Red Grouse habitat

djflawless

just wondering what the ideal size/grouse ratio on heather land is?if i had say 50 acres of bog what would be a healthy number to have on it without worrying about them ruining vegetation too much..and for the birds to be healthy?
cheers

wildfowler94

djflawless wrote: »

just wondering what the ideal size/grouse ratio on heather land is?if i had say 50 acres of bog what would be a healthy number to have on it without worrying about them ruining vegetation too much..and for the birds to be healthy?
cheers

Is there much grouse present?

Tawny Owl

We are putting two breeding pairs on our Gun Club lands soon on a raised bog we have been trapping and doing vermin control for the last two Months though I am not directly involved at this stage I will try and find out we have all the signs up saying Posion laid and traps in operation with no one to be allowed on the raised bog you will need grit in small piles as they need that to help when feeding and fresh running water

Tawny Owl

wildfowler94 wrote: »

Is there much grouse present?

I would hazzard a guess there's no Grouse present at all on his land or anywhere around him they are nearly impossible to reintroduce but a lovely bird

irish setter

the grouse numbers depend on management of the ground. on ground where there is no management you might be lucky to have a breeding pair every square kilometer. they don't ruin vegetation and need young heather to survive and rear chicks. burning old heather encourages new growth but for grouse they also need older heather for shelter. this is why the heather is burnt in stripes of about 25 meters wide year on year, burning the oldest heather in 10 year cycles. fox and crow control is also needed but medication and grit is usually not needed.

Birdnuts

Tawny Owl wrote: »

I am not directly involved at this stage I will try and find out we have all the signs up saying Posion laid

Be carefull here lad - I know people put up these signs nowadays simply to frighten off dog walkers etc. on private land, but with the new laws banning all poison meat baits(and all other poison baits, except covered bait for rodents) you could bring down a world of pain on yourself if there was an incident locally involving someones pet, working dog or a protected species.

TriggerPL

Birdnuts wrote: »

Be carefull here lad - I know people put up these signs nowadays simply to frighten off dog walkers etc. on private land, but with the new laws banning all poison meat baits(and all other baits except covered bait for rodents) you could bring down a world of pain on yourself if there was an incident locally involving someones pet or a protected species.

bet me two it !

on the strip burning this is not a matter of just burning strips , it a carefull process that involves lots of people and proper conditions . you dont burn it when it really dry because you ruin the seed . you burn it when it drying or lightly damp this cracks the heather and starts the process over again .

Grouse are a full time job , and you need a lot of bog to do it right . one breeding pair you will be lucky to get a return out of them .

but best of luck and if you ever looking for help with a count , id be more than happy to work the pointer and the mates pointers aswell . we do the count on the mountain down ere every year . and glad to say there on a steady climb .

Birdnuts

djflawless wrote: »

just wondering what the ideal size/grouse ratio on heather land is?if i had say 50 acres of bog what would be a healthy number to have on it without worrying about them ruining vegetation too much..and for the birds to be healthy?
cheers

You should drop the lads at the Irish Grey Partridge Trust an email on this - they also do work on Grouse with Gun clubs around the country and would have alot of info to share on this topic

http://www.greypartridge.ie/conservation/conservation-in-action.357.html

The Boleybeg Grouse project in Leitrim is another source of info - its run by the NPWS in conjunction with a number of local Gun Clubs:)

TriggerPL

Birdnuts wrote: »

You should drop the lads at the Irish Grey Partridge Trust an email on this - they also do work on Grouse with Gun clubs around the country and would have alot of info to share on this topic

http://www.greypartridge.ie/conservation/conservation-in-action.357.html

The Boleybeg Grouse project in Leitrim is another source of info - its run by the NPWS in conjunction with a number of local Gun Clubs:)

big mouth now there all going to be down ere !! :D

there is no grouse in leitrim i swear:cool:

Birdnuts

TriggerPL wrote: »

big mouth now there all going to be down ere !! :D

there is no grouse in leitrim i swear:cool:

My apologies!!:o:(;) - but keep up the good work anyways:cool:

Tawny Owl

Birdnuts wrote: »

Be carefull here lad - I know people put up these signs nowadays simply to frighten off dog walkers etc. on private land, but with the new laws banning all poison meat baits(and all other poison baits, except covered bait for rodents) you could bring down a world of pain on yourself if there was an incident locally involving someones pet, working dog or a protected species.

