why my parents did. I can't imagine a situation where it might be the only option.

Delirium

I went to a RCC primary school. Religion was part of every day, but that being said the teacher influenced to what extent. Obviously first class and sixth class had a lot of the year given over to communion/confirmation preparation.

In addition to that, the first Friday of every month meant a minimum of an hour for the monthly confession in the local church.

I then went to the Christian Brothers for secondary school. Lots of religious icons throughout the school, but beyond the Brothers or religion teacher there wasn't really any overtly religious teachers.

Two of the things that annoyed me about the schools was the total lack of information/education about other religions or any form of sex education.

Sonics2k

I was barred from Religion class in 5th year because I kept pointing out the contradictions in the Bible.

Also because our Religion teacher also happened to be the school chaplain, who was supposed to teach us about various religions, and not just her biased opinion.

As an example, she'd refer to the Hare Krishna's as "Harry Krisnus", and that Scientology was based purely on science and atheist agenda to take over Hollywood and the media.

seamus

koth wrote: »

I went to a RCC primary school. Religion was part of every day, but that being said the teacher influenced to what extent. Obviously first class and sixth class had a lot of the year given over to communion/confirmation preparation.

In addition to that, the first Friday of every month meant a minimum of an hour for the monthly confession in the local church.

I then went to the Christian Brothers for secondary school. Lots of religious icons throughout the school, but beyond the Brothers or religion teacher there wasn't really any overtly religious teachers.

Two of the things that annoyed me about the schools was the total lack of information/education about other religions or any form of sex education.

I would have a similar experience. Plenty of religion, but zero information about religions outside of Catholicism, never mind outside of Christianity.

Both my primary and secondary schools were run by the Carmelites. Decent enough folk in hindsight, can't remember any complete bastards. Me and one priest never saw eye-to-eye and I still consider him to be a prick, but that was a personality clash unrelated to who he was or what he did. Most other people loved him.

But yeah, overall there was a relatively large amount of religion in primary - taking time out of the school day to attend mass on any "holy" day (10 a year?), prayers at the start and end of the day, entire weeks devoted to preparing for communion and confirmation, but it was never really forced; it didn't have to be, everyone was Catholic.

Secondary would have been similar with some "mandatory" masses up until 3rd year, and I think two religion classes per week. Initially religion classes were about niche aspects of the christian faith (learning about Isiah or someone) before they just became a doss class with a video or a bit of chatting and loosely religious-related talks about ethics with the priest.

After 3rd year they tried to approach it from a more holistic point-of-view, going on "retreats" to a cabin in the Wicklow mountains to discuss God for the day, and later breaking us down into groups of four or five to sit around having "frank" discussions about God.
They ended up being not that frank because when I told one of the highly religious teachers that I was no longer Catholic because it was just a big old load of nonsense, I was met with a very cold response for the rest of the year.
By 6th year, religion was firmly demoted to the doss class and you used it to finish off assignments, or in some cases to sell drugs.

There was still the occasional "mandatory" mass all the way through secondary, but by 4th year I had stopped getting the eurcharist and just switching off and nobody blinked.
Although oddly I managed to get a reputation as being quite religious at the end of sixth year because I started playing guitar in church out of sheer boredom (I got to take the last class off on Thursday) and because I heard there were girls in it.

If the Internet had been as readily accessible and widely used when I started secondary school as it is today, I imagine I would have been a right pain in the hole for religion teachers. But as it was I generally accepted what I was told, because I had no other source of information.

Waking-Dreams

I went to a multi-denominational primary school and secondary school, though I still had to attend weekly church outside of school. We had religion class maybe twice per week in primary, reading the nice bible stories, etc., and the usual school morning assemblies with a general prayer and hymn song.

For secondary, it was just a generic prayer in the morning, with a few different ministers coming to speak at said assemblies once every month. Like many atheists, it was sometime during secondary school that I lost the faith. I think it had something to do with being exposed to other faiths. I was also part of the catholic boy scouts for a brief time in 6th class in primary school and, as such, attended a mass or two, and found the whole thing strange in comparison to the kind of church service I had always known. I think I began questioning, ‘why are there different rituals and beliefs? What makes one true over the other?’. It sort of grew from there.

MagicMarker

Went to a R.C Primary in England, lots of prayers, lots of hymn singing, a priest came in once a week to give mass, we used to go to confession in the principals office. We even got a visit from an important bishop! There was one area in a hallway that can only be described as a 'shrine' to Catholicism, due to the amount of crucifixes, pictures of The Pope/Mother Theresa etc. :eek:

There was also rating system for good behaviour, where kids were given gold stars etc, and everyone was divided into teams called Matthew, Mark, Luke & John.

TBH, it all seemed harmless at the time, and I did enjoy the hymns.

legspin

R.C. Primary in England. Great school and really good teachers. Not really hardcore as far as I can remember but it was a long time ago now.

National School here. Meh, bog standard parish school. What I would assume as the usual interference from the wizards and witchs of Taigery

Secondary. Probably the least religious catholic school in the country. Saw a priest in my class no more than 4 times in my 5 years there. No religion of any description taught to me throughout. Indeed, it was positively atheist in comparison to my sisters who went to the local convent.

marienbad

Catholic primary and secondary schools- late 50's and 60's - miserable lonely brutal violent- never fully recovered .

