nose to the ground

EastTyrone

whats the best way to get a dogs nose to ground when getting him to qaurter? when my boys trying to qaurter he hardly ever puts his nose to the ground (i have ground with not much sent on it) but when he gets into a ditch its a difrent story!

declan1980

EastTyrone wrote: »

whats the best way to get a dogs nose to ground when getting him to qaurter? when my boys trying to qaurter he hardly ever puts his nose to the ground (i have ground with not much sent on it) but when he gets into a ditch its a difrent story!

Maybe it's no harm for him to have his head up. He'll scent birds on the wind that way

meathstevie

I'd second Declan, on open ground a dog will often work with it's head at normal height taking up scent in the wind. Ditches since they are depressions in the ground and often overgrown with hedges and low growth would not release a scent as easy hence the dog going close in. Also, ditches would often be used as roads by game to travel quite some distances without having to break cover and as such a dog would often have a strong trail to follow through a ditch.

irish setter

what breed do you have. a pointer or setter is generally an air scenting dog and will carry a high head. a springer is mainly ground scenting and will keep a lower head. but this a big generalisation and it also depends on type of cover scent conditions and what type of bird and ground he was trained on. so to make a long story short the dog will carry his head the way he thinks is best considering all the conditions and his breed

deeksofdoom

make sure he is quartering into the wind, better that the dog is air scenting anyway.

4200fps

Often heard when training a young retriever how to use his nose is to get a soft tennis ball and wrap it in a piece of rabbit skin. The advantage of it is the tennis ball rolls into cover and encourages the dog to to use its nose and follow the scent line. Any young dog will love the smell of it. Simple and should be effective.

TriggerPL

EastTyrone wrote: »

whats the best way to get a dogs nose to ground when getting him to qaurter? when my boys trying to qaurter he hardly ever puts his nose to the ground (i have ground with not much sent on it) but when he gets into a ditch its a difrent story!

i think there is your ans if he is gud in the ditches then in feilds he dont need to work as hard cause he know fairly quick if theres birds or not i would stress to much but if your worries bring him into a feild with birds in it and just watch to see if he pick up a gear and flushes , you should see his head drop if he get on a bird

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

Often heard when training a young retriever how to use his nose is to get a soft tennis ball and wrap it in a piece of rabbit skin. The advantage of it is the tennis ball rolls into cover and encourages the dog to to use its nose and follow the scent line. Any young dog will love the smell of it. Simple and should be effective.

no need for rabit skin , just spit on the tennis ball is enough , remember the tennis ball is a pup fav toy and he'll find it with out any rabbit skin or anything ,

what you can try if it a pup your training , is two tennis balls have your dog quatering and as the dog quarters away from you ,drop the ball with out him seeing ya and then hunting him into the path of the ball . Get the retrive and then do the same again soon the dog will realise all he is looking for is close to you and he start to quarter in nice patterns .

alway do this in front of you so your dog aint back tracking !

4200fps

TriggerPL wrote: »

no need for rabit skin , just spit on the tennis ball is enough , remember the tennis ball is a pup fav toy and he'll find it with out any rabbit skin or anything ,

what you can try if it a pup your training , is two tennis balls have your dog quatering and as the dog quarters away from you ,drop the ball with out him seeing ya and then hunting him into the path of the ball . Get the retrive and then do the same again soon the dog will realise all he is looking for is close to you and he start to quarter in nice patterns .

alway do this in front of you so your dog aint back tracking !

or piss on the ball or rub of your butt lol

4200fps

Somehow I think a young dog would enjoy a soft tennis ball wrapped in rabbit skin rather than the smell of spit and a bare ball?. I was stating about encouraging a dog to use its nose. Anyways there's different ways I suppose

TriggerPL

yea but there is a stage in a dog training call fur and feathers and this is when you intruduce rabbit and birds.

like training drug dogs you get them obsessed with there fav toy ie tennis ball or cloth with a knot , and them you leave it in a seal'd box with the drug till it get the sent on it and introduce it that way . ya dont just throw them a bag a coke and say here find me more.

Ronnie Beck

Similar to the tennis ball rabbit skin. Tie the dog up out of sight. Drag a duck/pidgeon/rabbit (or whatever you can get) across open ground with a bit of string to create a trail into some heavy cover. Leave a few feathers and a dummy there not the bird ( unless she's retrieving cold game). Try not to walk along or across the trail. Go back and get the dog and send her for a blind in the direction of the start of the trail.

