Rented Property lease ended how much deposit should I give back

Psygnosis

Hi
I have 3 bed semi d house rented which the tenants have moved out of after 4 years. Now before moving in the house was spotless newly painted and new carpets although they were not that expensive.
I have just viewed the house after the tenants have moved out.

The following now needs to be done as the house is a state.
All the walls in the house need to be painted they are marked from top to bottom in every room absolutely destroyed.
Holes in the walls in a number of rooms they look like they have been kicked in.
Missing items from the inventory list
Missing kitched chairs replaced with cheap ones
Coffee table
bathroom accessories pulled of the walls and in most cases now broken
Skip needed to despose of rubbish left behind. Swings and slides in back garden, rubbish stashed under trees out the front of the house
Broken bath panel cracked
Electric shower broken (this was old though probably wear and tear)
Gas fire has parts missing will need someone to take a look only shell left.

The carpets are destroyed all marked and black some of it has been torn up from one room. Dont know what they where doing with this.
it will have to be trown out.

How much can I charge legitmaley from the deposit, how much of it would be above wear and tear over 4 years.
What Im thinking of charging for is
Skip to get rid of there crap left around the house swings slide dodgy kitchen chairs and damaged furniture in the house
Carpet disposal will go in the skip
Bath panel they broke
Missing items
Coffe table


Is this reasonable.

Lyn256

Only you can decide whats reasonable

As a tenant myself, I'd suggest you get in touch with your former tenants and give them an opportunity to remedy/repair some of your concerns.
Your list seemed pretty reasonable except for the carpet-cheap carpet wears really badly. My landlord (who I have a great relationship with) tells me that he replaces all carpet every 3/4 years.

If your tenants have been reasonable for the last 4 years (paid on time - didn;t hassle you too much) I wouldn;t be docking them too much.
Just my opinion

djimi

The painting is your own expense; after 4 years the place would need to be redecorated regardless. The electric shower likewise if you feel it is just normal wear and tear.

Everything else sounds like it is fair game to take from their deposit. You can legitimately charge them what you can provide receipts for, so go out and get prices for all the work that needs to be done, provide them with written invoices, and deduct that amount from the deposit.

To be honest by the sounds of it they wont be getting too much back from you!

djimi

Lyn256 wrote: »

Your list seemed pretty reasonable except for the carpet-cheap carpet wears really badly. My landlord (who I have a great relationship with) tells me that he replaces all carpet every 3/4 years.

There should be no need to change a carpet after 3-4 years unless it was the cheapest of the cheap to start with, or it was already well worn. I can understand needing to give it a good cleaning maybe, but I dont think a landlord should have to expect to change the carpets after a 4 year tenancy.

Lyn256 wrote: »

If your tenants have been reasonable for the last 4 years (paid on time - didn;t hassle you too much) I wouldn;t be docking them too much.

The OP is entitled to dock whatever it takes to put the place right after the tenants have left (and by the sounds of it they left the place in a right state). These people sound like they have shown little care for the accomodation in their time living there, so I dont see why the OP should be going easy on them. Very little of what they have described is normal wear and tear.

Psygnosis

Psygnosis wrote: »

........
Holes in the walls in a number of rooms they look like they have been kicked in..................

Lyn256 wrote: »

...............

If your tenants have been reasonable for the last 4 years (paid on time - didn;t hassle you too much) I wouldn;t be docking them too much.
Just my opinion

They've put large holes in the walls and their is furniture missing. I would think the deposit won't cover the damage to be honest.

the_syco

OP: from a tenants point of view, your last lot were scum, tbh.

Psygnosis wrote: »

Skip to get rid of there crap left around the house swings slide dodgy kitchen chairs and damaged furniture in the house
Carpet disposal will go in the skip
Bath panel they broke
Missing items
Coffe table


Is this reasonable.

I'd also add the cost of getting a qualified gas person to come out and fix the fire and to include the cost of the fireplace. I'd ask them for their new address so you know where to send the bill to as I doubt the deposit will cover it all.

ProudDUB

They wouldn't be getting a penny back if it were me. A landlord can retain a deposit to pay for repairs and work above what is considered to be "normal" wear and tear to return it back to being in rentable condition again. If they left so much crap behind that you have to hire a skip to clear out it out, and kicked holes in the walls, that goes far and above what would be considered "normal" imo. If you go one penny over the amount of the deposit, send them the bill for it, minus the things that would be considered normal wear and tear, such as having walls repainted.