Daftendirekt

Primary school was quite religious, with all Confirmation/Communion prep done during class time, as well as being taken to the church now and then for mass or confession. Certain teachers insisted on saying grace before and after lunch, as well as morning and evening prayers. Two teachers insisted on stopping for the Angelus every day. Random visits from the parish priest weren't unheard of either, though he was a nice guy.

Secondary school was also pretty religious. Assemblies always started with a prayer, and students were occasionally taken to the church for mass. Junior Cert religion (not an exam subject) was fairly Catholic oriented, though I don't remember much about it. Leaving Cert religion (also non-exam) was interesting. Every couple of months we'd change to a different teacher to cover a different topic. This attempted to be fairly neutral, though I remember the World Religions teacher put his own, "this is what they believe and it's just as valid as Catholicism wink-wink" spin on it. There was also a pointless Scripture module and a sort Ethics one, where we'd pretty much spend the class discussing various things (from a secular perspective).

highlydebased

Don't remember much about primary school, plenty of masses etc though. The usual, too young to know any better

Went to a CBS secondary school but never once saw a christian brother there. There used be prayers said over the intercom by the principal. Some of the teachers I had, particularly for the leaving told us they themselves were militant atheists. There was religion 3 times a week I think. It was awful up to the junior cert, we had one particular teacher who used make us write out bits of the bible she thought were "important for us". In TY and leaving cert religion was pretty much a watch movies class, I think we watched Die Hard at one stage =D I think we talked about stuff like the death penalty. I also remember them talking about sex at one stage.

In fairness most the religion teachers were mindful of the fact that many in the class were godless beyond brainwashing so there was little or none of it generally. Except for one sub teacher we had who was a strict creationist, and tried to peddle her beliefs but that didn't last terribly long

There was a religious retreat in 1st year which I didn't go on =D I think they climbed croagh patrick too, I happened to be going to Spain that week =D

I went in fairly godless but came out highly atheist.

Beruthiel

Sisters of Mercy (my arse) for both primary and secondary.
Apart from one nun, the rest were a bunch of bitches.
Fear ruled the day.
It was a time when they had free rein to beat you if they saw fit, which they did, regularly.
One cow had a lump of wood a yard long which she would swing at you from a height.
One example in 3rd class, during sewing class, she caught me with the sewing needle in my left hand, I got beaten for that as I should have been sewing with my right hand.

Religion was daily. Everything was to be learned off by heart.
Fear of what could be done to you made sure you never questioned anything.
School was a thoroughly awful experience and I felt like a prisoner set free on the day I left for good.

Ghost Buster

I went to a very very rural primary school in deepest dark North Mayo. It had two rooms. One for Baby (Junior) Infants up to First class and another for Second up to Sixth class.
The first room was run by a psycho woman who revelled in the hell fire and brimstone/ fear based strain of Irish catholicism. She was like a character from a Jon B Keane play. She actually pulled the trick of offering money to any child who could hold their finger in a candle flame for ten seconds as a way to demonstrate how hell would fell when we all inevitable ended up there. She also battered most of the kids on a regular basis !

The second room was run by a guy who had trained to be a priest, was briefly in the Christian Brothers but , and I surmise, was too trendy and radical thinking for either of those institutions. He was a bit more easy going than his counterpart but we still had prayers several times per day along with regular hymn singing sessions as he fancied himself as a folk mass tenor.

My secondary school , which is now officially non denominational interestingly enough, merely went through the motions required in the 80's. Other than watered down religion class we had occasional school masses. AS the schools best guitarist;) I got to play at all of these belting out such classics as "Though the mountains may fall" "Freely' and "Walk in in the light" and found this a great way to pick up girls.

Ghost Buster

Beruthiel wrote: »

Sisters of Mercy (my arse) for both primary and secondary.
Apart from one nun, the rest were a bunch of bitches.
Fear ruled the day.
It was a time when they had free rein to beat you if they saw fit, which they did, regularly.
One cow had a lump of wood a yard long which she would swing at you from a height.
One example in 3rd class, during sewing class, she caught me with the sewing needle in my left hand, I got beaten for that as I should have been sewing with my right hand.

Religion was daily. Everything was to be learned off by heart.
Fear of what could be done to you made sure you never questioned anything.
School was a thoroughly awful experience and I felt like a prisoner set free on the day I left for good.

Sound like mine!!!

sbsquarepants

I opted out of religion in first year after a brief spell of verbal abuse from a particularly nasty nun! I was always very sceptical even from a young age and she didn't like me asking questions or pointing out plot holes in her "factual" stories. One day she instructed the class to laugh at me, cos i was going to burn for eternity (while i stood on the bold spot for my sins!), i pointed out that that sounded very unchristian to me and therefore i'd most likely be burning next to her, walked out and refused to sit the class again. I can't for the life of me remember her name now though, it'll probably come back to me. Lets just call her sister cunty:mad:

Funnily enough my favourite teacher was also a nun, sister Angela, she thought me history and was an absolutely lovely, sweet, friendly and caring woman, in fact the only teacher i stayed in contact with after school. She was a brilliant teacher who happened to be a nun as opposed to the other bitch who was very much nun first, teacher second if she could be described as a teacher at all.

robindch

Ended up going to four primary schools in Killarney in the 1970's. Junior and senior infants was in a convent populated by peculiar nuns of whom I recall little; unlike the light-green/soylent green corridors and classrooms and frustrated, angry nunny teachers that the upper classes had, the JI and SI classes were bright places taught by a warm, lively, decent lay teacher (I found out a few months ago that she retired last year and lives next door to a friend of mine; small world).

