Family.

LegacyUser

Hi,

I’m looking for some advice on how to deal with my grandmother.

I am 20 and myself and my mother have lived with my grandmother all my life.

In recent years she has gotten aggressive. Every few weeks she gets into these bad moods which last for days and during these moods she tends to lash out at myself and my mother.

When my mothers sisters are visiting, my granny is as sweet as pie and shows now signs of aggression or bad moods, it’s only around my mother and myself.

She insults us often, threatens to “put us out of the house” and always reminds us “it’s her house” and “she is the boss of the house”.

Last year when I went back to college and was thinking of my future and what I’d like to do in college/uni, she said to me “I’ll be honest with you, you haven’t got the brains for it” – I was really, really insulted. I am a wee bit slow and wouldn't be a 'brainy' person (not sure if I described that right or not, apologies).

I haven’t got any state examinations, due to severe bullying in secondary school I ended up leaving early (about five months before my Junior Cert) so last year I went back to do the Adult Leaving Cert and actually did well in some exams.

However due to depression I ended up leaving college early because I was unable to cope with the course and it’s workload. I was very disappointed with myself for being able to cope with course and not being able to finish the course. I’d like to go back and do my Leaving Cert, but I wouldn’t be able to do it full time, as I wouldn’t be able for the workload etc.

My granny sometimes insults me about my weight, she recently told me “I was getting a fat arse”, I told her there was no need to be so rude and offensive, then she said “I am not being rude, you are”.
When my mother asked her what she said, she twisted it so it wouldn't look and sound as bad/offensive, only she didn't realise my mother had been in the kitchen and had heard exactly what she said so she was caught red handed and was in a bad mood with us for a few days.

Often when my mobile rings (either a call or text) she asks me who it is, and if they want to speak to her. She does the same with my mother also and my mother never tells her who rang/text and I do the same, I always just say “a friend” or something.

Sometimes when I get letters she asks who they are from and of course I just tell her they are junk mail, I don’t feel that I should have to disclose who it is that ring/text/sends me letters, it’s no one else’s business.

A few times that I have gotten post (be it a letter, parcel etc) she calls me into the kitchen or where to get my mail, I get my mail and open it upstairs and she calls me “sly” and “hidden” for not opening it in front of her.

I am also unemployed and spend most of my time at home. I am mostly online looking for jobs, courses that I can do, although I haven’t been successful yet, I keep trying, its all I can do. I do house work, I wash/clean/put away dishes, I cook for myself. I offer to for both of them also, but they usually refuse, mainly because I eat different foods to them. I eat lots of pastas, pizza's etc, they prefer spuds, veg, meat etc. However sometimes if I cook potatoes they'll have some, but not often.

My granny is also 100% against alcohol, going out etc. I don’t go out often or drink often and when I do drink I usually only have one, sometimes two drinks and no more, because 1) That’s enough for me and 2) If I drank any more I would be on my ear, literally. I guess you could say I am light weight.

When I go to pubs, I rarely have alcoholic drinks, I normally stick to water or minerals because I am aware and conscious of how alcohol affects me and for that reason I tend to only drink at home, but again, I might have maybe three or four glasses of wine/beer in a month, sometimes I can do for weeks/months without having any alcohol.

Any time I do have a glass of wine/beer/Bacardi etc my granny gets into a bad mood over it and causes a row/argument between herself and myself and my mum (myself and my mum don’t fight, just myself and my granny mostly). One time when I had half a glass of beer, she wouldn’t speak to me for about two days afterwards.

When my mother has a drink, she has to stay upstairs and drink, or else wait until my granny goes to bed, although my granny usually stays downstairs until 1-2am, we stay with her because one time she went to bed and left one of the kitchen windows opened.

Often enough during the day if she goes for a nap, she will leave the backdoor unlocked and sometimes opened slightly.

Sometimes when either my mother or I are going to the shop/supermarket my granny will ask us go get her a few things and she gives us the money before we go (she insists on giving us the money first, if we refuse, she’ll start a row), when we come home from the supermarket/shop we give her her change and receipt and put away the shopping, then a few days/weeks later she will accuse whichever of us got her groceries or not giving her back her change, even though we have given it back, we’ll tell her, we did give her back her change and she will cause a row claiming we didn’t, now let my mother do her shopping because, frankly, I am fed up of being accused of “stealing” when I haven’t stole anything at all.

