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Dublin Port 2012-2040

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  • Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭ Rock of Gibraltar




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,464 ✭✭✭ munchkin_utd


    Just saw this video on broadsheet.ie

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XehQ1DhAGD0&feature=player_embedded

    Dublin Port Masterplan 2012-2040.

    I like the idea of moving the passenger terminal further upstream, finally makes it properly accessible as a foot passenger.
    its not the passenger (ferry) terminal but the cruise ship terminal thats moving.

    Anyone looking to goto Wales on the ferry will not benefit from this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,278 ✭✭✭ dowlingm


    If land is important why is a bunch of it, albeit not quayside, being allocated to car storage? Why not build a multistory facility?

    While obviously some cargos and flows are reasonable to expect that DPort is the logical handling area, is DPort acting within national policy or just trying to build up capacity before other Irish ports make a case for it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,511 ✭✭✭✭ FreudianSlippers


    30 years is a long time. There's nothing too crazy in there that couldn't be included in a 10 year plan as far as I can see?!


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 31,301 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    Knew this was on the cards, considering the huge increase in Cruise Ships docking in 2011, and the passengers having to embark right in the heart of the industrial areas it was bound to happen.

    2012 Cruise Slots were nearly 100% filled before the end of Sep 2011 so that in it self shows increased traffic arriving. The new cruise passenger terminal will be a big bonus for tourists landing here imo.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,278 ✭✭✭ dubhthach


    I assume they'll have to put some sort of proper pedestrain crossing in at the roundabout for the EastLink Bridge. Given that they are talking about closeness to Luas etc.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 31,301 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    dubhthach wrote: »
    I assume they'll have to put some sort of proper pedestrain crossing in at the roundabout for the EastLink Bridge. Given that they are talking about closeness to Luas etc.

    yep, ive already seen plans showing pedestrian crossings / Traffic Control Signals etc

    One option is an pedestrian over pass, but i dont know how that went down with the head honchos ;)


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 20,995 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Some interesting developments here, but some disappointing elements too.

    The biggest disappointment is that there will be no change to the ferry port. Really this should be placed besides the new cruise ship terminal, where they are currently planning a RoRo terminal. By placing the ferry port here, it could share the check in, security and food facilities of the cruise terminal, while being right across the street from the Luas at the o2.

    Instead they have some undeveloped plan for some sort of frequent bus service connecting the o2 LUAS with the ferry port. But no details on who runs this (they seem to suggest DB), who funds it (DB aren't going to do it for free and almost certainly needs a subsidy) and how frequent it will be?

    The good points is the plans for walkways, cycle paths and observatorys around the port and the softening of the port boundarys. I agree that the port has always felt isolated and unaccessible to the public and this would be a welcome change.

    Also the idea of a freight handling center where freight from the ships could be managed and put on smaller vans for direct transport to the city, as opposed to going out to freight handling facilities around the M50, and then back into the city, seems like a very good idea.


  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭ Madpaddy79


    Anyone know if the cruise terminal building has started?

    Do any cruise ships currently ( when in season ) start out from and finish off at Dublin? Or are all transiting through?


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 31,301 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    Madpaddy79 wrote: »
    Anyone know if the cruise terminal building has started?

    Do any cruise ships currently ( when in season ) start out from and finish off at Dublin? Or are all transiting through?

    In 2011 they're we're all using Dublin as a stop over and I heard that there was meant to be some starting in Dublin in the next year or 2.

    Cruise liner season kick starts in April/may so ill try find out some more.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,453 ✭✭✭ strassenwo!f


    So that plan to redevelop Dublin Port and build lots of property there - has that been scrapped?


  • Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭ bg07


    So that plan to redevelop Dublin Port and build lots of property there - has that been scrapped?
    That went with Bertie, bless him.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 6,365 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Irish Steve


    Better connections for the ferries, and especially for foot passengers would indeed be a good idea, and the concept of a central check in for ferries could also work, an even better idea would be a facility to give cars and their passengers a suitably discounted rate for the port tunnel, given that to use the tunnel for a morning crossing at present adds a significant extra cost or extra time to the journey to the port. The same is true for an evening arrival, to get out of the port also incurs a premium rate charge, if it truly is a PORT tunnel, then surely, a vehicle with absolute requirement to access the port to connect with a ferry should not be hit with the anti commuter charge.

    Some of the ferry crossing times at present are not particularly well suited to public transport connections, and I cannot understand why one of the Stena boats does not carry any foot passengers at all, given the times it runs at. There are buses that serve the ferries, but only one per crossing, and the morning one is not well timed to tie in with anything, so even getting to the port by public transport from somewhere as close as Ashbourne is not easy. Rail that early doesn't work, and buses are possible, but tight.

