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Thinking of subbing for a year

  • 19-03-2012 9:26pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    So I'm (hopefully) finishing my physics degree in a few months and although I think I'd like to go on and do further study but the idea of taking a year out and earning some money appeals to me. I often hear that there's a dearth of physics and maths teachers in the country, so I figure if there's anyone who can get a job subbing a secondary school without a teaching diploma it's someone with a physics degree. I also have a second-hand story about one of the guys in a lab in college working as a sub for a year to fund his masters, so I figure it must be doable.

    I think I would make a decent teacher. I understand the subjects well and I find I am usually good at explaining things and helping people. Though my lack of real experience may be a problem here. I did correcting for first year homeworks and tests this year and I have helped people in years bellow me a little but I never did real tutoring or grinds.

    So well...how do I go about doing this? I know I need to be Garda vetted and I had a look on the teaching council website about registering, but it seems to only be for people who have achieved teaching degrees which made me question can I actually do this? I have anecdotal evidence but is it true? Is there a decent chance of the council, ASTI or a school or whoever is important in this sort of thing make a special allowance in this sort of situation?

    Does anyone have advice? Should I be doing this? How should I go about it? Any personal experiences?


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 221 ✭✭ lestat21


    Give up!! My degree included Honours Maths. I am a fully qualified and experienced teacher and I didnt get any work this academic year until February!!


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,491 Mod ✭✭✭✭ dambarude


    You're not qualified to sub. Plenty of qualified teachers can't find any work. It boils down to that, however good or otherwise you might be as a teacher.


  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    :(

    Wonder what the hell that other guy did then to manage it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 221 ✭✭ lestat21


    More than likely he did his masters 5 or 10 years ago when times were good and sub teachers were in really short supply .....


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 12,320 Mod ✭✭✭✭ byhookorbycrook


    Second-hand story may not be accurate and times have also changed, since there is a huge oversupply of teachers,subbing for a year is most unlikely without qualifications.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭ seavill


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    . I often hear that there's a dearth of physics and maths teachers in the country, so I figure if there's anyone who can get a job subbing a secondary school without a teaching diploma it's someone with a physics degree.

    nope, there are so many qualified subs even with experience you have almost no hope of getting subbing, unless your father is a principal:p (touchy subject with most people)

    So well...how do I go about doing this? I know I need to be Garda vetted and I had a look on the teaching council website about registering, but it seems to only be for people who have achieved teaching degrees which made me question can I actually do this? I have anecdotal evidence but is it true? Is there a decent chance of the council, ASTI or a school or whoever is important in this sort of thing make a special allowance in this sort of situation?

    I do not mean to come across as rude so apologies if I do but what sort of situation. You are looking to take a year out from studies with from what you said no intention of actually becoming a teacher so why would there be a special allowance for you. Even if you had intentions on becoming a teacher there are qualified teachers out there to do it, people who have 3 or 4 years experience, who is a principal going to pick in all honest, again don't mean to sound harsh

    Does anyone have advice? Should I be doing this? How should I go about it? Any personal experiences?

    Speaking from the experience in my school this year there is about 40 teahcers in the school, many not on full hours. We only have 1 sub that comes in when needed to do the subbing. I have no memory of anyone else coming in this year to do it. There are teachers who are on very few hours in the school and even they can not get many hours to fill up their timetable weekly.

    "Wonder what the hell that other guy did then to manage it."
    I would guess he had a relation in management within the school, the school were extremely desperate and had exhausted every other option or was this a number of years ago, if it was it explains a lot, if it was recent he was just extremely lucky with some circumstances


  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    Of course I wouldn't expect special treatment. I'm not mad. (on the comment of never wanting to become a teacher, I don't see myself becoming a school teacher (though I would not rule it out 100%) but I think being a lecturer is something I could go for)

    I guess I didn't realise there were so many teachers vying for positions. Doing a physics degree I don't have any friends who are teachers or going in that direction (some were considering it at the start, but they decided against it or dropped out) so all I've ever heard was the lack of physics teachers, not about an overflow of qualified teachers (I know I probably should have figured from the moratorium on hiring).

    I wasn't expecting to be chosen over qualified teachers, just that there would be enough demand so that there would be something left for me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭ seavill


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    Of course I wouldn't expect special treatment. I'm not mad. (on the comment of never wanting to become a teacher, I don't see myself becoming a school teacher (though I would not rule it out 100%) but I think being a lecturer is something I could go for)

    I guess I didn't realise there were so many teachers vying for positions. Doing a physics degree I don't have any friends who are teachers or going in that direction (some were considering it at the start, but they decided against it or dropped out) so all I've ever heard was the lack of physics teachers, not about an overflow of qualified teachers (I know I probably should have figured from the moratorium on hiring).

