Hardcore vs. Softcore modes (split from league thread)

the_syco

Looks at can or worms. Goes to kick it open...

djrichard wrote: »

Im finding Im having to reload ALL the time, and thats usually just when the enemy pops around the corner and wipes me out.

djrichard wrote: »

How do I train my mind to change something Im now used to? As soon as Im out of ammo, I instinctively go for reload, rather than selecting pistol!

It's quicker to switch to a pistol than it is to reload. When I'm reloading a LMG, I'm waiting to select the pistol key in case someone pops up.

djrichard wrote: »

I often struggle because Im left handed and have the keyboard over to the side.

Then why don't you just get a left-handed mouse? As for keys, I have the number "2" as my pistol and it works fine. I see no reason why you can't just use keys that are easy for you to use?

djrichard wrote: »

I was wondering, when this leaderboard is going to man-up and start using hardcore settings such as 60% players health and no gay crosshairs!

Every, and I do mean EVERY "hardcore" sever I've played on in BF:BC2 has the servers clan sit at the uncappable flag sniping the public. Have not bothered playing hardcore in BF3 as the servers tend to also contain snipers sniping the public and not capping the flags.

So no, I shall not be playing "hardcore". I find it laughable when a clan thinks that they're better than "softcore" players but flat out refuses to play against "softcore" players.

the_syco

djrichard wrote: »

having to almost empty an entire magazine

You can't be serious? Can "hardcore" players only hit the body, and never the head?

djrichard

the_syco wrote: »

You can't be serious? Can "hardcore" players only hit the body, and never the head?

Stupid statement that. I was referring to myself, not every player who prefers hardcore. I also didnt once state that anyone in my clan thinks that we are better at playing than softcore players.

The settings that were used in the Boards matches were not the standard softcore settings anyway, they were not far from hardcore apart from player health and crosshairs. No-one has answered why you use crosshairs yet. Very selective responses from people who seem a bit too keen to argue everything, rather than just give their viewpoint. I personally am getting sick and tired of every conversation regarding hardcore Vs softcore because for some unknown reason, it seems to bring out people who are incapable of communicating without being overly defensive.

Of course its quicker to switch to pistol than reload, especially with a machine gun which takes ages. I just tried what you said about changing to pistol whilst reloading. I didnt realise that was possible to do. I thought that once the animation for reloading had started, it had to complete. This will be a great help.

I do use a left handed mouse, but the keys are configured for right handed people, so when using your left hand, they are not in the optimum place. One time, I tried to configure keys so that it was like a mirrored image, using OLKJ, but I just couldnt get used to it after years of using WASD. Perhaps with more time I wouldve got used to it, but I found that as soon as the action intensified, I would not be able to react quick enough as I had to think where the key was, rather than just hit it. Its always going to be a very slight compromise, but its not the end of the world.

With regards to finding it laughable that a hardcore playing clan refuse to play against a softocre clan. Again, another pointless statement. Why would a clan want to play a competative match using settings they are not used to? We are used to a player being killed with a couple of bullets, so in softcore we naturally shoot the enemy and then move to the next target, except the first enemy isnt dead at all. So it is a complete gamechanger and means that it wouldnt be fair at all.

So I could in turn, state that I find it laughable that you wont come into a hardcore server and play against hardcore players. You might find it very easy, because youre so used to having to find headshots, all the players should be dying before your feet with only 60% health! On the odd occasion, we have went into softcore servers, after a few rounds we leave, but we notice that we find hardcore really easy as players die much quicker.

I also find it laughable that you are comparing this game with BFBC2. The maps are quite different and there are nowhere near as many snipers. In fact in my own clan, none of us play as sniper. Never once in a clan match has anyone EVER been a sniper. A sniper is a solitary player and our clan is about working together as a team. There is such a thing as smoke, snipers cannot see through it. For every probem in every game, there is a solution, you just have to use your intelligence to adapt. You could also use vehicles and cap it. Unlike BFBC2, the snipers cannot call mortar strikes on vehicles from away up in the hills. Its quite a different game.

Come into a hardcore server tonight and give it a try, you might be quite surprised, so long as you can learn to aim properly seeing as you wouldn't have your gay crosshairs to assist you!

