Im Planing to open a Pub.

SimonB30

Hi everybody,

Im planing to open pub in Ireland. Im looking for Pub in small towns (3000-6000 people). Maybe somebody is all ready in that kind of Business and maybe can give some advices?

With Kind Regards
Simas

homer911

Dont

grange mac

Agree with Homer!! This country is f****d, pubs r dying very fast...

Thargor

Dont do it Simon seriously, I was drinking all over Galway, Clare and Limerick over the Christmas holidays and the depressing vibe in every pub we went to was shocking, all the legendary places we went to in school had gone to the wall aswell, it was less depressing and a lot cheaper to stay at home drinking, which is the way the country is going/has gone. I know thats just one persons unscientific testimony but the official statistics are even more shocking, its a dying industry.

stackerman

It's that bad an idea, that I was wondering if this was a joke for a while :eek:

Let me put it to you like this. I've two friend who both had pubs in areas such as you talk about. One sold during the 'Good times' the other turned an offer down.
Now one is relieved, the other sick as a dog, and in deep trouble.

You can prob figure out which is which

SyntonFenix

I'd open one in Greece instead. Tourism is going to enter a boom there once they go back to the Drachma.

Jesus Shaves

Great idea, You'll have the governments full support

SimonB30

Thanks guys.
2day i spoke with one owner who have cpl pus in Ireland, USA, Tokyo. He told me that is not bad idea just must be done lots of calculation before doing any foward steps.
As well i heard that soon will not be availble to get any more cheap beers in shops. Soon cheapest cans will be 2euros.
And as well i think if u will make a good pub with exelent custumer service and good prices it can work.
For myself im not Irish but 6 years living over here. I just love Irish people and traditions.

jackiebaron

Of all the ways to lose money did you have to choose the fastest way?

Set up an Irish pub in China. You'll be coining it in.

shangri la

What is the story with the off license legislation?

The Greek tourism industry may be something worth considering.

Del2005

SimonB30 wrote: »

Thanks guys.
2day i spoke with one owner who have cpl pus in Ireland, USA, Tokyo. He told me that is not bad idea just must be done lots of calculation before doing any foward steps.
As well i heard that soon will not be availble to get any more cheap beers in shops. Soon cheapest cans will be 2euros.
And as well i think if u will make a good pub with exelent custumer service and good prices it can work.
For myself im not Irish but 6 years living over here. I just love Irish people and traditions.

It's still less than half the price in a pub.

To open a pub now you'd need to be doing decent,cheep, food and niche beers/wines. Don't know many small towns that could support that type of pub as you'd be way more expensive than an off licence on.

irish_goat

www.theparnell.com

www.yelp.ie/biz/the-black-sheep-dublin

There's 2 new pubs opening in Dublin whilst others are closing. Walk into Against the Grain, Wexford St; one of the Porterhouse bars or L.Mulligans, Stoneybatter and you'll see the place busy every night of the week. The thing they all have in common is that they sell decent, craft beers. There's countless numbers of pubs in Dublin that all sell the same, rubbish beers i.e. Guinness, Heineken, Bud, Carlsberg etc and they're all struggling to get people in the door. If you're opening a pub, craft beer is the way to go.

Unfortunately for yourself, if it's in a small town you'll probably find that you're unlikely to have a big enough market for craft beers and most small towns in Ireland already have too many pubs/not enough demand anymore.

In saying that, if there's a premises going cheap now (or the near future) would be a good time to buy as things are eventually going to pick up again.

eurokev

Go for it. Theres some great value on short term leases out there. You will have to work long hours yourself, but there is still definitely money to be made. Just do things smart obviously. Dont invest in too much stock etc.. Go for it and give it a try. Also that €2 a can thing is complete crap, that will never ever happen, so dont base your decision on that. Good luck

kissthesky

To repeat on Homer911. Dont, don't and don't again. As an ex publican I'll be happy to post the reasons as to why you should hold onto ur money/seed capital and ur sanity at the same time.Would hate to see someone blow their savings and time on a pub at the moment. Anyway will be happy to post my thoughts and any advice I can on this thread.

patwicklow

As an ex publican myself i say go for it its not the pub trade that is fecked its the way some pubs are run now a days that is why there either empty or rough pubs.
You have to put your whole heart into running a pub to make it work and the persons behind the bar like if there was a great pub in your area well run and looked after wouldn't it be great to visit now and then rather then sitting at home drinking from a can you would go.

If i had the money i would open a pub no problem its a 24 hour job but also great a job i never see as a job but then it has to be in your blood for some folk to understand that.

Grecco

Put up plenty mirrors that way you wont feel lonely inside

SimonB30

I know that will be really hard work, but im not afraid of it. even i planing as weel and to move to live into that pub for beginning.

mikom

SimonB30 wrote: »

I know that will be really hard work, but im not afraid of it. even i planing as weel and to move to live into that pub for beginning.

A prison you can't escape from.

BostonB

http://www.thejournal.ie/alcohol-consumption-down-by-17-per-cent-over-last-decade-344971-Feb2012/

I think you'd need to have a good business plan worked out. Lots of pubs closing all around me, but the good ones are still open. The worst ones all closed first.