When time came for first class, the boys were kicked permanently out of the convent school for some reason, so we all started in the nearby new "christian brothers" monastery school, aka the "new mon", doing first and second class there with two lay teachers whose names and achievements are well lost in the mists of time. The new mon's headmaster was a CB with a well-known vicious streak and all I recall of him and indeed, my main memory of that school, is fear of being assaulted, painfully.

Third and fourth class happened in the "old mon" version of the same CB school, across the road from the new one where we had two male lay teachers, both former county-level GAA players with a sense of humor. Religion certainly existed in the old mon, but I don't recall it being anything other than perfunctory at best; occasional discussions about the difference between venial and mortal sins, nothing about sex, prayers all the time, but no angst about them. I think I did first communion in that school; at a ceremony presided over by none other than Bishop Eamonn Casey (I'd give a lot to hear again the sermon he must have delivered to us all that day). I also recall endless training for first communion, and as the day drew near, the dry runs in Killarney's rather magnificent cathedral, where we'd form a long line from one side of the church to the other and a priest or teacher would walk the line, simulating the priest by pressing his soon-wet thumb onto the tongue of each child in turn. Even at the age of seven or eight, you could see that there was something faintly revolting about it all.

Fifth and sixth classes happened in a new co-ed school on the other side of town, much nearer where we lived at the time and we had the same teacher for those two years. I recall him as an interesting guy, but with unforgivable nationalist tendencies which had him deliver the desperately one-sided version of history that you'd expect in that time and in that place. He was unstable too, and from time to time, he would scream mid-level profanities, in my memory red-faced and foaming at the mouth, at ten-year olds; on one occasion, I recall him throwing one of those large plastic set squares used for drawing on the blackboard, at one of the girls in the class; she managed to duck in time and the thing smashed into a thousand pieces which showered the classroom with shards of broken plastic; heaven knows what would have happened he'd connected; certainly she'd have been hospitalized if not worse. Religion was by rote with that guy, learning by heart a bunch of useless prayers and now that the memory comes back, I recall that there was nothing that would enrage him more effectively than somebody fluffing a religious line. I still remember being sent up the headmaster (one of two times in the two years at that school), for forgetting the last line of the "Hail Holy Queen" prayer.

Secondary school was in a boarding-school in a monastery; mandatory prayers twice a day, morning and evening; grace before and after the three daily meals; mandatory mass on Sundays; religion classes four/five times a week; but for all of that, it was a fairly liberal place and I suspect that at least some of the monks were closet atheists and many, perhaps most, of them did not toe the Vatican line.

In all of the above, there wasn't much supremacism or the kind of catholic-chest thumping that I've seen in other places. Yes, a lot of it was inward-looking, near-horizon, boxed-in and fearful thinking, but that was as much a feature of the country at the time generally, as much as it was caused by, or perhaps a cause of, the Vatican's influence on the Ireland of the time.

UDP

Full catholic primary school where I learned the answer to important questions like "Who is god?". I always found it strange that I was given and had to repeat the answers word for word exactly as they were in the book. Didn't do a lot of questioning back then just accepted that was the way it was.

When I got to secondary school (catholic school with a few priest teachers) things changed a lot. The longer I was in the school the more I resented catholicism and was pissed off that I was forced to listen to such tripe without choice.

Then there was the forced to attend retreats some in the school, some in retreat locations. The first one I got through but after that I never lasted longer than an hour before being thrown out. I couldn't grasp how anyone could take the stuff seriously so all my answers to the "serious" discussion questions were just jokes - some good ones and some very insulting ones (to the staunch catholics giving the retreat sessions).

I think the amount of forcedness made me resent catholicism for what it was to me - forced indoctrination and frankly ludacris.

Beruthiel

robindch wrote: »

When time came for first class, the boys were kicked permanently out of the convent school for some reason, so we all started in the nearby new "christian brothers" monastery school

That happened where I come from too.
Odin help those poor lads. A 'christian' brother later had 109 charges against him for abuse. Luckily, none of my cousins were among them.
He liked to pick on the weak ones apparently.

swiftblade

Primary school for me was a mixed bag. I had some great teachers who thought religion, but not in a heavy or brainwashy manner. To be honest I think most of them didn't really care too much about it. I went to a National School by the way.

However, during the space of I think maybe 2 years, we had this crazy parish priest. He would always just burst into the class uninvited and start rambeling on about his time in Japan or Africa. Although, it was funny seeing the teacher's eyes roll as he entered.
It was weird though. I remember one time he tried to teach us Japaneese (to a buch of 7/8 year olds) . He was then "transfared" out of the parish and we never heard from him again.

Secondary school was worse, probably because I was going through the whole rebelious phase. It didn't help that I went to a Christian Brother's school.
Anyway, the only time I remember getting into trouble over religion was when I was in 5th Year. It was a school mass or something, and I didn't go up for communion. I was threatened to be expelled by the religion teacher, but thankfully the principle saw sence. The scary thing is, that this is only about 4 years ago.

