sprinter sacre look out!

handsomecake

sanctuaire just beat somersby by 17 lenghts.

taking to fences really nicely:eek:

Goldcupfav

Ha wouldnt get anywhere near Sprinter.

Johner

Was 17 lengths, love to see what would happen if he tryed to do that to Sprinter Sacre. Brilliant round of jumping.

handsomecake

Goldcupfav wrote: »

Ha wouldnt get anywhere near Sprinter.

no where near? or hyperbole abuse?

Goldcupfav

Field was hardly the strongest today. Somersby has been on the go since last October. Dan Breen is a handicapper, French Opera not as good as he used to be. Wishfull Thinking over the top. And you can forget about the rest.Nicholls had this race in mind for Santuaire for awhile. Skipped Cheltenham and Aintree to come here.

handsomecake

Goldcupfav wrote: »

Field was hardly the strongest today. Somersby has been on the go since last October. Dan Breen is a handicapper, French Opera not as good as he used to be. Wishfull Thinking over the top. And you can forget about the rest.Nicholls had this race in mind for Santuaire for awhile. Skipped Cheltenham and Aintree to come here.

fair enough

UrbanSea

Goldcupfav wrote: »

Field was hardly the strongest today. Somersby has been on the go since last October. Dan Breen is a handicapper, French Opera not as good as he used to be. Wishfull Thinking over the top. And you can forget about the rest.Nicholls had this race in mind for Santuaire for awhile. Skipped Cheltenham and Aintree to come here.

You're discounting his performance far too easily I think. When Sprinter Sacre beat French Opera on the bridle by six lengths people were practically cacking themselves over the performance, now Sanctuaire beats him 22 lengths and it's incomparable.

The fact is he beat a Grade 1 horse who is rated 166 by 17 lengths from the front. If the horse had been a better hurdler or even coming from a novice he'd be getting more credit. I'd rather him at 10/1 than Sprinter Sacre at evens for the Champion Chase

Huntley

One horse has won a Grade 2, with the winning distance partly down to a bunch of incompetent jockeys in behind who didn't decide to chase him down until he was 25 lengths clear.

The other has won the Wayward Lad, the Game Spirit, the Arkle and the Maghull. Not to mention that he is scaring everything off and the amount of record breaking feats along the way.

If Sprinter Sacre still has 4 legs and a tail next March he will win the Champion Chase.

UrbanSea

Huntley wrote: »

One horse has won a Grade 2, with the winning distance partly down to a bunch of incompetent jockeys in behind who didn't decide to chase him down until he was 25 lengths clear.

The other has won the Wayward Lad, the Game Spirit, the Arkle and the Maghull. Not to mention that he is scaring everything off and the amount of record breaking feats along the way.

If Sprinter Sacre still has 4 legs and a tail next March he will win the Champion Chase.

No questioning that. Though as you said it is partly down to it, the fact is that he is still unbeaten over fences after three races with a combined winning distance of 74 lengths. That's why I'm saying I'd rather 12/1 ante post than evens, it's obvious why he is evens though. It's something like this

Goldcupfav wrote: »

Ha wouldnt get anywhere near Sprinter.

that can't be proven until they meet

ft9

Huntley wrote: »

One horse has won a Grade 2, with the winning distance partly down to a bunch of incompetent jockeys in behind who didn't decide to chase him down until he was 25 lengths clear.

The other has won the Wayward Lad, the Game Spirit, the Arkle and the Maghull. Not to mention that he is scaring everything off and the amount of record breaking feats along the way.

If Sprinter Sacre still has 4 legs and a tail next March he will win the Champion Chase.

I think he'd manage it without the tail tbh

newuser89

It would be a race to savour if they both raced each other
Be great to see a horse that can match exuberance with sprinter sacre

NaiveMelodies

Sanctuaire given rating of 167, Sprinter Sacre 169.

Very interesting, I can't wait for next season!!
Sprinter would have to be firm fav at a course like cheltenham, but right handed flat track would make it very close I reckon!