Sonnenblumen

Sure times are tough but do your homework and as other have said, there are some growth areas eg micro-breweries or establishments with a wider appeal/product offering.

Often wondered why so there were so many pubs throughout Ireland. Many examples where owners didn't have a clue/couldn't care about the paying customers. Not surprising that many are being weeded out whilst others are booming. Reason - ongoing investment in customer satisfaction.

Good luck with your venture. God knows, the country needs many more like you.;)

patwicklow

Customer satisfaction = GOLDEN EGG is key.

tommylimerick

was in the pub today at 4 o clock
plenty of souls there for early friday evening
best of lock

SimonB30

Guys i will do my best to open totally good pub and I promise for you u will get free dring over there. know im doing big homework. but i never ever let traditional Irish pus to go down, even im not Irish.

SimonB30

As well guys if u need good special present for who u love. U can get 65% discount for special gifts. visit my shop and maybe u find out what u need.
www.sigicrafts.ie

Thargor

Stick with your shop if its successful, opening a pub is too risky in this environment and worse might still be coming, pubs are just too expensive for the majority of people these days. Also waiting and saving for another year or 2 might make sense aswell with prices still falling around the country, not sure if pubs are falling aswell but I would assume so.

By the way nice site but for a shop like that you should see some options right on the first page the customer sees when they click the link, or at least some categories of jewelery etc, you're probably losing a lot of traffic making them hunt for the Shop link in that menu and then having to click through into it, also the words in the menu are too close together, just an opinion, no offense intended.

Jesus Shaves

Any chance of a job?

kissthesky

A rough rule of thumb if ur leasing is for eg. if the weekly rent is 500eu then double it and add 10% and this will tell u what you need to take to cover it. In this case 1100eu. This goes for all your expenses. So a simple bag of coal translates as 15 eu to 33eu takings.
I know from my own experience and other publicans in both rural and town pubs, say you open at 4 mon to Friday and 2pm Sat and 12 on Sunday. Mon to Thurs you might average 100-120eu per nite sometimes less. This means come Friday morning u havent even started to cover the rent yet. On top of this are the biggies like rates,electric,gas/oil,water,VAT,insurance.The smaller ones like phone,bins,music licence,consumables etc can very quickly turn into large numbers if you let them run.As for Sky, just forget about getting it in. Add in a part timer for say 25 hrs a week and ur cashflow is really taking a battering. As another OP wrote, ur pub can quickly turn into a prison.
Also because of the recession suppliers, ur main ones Diageo, Heineken and local Cash & Carry will not give u credit and gas/oil will be paid upfront. The electric co's will look for a big deposit as well. When I switched to Airtricity 2 yrs ago they wanted 6keu as a deposit for example.You also have to put a deposit down on Fixtures & Fittings etc when u take out the lease and accountant fees and solicitor fees as well.
So before u pull a pint u will have a fair bit of money put down already.

Sorry to be so grim but u are really up against it. My advice along with another poster here is to stay out of the pub game for a couple of yrs and try and get work in a pub in the meantime and build up ur experience and just keep ur eyes open for a pub. If you go in with ur eyes closed u will get burned and burned very quickly at that. The main beneficiary of ur 60-80hrs a week could be the guy u are renting the place off and u walk away with a load of debt and nothing basically.

okiss

Hello Simas
Can I give you advice don't open a pub anywhere in Ireland at the moment.
The pub trade is dying on it feet at the moment due to the costs of running a pub and the drink drive laws. Every week the supermarkets have an offer for cheap booze.
Our unemployment levels are not going down and a lot of people are working a 3 day week. Our tax have been increased and people just don't have the money to spend in the pub.

sinixie

hi smas
i own a pub, the fantasy is not worth it dont do it the commerical rates are killer drink is so expensive to buy in and profit is barely existant its not a decent income for a person to live on sadly to say i would avoid this venture if i wer u i know i regret it. their are pubs up and down the country were the leasee's have left the keys in the letter box and taken the rest of the stock and left leaving the original pub owner in worse debt without a rent income and unpaid bills to pay dont buy a pub it will break your heart and send you into fianical ruin with pressures of bills and morgages

mickman

SimonB30 wrote: »

Guys i will do my best to open totally good pub and I promise for you u will get free dring over there. know im doing big homework. but i never ever let traditional Irish pus to go down, even im not Irish.

ur already giving away free drink? you wont let 6 months with that attitude man. What nationality are you ? your english is very poor, this will cause a problem when you try and open a pub as chatting with the locals is very important if you want regular customers

Non irish people seem to think that running a pub in ireland is the way to riches. they dont understand the huge costs involved and the way the industry has collapsed in recent years. You have to sell trucks loads of beer in order to make good money

ongarboy

I would never discourage anyone from starting a business (and all the risks that go with it) if there is a gap or niche in the market for the product that the business aims to sell. However opening a pub in 2012 Ireland must be the riskiest and most failure doomed enterprise anyone could venture into.

You sound like you are relatively recent to Ireland but let me provide you with some stats that you may not be familar with.