Ive challenged to find a game in here before, but as soon as I mentioned hardcore settings nobody was interested. I offer you to find your best softcore team and come play us anytime you wish on hardcore settings. I can guarantee there will not be a single sniper in sight!

You may just find that you enjoy hardcore more.

djrichard

dreamers75 wrote: »

You need to play Arma 2

I have Operation Arrowhead. Almost every member of our clan is from Operation Flashpoint. It was that single game which made me go out and have someone build me a gaming pc in 2000. Despite owning all the consoles since that time, I rarely ever use them because I much prefer gaming on the PC.

If only Arma had improved character animations. You get trapped in the most ridiculous movements and then got shot because you cant react to enemies. Here's hoping that Arma 3 delivers what 2 failed. I much prefer sims with almost 1 shot kills to arcade shooters. Knowing that I only have 1 life with no respawn makes everything I did in OF much more calculated. The concept of just running into open ground seemed ludicrous!

Jonny7

Ah I've always been hardcore mode - only recently trumped by Craggy mode; helicopter pileups in tunnels, trying to flip tanks, 20 min game of trying to stab just one person, its got the works

mick-fitz8585

Its not easy to change habits when playing FPS games everyone has a certain setup that they like to use and its hard to change what you like and are good at.

When i was playing cod4 i used to play with a few pro players in mixes and stuff and would ask for there config and you would start to notice a few things that alot of good players use in there configs.

A few things like always having "Hold to aim down sights", "low in game sensitivity", "easy reachable buttons for hand gun, frag, knife or in bf Repair tool, defeb and so on" and "having to hold crouch and prone to stay in that postion"

Over time i started to add these into my game and the hardest to get hold of was hand gun and hold to aim down sights.

When learning to use these id die a lot more than it would come off but over time it just came natural and id be able to play better for it.

P.s it also helps to disable windows mouse acceleration and what ever mouse you use mite have it to in the driver pack this stops windows guessing where you want your mouse to go

Spear

That's all the hardcore vs softcore stuff not related to the league, split off into its own discussion.

AnCapaillMor

Pretty much what someone else said about camping and full of snipers, although the AN-94 is decent again in hc mode.

the_syco

djrichard wrote: »

No-one has answered why you use crosshairs yet.

We're playing an arcade game, not a sim, so cross-hairs will stay.

djrichard wrote: »

Very selective responses from people who seem a bit too keen to argue everything

I disagree strongly with this :P Also because you're derailing the thread. Hopefully a mod will split the thread?

djrichard wrote: »

I personally am getting sick and tired of every conversation regarding hardcore Vs softcore because for some unknown reason, it seems to bring out people who are incapable of communicating without being overly defensive.

Yup, great fun, isn't it. What better way to get people to your side than by insulting them in the first sentence?

djrichard wrote: »

when this leaderboard is going to man-up and start using hardcore settings

djrichard wrote: »

I didnt realise that was possible to do. I thought that once the animation for reloading had started, it had to complete. This will be a great help.

Um, wow? Glad I could help

djrichard wrote: »

I do use a left handed mouse, but the keys are configured for right handed people, so when using your left hand, they are not in the optimum place.

Sounds like you have one of those f**ked up mice that can be used for either or. The mouse I linked to was the left-handed version of the mouse that I use, and has the "thumb button" on the right-hand side which would be totally useless for the right-handers like myself.

djrichard wrote: »

One time, I tried to configure keys so that it was like a mirrored image, using OLKJ, but I just couldnt get used to it after years of using WASD.

Bullsh|t. I used to be an "arrow keys" person (the ones under the Del/End/Page Down keys) person, using them with my right hand, until I was forced to use my left hand to WASD, and my right hand for the mouse for Quake. Do it, and don't look back, and you'll be used to it in no time at all.

djrichard wrote: »

Again, another pointless statement. Why would a clan want to play a competative match using settings they are not used to?

I'm glad you took this bait, as why would we play with "hardcore" settings if used to "softcore" mode? The league was set up as a "softcore" league, and no-one wants to play HC rules, so why change it.

djrichard wrote: »

but we notice that we find hardcore really easy as players die much quicker.

