Another 'greatest guitarists' list... Oh wait this one's actually good!

rcaz

http://www.spin.com/articles/spins-100-greatest-guitarists-all-time?page=0

Doesn't stick to the usual suspects at all. I was reading it going, "Yeah!... Yeah!..... ****in' yeah!!". Ribot, Cline, Bailey, Greenwood, Prince, Moore, Ranaldo, Shields... A list that sees past flashy solos? Finally.

endacl

rcaz wrote: »

http://www.spin.com/articles/spins-100-greatest-guitarists-all-time?page=0

Doesn't stick to the usual suspects at all. I was reading it going, "Yeah!... Yeah!..... ****in' yeah!!". Ribot, Cline, Bailey, Greenwood, Prince, Moore, Ranaldo, Shields... A list that sees past flashy solos? Finally.

Just another dreary arbitrary list.... Only this time including more of the non-technical.

Still waiting on the definitive list-of-the-100-greatest-lists...

:-)

Malice

I got as far as Skrillex at 100 who they introduce with

...as far as we know, our asymmetrically coiffed party pal has never held a guitar in his life.

I assume based on that then that it's just a list that deliberately avoids Slash, Clapton, Hendrix etc.

karaokeman

Great to see The Edge make it in at a slick #13.

This is his best ever performance by a long shot;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTd_irMT768

Malice

While The Edge is definitely a distinctive guitarist, I can't help but think of this every time he is mentioned:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6Go2DK9VtQ

Rigsby

endacl wrote: »

Just another dreary arbitrary list....

+1....and to make it worse...."The Edge" is on it. :rolleyes:



Is there really such a thing as the "greatest" guitarist, regardless of the status of the list ?

Rigsby

Malice wrote: »

While The Edge is definitely a distinctive guitarist

Distinctive maybe, but the "greatest" albiet at #13 ???????

Malice

Rigsby wrote: »

Distinctive maybe, but the "greatest" albiet at #13 ???????

Of course he's not the greatest, I never said he was. As I wrote in my first post on this thread, the intro to #100 was enough to make me close the browser tab and get back to work. A list of 100 guitarists which starts off with someone who's not a guitar player doesn't make any sense to me.

rcaz

Malice wrote: »

A list of 100 guitarists which starts off with someone who's not a guitar player doesn't make any sense to me.

Jam Master Jay is number 10 on the list, too. I don't see any problem, Run DMC did some amazing stuff with guitars, just they weren't actually playing the guitars. Still a lot of creative work and great execution applied to the sound of a guitar.

Wile E. Coyote

Malice wrote: »

A list of 100 guitarists which starts off with someone who's not a guitar player doesn't make any sense to me.

Thats where I stopped reading.

Bullseye1

This list is a joke.

No Steve Vai, No Joe Satriani, No Steve Morse, No Michael Lee Firkins, No Stevie Ray Vaughan etc etc.

Bullseye1

Hell no Jimi Hendrix.

rcaz

Bullseye1 wrote: »

This list is a joke.

No Steve Vai, No Joe Satriani, No Steve Morse, No Michael Lee Firkins, No Stevie Ray Vaughan etc etc.

That's exactly the point, though. Read the opening paragraphs, this list isn't about that kind of guitar playing. God forbid guitar players should be rated by anything other than technical ability.

Links234

*Sees Trey Azagthoth at 90*

Squeee!!! :pac:

hidinginthebush

I was happy to see Eddie Hazel on the list, I don't think he deserves to be placed as high as number nine, but it's good to see the funk child get recognition. Still tho, Skrillex as number 100?! The list tries far too hard to be cool and non-conformist.

Also, no Jimi in the top 40 (if he even makes the list?) means the list is broken.

Wile E. Coyote

rcaz wrote: »

That's exactly the point, though. Read the opening paragraphs, this list isn't about that kind of guitar playing. God forbid guitar players should be rated by anything other than technical ability.