Apart from that though it was just the usual crap I had to put up with. The religion teacher I had for a while was a strong Catholic that made her views felt.

Oh, just remembered another one. She decided to do this werid experiment thing one day (Hang in there, it's not as weird as it sounds ), in which, what we would do if a plane crashed and we were left with 5 survivors, but only space for 4 on a raft. Being the stupid person I am, I said I would throw the person overboard with the least chance of survival. She didn't like that.

But yea. I actually liked school. The whole religion aspect wasn't that bad. But it could have been better.

Sarky

Primary school was pretty religious. No priests actually taught, but there were a few older women who were quite zealous. There were certainly a few slaps thrown around in the earlier days, but after the oldest of them retired there was nothing done to us our parents wouldn't have also done. The parish priest would call around regularly, asking questions and expecting answers we had to learn by rote, with no deviation or questioning allowed. Plenty of time spent learning songs, which were all religious. I kept wondering why we were learning all this bollocks when there were clearly people having trouble with basic mathematics and English.

Secondary school was St. Joseph's College, Ballinasloe. An odd place, that. The best science teacher I ever had was a priest, but the "ethos", if the word was being knocked around all in the early 90's, was very catholic. It annoyed absolutely everyone when the midday class was interrupted for the sodding angelus, but of course there wasn't a hope you could just not take part. Plenty of classes were shanghai'd for masses, too, where we were essentially bullied into singing hymns.Oh, not to mention the compulsory rtreats and guest talks from those abstinence groups with those teenagers with that creepy middle distance stare they all get when they find Jesus.

Religion classes were just bizarre, ranging from the cranky old fire-and-brimstone guys to the angel-worshipping hippy lady to the old guy who would talk about Medjugorje and fairy rings and alcohol addiction. and of course there were always rumours of what priests got up to in boarding schools. I don't recall any scandals in that regard, but I'm glad I got to go home every day, in any case.

It could have been worse, I mean there could have been regular beatings, but it was still pretty bad.

sunbeam

I'm starting to think I got off very lightly here.

Primary for me (late 70s to mid 80s) was also a small two room school in rural Mayo staffed by lay teachers. I think we were one of the first years to do the Children of God programme, which looking back on it seems very hippy inspired-all caring and sharing, peace and love. I have fond memories of our May altars and us all pretending to be trees, waving our arms about as we prayed.

In third class a mission came to the parish and they had a special mass for us kids. Again it was all very non threatening and child centred. I remember the priest telling us that hell was like a buffet where everyone had long chopsticks attached to their arms that prevented them from eating anything. Heaven was the same but everyone helped each other out and fed each other. We all got copies of the New Testament to read by ourselves. It was then that I really started to question things.

Secondary was a VEC school where religion really wasn't taken very seriously. We were supposed to have two classes a week but one was given over to extra maths and we never got it back. In first year we had a young priest who couldnt really be bothered and spent most of the time showing us videos, including Rambo at one point. After him came an elderly nun, who had us memorising tracts of the catechism 1930s style. She was replaced by a young science teacher who more or less admitted she was only teaching religion because she couldn't get a job teaching her main subjects and didn't really believe any of it. I don't remember any religion classes in my leaving cert year. Was genuinely shocked when I went to college and met friends who went to convent schools and had prayers before every class etc.

JuliusCaesar

Church of Ireland primary school. Used to win the Religion prize every year. Mostly learned Bible stories, Old and New Testaments. Can still recite bits. Didn't believe it, and won the prize - I think - because it was all new to me, and thus interesting, whereas my classmates all went to Sunday School and Girls Brigade. (I've no idea if they did any religion in GB, it all looked like a lot of fun with gymnastics and balloon bursting.)

Catholic lay secondary school. Had to have been the least Catholic school ever. I opted out of religion class by saying it was against my principles (actually because it was really boring and full of RC dogma.) They bent over backwards to facilitate me - I don't even remember the school requiring any contact with my parents.

First job: told them I was Jewish and took a bunch of "religious holidays" off.

That was 60s, 70s. So Ireland wasn't entirely all of a oneness when it came to religion.

Roger Hassenforder

Went to a Redemptorist school in limerick, staffed by what I can only describe as gentle souls, one even was nicknamed Santa. They were what you'd imagine 'men of god' should be according to their belief system. We were encouraged to find our way in life. I found my way all right, and still enjoy some theological banter with them. I'm a little bit proud to see some of them incurring the wrath of Benny and his cronies.
Had my worst experiences in schools when I was teaching with nuns. Evil incarnate some of them

Northclare

School for me was a mixed bag really.
I liked English, I was a bit out there so I never conformed like the other kids to doing what we were meant to be doing.
So my essays were very interesting, full of adventure joy and cataclysm

I had a few resentments with the system and some teacher's,but sure who hadn't.
I never bothered learning the religious stuff off by heart, I just placed my bet's on not being asked to recite.

I always walked home the scenic route,clambering over rocks getting my shoes wet, collecting strange thing's like glass bouy's,strange shells,all sorts of objects.

Had the odd fight "what boy didn't fight"

I spent a lot of time enjoying the outdoors and got told off often enough for staring out the window.

