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Massive Medical Hub Kited in Health Minister O'Reillys Constituency Near Airport

  • 07-05-2012 4:12pm
    #1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭ Sponge Bob


    Who says FFers ( and Michael Lowry) have a monopoly on megalomanic construction schemes, eh!

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/500acre-hub-on-the-cards-near-airport-3101773.html
    A MASSIVE new €1.2bn medical hub with a national children's hospital and a relocated Beaumont Hospital at its core is being seriously considered by Health Minister James Reilly



    The Indo has learned the project -- mooted for a greenfield site near Dublin Airport -- is being promoted as a solution to the children's hospital headache and as a wider stimulus measure.


    The site, around the Belcamp area at the end of the M50, is being floated as a strong possibility as part of a larger health, business and education campus.


    Sources in Irish Rail also confirmed they had been tentatively approached by people from "Reilly's end" about connecting the proposed Dublin Airport Dart spur to the new campus.

    That much said it would do no harm to have a Medical 'cluster' in Dublin ...which is very much lacking criticality in that sphere compared to Galway or Cork and if an 'International Medical Services' campus/cluster were to be built it should be near the airport. This area was earmarked for a giant theme park Disney jobbie a few years ago and more recently with Europes biggest indoor ski slope or something. Glad to see the North Dublin pipedream merchants have lost none of their sang froid in recent years.

    This is not the maddest FFFG Developer Led pipedream in Irish history and is certainly far less risible than Monte Carlo sur Tipp.

    If they could kindly start with the childrens hospital ( only) in phase one please and a few Manufacturing and R&D units before they lose the run of themselves entirely. :)

    I suspect that O'Reilly will be battered with PQs and FOI requests in no time at all. Watch his answers _carefully_. :cool:


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 78,212 ✭✭✭✭ Victor


    It sounds like Indo / developer kite flying. Why would one build a semi-rural hospital when it would make much more sense to build an urban one with better links?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭ Sponge Bob


    I am minded to agree that the Chilters hospital should be near the M50.

    There is a bus every hour ( at least) to the Airport from Galway Victor. I don't care which bit of the M50 either.


  • Registered Users Posts: 78,212 ✭✭✭✭ Victor


    All well and good, but Beuamont Hospital is the main hospital for perhaps 200,000 people and there is no particular need to move it and spend an extra €700m that we don't have.

    That said, co-location is important to avoid a duplication of support services.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,673 ✭✭✭✭ Zebra3


    I read earlier that the planned hub will (if built) be outside O'Reillys constituency.

    Just.


  • Registered Users Posts: 635 ✭✭✭ Jayuu


    Firstly, I think the OP needs to revise the title of this thread because it's actually incorrect and seems to have been done to make it sound like there's a political agenda going on when nothing in the article suggests that.

    If a new hospital is being built around Belcamp then it is not in the Minister's constituency. Belcamp was moved into Dublin North-East for the previous election so it's been gone from Dublin North for quite a while now.

    The article that is linked to even points this out.
    "The new campus would be in Dublin North-East, just outside Dr Reilly's Dublin North constituency."

    Let's try and leave the politics out of the argument and discuss it on its merits. Personally I'm really not in favour of this suggestion. While I wouldn't be averse to seeing improvements in Beaumont (particularly its awful A&E department, which I have quite a lot of experience of) I think the idea of relocating it entirely is just plain madness. They've just completed a new cancer centre on the current site which must have cost millions. All of that would be wasted in a relocation project.

    I'm not convinced by the Mater location for the Children's Hospital because transport links to this part of the city centre are awful and the site is congested enough from a traffic point of view without locating a new huge hospital in the area.

    While co-location does seem to be a good idea to eliminate duplication of services it doesn't seem that any of the current hospital sites have a good enough infrastructure to cope with the addition of a major new hospital on top of them.

    Maybe in the longer term it would be better to build a new hospital on a greenfield site with room for expansion so that at a later stage you could add extra adult services to it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 78,212 ✭✭✭✭ Victor


    Jayuu wrote: »
    I'm not convinced by the Mater location for the Children's Hospital because transport links to this part of the city centre are awful and the site is congested enough from a traffic point of view without locating a new huge hospital in the area.

    While co-location does seem to be a good idea to eliminate duplication of services it doesn't seem that any of the current hospital sites have a good enough infrastructure to cope with the addition of a major new hospital on top of them.

    Maybe in the longer term it would be better to build a new hospital on a greenfield site with room for expansion so that at a later stage you could add extra adult services to it.
    Plenty of space at:

    St. James's http://binged.it/IKdGrx
    Tallaght: http://binged.it/Jsz8yV
    Blanchardstown: http://binged.it/JsziWS
    Beaumont: http://binged.it/JauqKt
    Elm Park: http://binged.it/JszCoD :pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,332 ✭✭✭ Mr Simpson


    Victor wrote: »
    It sounds like Indo / developer kite flying. Why would one build a semi-rural hospital when it would make much more sense to build an urban one with better links?

    Belcamp isn't exactly semi-rural, its about 30 seconds from the Hilton at Northern Cross, and less than 5 minutes from the M50.

    Also, wasn't this mooted a few years ago, with RCSI becoming part of DCU and moving their (RCSI not DCU) college to this site.

    Here's an Irish Times link from 2010


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭ Sponge Bob


    More here from December 2010.

    http://www.fingal-independent.ie/news/masterplan-for-belcamp-site-high-council-priority-2476738.html
    A SITE at Belcamp has been prioritised for the development of a masterplan by Fingal County Council that may clear the way for a € 750 million development with a teaching hospital for the county at its core.