I think that's why lots of people don't like it. There was a few who played BF2 who liked that sort of thing, and they've since gone over to playing the combat sims.

djrichard wrote: »

I also find it laughable that you are comparing this game with BFBC2. The maps are quite different and there are nowhere near as many snipers.

I tried 4 HC servers. All full of snipers. All the exact same as BF:BC2, so I haven't played on one since. I'd say a lot of people hate HC after playing HC mode on CoD and BF:BC2, and thus do not want to play it now.

djrichard wrote: »

Come into a hardcore server tonight

Give me the name of the one your clan plays on, and I may pop on, as I'm not going on a random HC server to play with SC public running around capping flags, and getting shot by HC snipers; it's just not worth it.

djrichard

My mouse is fine. I realise I didnt construct that sentence clearly enough. I can choose whatever button to do any task. I was talking about the keyboard layout being configured for right handed gamers by default.

With regards to saying Im sick of the backwards and forwards between softcore and hardcore debate, I wasnt trying to get anyone to join me, or see my way of thinking. I was simply giving my opinion on the topic. I dont feel I have to be extra nice to gain support for my opinions, I believe if they have merit my demeanour is irrelevant.

I also have no desire to try and alter the way the league is being played, I was only enquiring if there was a reason for the crosshairs and ridiculous health levels. I feel like Im firing rubber bullets in softcore.

I never debated that we were not playing a sim. That is not a reason as to why you need crosshairs to aim. It more or less negates using the laser site, aside from the slight blinding to your opponent.

I cannot guarantee no snipers etc in hardcore mode, because we are not using our own server so cant state the rules. I was talking about in a clan match. I find it so annoying when there are a lot of snipers, but like Ive already said, there are ways around minimising their impact. One fantastic way, if youre in a map with an attack chopper, is to have the gunner use IR, its very satisfying taking out 5 or 6 snipers with the greatest of ease. Then, if theyre stupid enough to try and go back to their position, they are bright white little men running across open areas just waiting to be shot again and again and again. They soon learn and either switch server or character class.

I didnt take any "bait" about hardcore players playing softcore or vice versa. I very clearly explained that from both perspectives.

Anyway, Im going to stop this conversation now, because like I said, its boring. I guess I will just have to accept you have a different opinion. I didnt post up to start an argument and to reignite this drivel, I just wondered if crosshairs would come off and perhaps 60% health would be considered. If it was, I could bring a lot more players in when we are short of numbers, which we have been every single week since its started.

Br4tPr1nc3

after skimming over the thread reading most of the points being made. I have to say, hardcore mode is something that only some people will prefer.

same with softcore. Ive played both types, i prefer softcore, harder to kill people, you need to be more aware of whose around when your shooting, as you show up on the radar.
radar wasnt turned on in the server i was in.
and it was too easy to kill someone, similar to cod, where you could go around with a pistol as though it was a rifle.


but i have to say, you seemed to mention the crosshair quite a bit, which suggests that when your playing hardcore mode, you dont really aim the gun, but simply spray and pray, which does work in hardcore mode, but not soft.

the crosshair disappears when you aim down the site, so the fact its there, doesnt really make a difference in softcore. so sounds like you like to just run about and not really aim.


the only real setting the league has in common with hardcore is the no health regen i think. but other than that it is a softcore league, and i dont think id played a league if it was in hardcore mode.

djrichard

Br4tPr1nc3 wrote: »

but i have to say, you seemed to mention the crosshair quite a bit, which suggests that when your playing hardcore mode, you dont really aim the gun, but simply spray and pray, which does work in hardcore mode, but not soft.

the crosshair disappears when you aim down the site, so the fact its there, doesnt really make a difference in softcore. so sounds like you like to just run about and not really aim.


the only real setting the league has in common with hardcore is the no health regen i think. but other than that it is a softcore league, and i dont think id played a league if it was in hardcore mode.

Not true. I never shoot from the hip unless Ive suddenly ran into a room and someone is literally right in front of me. I ALWAYS look down the scope because it is hard to hit someone if I dont due to the fact there is no crosshair helping me aim. My accuracy is 18.7%, clearly not someone who runs shooting anywhere.