Even if my some miracle, you can take care of all the repairs for less than what the deposit is, I'd still keep the rest to compensate me for the time, effort and stress that it took to get all that work done. Take lots of pictures of the state of the place BEFORE you start cleaning it up, just so you have a record of how they trashed the place.

djimi

ProudDUB wrote: »

Even if my some miracle, you can take care of all the repairs for less than what the deposit is, I'd still keep the rest to compensate me for the time, effort and stress that it took to get all that work done. Take lots of pictures of the state of the place BEFORE you start cleaning it up, just so you have a record of how they trashed the place.

You cannot do this as a landlord, can you? I can understand deducting money for lost rent maybe if the repairs were going to take a long time to complete and the place was going to be off the market for a period of time as a result, but I dont think effort and stress will wash as reasons to deduct from a deposit!

borderlinemeath

I wouldn't be giving back a penny. Take plenty of photos before you start repairing the property.

A similar type of thing happened to my OHs property when he let it to a group of guys through an agency. They trashed the place, holes in walls and doors and every bit of furniture had to be skipped along with the carpets. The green bin was also stuffed full of rancid waste that should have been in the regular bin.

The PRTB sent a letter stating that they were informed of non return of deposit on the registry and my OH sent in photos (by registered letter) to prove the damage caused. Not a thing more was said about it and that was almost 7 years ago.

Psygnosis

Hi,

Thanks for all the replys the house is registered with the prtb we took photos but will be going back again this week and Ill video it as well.
So what I'm going to charge for is.
K&N networks gas company to take a look at the fire,
Skip
Bins brown and black bin are stuffed to the gills with household rubbish
I'm going to take the carpets up and leave the varnished floors under neath with out replacing them. As they requested carpets incase there kids fell so we obliged wont be doing this again.
The holes in the wall can hopefully be patched up with " no more holes " and sanded down but I'll charge for all the products.
The furniture appatently you can only charge up to around 50% of purchase price for these items from what I've read.
I'll update later and let you know how it goes.

quietsailor

Psygnosis wrote: »

Hi,

Thanks for all the replys the house is registered with the prtb we took photos but will be going back again this week and Ill video it as well.
So what I'm going to charge for is.
K&N networks gas company to take a look at the fire,
Skip
Bins brown and black bin are stuffed to the gills with household rubbish
I'm going to take the carpets up and leave the varnished floors under neath with out replacing them. As they requested carpets incase there kids fell so we obliged wont be doing this again.
The holes in the wall can hopefully be patched up with " no more holes " and sanded down but I'll charge for all the products.
The furniture appatently you can only charge up to around 50% of purchase price for these items from what I've read.
I'll update later and let you know how it goes.

Be VERY careful of doing work yourself, other posters on here will be more clued in than me but my memory of comments in other threads is that you cannot charge money / keep money from a deposit if you do the work yourself. So filling the skip or patching walls cannot be charged for

You may be reported to the PRTB, if these people are as big a bunch of a**holes as you describe - and I think somewhere in the thread a tenant even called them scum - they will think everyone owes them something and will want compensation so Meticulously document everything.

1. Videos for an overall view of the house, inside and out.
2. Close up views of the damage to the house and the fittings. If you have pictures of the items damaged before they move in put a copy of that photo next to the picture of the damage.
3. Get repair quotes for all damage.
4. Get quotes for the rubbish removal from registered people (man-with-a-van quotes who don't have rubbish removal certification don't count)

Prioritise the deposit money
Your priorities should be to use their deposit for;

Work that has to be carried out by registered people first.
House cleaning second.
House repairs third.
Furniture replacement fourth.

The reason I list them that way is that certain jobs (showers, gas fires) CANNOT be carried out by you.
The house has to be cleaned so no-one will argue with deducting that cost, as long as you have proof it was dirty and receipts for the cleaning**
Next holes in the walls cannot be called fair wear and tear in any circumstances - if the tenants bring you to the PRTB over you using their deposit no-one can say a hole in the wall is your liability.
Furniture is a grey area. Unless you have good photos proving it was good quality furniture before they moved in the PRTB may force you to give this portion of the deposit back.


Get valuations for this work first, deduct that from the deposit. Now looking at the remainder buy furniture. Deduct 50% of the furniture costs and now do you have enough to cover the skip hire and wall repair?

** = When I said cleaning above I meant removing the rubbish & dirty carpets/fittings etc. If its really bad and after you've sent the deposit in the 4 ways I said above think of hiring a cleaning company - why should you have to clean their sh!t

quietsailor

One more thing, if the holes are very big you may want to consider cutting them bigger and into a regular shape - patching plasterboard will only work up to a certain diameter, I wouldn't like to try it on holes bigger than 4 inches in diameter.