Another time when my mother was taking down the light-shade in my granny’s bedroom (after my granny asked her to take it down), my mother notice half a burned cigarette on the inside of the window and a burn mark beside it, so now we are terrified that if she smokes in her room and falls asleep there will be a fire, and especially if she is alone in the house.

She constantly get's on to us about little things, like if we have the oven on to heat up so we can cook, she'll keep a check on it until it's heated up and will call us when it is heated.

She also plugs out the kettle, TV, etc when they aren't in use because "they'll run her ESB bill up sky high" - firstly my mother pays the ESB bill and it's rarely more than €80, every two months. I have offered my mother money towards the bills, but she refuses, because I am unemployed and get €95 per week, she says when I get a job/course and am getting more money, then I can start paying towards bills. I buy all my own food, and buy other bits of foods etc that they both eat too.

We also think she might have dementia, but we aren’t sure.

She is very forgetful, if I wash my hair or have a bath or something she’ll ask my constantly if I am going out, if I say no, she’ll ask me again a few minutes later. I’m not sure if she actually forgets that I have answered her or if she just constantly asks me because she thinks I will eventually say “yes”. If I am going out, I always tell her and my mum in advance, so they know I won’t be around. She recently said to my mother and I that Thailand is in Amercia.

A few weeks ago, just after Christmas, she was speaking to her brother and ask how her sister’s husband is, her sister’s husband died a number of years ago (I don’t know how many years ago). Then she asked her brother how one of their auntie’s is, their auntie is 40 years old than my granny who is 85 years old this year and their auntie did many, many years ago, yet my granny didn’t remember and was shocked when he told her their auntie was deceased.

Sometimes when she is talking to us, she slurs her words, so we have to listen carefully to what she is saying so we can understand what it she is saying.

Every month she is meant to go to her Doctor to get her blood pressure tablets, but every month, she always delays going to her Doctor (she hate’s Doctors), she’ll ring the pharmacy where she get’s her medication and they will give her a week or sometimes a month’s supply of tablets, so she won’t have to go her Doctor. A few times she has actually gone without her tablets to the point where she feel’s sick and light headed, so the pharmacy then give her more tablets. Her Doctor won’t issue a prescription without seeing her. She used to go to her Doctor every three months, then the Doctor changed that to every two months and now to every month.

Partly why she dislikes going to the doctor is because she has to take a taxi there because it’s too far for her to walk and she hate having to pay for taxi’s when she could walk for free, also her eyesight is so bad. She has little or no sight in her left eye (her optician told my mum this when my mother had to get a copy of her glasses prescription) and the sight in her right eye isn’t 100%, but it is better than her left eye.

We are terrified of her walking into town because of one time mam and I were in Dublin with her and when we got home, and got off the bus, she crossed the road at the bus stop, there was a car coming towards her, the driver of the car had to swerve to avoid hitting her and had another car been coming in the opposite direction, there could have been an accident.

My granny thought the car was further away than it was so just crossed the road without even thinking.

I'll never, ever forget that as long as I live. I just froze, I couldn't look away or move. Even now it still scares me and it was a few years ago. Sometimes I cry when I think of it. Just seeing her walk across the road and the car coming towards he, nearly hitting her.

I was considering going to speak to her doctor myself, but he doesn’t know me, I would of course explain who I am etc, but as he doesn’t know me, I would be worried that maybe he wouldn’t take me seriously or might just brush off anything I tell him. Maybe he wouldn’t , I don’t know.

I hate interfering in other peoples’ business, which is why I haven’t spoken to her Doctor about this before now, but now I am really considering it.

I have been asking my mother for months (since last Summer) if she will speak to my granny’s Doctor, but she never does. She always says “Yeah I’ll make an appointment to speak to him”, but never does.

Would it be wrong/bad of me to speak to him? He might tell me to take a running jump, I don’t know, but I feel maybe if he was aware of her recent behaviour, he could maybe run some tests and give a proper/official diagnoses, if there is anything to diagnose. Even if he doesn’t listen to me, at least there will be a record of me speaking to him.