Sorry but the minimum basic requirement to be included on a 'Greatest Guitarist' list is that you actually play a guitar. Either that or re-name the list 'The Greatest bands/musicians to use guitars in their work but not actually play the guitar themselves'. But that name isn't as catchy.

kunst nugget

rcaz wrote: »

That's exactly the point, though. Read the opening paragraphs, this list isn't about that kind of guitar playing. God forbid guitar players should be rated by anything other than technical ability.

But to be rated for having never played the guitar on their recordings as in Skrillex's place? And Jam Master Jay might have been a master manipulator of guitar samples and an innovator but being in a greatest guitarist list is silly.

rcaz

Wile E. Coyote wrote: »

Sorry but the minimum basic requirement to be included on a 'Greatest Guitarist' list is that you actually play a guitar. Either that or re-name the list 'The Greatest bands/musicians to use guitars in their work but not actually play the guitar themselves'. But that name isn't as catchy.

No need to be sorry, you're just very closed-minded, it's okay :pac: Just ignore Skrillex and Jam Master Jay and you've got a great list of 98 guitarists to go through.

The electric guitar was invented when, 1931? And we still haven't gotten past the idea of 'playing guitar' meaning only putting your fingers on the frets and plucking the strings? Think about Sonic Youth, with their prepared guitars and baseball bats, drills, whatever else, or My Bloody Valentine, with loads of guitars with only two strings on, tuned to the same note, where they recorded just the two strings with no fretting or moving, and based the whole sound around the manipulation of those sounds. Now what's so different between what those guys do and what Run DMC did?

Hannibal

What is the criteria for the "Greatest Ever"?
most agree that Hendrix would be number 1.
I've seen some lists that have Slash for example at 35, although a great player with excellent riffs he could possibly be the most iconic guitarist ever, with the Les Paul, top hat, cigarette etc he nearly ticks all the boxes of a cartoon character.
The likes of Chuck Berry although basic players invented styles that was the ground work for what came later so should they be considered ahead of better players that built on his leg work?

Rigsby

Dotsey wrote: »

What is the criteria for the "Greatest Ever"

There's none. It is all in the individual's ear and mind.

That's why, like in this thread there is always the "why isn't X,Yand Z in there"? type of comments.

Hannibal

Rigsby wrote: »

There's none. It is all in the individual's ear and mind.

That's why, like in this thread there is always the "why isn't X,Yand Z in there"? type of comments.

that's what I'm saying though, rock can be as much about the eye as the ear

Grid.

karaokeman wrote: »

Great to see The Edge make it in at a slick #13.

This is his best ever performance by a long shot;

I'm still waiting for him to do something?????:rolleyes:

SilverScreen

F**k yeah, Lee Ranaldo and Thurston Moore. I've seen a lot of these lists and 99% of them are a joke, with prudes like Slash, Steve Vai and others. Passionate and creative guitar playing is always more inspiring than wanky, technical, emotionless guitar soloing. The likes of J. Mascis and Kevin Shields beat Slash any day.

hidinginthebush

Steve Vai is NOT a prude. :mad: You can call each list subjective and opinions on who is best are simply that, opinions, but you can not doubt the man's amazing technical ability and mastery of guitar.

Sinfonia

hidinginthebush wrote: »

Steve Vai is NOT a prude. :mad: You can call each list subjective and opinions on who is best are simply that, opinions, but you can not doubt the man's amazing technical ability and mastery of guitar.

Also, Passion and Warfare is a very thoughtfully-composed album; I'm very impressed with his compositional technique (on this album at least), whereas many of his contemporaries unfortunately rely on boring backing tracks over which they can play.

SilverScreen

hidinginthebush wrote: »

Steve Vai is NOT a prude. :mad: You can call each list subjective and opinions on who is best are simply that, opinions, but you can not doubt the man's amazing technical ability and mastery of guitar.