Towns in Ireland used to have about one pub for every 70 people or so (Towns with less than 4000 had 60+ pubs (eg Listowel/Dingle etc). It was oversupply madness. Most of them would have been family run pubs handed down through the generations and in most cases barely scraped by or were loss making. In the last 20 years, all those excess supply pubs have closed (stricter drink driving laws/smoking bans/tightened health, safety and insurance standards all contributed) and continue to shut down on a weekly basis. These publicans would not have taken the decision to shut down their businesses lightly but only because there was no possible viablity. Other closure cause were that many did not move with the times (ie did not sell food, upgrade their premises, lack of modern toilet facilities, no other forms of entertainment provided - bands/music/djs/big screens for sports etc).

Another significant factor is that the demographics and culture of Ireland have changed. It is no longer a country where everyone goes to the pub multiple nights a week (if at all) or mark significant occasions with a visit to the pub (sure, many still do but it is declining). Large segments of the population of modern Ireland do not identify with pub going (many recent immigrant communities for example). More and more people are diversifying into other forms of entertainment. (Entertaining at home, healthier pursuits, alternative hobbies and activities). Finally, those who still remained regular pub goers were more discerning about where they drink and would not just hang out for the night in any old dive.

Sure, some new niche operators such as micro breweries and those that offer a product different to the norm are making a success but they are in the very small minority. If you think you have something different to offer that will attract customers that publicans with generations of experience and establishment cannot, then go ahead but investing your hard earned money in a pub in 2012 would be about as sensible as opening a Brown Thomas in Ballymun (no disrespect intended!).

SimonB30

Im not so sure but maybe from next week I will help some guys to run Pub in Dublin. And I let u know how it works and maybe u will come to see it as well.

patwicklow

SimonB30 wrote: »

Im not so sure but maybe from next week I will help some guys to run Pub in Dublin. And I let u know how it works and maybe u will come to see it as well.

What county are you looking to get a bar in simon?

neris

I always see the middle to high end pubs in dublin being the ones that are struggling. Its probably not worth the hassle but ive seen a few of the rogher/dodgier pubs around northside dublin always have a good few customers in them during the day especially around social welfare day however id say by night the bar guys are cleaning up broken tables and blood.

patwicklow

neris wrote: »

I always see the middle to high end pubs in dublin being the ones that are struggling. Its probably not worth the hassle but ive seen a few of the rogher/dodgier pubs around northside dublin always have a good few customers in them during the day especially around social welfare day however id say by night the bar guys are cleaning up broken tables and blood.

I have ran the roughest of the roughest of bars in east London they may be working class or on the social welfare but still humans and no i was not cleaning up blood at the end of the night i was counting the cash because believe it or not they are the ones that spend,not sit over looking at a glass of wine all night!

SimonB30

neris wrote: »

I always see the middle to high end pubs in dublin being the ones that are struggling. Its probably not worth the hassle but ive seen a few of the rogher/dodgier pubs around northside dublin always have a good few customers in them during the day especially around social welfare day however id say by night the bar guys are cleaning up broken tables and blood.

Im 6 years was working in north side of Dublin.Of course sometimes you have some crazy people who just coming and looking for trouble, but i never blame the area because it can happen everywhere. Same problems i had and in Finland where i was DJ and Events Manager, and in Lithuania. And i dont think is quit good idea to rate a pubs by the area. Pubs must be rated by Customer service,

Yahew

while drinking is down on the boom times, people still drink out in Ireland. Tinnies at home with ten mates is not the same, and it ignores the fact that some drinkers in Ireland only meet their drinking buddies in the pub never at home.

I have no idea if Pubs are in trouble, or why, but a crowded pub can make a boat load of money. The last time I worked in a pub in the mid 90's - working through college - my pay of about £4.50 a hour, or so could have been earned back in the sale of two or three pints. On a Friday, with a strong local crowd of about 20 people at any one time, or 100 over the course of the night, at about 3 pints each, he took in close to £1000 by my reckoning. I m thinking revenue was £3K a week, or £150K a year, inflation wise about €300K. The pub was his property. Yes, gross, yes take away costs and vat, but still you end up in a good nick.

So there is money there. The trick in small towns is to just make it comfortable, and sell at a cheaper price. Pubs are almost like cartels in Ireland, in pricing - slightly less so in the bust, in particular the first Irish pub which breaks the cartel tradition of selling a pint of Coke with two bottles, costing €5+ and uses a fountain at €2 will clean up.

Bring that innovation and you will see them flock in.

neris

i think one of the reason pubs are in trouble is they loaded themselves with debt in teh celtic tiger by either trying to update/upgrade their buidlings or took out hefty leases so while trade is down they have exra loans to repay which like all businesses is killing them.

I think pubs in what would be more working class areas lets say are more likley to have a regular daily trade mid week and weekends compared to some of the more affluent areas and bars in Dublin and will be the ones to make money.Like patwicklow said they dont sit looking at a glass for the night(i dont know the pub scene outside dublin). I agree that pubs are like a cartel. Ive even heard that being said by friends of mine who used to have a pub back in the good days and got out at the top.