    I wasn't expecting to be chosen over qualified teachers, just that there would be enough demand so that there would be something left for me.

    Physics would also be one of the choice subjects and not one of the bigger ones at that.

    In reality whatever the subject there is very little subbing anywhere I know, again unless somebody knows somebody. Again if that person did their masters years ago like someone said there was huge demand for subs but in recent years the rules for how you can use subs changed.
    Before you could use subs for covering teachers going to matches etc. however nowadays this is not the case. Activities would have been the biggest user of subs but not the case anymore.

    Apologies for sounding so harsh in my last comment I didn't mean for it to come across that way


  • Registered Users Posts: 909 gaeilgebeo


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    Of course I wouldn't expect special treatment. I'm not mad. (on the comment of never wanting to become a teacher, I don't see myself becoming a school teacher (though I would not rule it out 100%) but I think being a lecturer is something I could go for)

    I guess I didn't realise there were so many teachers vying for positions. Doing a physics degree I don't have any friends who are teachers or going in that direction (some were considering it at the start, but they decided against it or dropped out) so all I've ever heard was the lack of physics teachers, not about an overflow of qualified teachers (I know I probably should have figured from the moratorium on hiring).

    I wasn't expecting to be chosen over qualified teachers, just that there would be enough demand so that there would be something left for me.

    If pyhsics is offered as a leaving cert subject in a school, and remember not all schools do, it will be one class group for 5 periods a week!
    You have a slim to no chance of getting a job subbing as you are not qualified and there are hundreds of qualified teachers crying out for work.
    Teaching is not just some handy number anyone can do for a year to earn some extra cash! :confused:


  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    gaeilgebeo wrote: »
    If pyhsics is offered as a leaving cert subject in a school, and remember not all schools do, it will be one class group for 5 periods a week!
    You have a slim to no chance of getting a job subbing as you are not qualified and there are hundreds of qualified teachers crying out for work.
    Teaching is not just some handy number anyone can do for a year to earn some extra cash! :confused:
    Oh hey, I know my post was a bit casual but I don't think teaching is an unskilled job and I don't think educating is a light duty. I know it's not just an odd-job to earn cash. If this plan actually came to fruition (looking at these replies, it seems rather unlikely) I would take it very seriously.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 909 gaeilgebeo


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    Oh hey, I know my post was a bit casual but I don't think teaching is an unskilled job and I don't think educating is a light duty. I know it's not just an odd-job to earn cash. If this plan actually came to fruition (looking at these replies, it seems rather unlikely) I would take it very seriously.

    If I were to decide to try out dentistry for a few months and take it very
    seriously, would you come to me for a filling? ;)

    I just can't understand why people feel it is totally acceptable to "play" teacher!


  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    You make a fair point.


  • Registered Users Posts: 262 ✭✭ Fizzical


    Schools offering physics would have at least 2 class groups a week, one at 5th year and one at 6th. Some large boys schools would have more than one class group at each level.

    Other schools do not offer physics or have taken it off the curriculum in recent years, but a few offer it outside of normal school hours.

    You could also sub for general science classes but these could be filled by part-time teachers within the school.

    You could enquire from schools within your catchment area. Physics is a minority subject so it may not be possible to earn enough to keep yourself even if you did get hours.

    But it is also quite difficult to get physics subs when needed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 262 ✭✭ Fizzical


    gaeilgebeo wrote: »
    If I were to decide to try out dentistry for a few months and take it very
    seriously, would you come to me for a filling? ;)

    I just can't understand why people feel it is totally acceptable to "play" teacher!
    A bit harsh. The OP will have a physics degree. With the poor quality of the old H Dip, many of us learned how to 'play' teacher on the job.


  • Registered Users Posts: 909 gaeilgebeo


    Fizzical wrote: »
    A bit harsh. The OP will have a physics degree. With the poor quality of the old H Dip, many of us learned how to 'play' teacher on the job.

    Not one bit harsh.
    As for your point on "playing" teacher : times have changed.
    There are more than enough unemployed qualified teachers available to sub as well as qualified part time teachers who have had their hours cut.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,421 ✭✭✭ solerina


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    So I'm (hopefully) finishing my physics degree in a few months and although I think I'd like to go on and do further study but the idea of taking a year out and earning some money appeals to me. I often hear that there's a dearth of physics and maths teachers in the country, so I figure if there's anyone who can get a job subbing a secondary school without a teaching diploma it's someone with a physics degree. I also have a second-hand story about one of the guys in a lab in college working as a sub for a year to fund his masters, so I figure it must be doable.

