New Detention Centre, Lusk

martinn123

Go ahead for a New Detention Centre at Oberstown, Lusk, with a capital budget of E50M.

Good news/ bad news for the area.....your thoughts.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2012/0403/1224314298671.html

cowzerp

Don't think it will have any bearing on the area as far as prisoners go to be honest.

martinn123

Yea, but I was thinking more along the lines, of 50M spend, how many local jobs, say in Construction.
Then when it opens, again how many local jobs.
I appreciate, as a detention centre, there is little impact from the detainees, except when they escape, plenty of times I have heard the Siren from the existing Centre indicating someone has done a runner.

Few years ago, one of my lads made his Communion from a local school, with one detainee from Oberstown, apparently he had a great day out with his Granny, did the rounds of family, to show off new clothes, then skipped off, took the cops a week to catch him:)

LeoB

With the closing of Gardá stations there may not be the manpower to catch anyone if they do take off on a runner;)

Sewage plant, dump, Thornton hall, Garda stations closing, generally poor services and now a detention centre. Why dont we make a big list for the dept of dumping so they can throw more stuff out this way. Now it must be of no benefit to local community;)

On a serious note, Apart from a few jobs in construction and possibly security when under construction I dont see it bringing anything else to the area. Unlike years ago there will be huge compliance issues to deal with regarding staff working with young people so not so sure there will be the jobs for locals. Mind you it if there was it would be great boost for the area.

Cardinal Richelieu

LeoB wrote: »

With the closing of Gardá stations there may not be the manpower to catch anyone if they do take off on a runner;)

Sewage plant, dump, Thornton hall, Garda stations closing, generally poor services and now a detention centre. Why dont we make a big list for the dept of dumping so they can throw more stuff out this way. Now it must be of no benefit to local community;)

On a serious note, Apart from a few jobs in construction and possibly security when under construction I dont see it bringing anything else to the area. Unlike years ago there will be huge compliance issues to deal with regarding staff working with young people so not so sure there will be the jobs for locals. Mind you it if there was it would be great boost for the area.

Few people living locally already work there, might be a reason why people seem indifferent to the extension.

SeaSide

LeoB wrote: »

With the closing of Gardá stations there may not be the manpower to catch anyone if they do take off on a runner;)

That could actually be an issue if there is not Garda presence in the area.

LeoB wrote: »

Sewage plant, dump, Thornton hall, Garda stations closing, generally poor services and now a detention centre. Why dont we make a big list for the dept of dumping so they can throw more stuff out this way. Now it must be of no benefit to local community;)

Don't forget Bremore super port and St Ita's

Cardinal Richelieu

SeaSide wrote: »

That could actually be an issue if there is not Garda presence in the area.

Don't forget Bremore super port and St Ita's

Nothing wrong with St Ita's, it has provided a vital service in NCD since 1900. Quite a few NCD people had family members in St Itas over the years, some of them were even mentally ill;)

I came across an account recently in one of the Skerries "Time and Tide" Local History books recounting how a local Skerries doctor credited the decrease of mental illness in Skerries with the coming of the bicycle. High mental illness rates in NCD were a serious problem and remember St Ita's capacity was 1,200 patients. I don't think the new Central Mental Hospital will even have 200 patients.

Seriously do, this is starting to descend into we are getting "dumped(pardon the pun) upon" thread. Sure we might as well add the Airport to the list, all those fuel filled Airplanes flying over are heads day in day out. Where we ever asked? Or the M1, look at all that car pollution spreading through the heart of NCD. Ironically the worst thing that has happened to NCD IMHO is the poorly planned housing expansion in the last 40 years around towns such as Rush, Lusk, Balbriggan,Swords and Skerries. But you don't hear much about that because most of us live in those housing developments and most likely wouldn't be living in NCD today without them.

T-Maxx

I've no problem with the facility in principle, but €50m?!:eek:

xxkarenxx

martinn123 wrote: »

I appreciate, as a detention centre, there is little impact from the detainees, except when they escape, plenty of times I have heard the Siren from the existing Centre indicating someone has done a runner.

I think you must be mistaken regarding the siren. There is no siren alerting of an abscond or attempt at escape. Official statistics indicates there have been only 2 absconds since 2007.


Here is a more comprehensive press release regarding the expansion.

http://www.dcya.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=1842

Dobie

I wonder if people in Beaumont would add the hospital in their area to a sh1t list.
Hell whole that it is St Itas has been of service to locals.

Wishbone Ash

martinn123 wrote: »

plenty of times I have heard the Siren from the existing Centre indicating someone has done a runner

I have worked in Oberstown and can assure you that there is no siren.

SeaSide wrote: »

and St Ita's

That's a bit unfair to the many residents in St Ita's with a mental illness and intellectual disability. Most people around the country would be delighted to have a health facility in their area and it provides over 600 jobs - 75% of the staff living in north county Dublin.

LeoB

Cardinal Richelieu wrote: »

Nothing wrong with St Ita's, it has provided a vital service in NCD since 1900. Quite a few NCD people had family members in St Itas over the years, some of them were mentally ill.

I think where some people are coming from in regard to St. Itas is the state of the place. It was featured in a documentary on R.T.E about 3 years ago and they done the tabloid job on it only showing the derilict parts for the most, very little of the good work they do over there. It is a wonderful place that provides a good service to people with mental health issues and some handicapped people who live there.

