Growth Area's In The Music Industry?

Zangetsu

Between studio recording/producing, live tech work and post production for tv, movies and games which area would you think would offer the most opportunities as far as being able to carve out a living?

Also would it be uncommon for a live engineer to cross over into studio work and even post production stuff?

I've a few very difficult decisions to make about my future, just hoping there might be a few educated heads in here that could offer a little advice.

omen80

It's a tough industry to land a secure paying job. No matter what route you go down it's always handy to get into computer programming for audio. That way you have a skill that you could use in other areas. There are not many jobs going in studios that you would earn a decent secure living, and the trend is that these will become even more scarce. If you're serious about getting into it then by all means go for it, but just be aware that most people end up working in other sectors and do their music/production stuff on the side.

Zangetsu

omen80 wrote: »

No matter what route you go down it's always handy to get into computer programming for audio. That way you have a skill that you could use in other areas.

What kind of area's would it be useful?

omen80 wrote: »

most people end up working in other sectors and do their music/production stuff on the side.

Do you mean sectors unrelated to the music industry?

Thanks for the reply!

omen80

Zangetsu wrote: »

What kind of area's would it be useful?

Anywhere really, you could use it in game development, graphics, telecommunications, DSP, web developement etc.

Zangetsu wrote: »

Do you mean sectors unrelated to the music industry?

I surely do!

Zangetsu

omen80 wrote: »

Anywhere really, you could use it in game development, graphics, telecommunications, DSP, web developement etc.



I surely do!

I've heard of a few of these like supercollider and maxmsp? which would be most useful in your opinion?

Thanks again!

omen80

Zangetsu wrote: »

I've heard of a few of these like supercollider and maxmsp? which would be most useful in your opinion?

These tools are quite specific in terms of what they do and are only used for audio purposes.
In terms of languages for audio I would recommend Csound. It's a text based language and is great for synthesis and any table editing. It will also reveal any errors in your code, but you learn more that way.
For a general purpose language you can't go wrong with C and C++. This is great for low level audio programming but the skills can be transferred to other sectors which I've mentioned.
I actually wouldn't consider MaxMsp a programming language.

LeBash

From what I've seen and heard, the dole is probably a real possibility unless your the balls

Radiosurfer

I think this could be a really useful conversation if people with experience and jobs in the industry chime in.

One thing we can all be sure of is that there really are no careers in the coming decades. The people that will be the most successful are the ones that are prepared to reinvent themselves every 5 years or so. You may start in live sound and move into software, you could equally move in the opposite direction. The trends are coming thick and fast and the only guaranteed constant is change.

I know professionals (whom some of you may know but I don't want to name names) who started out as engineers, moved into mastering, spent half the time being pro-tools "consultants" over the last 10 years and now have no one thing that earns them all their money. They do a bit of everything to pay the bills.

The most useful single skill you could aquire is the ability to network and be liked as that seems to be the deciding factor in how these guys get most of the work they now get. Just my 2 cents.

studiorat

The biggest growth area as far as I can see is education.

godfrey

I agree with studiorat. There are a billion courses all over the country like a bad rash, mostly (I'm gonna get flamed here!!) turning out so-called engineers with the attitude they know everything, MUST have this & that desk, plugins, mic/pre combination, and can't fix a mic cable, can't put the speakers in the right place for a gig, can't get A DRUM SOUND and so on... Pretenders, all of them!!

IF you're good enough and can calm down and have patience, learn from other people who actually DO the job for a living, and you are able to work for nothing for a while, then that's the route I'd recommend, whether it's live or studio sound. In broadcast, your best bet is an OB facilities company as an assistant for a while. I believe the old model of an 'apprenticeship' is still the best education. I also recommend learning a little electronics in your own time. Nothing too heavy like some of the I.T.'s tend to focus on, but enough for a reasonable understanding of filters, amplifiers, and some basic principles of sound and acoustics. All these are imperative in getting a good sound more than just than one time you got lucky!!

Hope I haven't insulted any of the career educators here, but I'm in the business 32+ years and I think I've earned the right to share my opinions on the subject, and of course, I hope it's helpful so at least someone here...

Regards ~

g

krd

Radiosurfer wrote: »

The most useful single skill you could aquire is the ability to network and be liked as that seems to be the deciding factor in how these guys get most of the work they now get. Just my 2 cents.

That's the deciding factor in nearly any place you'll work.

If you were the kind of person who always got picked, at least in the middle, for the football team, you'll always have a job.

If you weren't, you could be in trouble.

Radiosurfer

krd wrote: »

If you were the kind of person who always got picked, at least in the middle, for the football team, you'll always have a job.

If you weren't, you could be in trouble.

Harsh, but fair point

krd

godfrey wrote: »

I agree with studiorat. There are a billion courses all over the country like a bad rash, mostly (I'm gonna get flamed here!!) turning out so-called engineers with the attitude they know everything, MUST have this & that desk, plugins, mic/pre combination, and can't fix a mic cable, can't put the speakers in the right place for a gig, can't get A DRUM SOUND and so on... Pretenders, all of them!!

Yeah. The vast majority of these course are rubbish. They can be very slick though - all the gear, and all the bull****. I have known some people to do three year diploma courses, and they've come out, and really they wouldn't be up to producing anything. When I was a teenager, I would have loved to be on one of those courses. Maybe I would have worked very hard at it - but what I've learned often, is the quality of the teaching, and what's covered is so useless, that whole course is often pointless.

Saying that......One or two of the people teaching some of those courses, I know to be excellent musician/producers...Who if there wasn't as much illegal downloading as there is, would more likely be making a living through their music, and not through teaching these courses.

