Irish Times article "Costs of operating State jets decline"

EchoIndia

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0319/1224313530675.html

It's pretty clear that, because of reduced usage, total expenditure has fallen. The cost per mission has probably risen rather than fallen, though, as the fixed costs must be apportioned over a smaller number of flights. However I suppose that sort of reasoning is a bit advanced for most media outlets. Also missing from the calculations is what was spent on commercial flights instead of using the Air Corps. Any assessment of the cost of Government transport would have to factor this in also.

280special

Yep, todays journos seem to find it hard to use a calculator, or in the case of the RTE teletext people a dictionary....

pclive

Anyone know how the Taoiseach has travelled on his recent trips to the states. Did he fly commercially or on the government jet?

xflyer

Of course if you use them less, expenditure is less. But the less they're used, the less the justification for having them in the first place. I would imagine that the higher echelons in the Air Corps are a bit disturbed by this. Hence their Facebook page trumpeting their use on air ambulance missions. But even that could backfire once it becomes clear that it's probably less expensive to hire a specialist civilian air ambulance aircraft.

Of course that is lost on their idiotic Facebook friends.

The British use Commercial aircraft more and more. The most obvious example being the arrival of the Queen in a hired 146. If it's good enough for the Queen it's good enough for Eamon Gilmore and Enda Kenny.

If any journalists worth their salary started to look into this. They might find themselves with quite a story.

kona

xflyer wrote: »

The British use Commercial aircraft more and more. The most obvious example being the arrival of the Queen in a hired 146. If it's good enough for the Queen it's good enough for Eamon Gilmore and Enda Kenny.

I thought the British owned a 146 for the royals and it wasnt hired in?

xflyer

The RAF has 146s but British VIPs regularly hire in aircraft these days. The one that came to Ireland was hired for the occasion. Maybe we should have lent them the Gulfstream?

balkanhawk

Of course if you use them less, expenditure is less. But the less they're used, the less the justification for having them in the first place. I would imagine that the higher echelons in the Air Corps are a bit disturbed by this. Hence their Facebook page trumpeting their use on air ambulance missions. But even that could backfire once it becomes clear that it's probably less expensive to hire a specialist civilian air ambulance aircraft.

Of course that is lost on their idiotic Facebook friends.

Seriously Xflyer?? idiotic Facebook friends..... what are you, 5?
What is wrong with the air corps actually communicating with the public, whom they serve, and letting them know what they do?? For years no one really knew what the defence forces did and now someone has copped onto the social media thing for the better. The defence forces appear to have finally learned the value of using the great PR they generate.

It doesn't look like this civilian air ambulance you mention seems to be gaining much traction with the government or HSE. The air corps appear to be doing a sterling job at the moment whether it is with the helicopters, casa or jets. The cost of these flights is absorbed by the department of defence budget ie if they dont do air ambulance flights they will probably do another flight such as training. There would be no net saving at the end of the day just a duplication of services.

The British use Commercial aircraft more and more. The most obvious example being the arrival of the Queen in a hired 146. If it's good enough for the Queen it's good enough for Eamon Gilmore and Enda Kenny.

If any journalists worth their salary started to look into this. They might find themselves with quite a story.

This story is constantly flogged to death in the papers. To be honest I am tired reading about it as they quote the same figures. A government should have access to an aircraft as long as the costs are reasonable. How would you like Enda arriving for a big meeting in Brussels or US after being crammed into a seat for hours!! Not exactly a good start to a long night of negotiations, The jet allows them to prepare and communicate with government while in the air. Simples.....

xflyer

Balkanhawk, I didn't object to their use of Facebook, merely that their 'friends' haven't a clue judging by the comments made.

The cost of these flights is absorbed by the department of defence budget ie if they dont do air ambulance flights they will probably do another flight such as training. There would be no net saving at the end of the day just a duplication of services.

You don't appear to have any understanding of how aircraft are operated or funded but you've accidentally helped me make my point. Why is the Dept of Defence budget being used? It's a HSE problem. The Defence forces are poorly funded as it is without using it to bail out the health system.

Secondly training flights will be entirely separate from any other flying. Any air ambulance mission will be an additional cost, €4200 an hour or thereabouts. They're not free. If a training flight is cancelled for a mission it will be re-scheduled later.

Also using air ambulance as a justification for having two very expensive jets simply demonstrates they're not needed. The costs are not reasonable. They're expensive luxuries.

Both VIP and air ambulance roles can be done more efficiently and less expensively by hiring in appropriate aircraft from specialist operators as and when required. Enda doesn't have to fly Ryanair at all if he doesn't want to.

Tenger

balkanhawk wrote: »

........A government should have access to an aircraft as long as the costs are reasonable. How would you like Enda arriving for a big meeting in Brussels or US after being crammed into a seat for hours!! Not exactly a good start to a long night of negotiations, The jet allows them to prepare and communicate with government while in the air. Simples.....

I would also be of the opinion that private travel is essential in certain circumstances for Govt ministers. If they are going to important meetings then they need room to work and/or discuss policies in private with their colleagues/advisors/PA's

Personally I will never have anything but disdain for former Environment Minister Dick Roche after I was once sitting behind him on a flight ex-DUB. As his 2 assistants were briefing him on the upcoming matter I could hear most of the conversation and his was aware of his inability to understand what they were actually telling him. The situation was inappropriate and he was an imbecile.