I loved drawing,on Fridays we did art,so I would draw pictures of 2000 AD characters,people fishing,and landscapes.

We had these Folens soft back booklets I loved those they were very insightful especially the ones about castles,old trades like Black Smith's, old farming techniques and legends.

I loved Christmas in school too.

But I over all school was ok....

Daemonic

Primary school was a 'Christian' Brothers. Although there were only 2 CBs teaching, what they lacked in numbers they made up for through their great enthusiasm for being sadistic <insert rude word of choice>. One was the headmaster who during one Assembly in the schoolyard ripped an earring from some unfortunates ear and the ultimate fear was being sent to his office as he had a nasty contraption made up of a few rulers tied together. Edge onto the hand it pinched viciously.
The other kept a bamboo cane outside his classroom and woe betide anyone who had to go outside to experience that. More than one parent marched into the school to him confront over punishment handed out with that.

Secondary by comparison was pretty benign. Religion class once or twice a week with the local Fr. Trendy. Although I do recall an 'intervention' after I mentioned I didn't get the whole organised religion thing. Fr. Trendy and the headmaster having a serious chat with me. I couldn't atriculate my reasons as well as I'd have liked as i was still at the lots of questions, few answer stage but once I made it clear I wasn't changing my mind that was that.

smithcity

I went to RCC primary and secondary schools, in primary school I was still quite devout so can't speak to the school's attitude towards non believer, it wasn't until 2nd or 3rd year of secondary school that I began to opt out of religion.

My experience was pretty good, I didn't opt out of religion class because it wasn't a catechism type thing, but rather taught about many religions and cultures, so I found that useful. The school had many masses and religious observances which I did not want to take part in, but all I had to do was have a quiet word with any teacher and I was free not to attend.

The only slightly negative experience I had was in 6th year when all the students were expected to attend an overnight religious retreat before exams. The principal came to my class to see why some students had not paid the fee for the retreat. He asked the people who had not paid to stand up, and then one by one asked us all why we hadn't done so. When he got to me, I said that I didn't want to go on the retreat. When he asked why not, I was a little flustered and blurted out, "I don't believe in god."

It was a little uncomfortable to have to do in front of everyone, but in another way it was quite good. The principal said, "Well, that's ok. We're not going to shove religion down your throat like they did in my day."
I never felt any degree of judgement from anybody and wasn't subjected to any kind of proselytizing.

Hotblack Desiato

Ghost Buster wrote: »

He was a bit more easy going than his counterpart but we still had prayers several times per day along with regular hymn singing sessions as he fancied himself as a folk mass tenor.

Two words guaranteed to strike terror - Folk Mass :eek:

The infamous Fr Sean Fortune was into that sort of thing. Was actually made to go to one of his masses in 84 or 85 when we were on holiday down there (didn't mass on holiday suck ten times more than mass at home? But Ma, we're on holiday ) - I thought he looked dead creepy... turned out my spidey sense was right.

"Walk in in the light"

A kid in primary school always used to try to crack everyone up when we were made sing that, by singing 'walk in the sh**e' just loud enough for the teacher not to hear

Heard a few years back he got ten in the Joy for possession of heroin with intent to supply...


As for my school experience, 75-78 was the Sisters of Charity and there is only one I remember, a particularly vicious whiskery old bitch who used to swing the leather around for fun. She seemed to have a particular interest in our class and although she didn't teach she was always shadowing us. I remember at age 4 or 5 being leathered by her for no reason, then she stopped, a brief barely audible sorry, and leathered the boy next to me she'd also go swinging the leather walking down the corridor and if you weren't lined up right up against the wall you'd get the leather in the bare calf - short trousers then! Needless to say we were all terrified of her. Even my very religious mother gave out about her, once, back home, I'd been taken out of school one day to buy a communion suit, probably the only feckin' day of primary school I ever missed and for a religious reason and this oul biddy still gave out to my poor mam about it.

They still did the 'penny for the black babies' every week then. Remembering that f'kin ages you...

Then the CBS primary across the road 78-83. There was one mass a term I think, and a confession before the class mass.

One time, 3rd class I think, we were all assembled in the hall to watch a film about the 'missions'. Oooh look at the dark kids, laugh at their native ways, how lucky they are to have the civilising influence of the white man and his religious salvation, sort of thing :rolleyes: There was never another assembly in either primary or secondary.

When we were in 4th or 5th class they built a little chapel in the grounds and some poor saps actually used to turn up at 8am to go to daily mass before school :rolleyes: even then I thought that was going way too far

When we were in 6th class there was an oddball head brother, very Vatican II peace and love hippy type which really didn't fit in with the conformity and brutality ethos. Late in 6th class year, everyone got called in to his office one by one and made sit on his knee :eek: he asked me if I would consider becoming a CB and I said I'd think about it... naive as we were this just felt wrong. maybe we should get Sean Brady to ask him if he became stiff during these chats

Secondary CBS 83-88 : there was a rumour going around that one of the science teachers was a Protestant or possibly even a Jew, that's how wild it was :rolleyes: I don't recall more than one class mass a year and some had permission not to go. After the 'inter' the confession before the mass was optional, don't remember before that. There was only one brother who ever taught our class, Commerce in 1st year, if you got your debit mixed up with your credit you got leathered He disappeared halfway through first year and the consensus among us was that it was either the drying out clinic or the loony bin.

