Well I Never...

WhoFeltMark?

Well I never...

Jester252

WhoFeltMark? wrote: »

Well I never...

What the buck is this and whats going on

wnolan1992

WhoFeltMark? wrote: »

Well I never...

LOL. LOL. And LOL again.

Nockz

I must have missed that article last semester. Looked like a goodun.

OhMSGlive

Interesting read, to say the least.

CiaranMT

Buddy Holly dies in plane crash aged 22: “We probably couldn’t have stopped him anyway”

Quality.

spacemunter

CiaranMT wrote: »

Quality.

I don't get it....

CiaranMT

It's a reference to a comment made by KOB during Hustings about suicide.

spacemunter

CiaranMT wrote: »

It's a reference to a comment made by KOB during Hustings about suicide.

thanks, somehow I am not suprised

Fifi Trixie Belle

CiaranMT wrote: »

It's a reference to a comment made by KOB during Hustings about suicide.

The bizarre thing about that comment is that it is entirely correct. The only people that suicide intervention works on are those that are ambivalent about suicide, not those who have made their minds up.

CiaranMT

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

The bizarre thing about that comment is that it is entirely correct. The only people that suicide intervention works on are those that are ambivalent about suicide, not those who have made their minds up.

The question originally put the the Welfare candidates was in relation to suicide prevention, not suicide.

And whatever about the veracity of the statement, it's something that should never publicly come from the mouth of those seeking to be elected to a position in charge of student welfare.

djnr8

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

The bizarre thing about that comment is that it is entirely correct. The only people that suicide intervention works on are those that are ambivalent about suicide, not those who have made their minds up.

And that is the mentality which is why Ireland has such a high level of suicide and not the mentality you want in a welfare officer.

That is not an attack on KOB either, it is a statement of fact.
Words can change anything if used it the right way.

Nobody every makes up their mind, they just haven't been challenged by somebody on it if they've come to a "conclusion".

Fifi Trixie Belle

CiaranMT wrote: »

The question originally put the the Welfare candidates was in relation to suicide prevention, not suicide.

And whatever about the veracity of the statement, it's something that should never publically come from the mouth of those seeking to be elected to a position in charge of student welfare.

Ah, yes the context of the statement is important. I wasn't there obviously, so that sheds some light on things.

I disagree with you on the second point though. In the right context, I think it's very important for a welfare officer to be clear, publicly and privately, about when suicide intervention will and will not work. A belief that you can help everybody is dangerous, just as a belief that you can't help anybody is. But I think this may be diverting the conversation elsewhere..

Fifi Trixie Belle

djnr8 wrote: »

And that is the mentality which is why Ireland has such a high level of suicide and not the mentality you want in a welfare officer.
.

Do you mean my mentality? Or the mentality of the original person?

CiaranMT

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

Ah, yes the context of the statement is important. I wasn't there obviously, so that sheds some light on things.

I disagree with you on the second point though. In the right context, I think it's very important for a welfare officer to be clear, publicly and privately, about when suicide intervention will and will not work. A belief that you can help everybody is dangerous, just as a belief that you can't help anybody is. But I think this may be diverting the conversation elsewhere..

In the context of the question, it was said in a very throwaway fashion, which was picked up on by the crowd there. You could hear the murmurs straight away.

It wasn't that she was being 'upfront' about it, the significance of it was that she was pretty careless.

And of course we should aim to help everybody. How can it be seen as dangerous? Are you suggesting something along the lines of false hope?

Fifi Trixie Belle

CiaranMT wrote: »

And of course we should aim to help everybody. How can it be seen as dangerous? Are you suggesting something along the lines of false hope?

I'm not saying that we shouldn't try to help as many people as possible, we should. What I'm saying is that the belief that you can help everyone is dangerous.

Also, like I say, I wasn't at hustings. So thanks for clarifying the context of the comment.

djnr8

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

Do you mean my mentality? Or the mentality of the original person?

I don't understand the need for this question.

You are agreeing with the original person, yes?