Cardinal Richelieu wrote: »

I came across an account recently in one of the Skerries "Time and Tide" Local History books recounting how a local Skerries doctor credited the decrease of mental illness in Skerries with the coming of the bicycle. High mental illness rates in NCD were a serious problem and remember St Ita's capacity was 1,200 patients. I don't think the new Central Mental Hospital will even have 200 patients..

Were the rates higher than anywhere else in Ireland? There was quite a bit of poverty and often where you have poverty you have a low rate of literacey. This appears to have been often confused with mental health especially back in 30s, 40s and 50s. I used to visit someone there and one or two PEOPLE (cases ) I learned about would send a shiver up your spine. They had became instatutionalised over the years.

Cardinal Richelieu wrote: »

Seriously do, this is starting to descend into we are getting "dumped(pardon the pun) upon" thread. Sure we might as well add the Airport to the list, all those fuel filled Airplanes flying over are heads day in day out. Where we ever asked? Or the M1, look at all that car pollution spreading through the heart of NCD. Ironically the worst thing that has happened to NCD IMHO is the poorly planned housing expansion in the last 40 years around towns such as Rush, Lusk, Balbriggan,Swords and Skerries. But you don't hear much about that because most of us live in those housing developments and most likely wouldn't be living in NCD today without them.

A lot feel we are being dumped on. The house for the most part were needed and peoples problems stem from the lack of facilities put in when they were being built. Look at St. Catherines in Rush built over 30 years ago and gets a playground 2 1/2 years ago. As you have often said yourself "no forward planning" or joined up thinking.

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I have worked in Oberstown and can assure you that there is no siren.

That's a bit unfair to the many residents in St Ita's with a mental illness and intellectual disability. Most people around the country would be delighted to have a health facility in their area and it provides over 600 jobs - 75% of the staff living in north county Dublin.

I was in Portrane last year and drove up around the hospital. I walked around for a bit and found a door open and wondered in. I didnt go to far far but the person with me was suprised at its size and layout. There is massive potential. It is a superb facility which in my opinion should be bit by bit developed primarley as a care unit for the mental health area but it could also be used for a number of other things which I have suggested in the past, Addiction centre, Step down care to release people from general hospitals. The place is massive and while it looks awful from the outside has the potential to be developed over a period of time.

A new unit was opened by president McAleese just before her term was up and it is providing independent living, dignity and self esteen to some people who live there. They are I believe doing some educational work where as 40 years ago they might well have been left on scrapheap. So maybe it could also be used as some type of educational facility for people who are in a bit of trouble, like a boot camp?

SeaSide

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

That's a bit unfair to the many residents in St Ita's with a mental illness and intellectual disability. Most people around the country would be delighted to have a health facility in their area and it provides over 600 jobs - 75% of the staff living in north county Dublin.

Context of my comment was in relation to development not the existing facility hence reference to Bremore port in the same sentence.

martinn123

xxkarenxx wrote: »

I think you must be mistaken regarding the siren. There is no siren alerting of an abscond or attempt at escape. Official statistics indicates there have been only 2 absconds since 2007.


Here is a more comprehensive press release regarding the expansion.

http://www.dcya.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=1842[/QUOTE]

I certainly have a recollection of having a pint in my local, '' Murtaghs of Ballough'' now sadly closed, and being alerted by a siren, Gerry Murtagh would then patrol the car park, as cars had been stolen in the past, in the act of absconding.

Also, I '' Googled '' these

http://www.oireachtas-debates.gov.ie/D/0496/D.0496.199811110169.html

OK, its from 1998,

http://www.fingal-independent.ie/news/youth-caused-4600-damage-to-his-room-at-lusk-boys-centre-792806.html

bit more recent, 2001

http://www.argus.ie/news/obituaries/found-in-dundalk-after-making-966451.html
2002

http://www.kildarestreet.com/sendebates/?gid=2004-10-20.227.0
2004

Nothing more recent than that, seems the problem has been solved

xxkarenxx

I'm not sure what the siren you heard was but I know it was not from Oberstown, as I and another poster said there is no siren.

€50 million does seem like an awful lot of money to spend but hopefully it will be a better service than the current system of St Pats.

Cardinal Richelieu

xxkarenxx wrote: »

I'm not sure what the siren you heard was but I know it was not from Oberstown, as I and another poster said there is no siren.

€50 million does seem like an awful lot of money to spend but hopefully it will be a better service than the current system of St Pats.

Its was originally €90.

whistler741

martinn123 wrote: »

Yea, but I was thinking more along the lines, of 50M spend, how many local jobs, say in Construction.
Then when it opens, again how many local jobs.
I appreciate, as a detention centre, there is little impact from the detainees, except when they escape, plenty of times I have heard the Siren from the existing Centre indicating someone has done a runner.

Few years ago, one of my lads made his Communion from a local school, with one detainee from Oberstown, apparently he had a great day out with his Granny, did the rounds of family, to show off new clothes, then skipped off, took the cops a week to catch him:)

Your right about the sirens, they were from Trinity House when someone escaped, not used anymore

whistler741

xxkarenxx wrote: »

I think you must be mistaken regarding the siren. There is no siren alerting of an abscond or attempt at escape. Official statistics indicates there have been only 2 absconds since 2007.


Here is a more comprehensive press release regarding the expansion.


The sirens were from Trinity House, haven't been used in years

Dizzyblonde

Hi whistler741, welcome to Boards

As a general rule we don't revive threads that haven't been posted in for years, so I'll close this one but feel free to start a new thread.