Been experimenting with this. Didn't work at first with a ball of tied up duck feathers. A freshly snared rabbit drag done the trick though. It was pretty cool. Her nose glued to the trail and went straight into the cover.

TriggerPL

Ronnie Beck wrote: »

Similar to the tennis ball rabbit skin. Tie the dog up out of sight. Drag a duck/pidgeon/rabbit (or whatever you can get) across open ground with a bit of string to create a trail into some heavy cover. Leave a few feathers and a dummy there not the bird ( unless she's retrieving cold game). Try not to walk along or across the trail. Go back and get the dog and send her for a blind in the direction of the start of the trail.

Been experimenting with this. Didn't work at first with a ball of tied up duck feathers. A freshly snared rabbit drag done the trick though. It was pretty cool. Her nose glued to the trail and went straight into the cover.

hey believe it or not but the dog will do this with just a tennis ball , and dragging game across the ground and then giving a dummie as the reward , i could see leading to problems . the golden rule with any retriver when training is never let them fail on a retrive so if you send it following the scent of the game then it should be game it retrives .

if your persistant with the rabbit draged along the ground then skin a rabbit and put the dummie wrapped in it . this at least allowes the dog to see there is a point to following scent .

youve got the right idea just need to tweek you method and you will get better results .

hope i dont come across cheeky . im alway open to learning new ways to get the message across to the dogs .

and peoples expeirences seem to be the best way to learn

Ronnie Beck

TriggerPL wrote: »

if your persistant with the rabbit draged along the ground then skin a rabbit and put the dummie wrapped in it . this at least allowes the dog to see there is a point to following scent .

youve got the right idea just need to tweek you method and you will get better results .

I take your point there she needs to associate a scent with the retrieve. She was never mad about retrieving tennis balls or canvas dummies. She would chase them all day but got easily bored of retrieving them. I use socks stufffed with a log and feathers. Works way better. She doesn't want to give them back;). Must make a fur dummie so if I drag a rabbit I leave a fur dummie etc. Don't want to confuse her. I had her mad for blind retrieves before starting this. It's all a big game to her. Building up to cold game. She's only twelve months so it's a bit early for it yet.

EastTyrone

thanks for the replys lads i put out some tenis balls n rabbit skins and it has helped to put his nose on the ground, the reason i was asking this is because when my springer qaurters ground he runs around with the head in the air and the big fat tongue hitting is ears wondering what hes at lol, but he'l not aurter ground right hel go up in a straight line n then a diagonal and then back into me and hes all over the place, any tips?

TriggerPL

EastTyrone wrote: »

thanks for the replys lads i put out some tenis balls n rabbit skins and it has helped to put his nose on the ground, the reason i was asking this is because when my springer qaurters ground he runs around with the head in the air and the big fat tongue hitting is ears wondering what hes at lol, but he'l not aurter ground right hel go up in a straight line n then a diagonal and then back into me and hes all over the place, any tips?

right you need to stop with any sort of toy or dummie or ball .

and go back a step. over about 4 weeks when quartering if your using a wistle to teach him .

send him left while you walk left then two peeps and turn right showing the dog this is what you want pointing the dog in the direction and then two peeps and back left again . you will be going in a zig zag motion your self .

if he starts to go forward from you change your direction completely away from him that he realises he has to keep an eye on your or you will be gone . Keeping him in front .

do this for about 10 min every day it will come to him and then you will be able to walk in a straight line and just point or he will be quartering naturally.

and then you can go back to introducing the tennis ball.

crackcrack30

If i introduce rabbit scent to a dog in training how difficult is it to get him to only concentrate on phesant (and not timewaste on rabbit) when the sole phesant hunting starts??

cc30

TriggerPL

you dont get your dog to just hunt something he will use his ability to find all game , if your out for phesent and you come across woodcock he will flush it just as well . the biggest thing to train into any dog is the stop or come back cammand .

so you know you have control

blackstairsboy

crackcrack30 wrote: »

If i introduce rabbit scent to a dog in training how difficult is it to get him to only concentrate on phesant (and not timewaste on rabbit) when the sole phesant hunting starts??

cc30

If the breeding is behind the dog he will have no problem hunting pheasant woodcock etc. To prevent a young dog becoming a bit too strong on rabbit scent do not shoot any rabbits flushed by him just let them on and don't reward the dog for flushing them. Shooting at the rabbits flushed will reward the dog which contradicts what you are trying to achieve. On the other hand shooting a pheasant flushed rewards the dog so the penny will drop with him eventually that you are more interested in the pheasants than the rabbits.
I do not mind the springers hunting rabbits I just would not shoot them over young dogs in their first season. After that when the dog knows there job I will shoot away at them.