So therefore is it the mentality of both of you

djnr8

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

I'm not saying that we shouldn't try to help as many people as possible, we should. What I'm saying is that the belief that you can help everyone is dangerous.

Also, like I say, I wasn't at hustings. So thanks for clarifying the context of the comment.

I'm not saying you can help everybody, but a student is part of a group of individuals.

If you said I can't help the junkies strolling around Dublin looking for heroin I would agree with you. But if you said I can't help a student with the idea of suicide in their head, I would disagree.

You may not be able to help some people, but you can always try

CiaranMT

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

What I'm saying is that the belief that you can help everyone is dangerous.

Naturally, no argument there.

Fifi Trixie Belle

djnr8 wrote: »

I'm not saying you can help everybody, but a student is part of a group of individuals.

If you said I can't help the junkies strolling around Dublin looking for heroin I would agree with you. But if you said I can't help a student with the idea of suicide in their head, I would disagree.

You may not be able to help some people, but you can always try

Ok I think my comments may have been misinterpreted. Firstly, like I said in my last post, I didn't have the original context of the comment so perhaps that's where the problem has occurred. Here's what I mean;

1) There are some situations where a suicide intervention will not work. Those situations are where the person has made the decision. Hence my acceptance of the statement, without knowing the context. I don't say any of this from a position of being unsympathetic, cold or ignorant. I say it from my experience of (a) suicide intervention training and (b) actually conducting a suicide intervention.

2) Often, interventions do work because the person considering suicide is doing just that, considering. I am not implying "don't try", what I mean is that sometimes there is genuinely nothing you can do.

I hope that clarifies what I meant.

Carol.Lillie

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

Ok I think my comments may have been misinterpreted. Firstly, like I said in my last post, I didn't have the original context of the comment so perhaps that's where the problem has occurred. Here's what I mean;

1) There are some situations where a suicide intervention will not work. Those situations are where the person has made the decision. Hence my acceptance of the statement, without knowing the context. I don't say any of this from a position of being unsympathetic, cold or ignorant. I say it from my experience of (a) suicide intervention training and (b) actually conducting a suicide intervention.

2) Often, interventions do work because the person considering suicide is doing just that, considering. I am not implying "don't try", what I mean is that sometimes there is genuinely nothing you can do.

I hope that clarifies what I meant.

citation please or STFU

Fifi Trixie Belle

Carol.Lillie wrote: »

citation please or STFU

ASIST (Applied Suicide Intervention Skill Training) offered by the HSE, taken in St. Joseph's Psychiatric Hospital, Limerick.

Normally I don't respond to people who show such levels of rudeness. However, I have no interest in getting into a pointless argument where someone accuses me of having no basis for what I've said.

In future, watch your manners.

Carol.Lillie

well excuse me for questioning someone who did a 2 day course on suicide prevention

Fifi Trixie Belle

Carol.Lillie wrote: »

well excuse me for questioning someone who did a 2 day course on suicide prevention

Yawn..

Jester252

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

djnr8 wrote: »

I'm not saying you can help everybody, but a student is part of a group of individuals.

If you said I can't help the junkies strolling around Dublin looking for heroin I would agree with you. But if you said I can't help a student with the idea of suicide in their head, I would disagree.

You may not be able to help some people, but you can always try

Ok I think my comments may have been misinterpreted. Firstly, like I said in my last post, I didn't have the original context of the comment so perhaps that's where the problem has occurred. Here's what I mean;

1) There are some situations where a suicide intervention will not work. Those situations are where the person has made the decision. Hence my acceptance of the statement, without knowing the context. I don't say any of this from a position of being unsympathetic, cold or ignorant. I say it from my experience of (a) suicide intervention training and (b) actually conducting a suicide intervention.

2) Often, interventions do work because the person considering suicide is doing just that, considering. I am not implying "don't try", what I mean is that sometimes there is genuinely nothing you can do.

I hope that clarifies what I meant.

How would you know that the person made the decision to kill themself and if you knew that person will you still not try and stop them?

Fifi Trixie Belle

Jester252 wrote: »

How would you know that the person made the decision to kill themself and if you knew that person will you still not try and stop them?