    I think I would make a decent teacher. I understand the subjects well and I find I am usually good at explaining things and helping people. Though my lack of real experience may be a problem here. I did correcting for first year homeworks and tests this year and I have helped people in years bellow me a little but I never did real tutoring or grinds.

    So well...how do I go about doing this? I know I need to be Garda vetted and I had a look on the teaching council website about registering, but it seems to only be for people who have achieved teaching degrees which made me question can I actually do this? I have anecdotal evidence but is it true? Is there a decent chance of the council, ASTI or a school or whoever is important in this sort of thing make a special allowance in this sort of situation?

    Does anyone have advice? Should I be doing this? How should I go about it? Any personal experiences?

    You have nothing to lose by trying to find work, there is often a shortage of teachers in certain subjects, Irish is one and maybe Physics is too. People on here have a huge issue with unqualified teachers doing sub work, and I can see their point, but the fact remains that in some geographical areas there are not any qualified teachers of certain subjects available so you may be lucky that Physics and maths are required in your area. Good Luck !!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭ seavill


    solerina wrote: »
    You have nothing to lose by trying to find work, there is often a shortage of teachers in certain subjects, Irish is one and maybe Physics is too. People on here have a huge issue with unqualified teachers doing sub work, and I can see their point, but the fact remains that in some geographical areas there are not any qualified teachers of certain subjects available so you may be lucky that Physics and maths are required in your area. Good Luck !!

    Some prow on here do have a prob with it. My issue would be someone who has no intention of teaching thinking that sure its a hàndy number anyone can do it. I've nothing else to do for a year so why not.
    If its only for money for a year get a job that doesn't require any qualifications.

    Also an unqualified person with a physics degree is as much use as an Irish teacher taking the class, except the Irish teacher has actually studied teaching

    The physics graduate has no proper idea of the curriculum, any teaching metholodogies classroom management skills. Sure they might be able to go in and open the book and know the material but of that's all it takes to be a teacher sure why did any of us bother getting the proper qualifications. Sure the local chef in the local pub can come in and be the home ec teacher when he's bored in the mornings.

    A rediculuous attitude towards our profession

    BTW OP that was not an attack aimed towards you I was just using that as an example apologies if it came across that way


  • Registered Users Posts: 909 gaeilgebeo


    seavill wrote: »
    Some prow on here do have a prob with it. My issue would be someone who has no intention of teaching thinking that sure its a hàndy number anyone can do it. I've nothing else to do for a year so why not.
    If its only for money for a year get a job that doesn't require any qualifications.

    Also an unqualified person with a physics degree is as much use as an Irish teacher taking the class, except the Irish teacher has actually studied teaching

    The physics graduate has no proper idea of the curriculum, any teaching metholodogies classroom management skills. Sure they might be able to go in and open the book and know the material but of that's all it takes to be a teacher sure why did any of us bother getting the proper qualifications. Sure the local chef in the local pub can come in and be the home ec teacher when he's bored in the mornings.

    A rediculuous attitude towards our profession

    BTW OP that was not an attack aimed towards you I was just using that as an example apologies if it came across that way


    You have hit the nail on the head! The attitude of some of our "colleagues" is appalling, most especially the attempts to "dumb down" the profession. :mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ ríomhaire


    I will admit I my thinking on this was pretty naive and possibly even a little arrogant. Basically I didn't think it through enough.


  • Registered Users Posts: 909 gaeilgebeo


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    I will admit I my thinking on this was pretty naive and possibly even a little arrogant. Basically I didn't think it through enough.

    Ríomhaire, my comment wasn't aimed at you. Of course you are naive, that is fine. What irks me is qualified "professionals" making out that anyone can teach!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭ seavill


    ríomhaire wrote: »
    I will admit I my thinking on this was pretty naive and possibly even a little arrogant. Basically I didn't think it through enough.

    Riomhaire,

    Your thinking was fair enough from your point of view. You felt it was something that you would be able to do, and something that someone you know was able to do before.

    Most of the comments from teachers here were not specifically directed at you it would just be a common theme that would be coming across on many threads of late and unfortunately you got the brunt of it.

    As I said my comments were never meant as an attack towards you and it was definitely nothing personal.

    As someone mentioned you may get lucky and have a school close to you that is in particular need for a physics teacher and the principal may think you would be the best option and who knows it may actually be the perfect job for you after all,
    however I suppose from a teachers point of view, with many of our colleagues out of work (two people I know who are teaching 4 and 5 years each are both losing their jobs in September due to cuts year after year) and thousands more not on full hours because it suits principals to have teacher free ready to jump whenever they say so, I suppose it has become a sore point for many.

    Hope you understand where I and other colleagues here are coming from rather than it being a case of us out to get you or trying to put you off.


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