Morgans

Sprinter Sacre is one of the most amazing looking horses and jumpers that Ive seen. However, that he is 5/4 for the Champion Chase and Big Bucks is 7/4 for the World Hurdle, is off the wall nuts.

MoscowFlyer

Amazes me how people still claim a horse cannot lose even though they haven't raced. You don't know how a horse will react when it comes under pressure. Sprinter Sacre is an amazing horse, no doubt about it but who's to say he won't crack under the pressure if Sanctuaire applies enough? You just don't know so claiming something is a done deal before a horse shoe is fitted is quite funny to me.

I mean all Hurricane Fly had to do was turn up at Cheltenham, we all know how that turned out.

Morgans

MoscowFlyer wrote: »

Amazes me how people still claim a horse cannot lose even though they haven't raced. You don't know how a horse will react when it comes under pressure. Sprinter Sacre is an amazing horse, no doubt about it but who's to say he won't crack under the pressure if Sanctuaire applies enough? You just don't know so claiming something is a done deal before a horse shoe is fitted is quite funny to me.

I mean all Hurricane Fly had to do was turn up at Cheltenham, we all know how that turned out.

I think Sprinter Sacre has done what has asked to date, but I think he was pushed out to win at Cheltenham, not kitchen sink, but the fairest reflection of his talent. He is likley to improve past everything and prove himself the best, but he hasn't met horses like Finian's Rainbow or Sizing Europe yet. I would have Finian's Rainbow beating Cue Card giving 7lbs.

I personally dont think Sainctuaire is a Champion Chaser in the making, but the Tingle Creek might be interesting.

MoscowFlyer

Yeah I do agree with you and I should have mentioned those other 2 horses. Some cracking races in the making next year, cannot wait!

Just hope the rain goes away so we can get the flat season going in full swing. This horrible ground is making for some awful racing.

handsomecake

Morgans wrote: »

I think Sprinter Sacre has done what has asked to date, but I think he was pushed out to win at Cheltenham, not kitchen sink, but the fairest reflection of his talent. He is likley to improve past everything and prove himself the best, but he hasn't met horses like Finian's Rainbow or Sizing Europe yet. I would have Finian's Rainbow beating Cue Card giving 7lbs.

I personally dont think Sainctuaire is a Champion Chaser in the making, but the Tingle Creek might be interesting.

cracking post to be fair. hammer.nail .head

Huntley

You can be sure that Seven Barrows know who is the better horse between Finian's Rainbow and Sprinter Sacre. Should both of them line up next year in the Champion Chase then it will be one of the rare occasions when the stable jockey won't be sitting on the defending champion.

mdwexford

MoscowFlyer wrote: »

Amazes me how people still claim a horse cannot lose even though they haven't raced. You don't know how a horse will react when it comes under pressure. Sprinter Sacre is an amazing horse, no doubt about it but who's to say he won't crack under the pressure if Sanctuaire applies enough? You just don't know so claiming something is a done deal before a horse shoe is fitted is quite funny to me.

I mean all Hurricane Fly had to do was turn up at Cheltenham, we all know how that turned out.

Santuaire won't be able to run fast enough to get him off the bridle.

Hurricane Fly was always beatable.

Morgans wrote: »

I think Sprinter Sacre has done what has asked to date, but I think he was pushed out to win at Cheltenham, not kitchen sink, but the fairest reflection of his talent. He is likley to improve past everything and prove himself the best, but he hasn't met horses like Finian's Rainbow or Sizing Europe yet. I would have Finian's Rainbow beating Cue Card giving 7lbs.

I personally dont think Sainctuaire is a Champion Chaser in the making, but the Tingle Creek might be interesting.

I think he was pushed out only in the Arkle but I still think Azertyuiop was a more impressive novice chaser and better jumper.

SE will be old and past it by next March.

FR nearly won by default in what was a poor year for 2 mile chasers imo.

hucklebuck

mdwexford wrote: »

FR nearly won by default in what was a poor year for 2 mile chasers imo.

He outbattled what looked an unbeatable horse up the hill. Sizing demolished everything else, this was Sizings most impressive year in my book save for the shambles at the last in the Champ Chase.