I can admire the technical ability but that's all and nothing more, I feel nothing from it. What's the motivation and drive behind it? What's he using his guitar for other than to show how many scales he can play? If you get where I'm coming from. The likes of J. Masics, Greg Ginn and Kurt Cobain, while not technically gifted, put something else into their guitar playing that Steve Vai or Joe Satriani never did.

hidinginthebush

Zero1986 wrote: »

I can admire the technical ability but that's all and nothing more, I feel nothing from it. What's the motivation and drive behind it? What's he using his guitar for other than to show how many scales he can play? If you get where I'm coming from. The likes of J. Masics, Greg Ginn and Kurt Cobain, while not technically gifted, put something else into their guitar playing that Steve Vai or Joe Satriani never did.

Yeah I can see your side alright. As far as I'm concerned, Cobain's playing was more about his attitude, the wanting to stay out of the limelight, turn your back on the world essence of himself, and he did it very well. His guitar sounds ugly and uncaring, but that's it's appeal, and it really suits the music he played.

Vai on the other hand, can convey emotion through his playing. He does this through the utilisation of different modes and keys, and his huge knowledge of the instrument. I suppose you could put it on par with classical music. I get where you're coming from though, Vai is of the high-brow "look at how much I know about music and how well I can do it" frame of mind, and I've seen him play live and it does get tiresome and boring after a while. Let's be honest, he'll probably never write a hit like Wonderwall, but then does the make Noel Gallagher a better guitarist than him, after all, more people like songs he's written than Vai has, his music is more accessible and has most likely reached more people than Vai's. (Just an example, of course Vai > NG lol).

I think though saying that you feel nothing from Vai's playing just means you haven't heard enough of it or given it enough of a chance. Yeah it's very technical, but some of it's very emotive. I wouldn't be his biggest fan anymore, but songs like tender surrender or whispering a prayer are quite beautiful and stirring in their composition.

I know what you mean though, there's more to playing that sweep picking at 240bpm, but this poll still annoys me. Maybe it's because I'm a guitarist and so want to see all the greats up there (as if they haven't dominated enough polls, lol), but it's the sort of contradicting rules they have, like throwing in people that don't play the guitar (mentioned a few posts ago), or removing people like Jimi, even though he was far from conventional in the way he played. I don't know, it just feels like a poll for hipsters to get excited over, I just wish they'd admit it. (Case in point, putting Eddie Hazel in at no. 9. Yes, Maggot Brain is a epic tune, one of my favourites, but his playing besides that was hardly revolutionary or new, he was just a funk player. Having him there just feels to me like the writers exclaiming 'look how cool and alternative we are!').

PS Great to see Slayer floating around the 20 mark tho
\m/ take that hipsters \m/

Jimmy Iovine

If Skrillex is there then Lil Wayne should be on it. At least he has played a guitar.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4CoXRPK4TM

Bullseye1

Zero1986 wrote: »

I can admire the technical ability but that's all and nothing more, I feel nothing from it. What's the motivation and drive behind it? What's he using his guitar for other than to show how many scales he can play? If you get where I'm coming from. The likes of J. Masics, Greg Ginn and Kurt Cobain, while not technically gifted, put something else into their guitar playing that Steve Vai or Joe Satriani never did.

Have you ever seen either of these two play live. If you have your lying. They live and breath emotion through their guitars.

Bullseye1

No:

Jimi Page
Eddie Van Halen
Hank Marvin
Mark Knopfler 
Bobby Gustafson
Zaak Wylde
Randy Rhoads
Paco de lucia
Narciso Yepes

SilverScreen

I think a lot of people are missing the point that Spin magazine caters for a certain type of music fan than say Rolling Stone. A greatest guitarist list made by Rolling Stone is always going to biased toward classic rock while a magazine like Spin would be more biased towards alternative music. No greatest guitarists list will ever be definitive so If you are complaining about your favourite guitarist not being included you are wasting your time.

This list just happens to be more diverse than ones I've previously seen.

Rigsby

Zero1986 wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point that Spin magazine caters for a certain type of music fan than say Rolling Stone. A greatest guitarist list made by Rolling Stone is always going to biased toward classic rock while a magazine like Spin would be more biased towards alternative music. No greatest guitarists list will ever be definitive so If you are complaining about your favourite guitarist not being included you are wasting your time.