{Edit: the career 'guidance' CB was an alcoholic chain-smoker with bright yellow fingers, whose big idea for getting a job in the 80s was making sure you put the stamp on the envelope the right way up. I am not making this up.}

Religion wise, things were a lot more low key in 'seco' but there was the odd lay teacher who'd give you a religious rant when you least expected it, half of an English class was memorably taken up one day by a rant against the evils of condoms
There was a history teacher who talked about Petrarch and humanism and Martin Luther's theses but we were too thick or naive to get that she was trying to hint that catholicism was full of s**t

Religion class got increasingly less serious and the teachers assigned to it got increasingly more apathetic. One time we spend a couple of weeks watching Escape to Victory on VHS in 'religion' class. Another time there was a current affairs quiz

There was a retreat once, think it was 6th year as one of the repeat students was there, he dropped LSD the first night and the CB in charge had his 'the power of christ compels thee' moment in the sun ranting at him mid-trip.

TBH I don't think the whole lot of them could've done more to turn me off religion for life!

iguana

I went to 3 different primary schools. The first was a convent school, and the second two national schools. In the first two there was lots of religion but I didn't really think anything of it. It was a class I did and obviously if it was being taught in school it was a factual subject that I wanted to do well in. In the convent school my main teacher was a nun but she was very nice and a good teacher who would take the time to ensure all the kids were working at a pace that suited them. The second school I went to was a fantastic school with a brilliant principle but as a new school it had lots of church involvement and I remember absolutely adoring the parish priest, who had a (completely innocent) soft spot for me. I was devastated when he moved parish and cried all through the special school mass to see him off. I was a very devout little thing, I 100% believed what we were taught in religion class, just as I believed everything from school.

The last primary school was weird, really, really odd. I honestly think it's some sort of dumping ground for mentally ill people with B.Eds. There were a few normal teachers there but so many of them were and still are utterly nuts. As a national school none of the teachers were clergy but plenty were extremely religious. In that school we had 3 Jehovah's Witness kids who were well treated but they must have sat out at least 1 third of the school day as in addition to religion lessons, so much of the English and Irish books were full of religious stories. In some ways having those kids in the class made most of us glad to be Catholic as JWs aren't allowed to accept gifts for celebrations and didn't get Christmas and birthday presents which sounds utterly hellish to most kids. We envied them getting to do art or read books during certain lessons but it didn't seem like a good trade-off for missing out on presents.

It was while at this school that I learned my dad was not Catholic (by belief, he was raised as one) because our second class teacher, drilled it into us that if you didn't believe in God and Jesus and didn't go to mass (or Kingdom Hall - she didn't want to discriminate against the JW kids) every week, you would go to hell. My dad didn't go to mass so I asked him that night if he believed in God and he told me that he might, he wasn't sure. I worriedly asked him if he believed in Jesus and he told me no, that there might have been a person called Jesus but that he certainly wasn't God's special son. He told me he was something that I heard as an Egg-nostic and when I told me teacher she laughed at me and said she'd never heard of such a religion and that he must like chickens. (Which actually he did.) I was gutted and spent ages worried about my dad ending up in hell being tortured forever.

Obviously a lot of 6th class was spent on confirmation preparation. I remember once walking back from church and my teacher asking me if I actually wanted to make it. I thought it was a genuine question and thought about it before answering as it was the first time I'd ever been asked if I wanted to take part in a religious event rather than it being inevitable. It shook my world a bit but as I started to respond she told me that if I did I better behave better in church next lesson. I still don't know what misbehaving I'm supposed to have done. But weirdly enough it was actually at that point that I really started to question religion and whether I believed it. I knew I really wanted the nice outfit and the money I'd be getting but I started to realise that was all I actually cared about.

In secondary I was at a girls convent school. The principle and the librarian were the only nuns, all other teachers were lay but again some of them were fanatical about religion. We had religion lessons every day, prayers over the intercom in the morning and at mid-day and numerous masses throughout the year. As I started secondary I would have considered myself Catholic but as the years went on I decided I didn't like the church itself. This was at the time of the truth about the abuse perpetrated by in schools, orphanages and laundries coming out, so there was a lot of disillusionment about the church. In 2nd/3rd year we had a religion teacher who was actually a young geography teacher who got stuck with a religion class due to scheduling. She was clearly not very Catholic and would allow proper debate on the teachings of the church. I remember when the X-case and abortion referendum was happening she was even badgered into admitting that she was pro-choice but asked us not to tell anyone she admitted that as she'd be fired. In 5th year we had a teacher who was an unseated senator who was very feminist and used to teach women's studies and civics as non-exam subjects. It's pretty much impossible to teach a feminist course that complies with church teaching, so combined with the current affairs at the time whatever faith I had left was being eroded. Also at this time we had a very devout religious teacher who would regularly make us listen to Charlie Landsborough's My Forever Friend on a loop for 40 minutes while we thought about the message. I can't imagine anything more likely to create enthusiastic Satanists, nevermind atheists.