4200fps

If the pointer or what ever the dog is goes on a rabbits scent shoot the rabbit and hit the dog a few belts with the rabbit and i guarantee he wont want to go after one again. Problem solved once and for all and no time wasted. It sounds cruelish but it will work. The dog will keep clear of rabbits after that's if you want him to keep away from rabbits

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

If the pointer or what ever the dog is goes on a rabbits scent shoot the rabbit and hit the dog a few belts with the rabbit and i guarantee he wont want to go after one again. Problem solved once and for all and no time wasted. It sounds cruelish but it will work. The dog will keep clear of rabbits after that's if you want him to keep away from rabbits

you run the risk of the dog not pointing at all . and a rabbit is game so what the problem with it pointing of flushing it.

in all fairness it not aften ya run into this problem

4200fps

TriggerPL wrote: »

you run the risk of the dog not pointing at all . and a rabbit is game so what the problem with it pointing of flushing it.

in all fairness it not aften ya run into this problem

what are you talking about. If you were a dog and you brought back a rabbit back to me and i bet you with it would you be that dumb to bring a rabbit back again? I seen it done and it worked. Who wants a pointer going after rabbits when your after birds in all fairness???Nobody at all unless they have no pheasants to shoot. You shoot a rabbit next time and see how many pheasants you get in that area after you let the shot off. If you disagree go ask jason as he has by far the best pointer around our area. Well i wouldn't like pointer trailing a rabbit when out after pheasants wasting time thinking its a bird he's on

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

TriggerPL wrote: »

you run the risk of the dog not pointing at all . and a rabbit is game so what the problem with it pointing of flushing it.

in all fairness it not aften ya run into this problem

what are you talking about. If you were a dog and you brought back a rabbit back to me and i bet you with it would you be that dumb to bring a rabbit back again? I seen it done and it worked. Who wants a pointer going after rabbits when your after birds in all fairness???Nobody at all unless they have no pheasants to shoot. You shoot a rabbit next time and see how many pheasants you get in that area after you let the shot off. If you disagree go ask jason as he has by far the best pointer around our area. Well i wouldn't like pointer trailing a rabbit when out after pheasants wasting time thinking its a bird he's on

Ur just proving more and more that ya know **** all about dogs and training . Few post back ur saying rap a tennis ball in rabbit fur to get him to retrieve or scent , now your saying beat the head of him to let him know ya don't want rabbit . Which is it .
And making a statement that a man has the best pointer in an area when there is a lad in cloone proving himself at pointer trails , and a breeder in kesh that has Bread an irish champion is crazy . Jason him self wouldn agree with ya he say he has a pointer that he is very happy with .

Ur right in saying that the dog won't bring it back again if ya beat him with it !

He won't bring anything back .

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

TriggerPL wrote: »

you run the risk of the dog not pointing at all . and a rabbit is game so what the problem with it pointing of flushing it.

in all fairness it not aften ya run into this problem

what are you talking about. If you were a dog and you brought back a rabbit back to me and i bet you with it would you be that dumb to bring a rabbit back again? I seen it done and it worked. Who wants a pointer going after rabbits when your after birds in all fairness???Nobody at all unless they have no pheasants to shoot. You shoot a rabbit next time and see how many pheasants you get in that area after you let the shot off. If you disagree go ask jason as he has by far the best pointer around our area. Well i wouldn't like pointer trailing a rabbit when out after pheasants wasting time thinking its a bird he's on

Ur just proving more and more that ya know **** all about dogs and training . Few post back ur saying rap a tennis ball in rabbit fur to get him to retrieve or scent , now your saying beat the head of him to let him know ya don't want rabbit . Which is it .
And making a statement that a man has the best pointer in an area when there is a lad in cloone proving himself at pointer trails , and a breeder in kesh that has Bread an irish champion is crazy . Jason him self wouldn agree with ya he say he has a pointer that he is very happy with .