Neither of my mothers two sisters understand to the full extent my granny’s behaviour, even having being told numerous times, they think my mother and I are being over the top and there is nothing wrong with my grand mother other than old age, however they don’t see her often, every few weeks usually. They would be furious with me for interfering and rightly so, but no one else will do anything other than put it down to old age.

I would really appreciate some advice and suggestions on what I should do, because I am at a loss, apologies for the long post.

Lollipops23

I can't diagnose your granny, but it does sound like some sort of dementia- the forgetfullness is one thing, but the agression/lashing out is setting off alarm bells for me.

I think you should take another crack at speaking to your mum- she may be in denial that things are so bad, but if your granny is sick she maybe a danger to herself (and others). If she is unwilling I would maybe try and approach one of your granny's other children and let them know your concerns.

Good luck, it's not a nice thing to deal with, but if your granny gets the help and support she needs it'll be worth it.

woodchuck

I really think you need to get your granny seen by a doctor about all this. There’s a lot of serious alarm bells going off there.

Any doctor worth his/her salt will hear you out and take your concerns seriously. If your mother agrees on everything maybe it would be better for the two of you to talk to the doctor together.

It’s perfectly normal that you and your mother would be the only ones to notice these things. The rest of the family isn’t living with her. Even if you give examples of her behaviour to them it’s very easy to brush each of these off with excuses if you haven’t experienced it first hand. It’s only when you’re in the thick of it you know what’s really going on. So don’t be worried about the rest of the family might think, just do what you know is right. Even if it turns out you’re wrong, it’s much better to be told you’re wrong than to suspect something’s wrong and not act on it.

blue skye

You poor thing & I'm sure your mother is feeling the same way!

I would definatly go speak to the doctor about her behaviour as it's irratic, Unusual & down right rude!!!

It sound's like she's NOT alway's been like this so I would definetly be seeking help.

qwertytlk

Hi, firstly i just want to say that you shoudnt put yourself down, nor should you alllow anyone else too. I know i dont actualllly know you but from reading your thread you seem like an intelligent, genuine, caring and nice person. You certainely have no problems explaining yourself clearly and concisely, so please try have a little more confidence in your abilities!
As for your granny, well no this doesnt just sound like 'old age' to me. I know that people do loose some of their faculties as they age but the stuff you describe sounds more serious than that. I dont think its normal for someone to forget the deaths of close realitives etc. Amd the other behaviours you describe, the accusations, nasty comments, constantly repeating herself and the angry outburtst....well in my opinion this sounds like it could be the beginnings of alzheimers, or dimentia, or both. Althugh im no medical professional so thats just my opinion based on somethings iv read and also seen first hand.
Your mother doesnt sound as though she wamts to go to the doctor about ut granny, for some reason. She seems to be putting it off. Now i dont know oif she is just extreemly busy and is just looking for the right time, or maybe she is worried about the backlash from your granny as she may see it as interfering. So if you can, id suggest you sit down with your mother for a proper chat about all of this, tell her your comcerns, ask why she keeps putting off the doctor visit etc. Then you could offer to go with her for support, and also to give your input as you live with her too. Even say you will ring and make an appointment right now for whstevr day your mum s free. Then if nothing transpires and she doesnt go, i would take the ball i your court and go yourself. Dont worry, the doctor wont brush you off. He will listen to you and your concerns. He will take the, seriously-if there is need to.
Best of luck

Beruthiel

What Should I Do? wrote: »

I have been asking my mother for months (since last Summer) if she will speak to my granny’s Doctor, but she never does. She always says “Yeah I’ll make an appointment to speak to him”, but never does.

Time to insist on it I'm afraid.
None of us here are qualified professionals. But, without a doubt, there is more going on here and I believe your Gran is suffering from some sort of disease prone in the elderly.
It is a terrible thing when the body is fine and the mind goes.
Tell your mother that it is dreadfully unfair to just live in denial like this and she owes it to her mother to at least get her to a doctor for a diagnosis.

Oryx

I know your granny would still consider herself a fully competent adult, and I guess you do too, but it does sound like she is slowly losing some of her ability to cope. Its a difficult stage, because she wont want to give up her independence, and its hard for you both to deal with that.