    The cruise ship enhancements are already needed, and are now a high priority, and again, with the port tunnel facility, flying in to Dublin and then joining a cruise ship should in theory be very easy and straightforward to do, but given the ability of too many companies to screw something this simple up, there will undoubtedly be problems making it work properly, and unfortunately, semi states do not have a good track record in this area, and we're talking 2 large ones here, DAA and Dublin Port, and we've seen just how wrong DAA can be on occasions, and that's in the things people see, let alone the operational problems that are ususally only talked about in specialist forums.

    If I compare Dublin Port to Holyhead, there are good points and bad points. Holyhead has rail links from the terminal to just about anywhere in the UK, and the station is effectively attached to the ferry terminal. I know that's an accident of history, and goes back to the days of the mail boats, but it is definitely a better service that side. What does let it down, in the same way as Dublin, is that the new berths for the traditional ferries are now a long way from the terminal, and the coaches they use to connect to the ferries are not the best, the terminals at the ship are also pretty poor. The old berths for the ferries were a lot closer, but I am guessing that the inner harbour at Holyhead doesn't have the depth to accomodate the much larger ferries that now operate the route, they have grown exponentially over the last 20 years. Unfortunately for them, the fast ferry concept that Stena spent so much on didn't work out, a combination of high fuel costs and poor reliability, especially during winter months, has meant that their high speed vessel has become more of a liability than an asset, and the terminal for it is now a massive waste of space in many ways. Poor port design didn't help, reversing the HSS into the berth at Holyhead is a nightmare in poor weather, and has caused more than a few crossing cancellations.

    In that respect, Irish Ferries at Dublin is a lot better (I've not used Stena as a foot passenger so can't comment on their facilities), the problem is getting to the Irish Ferries terminal, as mentioned, there's one bus per sailing, which is not ideal. What is a LOT nicer is the entire experience, compared to the hassle of travelling by air these days. There is security, and there are ID checks, but nothing as unpleasant as the system that is now the norm at most airports.

    Longer term, I can see the ferries becoming a more used resource for foot passengers, depending on what happens long term to the price of oil, but that's not something that can be assumed.

    It will be interesting to see how much of the Dublin Prt plan does actually happen, and how well it is implemented.

    Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,330 ✭✭✭ AngryLips


    Isn't the requirements of a car ferry sufficiently different from a cruiseliner as to require two different terminals anyway?

    I've never understood why there aren't more services between Dublin and Liverpool given that it is much more of a major population centre than Hollyhead.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 6,365 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Irish Steve


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Isn't the requirements of a car ferry sufficiently different from a cruiseliner as to require two different terminals anyway?

    The ferries would need separate terminals and berths yes, but that's not what DPA are proposing, my understanding is that they are looking at a common check in for all the ferries, instead of multiple check in locations as used now.

    I've never understood why there aren't more services between Dublin and Liverpool given that it is much more of a major population centre than Hollyhead.

    Sailing time and operating costs. The Holyhead route can be sailed twice a day with the present ships, the same ships on Liverpool would only be able to do one crossing in each direction per day, so the cost of the crossing would have to be considerably higher to cover the operating and fuel costs.

    There are Liverpool routes now, but they don't take foot passengers. Some of the ferries are also freight only, so limited numbers of drivers/passengers, which reduces their cabin requirements, Liverpool is about an 8 hour crossing, OK by day, but really needs a cabin for a night crossing.

    At the moment, the money earner is freight, cars are very seasonal and in comparison to freight, more expensive to support, the passengers need facilities that just are not there on freight only services, having used both, I know :D,

    I suspect that's why Stena have kept the HSS, even though it's only doing one crossing a day during a restricted season, the times it runs at are more convenient for car passengers than for freight, which make it more attractive to the car passengers, being able to get to home, regardless of which side of the water it is, without an overnight stop en route, is a significant factor, and the existing cruise ferry timings make getting home without an overnight stop a lot harder to do.

    Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 31,301 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    The ferries would need separate terminals and berths yes, but that's not what DPA are proposing, my understanding is that they are looking at a common check in for all the ferries, instead of multiple check in locations as used now.

    Aren't they looking to develop a new cruise liner berth at the location where the world cruise ship parked a few years back?
    It's just at the east link bridge on the North side of the bay.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭ expectationlost


    did my own mesy version of the explansion of dublin port over the centuries


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