There's an explosion in these courses, because there's much less money to be made through recorded music than there was. And so many kids want to do music/media production.

Hope I haven't insulted any of the career educators here, but I'm in the business 32+ years and I think I've earned the right to share my opinions on the subject, and of course, I hope it's helpful so at least someone here...

The courses would be more effective if they were run more like apprenticeships. But I've heard, many kids on the intake into these courses are so lacking in basic skills, they wouldn't be able to program happy birthday on a Fruity Loops.

omen80

Agree. These courses are fine for the home hobbyist who wants to record their own music in their bedroom etc. But experience is worth so much more when it comes to doing it professionally in a studio.
I know someone who finished a diploma in Pulse a few years back. He's been freelancing since but earning nothing really. He's thinking of just looking for a day job to pay the bills. It's a tough reality.

madtheory

To answer the OP's homework question- theatre and corporate sound, TV post, location sound for TV, and radio production/ advertising are the areas where there is actually work, as far as I can see. And education. Being a freelance engineer working with bands is extremely difficult even without a recession. It pays to be a bit more broadminded about your career path I think.

To address some other points: don't tar all courses with the same brush. And it's tough out there no matter what your qualifications are.

I agree with godfrey. Except that students either don't understand what they're getting themselves into (due to lack of maturity/ responsibility), or have not received good guidance. UL, Tralee IT, CIT and LIT all run good courses. The real problem is that career guidance at second level is very poor in this country. You have people giving career advice who have never worked outside of an institution. It's really bad. Add to that, the way second level is entirely exams oriented and it's amazing that people actually progress at all.

At LIT I think we do pretty well. For example we do teach audio electronics (including soldering cables!) and acoustics, and we run live shows with full production- PA, lighting and video. So plenty of hands on practical experience. Self directed learning is hugely important. As well as having studios with PT HD, drumkits, piano, a theatre/venue with a PM5D etc. etc. etc.

Interestingly, graduates are saying that the most useful module was Comms and Networks. It's designed for modern broadcast systems, but is applicable to a wide range of IT jobs. It's hated because it doesn't appear relevant on the face of it, but it is in fact highly relevant.

Note: I've added quite a bit to this post as I thought more about it...

mkegvn

madtheory wrote: »

To answer the OP's homework question- theatre and corporate sound, TV post, location sound for TV, and radio production/ advertising are the areas where there is actually work, as far as I can see. And education. Being a freelance engineer working with bands is extremely difficult even without a recession. It pays to be a bit more broadminded about your career path I think.

To address some other points: don't tar all courses with the same brush. And it's tough out there no matter what your qualifications are.

I agree with godfrey. Except that students either don't understand what they're getting themselves into (due to lack of maturity/ responsibility), or have not received good guidance. UL, Tralee IT, CIT and LIT all run good courses. The real problem is that career guidance at second level is very poor in this country. You have people giving career advice who have never worked outside of an institution. It's really bad. Add to that, the way second level is entirely exams oriented and it's amazing that people actually progress at all.

At LIT I think we do pretty well. For example we do teach audio electronics (including soldering cables!) and acoustics, and we run live shows with full production- PA, lighting and video. So plenty of hands on practical experience. Self directed learning is hugely important. As well as having studios with PT HD, drumkits, piano, a theatre/venue with a PM5D etc. etc. etc.

Interestingly, graduates are saying that the most useful module was Comms and Networks. It's designed for modern broadcast systems, but is applicable to a wide range of IT jobs. It's hated because it doesn't appear relevant on the face of it, but it is in fact highly relevant.

Note: I've added quite a bit to this post as I thought more about it...

Most of my peers aren't quite fond of the two elements I've highlighted up there, Mad. Self directed learning especially.

Back on thread though, I think that a few years of college only teaches you how to teach yourself. It's the tip of the iceberg. saying that, I've partaken in a few Sound Eng/Music Tech courses, and the LIT course is actually fantastic. Great lecturers, and facilities to match.

madtheory

mkegvn wrote: »

a few years of college only teaches you how to teach yourself.

That is self directed learning, so your point shows that it works thank god. And I did say that comms is hated, the point is it's actually very very useful. And it's not me saying that, it's graduates.

mkegvn

madtheory wrote: »

That is self directed learning, so your point shows that it works thank god. And I did say that comms is hated, the point is it's actually very very useful. And it's not me saying that, it's graduates.

I had my own battles with it to begin, but i've come around. It's actually very interesting, but not many others see it like that.

GTE

godfrey wrote: »

I agree with studiorat. There are a billion courses all over the country like a bad rash, mostly (I'm gonna get flamed here!!) turning out so-called engineers with the attitude they know everything, MUST have this & that desk, plugins, mic/pre combination, and can't fix a mic cable, can't put the speakers in the right place for a gig, can't get A DRUM SOUND and so on... Pretenders, all of them!!



Hope I haven't insulted any of the career educators here, but I'm in the business 32+ years and I think I've earned the right to share my opinions on the subject, and of course, I hope it's helpful so at least someone here...

Regards ~

g

I am just finishing up in the education loop (2 years in an FE and 2 in a University) and since going to the Uni I have seen the exact pretenders you are on about.

Bloody hell, I had a conversation with someone where they charged 100 euro to record and mix and master (not really worth saying you are mastering really) and he completely disregarded the concept of vocal automation and automation of any kind for that matter and he is going to get a better result on paper then me! I am in no way perfect but I do try my best.

I do want to get into education though, but that is out of a love of teaching and I am so utterly frustrated at how bad the university level of teaching is.