Dont ignore the forgetfulness, or brush it off. The accusations of stealing and the anger are so familiar to me, having seen a close relative deteriorate from dementia. Its a very tough road, if that is what is happening. I know you respect your grans privacy, but you do need to act on this. YOU make the appointment, and ask your mother to come with you. Speak to the doctor and see what you decide to do after that. Im sure the doctor is not completely unaware of the situation seeing as they are so rigid about seeing your gran before prescribing medication to her.

LegacyUser

OP here, thanks everyone for your replies, they have really helped me.

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I think you should take another crack at speaking to your mum- she may be in denial that things are so bad, but if your granny is sick she maybe a danger to herself (and others). If she is unwilling I would maybe try and approach one of your granny's other children and let them know your concerns.

My mother isn't in denial that things are so bad, at least when I speak to her about it, she acknowledges my granny's behaviour.

My mother and I have already spoken to one of her other children and she brushed us off and said "sure we all get like that at her age".

Speaking to her other child isn't an option, because 1) she will think we are exaggerating and there is nothing wrong and 2) She would then say that we are trying to cause trouble.

We are not trying to cause trouble at all.

blue skye wrote: »

It sound's like she's NOT alway's been like this so I would definetly be seeking help.

You are right, she hasn't always been like this, but in the last few years she has changed.

She has always been 100% against alcohol though. She never, ever drank or liked drink at all. She considers it a waste of money.

When I was a child, if my mother was out with her friends, my granny would get me to phone my mother and ask her what time she'd be home at.

My mother wasn't out every weekend or month, it was usually once every 4-6 months when she went out.

As I was a child I wasn't aware of what my granny was doing and had I realised why she did it, I wouldn't have phoned my mother.

qwertytlk wrote: »

Hi, firstly i just want to say that you shoudnt put yourself down, nor should you alllow anyone else too. I know i dont actualllly know you but from reading your thread you seem like an intelligent, genuine, caring and nice person. You certainely have no problems explaining yourself clearly and concisely, so please try have a little more confidence in your abilities!

Thank you, your right, I shouldn't put myself down or allow anyone else too.

I've suffered with confidence issues for a number of years (all relating to the bullying in school) and as a result of those confidence issues I tend to put myself down quite a lot. And allow others to put me down as well. Normally if someone says something to me, I rarely every say anything back, I just ignore what they say.

I've managed to get some control over those issues though and have made huge improvements over the past year.

Beruthiel wrote: »

Time to insist on it I'm afraid.
None of is here are qualified professionals. But, without a doubt, there is more going on here and I believe your Gran is suffering from some sort of disease prone in the elderly.
It is a terrible thing when the body is fine and the mind goes.
Tell your mother that it is dreadfully unfair to just live in denial like this and she owes it to her mother to at least get her to a doctor for a diagnosis.

I am going into town today and I am going to speak to her doctor myself.

My granny was due to go up to him today, but decided not to (I don't know why, but am presuming it's her usual reason of 'hating the doctor').

Her Doctor has never done anything to her (as far as I know) she just hates all things medical, doctors, hospital, clinics etc.

She has no tablets now and won't have any until she does go to her Doctor.

My granny would be quite smart and would cop on straight away if the doctor started running tests etc for anything (the only reason she ever goes to the doctor is for her blood pressure tablets).

She wouldn't necessarily think that I or my mother would have spoken to her Doctor, but she would probably suspect someone did.

I didn't mention that one night recently around 2am, my grandmother came out of her room (she was in bed) and threw a 'tantrum', shouting and banging on the floor looking for a key to one of the bedrooms (my room) because she thought the oil/heating was on, it wasn't.

She came down stairs and was going on about how "she pays for everything" - which isn't true.

My mother pays the ESB, broadband, phone bills etc.

When we get a fill of oil, my mother pays 50% of the cost.

The only thing my granny pays for are any house repairs, house charges etc.

The food shopping is split 50/50 between herself and my mother, my mother buys ALL the cleaning products, my granny doesn't contribute to any of those.

My granny isn't poor, she's not flush with cash, but she would be very comfortable and wouldn't have any financial worries and wouldn't have had any for the past number of years.

She gets two pensions monthly, which amount to quite a bit, normally with her post office pension she lets it run for about 5-6 weeks usually so when she (or my mother) collects is, there is normally around €1,000 to collect, which goes straight into the bank.