I dont think there is any 3D spotting in the league either. 3D spotting is the most stupid setting ever. Players running about with little orange triangles over their heads...completely insane. It also means that the smoke has much less use as you just need to shoot under the triangle at the invisible person. I cant remember if friendly fire is turned on or not, but it should always be turned on, it requires much more tactical and spacial awareness when its on. No longer do players just blindly fire M320 and RPG into buildings and areas in the hope they might just fluke a kill, because there is the risk of teamkilling. Also, when advancing in an area, if your squad dont coordinate, you will block players behind you from being able to shoot. This means a team working properly together, advancing as a coordinated unit, will absolutely decimate a bunch of players not doing so. Thats why my clan has only ever lost one round in any of the clan matches we have played. That particular round was lost due to an unexpected achievement by the other side, which we ensured didnt ever happen again in that particular map.

See what youve gone and done, I was trying to get out of this. Sounds like Im one of the few who play hardcore in Ireland.

dreamers75

I prefer Hardcore as its harder and has a few tweaks that i like.

mick-fitz8585

each to his own lads

This tread should be locked before all the whining gets out of hand

Jonny7

Shouldn't be called hardcore mode - "realism" mode suits better.

Health indicators are switched off, no spotting, can't tell what percentage the tank is at, no 3rd person view, friendly fire kills quickly, enemy fire even quicker, no health regen, etc.. its like a racing sim with certain driving aids turned off.

It's really just down to personal preference, and for me, it feels right.

dreamers75

Jonny7 wrote: »

Shouldn't be called hardcore mode - "realism" mode suits better.

Health indicators are switched off, no spotting, can't tell what percentage the tank is at, no 3rd person view, friendly fire kills quickly, enemy fire even quicker, no health regen, etc.. its like a racing sim with certain driving aids turned off.

It's really just down to personal preference, and for me, it feels right.

Pretty much that. Wouldnt call it Realism tho

/See Arma for Realism :pac:

djrichard

Thats all right, no need to lock it. We can behave. Nothing like a bit of passion to get everyone talking

ktulu123

I used to only play hardcore in BC2. Have tried it a few times on BF3 and im not really a fan. The only server that's decent is the 1-PARA Harcore one.

I really like some aspects of it, like no health regen, radar etc... But as has been said 90% of servers are full of camping snipers just watching objectives for easy kills and not bothering to PTFO. Each to their own i suppose

dreamers75

ktulu123 wrote: »

The only server that's decent is the 1-PARA Harcore one.

BFN ones are good too but get boring as they only play certain maps.

Tig got banned from 1para the other night, funny ****

RunningShovel

I recently started playing on HC servers in BF3 and I'm quite enjoying it. HC was all I could play in BC2 after a while and now that I'm decently acquainted with BF3 I think I'll stick with it here too. As a shotgun aficionado, killing someone with a shotgun in one shot from more than 2 foot away is great (And slightly more realistic). I've had a few experiences with camping snipers, but that just makes the tags all the more satisfying.

I've been playing a lot of agressive/frontline/flanking Recon with M40A5 Ironsights and it's great fun. Nothing like coming up behind 2 squads as they zerg towards B on Metro and getting a double with your rifle, then cleaning up with a silenced M1911 and Knife before they even know what's happened.

Those kind of moments are what keep me coming back to hardcore, I get annoyed at some camper/team mate/idiot/all of the above and then something like that happens and it's all okay again.

the_syco

djrichard wrote: »

See what youve gone and done, I was trying to get out of this. Sounds like Im one of the few who play hardcore in Ireland.

Most of those who I know that seemed to enjoy the HC seemed to have left the Bettlefield franchise for some other games.

Lucutus

dreamers75 wrote: »

BFN ones are good too but get boring as they only play certain maps.

Tig got banned from 1para the other night, funny ****

We got banned as "promoting another clans TS" when I invited YOU onto TS as you said you were having a drink or two... it was friday night ffs!

DeWinterZero

I liked hardcore in Bad Company 2 because it negated the teleporting knifer running up the heavy machine barrel and taking your tags. BF3 normal mode is half way toward the lethality of BC2 hardcore anyway. Hardcore just becomes ridiculous.

But each to his own. Some people like hardcore, some like normal. Some people like bunny hopping, I like RPG'ing little fluffy bunnies