Ur right in saying that the dog won't bring it back again if ya beat him with it !

He won't bring anything back .

4200fps

TriggerPL wrote: »

Ur just proving more and more that ya know **** all about dogs and training . Few post back ur saying rap a tennis ball in rabbit fur to get him to retrieve or scent , now your saying beat the head of him to let him know ya don't want rabbit . Which is it .
And making a statement that a man has the best pointer in an area when there is a lad in cloone proving himself at pointer trails , and a breeder in kesh that has Bread an irish champion is crazy . Jason him self wouldn agree with ya he say he has a pointer that he is very happy with .

Ur right in saying that the dog won't bring it back again if ya beat him with it !

He won't bring anything back .

Well I've yet to see your pointer come back when you call him back also i did say if its a young dog use rabbit skin on a tennis ball referring to a retriever as the guy didn't specify at the begining which it was. Loads of great dogs out there who are never brought to these field trials and are still good dogs. Go ask Jason about his pointer,ask him about the day he was shooting ducks and while he was at it his pointer stayed set on the pheasant for over a half hour and didn't move till he got there and he got his bird. You do know nobody around this area hasn't a pointer near as good as his and i've loads to back this up. If i had a pointer going after rabbits or hares me thinking it was a bird he was after i be bringing him to the vet for his one of injection and that's for sure

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

Well I've yet to see your pointer come back when you call him back also i did say if its a young dog use rabbit skin on a tennis ball referring to a retriever as the guy didn't specify at the begining which it was. Loads of great dogs out there who are never brought to these field trials and are still good dogs. Go ask Jason about his pointer,ask him about the day he was shooting ducks and while he was at it his pointer stayed set on the pheasant for over a half hour and didn't move till he got there and he got his bird. You do know nobody around this area hasn't a pointer near as good as his and i've loads to back this up. If i had a pointer going after rabbits or hares me thinking it was a bird he was after i be bringing him to the vet for his one of injection and that's for sure

the tennis ball statment was made in relation to gettin a dog to hunt there was no mention of retriving and this thread was about springers

i took a 4 year old pointer with no training off a lad that had never done anything with it , and i have her quartering and stopping to the wistle now . and how would you know , you wouldn walk a hundred yards in a feild , i never said that jasons dog wasnt gud , you made the statment that he has the best pointer in this part of the country , and nothing to back it up with apart from you opinion because it the only pointer you seen working till mine . ur right lots of gud dogs are never trailed.

but the trailed ones are the ones sought after for breeding .
if ya had a pointer that the best statment you have made in this thread so far .

4200fps

TriggerPL wrote: »

the tennis ball statment was made in relation to gettin a dog to hunt there was no mention of retriving and this thread was about springers

i took a 4 year old pointer with no training off a lad that had never done anything with it , and i have her quartering and stopping to the wistle now . and how would you know , you wouldn walk a hundred yards in a feild , i never said that jasons dog wasnt gud , you made the statment that he has the best pointer in this part of the country , and nothing to back it up with apart from you opinion because it the only pointer you seen working till mine . ur right lots of gud dogs are never trailed.

but the trailed ones are the ones sought after for breeding .
if ya had a pointer that the best statment you have made in this thread so far .

Well you cant talk about guns so if you say i cant talk about dogs. Also a retriever that cant use its nose is no good is it? hardly only depends on ears or eyes..

EPointer=Birdss

4200fps wrote: »

Well I've yet to see your pointer come back when you call him back also i did say if its a young dog use rabbit skin on a tennis ball referring to a retriever as the guy didn't specify at the begining which it was. Loads of great dogs out there who are never brought to these field trials and are still good dogs. Go ask Jason about his pointer,ask him about the day he was shooting ducks and while he was at it his pointer stayed set on the pheasant for over a half hour and didn't move till he got there and he got his bird. You do know nobody around this area hasn't a pointer near as good as his and i've loads to back this up. If i had a pointer going after rabbits or hares me thinking it was a bird he was after i be bringing him to the vet for his one of injection and that's for sure

Last line is a bit silly don't you think?
My dog points hares & rabbits - why - as the place is walking with hares & he meets a dozen a day. I've yet to shoot one but he seems to enjoy it none the less. Doesn't affect his bird ability at all.