But my granny seems to think that if she spend €50 or €100 (examples) that her money is "going very low" and gets into a mood over that, which she then takes out on my mother and I.

I will speak to her doctor today and see what he says, hopefully he will listen to me.

Thanks again everyone for your replies.

shinikins

Hi OP, I'm glad your going to see your granny's doctor, it's the best thing you could do. Unless they are alerted to issues, a doctor will only treat their patient for the symptoms they present-so if your granny is only going in and asking for her blood pressure to be checked, thats pretty much the only thing that will be checked. Hopefully after you speak to him, her doctor will arrange a firm appointment for her to go and see him-he's not going to say "oh, your grand-daughter was in and she's really worried about you having possible dementia", he'll more than likely disguise it as "you haven't been in to see me in quite a while, lets do a full check up"

One thing I would do if I were in your shoes-speak to the pharmacist. I'd be willing to bet your granny knows one of the staff quite well, and they are the one's giving her tablets without a prescription. I'd also be willing to bet that the pharmacist knows nothing about this. Prescription medication can be so dangerous, too much or too little of the wrong drug can potentially cause massive health risks, so for drugs to be given out to her without the doctor having seen her is massively irresponsible.

I know your granny lashes out at you and your mother, but if she is suffering from dementia, or alzheimers, or one of the many health problems that older people suffer from, her anger may be a symptom. Not an easy thing to live with, and yet you are doing so with a lot of understanding and acceptance. Be proud of yourself, you're taking steps to help her, your not burying your head in the sand and hoping that it will all blow over as your extended family seem to be.

saa

I know what its like to live with an ill person and the rest of my family stopped seeing how their behaviour was destructive and didn't anything needed to be done so that put me off trying to get them any help for it and I took on all the emotional stress for their illness,

Talk you the GP, for your Grandmothers sake and yours the doctor should know so she can be protected, I'm especially concerned over the walking out into the middle of the road incident, that IS being a threat to her own life and others and its not your job to be her carer.
OP you sound very overwhelmed you know you can Talk to the Samaratins about stress or anything that you're having difficulty with because you sound trapped because you're unemployed and you have to live there and I know when everyone else is turning a blind eye except you it can be really tiring and upsetting.

Neyite

I have experience living with Dementia, though I cant get into much detail on a public forum, but suspicions about money, being distrustful, being verbally agressive, and thinking things are not as they are, all sound very familiar.

A doctor described it best when he explained its like if you imagine a corrupted /fragmented computer file - say music or film. There are gaps where information should be causing the whole story to be distorted. Thats what goes on in a brain with dememtia. The past, present and future all get mixed up. My relative was waiting for children to come home from school (circa early 80's) losing large sums of money (never found) getting annoyed at imaginary things -such as the washing machine that had been in the same place for years was noticed as if it had just been delivered and someone deliberalty put it in the same place. they struggle to control their emotions and feel angry and frustrated.

We found it easier to just agree and try to shelve the subject and it was subsequently forgotton about. In your grannys mind, the memory of the money she put somewhere safe (sometime in the past) is mixed up with a current realisation that its now gone. Her only explanation to herself is that someone in the house took it. Because she is certain it was there. Her memory of that past act is not recognised as a past act. It feels like a recent memory. Then, because the emotions are all also mixed up, what might have been a calm rational realisation that she was mistaken is non existant, and suspicion and anger factor in. Its really hard to reason with them. We found that just agreeing and distraction helped with most stuff.

Its a common theme that the dementia sufferer is adamant that nothing is wrong with them, but its easier once its diagnosed to explain to others that you are not doing what you are accused of. More importantly, there are support systems in place - if your gran is diagnosed with this, she will need a closer eye - things like forgetting to turn off the cooker or leaving the place unlocked, or bad money decisions are all very valid fears. Its not easy - I would go as far as to say that its a terrible illness, made all the more harder when you have someone very set in their ways and who has always been independant.

Best of luck with talking to the doctor.

LegacyUser

Thanks everyone.

I didn't speak with the doctor yesterday as I wanted to speak to my mother about it once more, and I'm glad I did.

I spoke with my mother last night about it and she told me, my grandmother doesn't have her bank accounts sorted out with her will (she hasn't included them in her will and she wants to) and she (grandmother) wants to sort them out, but keeps putting it off.