Putting in new plasterboard works especially well if this brings the patch across a timber upright, it gives added rigidity.

After you prepare the hole put timber behind the plasterboard and so some is behind the existing board and some is out in the hole, screw through the existing plasterboard to the timber. Now you have can put in the new plasterboard and screw it to the timber (and the upright if possible).

NIMAN

Take photos, give back nothing, and tell them you'll see them in court if they want to take it further.

Normal wear and tear is fair enough, but there's no excuse for acting like animals.

Francie Barrett

Just on the above advice, make sure you keep receipts for everything, in case the PRTB get involved. It sounds like the cost of replacements is easily going to exceed the deposit, so you won't need to expense for "your" labour in getting the place clean. Photos is a great idea as well.

Psygnosis

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Just on the above advice, make sure you keep receipts for everything, in case the PRTB get involved. It sounds like the cost of replacements is easily going to exceed the deposit, so you won't need to expense for "your" labour in getting the place clean. Photos is a great idea as well.

Hi thanks for the advice I have 2 more questions I'm going to purchase a new table and chairs probably on adverts.ie so it will be second hand but very good quality. Can I charge a portion of this against the deposit. If I get a receipt. Also would it be worth my while contacting the ptrb myself to let them know the state the house was left in

quietsailor

Psygnosis wrote: »

Hi thanks for the advice I have 2 more questions I'm going to purchase a new table and chairs probably on adverts.ie so it will be second hand but very good quality. Can I charge a portion of this against the deposit. If I get a receipt. Also would it be worth my while contacting the ptrb myself to let them know the state the house was left in

Table and chairs second hand - I don't know, the PRTB might only allow you a percentage of their value, they might also say your replacing like for like and allow you the full value against the deposit. One thing is for sure - before you purchase tell the vendor you need a receipt because without one the PRTB will allow you nothing


Contacting the PRTB - you have nothing to lose by sending them a letter, call it a "statement of intent" that you may be considering further charges against xyz persons in respect of tenancy number###. IF you do this register the letter in some way so you have a paper trail that it was sent - they probably won't acknowledge it, i've found it near impossible ot get them to reply to anythin other than a tenancy registration or a request for the name of a landlord of a house that had anti-social behaviour near to us

djimi

When it comes to furniture as far as I know you can only charge to repace it with furniture of the quality and condition it would have been after normal wear and tear during their tenancy. In other words you cannot "profit" (for want of a better term) from the replacement; you must be seen only to be replacing what was broken with like for like.

Burnbaby76

I have been reading this post with intrigue... I had a similar issue, and would be interested in how your situation pans out.

In my situation, I had to enlist the services of a plasterer, as I didn't have the necessary skill set to repair the damage caused.

I have no difficulty dealing with wear and tear - however holes in walls are certainly not that.

Keep us posted!

B.

Messi54

Absolutely ridiculous behaviour by presumably a group/couple of scumbags, photo everything and keep receipts for any expenses, wouldn't even consider giving them a cent back. Can't imagine there being any money left after covering the costs anyway. Have rented for almost 10 years sharing with different people and never had a hole in the wall/chair missing/fireplace part stolen incident anywhere I've lived or by anyone i lived with. If they get difficult you can always mention getting the gaurds involved due to the theft and criminal damage done to your property

fasttalkerchat

After 4 years it is acceptable that you would have to repaint and re-carpet.
Give them the chance to collect rubbish etc. Charge them whatever it costs you to replace anything that isn't wear and tear.

borderlinemeath

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

After 4 years it is acceptable that you would have to repaint and re-carpet.
Give them the chance to collect rubbish etc. Charge them whatever it costs you to replace anything that isn't wear and tear.

Any decent tenant would do this before they move out in order to get their deposit back.

Repainting and recarpeting is fine. Did you not look at the other list of degredation that the tenants inflicted?

fasttalkerchat

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Did you not look at the other list of degredation that the tenants inflicted?

Yes, I said to charge them for all of that.

katisha

From what you've described they are not entitled to their deposit back at all - and probably they know this too! In fact they may owe you money!

mikemac1

Electric showers break, after four years you can replace this
Also the place was due to be painted anyway, so I wouldn't charge for the painting. It's just one of these things that has to be done every few years

I'm unsure over the carpet

Everything else is fair game for the deposit