4200fps

EPointer=Birdss wrote: »

Last line is a bit silly don't you think?
My dog points hares & rabbits - why - as the place is walking with hares & he meets a dozen a day. I've yet to shoot one but he seems to enjoy it none the less. Doesn't affect his bird ability at all.

That's a fair answer i admit.There is some people hate their pointers chasing rabbits and hares. Some pointers ignore them

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

Well you cant talk about guns so if you say i cant talk about dogs. Also a retriever that cant use its nose is no good is it? hardly only depends on ears or eyes..

i suppose my lab cant use his nose either ? what are you on about ? did i say you cant talk about dogs, it a debate as you always say .

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

That's a fair answer i admit.There is some people hate their pointers chasing rabbits and hares. Some pointers ignore them

why would your pointer chase anything , when it job is to point

EPointer=Birdss

4200fps wrote: »

That's a fair answer i admit.There is some people hate their pointers chasing rabbits and hares. Some pointers ignore them

Ah ya I'd flog him for chasing but having a quick follow when it runs under his nose & turning back when I call is fine by me. It's usually when there's no pheasants in the immediate area that he entertains himself.

4200fps

TriggerPL wrote: »

i suppose my lab cant use his nose either ? what are you on about ? did i say you cant talk about dogs, it a debate as you always say .

Well if was a debate you wouldn't be going mad saying :if ya had a pointer that the best statment you have made in this thread so far ..??

4200fps

EPointer=Birdss wrote: »

Ah ya I'd flog him for chasing but having a quick follow when it runs under his nose & turning back when I call is fine by me. It's usually when there's no pheasants in the immediate area that he entertains himself.

Sound understand your post but if you were after pheasants and you knew there was a pheasant in that area and the pointer took of after a rabbit/hare would you not get browned off. I would myself but that's me i suppose. Thats what i'm referring too and nothing as bad as any dog that wont come back to the owner no matter how much he calls is another thing that drives me crazy

TriggerPL

4200fps wrote: »

Well if was a debate you wouldn't be going mad saying :if ya had a pointer that the best statment you have made in this thread so far ..??

the only thing im annoyed about is the statment about my pointer bitch that you were happy to go hunting with ,and that worked well after a month of me getting her ,

try putting you words into practice with you own dog seeing as it so easy to train a dog .

EPointer=Birdss

4200fps wrote: »

Sound understand your post but if you were after pheasants and you knew there was a pheasant in that area and the pointer took of after a rabbit/hare would you not get browned off. I would myself but that's me i suppose. Thats what i'm referring too and nothing as bad as any dog that wont come back to the owner no matter how much he calls is another thing that drives me crazy

Ah ya it is & chasing & not coming back would drive me nuts! That's poor training though.

Watch this video. Came to mind when I read your post. One of my favorite by far!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

4200fps

EPointer=Birdss wrote: »

Ah ya it is & chasing & not coming back would drive me nuts! That's poor training though.

Watch this video. Came to mind when I read your post. One of my favorite by far!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

Its good the way he came back and ignored the rabbit when told! That's a good dog.

irish setter

4200fps wrote: »

Its good the way he came back and ignored the rabbit when told! That's a good dog.

nothing to do with the dog being good or bad, it's good training. when you see enough dogs and more importantly their owners you begin to notice a pattern, dogs from the same owners keep developing the same habits' good or bad

4200fps

irish setter wrote: »

nothing to do with the dog being good or bad, it's good training. when you see enough dogs and more importantly their owners you begin to notice a pattern, dogs from the same owners keep developing the same habits' good or bad

Good training of coarse. If the owner cant train a dog correctly is another thing.

Spunk84

4200fps wrote: »

Good training of coarse. If the owner cant train a dog correctly is another thing.

4200fps wrote: »

If i had a pointer going after rabbits or hares me thinking it was a bird he was after i be bringing him to the vet for his one of injection and that's for sure

Think you just made a boo boo mate;)

4200fps

Spunk84 wrote: »

Think you just made a boo boo mate;)

Nah just leave the rabbits for the ferrits
Didn't think people trained pointers for rabbit hunting so you learn something new every day lol

German pointer

EPointer=Birdss wrote: »

Ah ya it is & chasing & not coming back would drive me nuts! That's poor training though.

Watch this video. Came to mind when I read your post. One of my favorite by far!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=ZVoUncQ8TsE

Lovely job. Hope my one will do that some day:)