This list just happens to be more diverse than ones I've previously seen.

I agree. "Greatest," if it existed at all, would and should mean undisputed. We all know that's not going to happen.

glord

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEdl_a2vlXk = Guthrie Govan .Full Stop .Insanely good at every style and great ear .More taste and more down to earth than satriani

rcaz

glord wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEdl_a2vlXk = Guthrie Govan .Full Stop .Insanely good at every style and great ear .More taste and more down to earth than satriani

How does he stand out from anyone else who's ever tried to play that kind of guitar music? He follows some really basic harmonic movements, bends up to tonics and fifths to start or end phrases, every now and then he'll squeeze as many notes as he possibly can into a bar, pinch harmonics now and then, he uses so much vibrato that it loses any expression or significance. All his notes are at the exact same loudness too, he doesn't do anything with dynamics.

He does have a ring modulator, which he throws on for a few bars at the end, though. Fantastic.

smokedeels

Progressive list.

Great to see Duane Denison make it in.

glord

thats just one video where hes obviously playing blues.I think its pretty cool.Hes very dynamic, like look at this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1tNOLsMZiI .Not every guitarist can jump styles so effortlessly .And this also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzft2tjp3IA .Give me another guitarist that can do this please .Some of the stuff with aristocrats is also very original ,you should have a look.

I also think Jonny Greenwood is one of the greatest guitarist of all time(who you mentioned) which is a bit of a hop but id say guthrie stole a few ideas from him along the way

nyarlothothep

hidinginthebush wrote: »

Yeah I can see your side alright. As far as I'm concerned, Cobain's playing was more about his attitude, the wanting to stay out of the limelight, turn your back on the world essence of himself, and he did it very well. His guitar sounds ugly and uncaring, but that's it's appeal, and it really suits the music he played.

Vai on the other hand, can convey emotion through his playing. He does this through the utilisation of different modes and keys, and his huge knowledge of the instrument. I suppose you could put it on par with classical music. I get where you're coming from though, Vai is of the high-brow "look at how much I know about music and how well I can do it" frame of mind, and I've seen him play live and it does get tiresome and boring after a while. Let's be honest, he'll probably never write a hit like Wonderwall, but then does the make Noel Gallagher a better guitarist than him, after all, more people like songs he's written than Vai has, his music is more accessible and has most likely reached more people than Vai's. (Just an example, of course Vai > NG lol).

I think though saying that you feel nothing from Vai's playing just means you haven't heard enough of it or given it enough of a chance. Yeah it's very technical, but some of it's very emotive. I wouldn't be his biggest fan anymore, but songs like tender surrender or whispering a prayer are quite beautiful and stirring in their composition.

I know what you mean though, there's more to playing that sweep picking at 240bpm, but this poll still annoys me. Maybe it's because I'm a guitarist and so want to see all the greats up there (as if they haven't dominated enough polls, lol), but it's the sort of contradicting rules they have, like throwing in people that don't play the guitar (mentioned a few posts ago), or removing people like Jimi, even though he was far from conventional in the way he played. I don't know, it just feels like a poll for hipsters to get excited over, I just wish they'd admit it. (Case in point, putting Eddie Hazel in at no. 9. Yes, Maggot Brain is a epic tune, one of my favourites, but his playing besides that was hardly revolutionary or new, he was just a funk player. Having him there just feels to me like the writers exclaiming 'look how cool and alternative we are!').

PS Great to see Slayer floating around the 20 mark tho
\m/ take that hipsters \m/

I find that there is a certain contempt displayed by journalists in the mainstream press with regards to genres such as prog and metal and the kinds of guitarists that they produce. I attribute this to the 1970s explosion of punk. Every genre has its place, including punk but in the mainstream press guitarists such as Vai etc are written off. And bands which aren't indie/punk/garage or whatever don't get the coverage they deserve. So I see this list as symptomatic of this attitude in the media towards music that actually isn't instantly accessible, which is built upon the study of an instrument and which is immensely rewarding. And that's not just limited to rock, why not include some classical players like Ana Vidovic or Django Reinhardt. The problem with lists compiled by journalists is that it's their opinion, under the mask of authority, when they have no authority at all to decide who should be in that list. They should be put to a vote by the readers.