    The local authority has confirmed that developing a masterplan for the site is a priority for the council once the current County Development Plan process is complete. The commitment comes in response to a motion proposed by Cllr Ciaran Byrne (Lab), who believes the site has massive potential for economic development and job creation in the county and would create 7.000 to 8,000 jobs in its construction phase alone.

    There was differing opinions in the council chamber on the readiness of the Royal College of Surgeons Ireland (RCSI) to be the anchor tenant of the site and develop a teaching hospital there.

    Cllr Byrne said he believed the Royal College did want to proceed with the project but Cllr Tom O'Leary (FG) said it was his information that the college was not 'actively supporting' the project at this time.

    Cllr Byrne outlined the possibility of a 'synergy' on the site between a teaching hospital and a research and development facility into biomedical research, linked in with work already going on in that field at Dublin City University.


  • Registered Users Posts: 288 ✭✭ n900guy


    It's complete nonsense and magic-talk, as usual (like the National Children's Hospital and other amazing projects).

    The government uses these projects to divert money to certain core support groups - developers or banks that successfully lobby for consultancy fees, etc.,. Absolutely zero will come of this.

    Why would they base themselves near Dublin? Transport is bad, shipping is limited, etc., Which is why traditionally pharma has located in Cork. Seeing as how the academic and health sectors completely obstruct modern medical research (and why Ireland no longer a base for significant medical trials) with full support from the government to keep it that way, if even one cent of the money has anything but to do with around 30-50 million euros in management consultancy and financial advise, and property assessment bolloxology, I will eat my hat. Some money will get spent, there will be project dinners, fees, advisory panels, salaries, etc., for a few years and then it will disappear.


  • Registered Users Posts: 78,212 ✭✭✭✭ Victor


    n900guy wrote: »
    Why would they base themselves near Dublin? Transport is bad, shipping is limited, etc., Which is why traditionally pharma has located in Cork.
    Eh? What does the pharmaceutical industry have to do with this thread?


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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 61,001 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    Victor wrote: »
    Plenty of space at:

    St. James's http://binged.it/IKdGrx
    Tallaght: http://binged.it/Jsz8yV
    Blanchardstown: http://binged.it/JsziWS
    Beaumont: http://binged.it/JauqKt
    Elm Park: http://binged.it/JszCoD :pac:

    Beaumont has had a LOT of building work done since those images were taken and the vast majority of that surface car parking is built on.

    The areas at Tallaght and James' are deceptively large looking from those photos. They really aren't big enough to build two new hospitals on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 78,212 ✭✭✭✭ Victor


    MYOB wrote: »
    They really aren't big enough to build two new hospitals on.
    They would only need one hospital built on them. :)

    Several of hte site have adjacent vacant sites, especially Tallaght.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 61,001 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    Victor wrote: »
    They would only need one hospital built on them. :)

    Several of hte site have adjacent vacant sites, especially Tallaght.

    One massive hospital.

    Tallaght's "vacant sites" have industrial units (many of them not vacant!) on them at the moment. Easily CPOable isn't the same as already having.

    Blanchardstown has huge swathes of land around it but the existing buildings are in very poor condition as it is.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 13,991 Mod ✭✭✭✭ monument


    Victor wrote: »
    Eh? What does the pharmaceutical industry have to do with this thread?

    From the Indo article: "The development, as envisaged, would be between 400 and 500 acres in size, and may also include pharmaceutical and IT companies and third-level institutions, with the Royal College of Surgeons of Ireland mentioned by sources."
    n900guy wrote: »
    Why would they base themselves near Dublin? Transport is bad, shipping is limited, etc., Which is why traditionally pharma has located in Cork.

    There are pharmaceutical in Dublin already! And not all parts of the industry need shipping, but the site has good access to Dublin Port and Dublin Airport!


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,188 ✭✭✭ lucernarian


    Jayuu wrote: »
    Firstly, I think the OP needs to revise the title of this thread because it's actually incorrect and seems to have been done to make it sound like there's a political agenda going on when nothing in the article suggests that.

    If a new hospital is being built around Belcamp then it is not in the Minister's constituency. Belcamp was moved into Dublin North-East for the previous election so it's been gone from Dublin North for quite a while now.

    The article that is linked to even points this out.
    "The new campus would be in Dublin North-East, just outside Dr Reilly's Dublin North constituency."

    Let's try and leave the politics out of the argument and discuss it on its merits. Personally I'm really not in favour of this suggestion. While I wouldn't be averse to seeing improvements in Beaumont (particularly its awful A&E department, which I have quite a lot of experience of) I think the idea of relocating it entirely is just plain madness. They've just completed a new cancer centre on the current site which must have cost millions. All of that would be wasted in a relocation project.

    I'm not convinced by the Mater location for the Children's Hospital because transport links to this part of the city centre are awful and the site is congested enough from a traffic point of view without locating a new huge hospital in the area.

    While co-location does seem to be a good idea to eliminate duplication of services it doesn't seem that any of the current hospital sites have a good enough infrastructure to cope with the addition of a major new hospital on top of them.

    Maybe in the longer term it would be better to build a new hospital on a greenfield site with room for expansion so that at a later stage you could add extra adult services to it.
    Not in the minister's constituency? AKA a 15 minute drive from Swords?! Many of his constituents would be delighted with him for making such a decision. But I agree in that most of the acute hospitals have inadequate space (including St. James, practically all of the campus is functioning space and it would not be easy to free up sufficient room). Tallaght and Blanchardstown are options worth considering though.


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