And my mother is afraid that if she speaks to the doctor that if my grandmother did sort her bank accounts out with her will that it could (and would) be challenged in court (by my grandmothers sons, all of whom she has nothing to do with, for other reasons).

She wants nothing to do with her sons and doesn't want them getting anything if she was to pass away, but as she hasn't got her bank accounts included in her will, if anything did happen to her, they would be split between her six children, but she only wants her three daughters to get her inheritance, none of her sons.

This kind of leaves me in limbo - on one side - I want to tell her doctor so he can keep a closer eye on her - on another side - I don't want to mess things up, re; her will.

I still think I should speak to her doctor, but what do others think?

shinikins wrote: »

One thing I would do if I were in your shoes-speak to the pharmacist. I'd be willing to bet your granny knows one of the staff quite well, and they are the one's giving her tablets without a prescription. I'd also be willing to bet that the pharmacist knows nothing about this. Prescription medication can be so dangerous, too much or too little of the wrong drug can potentially cause massive health risks, so for drugs to be given out to her without the doctor having seen her is massively irresponsible.

You are right, she knows the pharmacist and most of the staff there quite well.

She has been getting her medication in this same pharmacy for years.

LegacyUser

Can anyone give any advice on what I should/could do now please?

Ickle Magoo

I think her mental well-being comes before any assumptions/worries about her money - if she isn't well and that comes out then any will she makes in the interim could well be contested anyway.

She needs to be seen by a medical professional, we can't diagnose but she could be seriously unwell, it could be a degenerative condition and avoiding getting her the proper treatment promptly could be doing her a much bigger disservice than holding off due to inheritance issues.

Seriously OP, I'd insist she see's a doctor asap.

KDII

Hey,

I completely understand your position, you don't want to upset anyone, least of all your Granny but I could imagine this would be eating you up.

I know it seems hard but you probably need to bring the issue up with the doctor. I know that it's "not your business" but you need to advocate for your Gran as it seems as if she isn't able to at the moment.

I can only imagine how distressing it is to see her like this but if she HAS to go see the doctor eventually about her BP tablets he may approach a conversation differently than usual.

Also if you are seeing a deterioration it will be relatively minor, day to day stuff but to a health professional who sees this literally daily there would be subtle signs for the doctor to pick up on.

I think you need help, and you know that, and that's why you posted here. None of us can diagnose anything at all, but I wonder if you even gave your local Public Health Nurse office a call if they could point you in the direction of a support group of even a site to help you out?

Hope everything works out, and if all else fails you should open up to your Mum about how upset it makes you feel. What you describe about watching your Granny crossing the road and nearly being in an accident seems as if the real shock was seeing her vulnerable for the first time, she sounds like a very independent lady.

LegacyUser

OP, my mum has Alzheimer's Disease and some of what you've described sounds like what happened in the early stages with her. I do think that you should go talk to your gran's GP though and see what he thinks. They're bound by confidentiality. Besides, as someone said already, professionals can pick up on these things.

As regards your gran's will, if she's not in the full of her health, the will might not have a legal standing. Don't quote me on that though - I'm no legal expert. I know someone who had a parent with dementia and they got them made a ward of court.

If you're not comfortable going to her GP immediately (though I do think you should), why not give your local Alzheimer's Society office a buzz and have a chat with someone there?

LegacyUser

I would speak to your Gran doctor about her and what is happening as soon as possible.
From what you are saying she may have some type of memory loss. I know someone who's mother who I will call Mary has Alzheimer.
When Mary was told this her family could help her. She made a will at this time as she knew then was going on and understood what she was doing. Her solicitor could see this.
This was a few years ago.
Mary child now has power of attorney along with another relative which means that they can make the decisions Mary can no longer make ie they can speak to the bank about her money, collect her pension and discuss her medical condition and decide on medical treatment with her doctor.
You gran thinks she is fine but she is not. She won't want to make a will but she need to do this soon other wise you mother will be dealing with some amount of problems. Mary family noticed her decline and change and some of the relatives said O there nothing wrong with Mary. Because someone got an early dignosis Mary can get the treatment she need to keep her as well as possible for as long as possible.