I don't like Vai's playing, it's boring to me but he is a great guitarist imo because he's reached a very high level of performance and technique and that should be praised. However the shred is emotionless argument falls flat on its face because its a generalisation, Animals as Leaders for example has a lot of shred guitar in it and for me anyway, it does convey emotions, ditto for Opeth solos.

Also if you don't play guitar you're not a guitarist, I see where that argument is coming from, eg Daft Punk have a "guitar solo" in Digital Love which wasn't played on guitar, nonetheless it's not a guitar solo, it's a solo which emulates the guitar sound. For example I do drum programming, I can't play drums, therefore I'm not a drummer. An actor who plays a role is not that role, Jeff Goldblum is not a scientist etc

KKkitty

Right first off I'm not big into guitarists but Yngwie Malmsteen, Steve Vai, Joe Satriani and Jason Becker pre ALS are/were amazing. Jason Becker's early clinics were out of this world. Even when I watched them on standard VHS you couldn't follow his fingers in slow motion they were that quick.

smokedeels

The bulk of the list is aimed at fans of indie/punk music.

Steve Vai and all those wizards are just fine, but some people don't get that sort of stuff. It's almost like a genre thing I guess, or how some people would rather admire the art in a Vertigo comic than a Caravaggio.

While I'd be a fan of the list, I do find some of the hate that "technical players" get to be a little strange, I think it's some Punk idea that they are part of the establishment or something.

Zero1986 mentioned J. Masics, apparently Dinosaur Jr. got lots of hate at the time for playing solos.

Anyway... it's all bs and no list will please everybody.

rcaz

glord wrote: »

thats just one video where hes obviously playing blues.I think its pretty cool.Hes very dynamic, like look at this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1tNOLsMZiI .Not every guitarist can jump styles so effortlessly .And this also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzft2tjp3IA .Give me another guitarist that can do this please .Some of the stuff with aristocrats is also very original ,you should have a look.

The jazz and country stuff there is just like him playing in different clichés... Being able to get away with a bit of jazz and country (and that's like Diet Jazz™ or Country Lite®) as opposed to being a good jazz or country guitarist.

My favourite guitar player ever is Nels Cline, he plays with Wilco now but he's also had a pretty long jazz career of his own, and he's been involved with some alternative rock and noise and punk stuff too.

Nels and Thurston Moore improv set

Nels' rockier band Banyan covering Funkadelic's Maggot Brain. Shows off some of his fancier noodling abilities, and gets into a really cool noise section towards the end. Also a masterclass in how to use a Whammy pedal :pac: A lot of the phrases he puts in to start off sections of his solos are a bit obviously bloozey (like bending the fourth up to the fifth and then settling on the minor third), but when he gets really into his own buzz in bits, some of the stuff he plays is really amazing.

The Nels Cline Singers - Divining.

flyswatter

It has too much of a clear indie bias for my liking. The Jam Master Jay inclusion is a bit of a joke.

I like some of the inclusions though like Nels Cline, Eddie Hazel and especially Nile Rodgers, who I adore.

Wish Ernie Isley was included, so unappreciated in these type of lists, bit Hendrixy but I prefer Ernies playing.

Tommy Bolin is another one, guitar prodigy who played with Deep Purple and Billy Cobham, was very gifted but died at 25.

glord

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXJiieCafjM = more Guthrie

I also like the guitarist in the Dillinger Escape Plan.Very Heavy but addictive none the less

John Mcloughlin hasnt got a mention yet suprisingly either

glord

Larry Lelonde out of primus.He got lessons off Satriani but has a total out there style.Genius