Finians is a very good horse but Sprinter is better now and probably will have improved more than Finians over the summer given their ages.

Sanctuaire was very impressive, any horse beating Somersby that easily going right handed must be respected but what is Sanctuaire like going left over fences and was it a once off?

mdwexford

hucklebuck wrote: »

He outbattled what looked an unbeatable horse up the hill. Sizing demolished everything else, this was Sizings most impressive year in my book save for the shambles at the last in the Champ Chase.

Finians is a very good horse but Sprinter is better now and probably will have improved more than Finians over the summer given their ages.

Sanctuaire was very impressive, any horse beating Somersby that easily going right handed must be respected but what is Sanctuaire like going left over fences and was it a once off?

SE has been beaten many times.

He is a very good horse but the rest of the field were bums.

Yeah FR is 10 next season, 10yo don't win championship races unless they are very very special.

hucklebuck

mdwexford wrote: »

SE has been beaten many times.

I was on about this season, he looked unbeatable en route to Cheltenham.

This is from Paul Nicholls Twitter feed:

"Very interesting end of season handicap marks !...Sanctuaire 167. Sprinter Sacre 169 Bring on the Tingle Creek."

Morgans

mdwexford wrote: »

SE has been beaten many times.

He is a very good horse but the rest of the field were bums.

Yeah FR is 10 next season, 10yo don't win championship races unless they are very very special.

Bums. I think FR was a clear winner of the Champion Chase, and I think SE has been the best around for a while. Constantly underrated I think.

Interesting to hear your opinion of what Sprinter Sacre beat this year. French Opera, Toubab, Cue Card and think its conclusive that looking back that mistake at the first was the end of Peddlers Cross chasing career. Even Al Ferof didnt get the chance to take him on properly. I cant remember a poorer bunch of 2m novices, outside the winner.

I think Sprinter Sacre is the most likely winner of the champion chase, especially given the noises of Barry Geraghty. However, he needs to improve to do so and 5/4 is nuts. 7/4 about Big Bucks. 7/1 about Finians Rainbow represents each way value. He deserves to be favourite and something like 9/4 would be about fair to my mind.

But I think it would be very wrong to pretend Sprinter Sacre was 5l or 10l better than he showed at the Arkle. Having had my nuts on, I was a) surprised at how close Cue Card was turning in, and b) nervous that a mistake at the last would allow him in. The most likeable thing about the Arkle was that a horse that can run so free picked up the hill.

Talk about how many lengths he will win by etc for the champion chase is very premature. Master Minded had far greater credentials and failed. There is always a rush for overegg a superstars performance.

Morgans

One other thing. If Sprinter Sacre did what Sanctuaire did last weekend, there would be thousands creaming their trousers over it. I personally dont think Sanctuaire is all that reliable, but a proper horse when on it.

Huntley

Morgans wrote: »

Even Al Ferof didnt get the chance to take him on properly.

What utter garbage. Al Ferof was going a stride quicker than he wanted and suffered for it. He did take him on "properly", he wasn't good enough.

The only thing that astounded me about Sanctuaire's win was the incompetence of the other jockeys. Dominic Elsworth and co must have thought they were already on their holidays because they were sitting back admiring the trees turning off the back while Daryl had snuck 25 lengths clear.

Morgans

It was unfortunate that Al Ferof didnt run to his Victor Chandler form in the Arkle to give the race more substance. Given that Al Ferof was leading at the time, I think Ruby was happy enough on a stayer. He took a chance at a tricky fence and paid the price. I believe Al Ferof is better over further and dont believe Al Ferof to be a grade 1 2m chaser, but he brought the only meaningful 2m novice form into the race. Running him down is running down Sprinter Sacre, and only proves the point at how poor the 2m novices were this year. Had Al Ferof run his race, we would be able to better guage where Sprinter Sacre is, at the moment, he needs to improve past FR and SE to win next year.

Utter garbage? Huntley doesn't like being challenged.

Huntley

Morgans wrote: »

Utter garbage?