Its been tested already a local person called the Garda in connection with the signs posted on the land and we as a Club have all the permisson which is Highlighted in a document as we are doing this in conjuction with a Goverment body to introduce Grouse back into our area it has established this is a prime area for the Grouse so the person got no where as the area is Goverment property with us having shooting rights but most of all the chance of Grouse breeding again.

Birdnuts

Tawny Owl wrote: »

Its been tested already a local person called the Garda in connection with the signs posted on the land and we as a Club have all the permisson which is Highlighted in a document as we are doing this in conjuction with a Goverment body to introduce Grouse back into our area it has established this is a prime area for the Grouse so the person got no where as the area is Goverment property with us having shooting rights but most of all the chance of Grouse breeding again.

The warning signs themselves are probably legal(I saw similiar ones in an industrial estate recently which had bait boxes for rodents operated by Rentokill)- I was just pointing out the actual law now regarding the banning of the use of poison baits against vermin/unprotected species, other then non-meat based poisons for certain rodents. There are other Grouse projects being run in conjunction with the NPWS and as far as I know they all are run within this law. Here is the law I'm reffering to :http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/si/0481.html

Its long winded but the main points are

1) All poison baits are banned for use, other then certain rodenticides under statuatory conditions i.e. as covered non-meat bait for rodents.

2) that a special Ministerial Order/licence with strict conditions and NPWS oversight is needed for any individual or group to engage in any activity that deviates from its provisions.

PS:Regarding point 2 - Maybe these special cases do arise but I haven't heard about any to date(maybe this is what Tawny is referring too??).

TriggerPL

Tawny Owl wrote: »

Birdnuts wrote: »

Be carefull here lad - I know people put up these signs nowadays simply to frighten off dog walkers etc. on private land, but with the new laws banning all poison meat baits(and all other poison baits, except covered bait for rodents) you could bring down a world of pain on yourself if there was an incident locally involving someones pet, working dog or a protected species.

Its been tested already a local person called the Garda in connection with the signs posted on the land and we as a Club have all the permisson which is Highlighted in a document as we are doing this in conjuction with a Goverment body to introduce Grouse back into our area it has established this is a prime area for the Grouse so the person got no where as the area is Goverment property with us having shooting rights but most of all the chance of Grouse breeding again.

As bird nut pointed out . Because of the birds of pray release in Ireland in the last few years , the use of poisoned meat is now against the law , if your gun club has permission to do this , well and gud but I'd be asking to see this permission before giving any help . And I cant see them giving special permission for grouse when other projects are been ran with out it . Good look with the grouse !

Tawny Owl

Birdnuts wrote: »

The warning signs themselves are probably legal(I saw similiar ones in an industrial estate recently which had bait boxes for rodents operated by Rentokill)- I was just pointing out the actual law now regarding the banning of the use of poison baits against vermin/unprotected species, other then non-meat based poisons for certain rodents. There are other Grouse projects being run in conjunction with the NPWS and as far as I know they all are run within this law. Here is the law I'm reffering to :http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/si/0481.html

Its long winded but the main points are

1) All poison baits are banned for use, other then certain rodenticides under statuatory conditions i.e. as covered non-meat bait for rodents.

2) that a special Ministerial Order/licence with strict conditions and NPWS oversight is needed for any individual or group to engage in any activity that deviates from its provisions.

PS:Regarding point 2 - Maybe these special cases do arise but I haven't heard about any to date(maybe this is what Tawny is referring too??).

Point two is correct and it is with the NPWS over seeing the the whole management its themselves that supplied the traps the Birds and there is no meat bait used.it was just decieded it is a prime area to establish the Grouse in its a massive area of Bog land