Yet we had no room within the school to exercise any loss of faith. Prayers were mandatory, church attendance was mandatory, overnight religious retreats were mandatory. Not attending would lead to serious trouble that qualified as out and out bullying. I remember an ongoing war between my 6th year art teacher and two non-Catholic girls as they would stand up quietly during prayers but not clasp their hands, despite the fact that their parents had made it clear they didn't want them to participate in any religious activity. I also found that children of a specific religion would have their faith respected but children of no faith would be bullied and badgered into participating. And when they still refused would take their ire out on them by being overly critical of their class work and behaviour.

I would honestly not be comfortable with my children being in a religious school based on my experiences. I don't want them worried that their dad and I will be spending an eternity in hell based on what their teacher tells them. I don't want to confuse them by telling them they should listen to their teacher and learn from him/her, except for about X,Y and Z. I don't want there to be a resumption of a long running battle every time they get a new teacher who thinks he/she can convert them or who takes their lack of faith (upbringing at least) as a personal affront and bullys them in other subtle ways because they can't convert them.

Fenian Army

I enjoyed religion classes, was one of my fave tbh, always loved hearing bible stories. I had lovely teachers though.

In secondary I liked religion too, it was mainly learning about others.

The priest we had in the school was and still is, a great man. One of the best, most passionate teachers I've ever had(Music and Classical studies), a sound man to boot.

I'm kind of taken aback listening about all these "overnight religious retreats"
things are worse than I'd thought
where would ye go on these retreats? what if you didn't get parental permission? did you have to pay for them as well? what was involved?

iguana

ninja900 wrote: »

Secondary CBS 83-88 : there was a rumour going around that one of the science teachers was a Protestant or possibly even a Jew, that's how wild it was :rolleyes: I don't recall more than one class mass a year and some had permission not to go. After the 'inter' the confession before the mass was optional, don't remember before that. There was only one brother who ever taught our class, Commerce in 1st year, if you got your debit mixed up with your credit you got leathered He disappeared halfway through first year and the consensus among us was that it was either the drying out clinic or the loony bin.

Or perhaps he was fired for hitting students. Corporal punishment in schools was banned while you were in primary school.

This regulation was circulated by John Boland, Minister for Education, Republic of Ireland to all schools on January 26, 1982, and took effect almost immediately, on February 1, 1982.

1. Teachers should have a lively regard for the improvement and general welfare of their pupils, treat them with kindness combined with firmness and should aim at governing them through their affections and reason and not by harshness and severity. Ridicule, sarcasm or remarks likely to undermine a pupil's self-confidence should not be used in any circumstances.
2. The use of corporal punishment is forbidden.
3. Any teacher who contravenes sections (1) or (2) of this rule will be regarded as guilty of conduct unbefitting a teacher and will be subject to severe disciplinary action.

It honestly never ceases to amaze me how many teachers were still hitting students and getting away with it long after it was banned. I started school in Feb 1982 and my parents made it clear to me that teachers were not allowed to hit and if they did I was to tell them straight away and they would take care of it. I never saw a child being hit in school by a teacher except for once when it happened by accident and even then the boy's mother was in the next day to make sure it didn't happen again.

Fenian Army

We went on religion trips, to see Plunketts head, visit shrines, Glendalough and stuff like that. Only overnight one was to climb Croagh Patrick.

We just paid for the bus... Everyone enjoyed them as far as I remember.

smithcity

bluewolf wrote: »

I'm kind of taken aback listening about all these "overnight religious retreats"
things are worse than I'd thought
where would ye go on these retreats? what if you didn't get parental permission? did you have to pay for them as well? what was involved?

Since I didn't go the details are kind of fuzzy. I can't remember where it was to but everyone was expected to attend, I think I'm the only one in my class who didn't. As for the fee, it may have only been for the bus, I don't remember it being extravagant.
The students who went on the retreat had a mass, group exercises and meditations and a lot of prayer.

iguana

bluewolf wrote: »

I'm kind of taken aback listening about all these "overnight religious retreats"
things are worse than I'd thought
where would ye go on these retreats? what if you didn't get parental permission? did you have to pay for them as well? what was involved?

Mine was in Galway in 6th year. It was 2 nights long and cost IR£22, in 1996. People who pleaded hardship could go for half price. I really, really didn't want to go and my parents were seriously struggling at the time and did not have £11 to spare. I refused to pay and after about 3 weeks of battle in front of the whole 6th year, they decided I would be sent for free. I was gutted.

Two girls (the ones from the art class issues) didn't go. One was from a Baptist sect and the other was non-religious but pretended to be CoE as it was easier. Their parents didn't give them permission to go but like with me it was an ongoing battle for weeks, in front of everyone, as the school applied lots of pressure to them and sent letter after letter home about it.

The retreat consisted of group bonding exercises, prayer and meditation (supposedly to prep us for our leaving certs), nature walks and lots and lots and lots of talks by youth workers about how we should not have sex outside of marriage, should not be gay (it's a choice) and should not use contraceptives as when we were married and having sex the rhythm method would suffice,* and the event ended with a big group mass.

*I'm not sure if the school actually knew about this as the one thing I would never fault them for was realistic sex education as they were faultless in this regard including arranging a 2 day seminar on birth control and weekly health classes in 5th year that realistically dealt with the emotional side of sexual relationships.

smithcity

iguana wrote: »

... I don't want to confuse them by telling them they should listen to their teacher and learn from him/her, except for about X,Y and Z.