Yes, utter garbage. Did you fail to comprehend that the first time I said it?

To suggest that Al Ferof didn't get to properly take on Sprinter Sacre is comically unintelligent.

Morgans

Fair point, well made.

Nulty

Huntley just loves to get his teeth in. He's actually quite the charmer though, aren't you?

Huntley

I just have minimal time for idiocy Nulty, hence why I rarely converse with you.

convert

Play nice, folks. Next person who's 'naughty' or uncvil will be infracted. Final warning.

Nulty

Huntley wrote: »

I just have minimal time for idiocy Nulty, hence why I rarely converse with you.

Why won't you love me back Huntley?

mdwexford

Morgans wrote: »

Bums. I think FR was a clear winner of the Champion Chase, and I think SE has been the best around for a while. Constantly underrated I think.

Interesting to hear your opinion of what Sprinter Sacre beat this year. French Opera, Toubab, Cue Card and think its conclusive that looking back that mistake at the first was the end of Peddlers Cross chasing career. Even Al Ferof didnt get the chance to take him on properly. I cant remember a poorer bunch of 2m novices, outside the winner.

I think Sprinter Sacre is the most likely winner of the champion chase, especially given the noises of Barry Geraghty. However, he needs to improve to do so and 5/4 is nuts. 7/4 about Big Bucks. 7/1 about Finians Rainbow represents each way value. He deserves to be favourite and something like 9/4 would be about fair to my mind.

But I think it would be very wrong to pretend Sprinter Sacre was 5l or 10l better than he showed at the Arkle. Having had my nuts on, I was a) surprised at how close Cue Card was turning in, and b) nervous that a mistake at the last would allow him in. The most likeable thing about the Arkle was that a horse that can run so free picked up the hill.

Talk about how many lengths he will win by etc for the champion chase is very premature. Master Minded had far greater credentials and failed. There is always a rush for overegg a superstars performance.

It was a two horse race, Big Zeb was past it.

I backed Finians Rainbow and while he's a decent horse he's just lucky to have been around in an average year.

Sprinter Sacre ended up probably beating not much but the manner in which he did it was very classy. Pre Cheltenham all the talk was of a vintage Arkle. Al Ferof will be in handicaps next season. Menorah and Cue Card will win races.

5/4 I agree is a shocking price.
5/2 would be ok I guess.

Here is where we differ. I think he had plenty left, while he didn't pull away like I thought he was going to 4 out I think Barry went easy on him and he could have won by more.

He is clearly overhyped now and has lots to do to be mentioned alongside Azertyuiop and Moscow Flyer. Hopefully he is up to it.

Morgans

An example on how to argue a point.

I cant disagree with much of it - maybe it was talked about in terms of a vintage Arkle when Peddlers Cross was in the mix. Not a bad race still.

Big Zeb is gone, first signs being the Tied Cottage.

I actually think that Cue Card used up his energy chasing Sprinter Sacre down to the last, and had nothing left up the hill. I think Barry was conscious of the spectacle/cameras a bit and thought the race was put to bed when kicking on. I think he was surprised by Cue Card as much as anyone.

Hulk Hands

I think Finians is only 7/1 because Barry has said he is likely to step up to the Ryanair to avoid SS, and he proved his stamina at the Melling chase.

I can see both points, and SS didn't win the Arkle as comfortable as you would've thought turning in.He never really pulled clear of Cue Card, and I think he may still prefer flat tracks.

However, he wasn't got after by BG in any real way either, so I kind of inclined to believe that he is a total superstar until i'm proven otherwise. If he was in a Champion Hurdle run tomorrow i'd be backing him, to have that kind of speed and then jumping ability comparable to Azertyioup to top it off is something special.

Sanctauire's performance on Saturday was breathtaking. The bare form of beating Somersby that far is superb. Sandown is a bit like that though, horses can gallop away from the field. I remember Twist Magic beating a field including Big Zeb by 15l+ in a tingle creek. I can't see him getting away from SS, but it adds a bit of excitement to the Tingle Creek. I can't see Finians Rainbow and SS meeting at all on the track next year