You only find out if they've made the decision when you try to intervene. You hope they haven't, you hope they're still undecided. Of course, I would try to stop them. But sometimes people do their best and it won't be enough. I'm definitely not saying don't try, I'm just saying that sometimes there is nothing you can do. Sorry if I caused confusion with what I posted.

Jester252

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

Jester252 wrote: »

How would you know that the person made the decision to kill themself and if you knew that person will you still not try and stop them?

You only find out if they've made the decision when you try to intervene. You hope they haven't, you hope they're still undecided. Of course, I would try to stop them. But sometimes people do their best and it won't be enough. I'm definitely not saying don't try, I'm just saying that sometimes there is nothing you can do. Sorry if I caused confusion with what I posted.

I not confused at all I find it stupid that anybody is willing to throw in the towel. You cant give up hope on someone because they tried to kill themself

Jester252

Fifi Trixie Belle wrote: »

Jester252 wrote: »

How would you know that the person made the decision to kill themself and if you knew that person will you still not try and stop them?

You only find out if they've made the decision when you try to intervene. You hope they haven't, you hope they're still undecided. Of course, I would try to stop them. But sometimes people do their best and it won't be enough. I'm definitely not saying don't try, I'm just saying that sometimes there is nothing you can do. Sorry if I caused confusion with what I posted.

I not confused at all I find it stupid that anybody is willing to throw in the towel. You cant give up hope on someone because they tried to kill themself. You said you will try but you feel that it won't change anything. It is a sad view point. Everyone effect everyone else it life maybe your not the person to stop maybe you are or maybe to just buy some time so other people can help this poor person. Most of these are people who are traped and feel it is the only way out. We need to show them other ways out. The attude you have is just upsetting to see.

CiaranMT

Jester252 wrote: »

I not confused at all I find it stupid that anybody is willing to throw in the towel. You cant give up hope on someone because they tried to kill themself

That's not what Fifi is saying.

EDIT: I think wires are being crossed here.

UL_heart_throb

I don't think this is the time or the place for such a discussion tbh.

canned_ulkc

First - who is A. Leahy? and fair play...


However, on the suicide prevention issue I have to call bull****. Because it is just that....


Fifi has already pointed out the truth (and mya I say that I don't know Kelly at all) but some people have trouble facing reality.


It is NOT inappropriate for someone to state the truth.

Unfortunatley though, some are unwilling and/or unable to accept the truth (just look at the faithfull?*)

What Kelly said was not wrong, though the question could have been more comprehensively addressed. Loads of people seemed to take issue with this, as if they should feel sooooo insulted that Kelly said what she said.... How does anyone know what she or someone close to her has been through?

I can't see the attitude that has been given to Kelly as anything but ignorant and righteous.

Get off the high horse there lads, you've little experience up there and chances are, you'll just fall and hurt yourselves...

Eire-Dearg

Looks like UL students would start an argument in an empty room.

Good job OP. Like Stone Cold Steve Austin once said: Arrive. Raise Hell. Leave.

canned_ulkc

Fair play - near 6 posts per day, with a username that suggests a Ginge AND from Tipp....


Want to let us know about any other South Park episodes you've been in?

Fifi Trixie Belle

CiaranMT wrote: »

That's not what Fifi is saying.

EDIT: I think wires are being crossed here.

Ditto

Jester252 wrote: »

I not confused at all I find it stupid that anybody is willing to throw in the towel. You cant give up hope on someone because they tried to kill themself.

...

Given that you've completely misrepresented (or misinterpretted) what I said, you are obviously quite confused. Feel free to read back over all the posts where I say you should help and talked about intervention itself, etc. There's no point in me repeating what I've already said.

CiaranMT

canned_ulkc wrote: »

Fair play - near 6 posts per day, with a username that suggests a Ginge AND from Tipp....


Want to let us know about any other South Park episodes you've been in?

Oh dear.


You were right, Eire-Dearg.

djnr8

canned_ulkc wrote: »

First - who is A. Leahy? and fair play...

Am I missing something here?