I know it's just one small point taken out of context but I have to say, it's not all bad. I remember when I was young, I had a teacher who, when confronted with a question he couldn't answer, would invent one. There were times when he would tell us things that I knew were wrong (I'm not speaking of religion specifically, any topic was ripe for BS).
For me it was an early eye opener that my "elders and betters" were fallible, capable of getting things wrong, and not always teaching information that was true. It led me to understand that I couldn't just believe everything I was told, and taught me the value of independent learning.

Ghost Buster

ninja900 wrote: »

The infamous Fr Sean Fortune!

OFF topic form a mo.
I lived in a basement flat in rathmines during my student years and used to have to pop up stairs to use the phone and would regularly meet a priest on the landing who gave me the willies (Not in that way).
Years later I recognised him as the one and only Mr Fortune.

Temptamperu

In primary, we started the day with a prayer, followed by classes till 11 at which point we learned of Jesus. Mostly the stories of his magic tricks. I got kicked out of class for saying he was almost like Gandalf
Mostly church was a place where i giggled with friends and we tried to make a laugh out of confessionals by coming up with the worst lie/stories to shovk the priest.
Secondary school was a priest teaching us, the whole class just took the piss out of him and i dont remember a single lesson.
Some people have horrible tales of abuse but i being a child born in the 80's when their reach wasn't as long as they would of liked. By the age of around 8 i knew it was a load of old bollox. still forced into conformation and communion which was just a giggle where i got a load of money.

odonopenmic

Particularly bad experience in Secondary School and I was a Celtic Tiger graduate so I had thought that it would have died down a bit!

The maths teacher also taught religion. In a debate on the Mother and Child Scheme (which he walked out of in protest at our 'blaspheming'), it became apparent that I was atheist.

The next day and for there on after in maths class, he refused to answer any questions I had and even told the 'heretic' (me) to put down her hand. What an ar$e! I had to drop down to pass maths because of his antics.

Himself a few buddies on the staff used to amuse themselves by ripping the horroscope pages out of our teen mags saying they were the 'work of the devil'.

I'd love to say that it was just this guy and his posse but unfortunately, it permeated the whole school and even the punishments meted out were sufficiently humiliating to resemble a thoroughly Catholic ethos (e.g. a girl's shoes confiscated off her feet in front of 200 pupils and replaced with the most godawful nuns shoes).

Personally, under pain of a two-hour round trip commute, I would not send my kids to a demoninational school, given the experiences I had. However, I understand that it many instances it's not a simple as this, be it for time, money, family, whatever issues so best to be very acquainted with the school and staff you're considering.

Undergod

In secondary school, on Ash Wednesdays we had to go across the road to mass or take detention. When we came back we were free to buy sausages from the school kitchenette.

That annoyed me.

rainbow kirby

Went to a Catholic all-girls secondary school in south Dublin, did my LC 10 years ago. Plenty of teachers who liked to start class with a prayer (even for totally unrelated subjects), morning prayer over the intercom at 10.15 every day, still a few aging Sisters of Mercy around the place. There was one nice religion teacher (who did most of the relationship and social-type classes), the rest were either the Youth 2000/folk mass type or else pretty hardcore. Had a 78 year old nun teaching us in 6th year - she kicked me out of the class after a few weeks for asking a few too many awkward questions. Retreats were compulsory for all years, which were a gigantic waste of time, and were run by some nutbags. In 5th year, the retreat coordinator spent about 10 minutes praising a girl who was 6 months pregnant for not having an abortion...

I left that school swearing that if I ever have kids that they are not going anywhere near a Catholic school.

Coriolanus

Pretty good. Went to a secular primary, montessori nominally, run by local Church of Ireland worthies. Religious instruction for Catholic and CoI was done outside of class time, though on the grounds. We had a local woman teach scripture after school and only saw the parish priest during the run up to communion and confirmation. I gather something similar for the CoI kids, though I think it was a parent that taught them scripture.
Learned about religion in class though, I remember having to do a project, I did the Sikhs. But that was very much in a comparative, cultural sense.

Secondary went to a school newly taken over by the State though some of the sisters still taught and did secretarial duties. Religion class was more about ethics and morality than any outright doctrinal matters.

Attendance at masses was however compulsory and was during class time. As was receiving communion, at least it was supposed to be, I argued my way out of it from about fourth year on.

All in all, pleasant enough. Very very few instances of having anything pushed upon us, other than the mass attendance. One generally bat**** teacher made her classes pray before starting, but I'm pretty sure there was a complaint made because she stopped doing it...

uppishhauk

both the primary and secondary school i attended were catholic schools but the role that religion played in the classroom was purely down to the teachers

In primary one teacher told about how two new boys were going to be joining the class who weren't catholic and we shouldn't tease them or bully them for having the wrong religion
but the year we were to do our confirmation the school principal came to us and said that it was okay not to believe in god and if that was the case we didn't have to do the confirmation ceremony
overall there was mention of other religions but they would only teach Catholicism

In secondary school religion didn't play a big role, there was one teacher who would make everyone say prayer at the start of class,
in RE other religions were taught but not as equal a footing as catholicism