septic tank in wrong position

churchtown2012

Hi Guys... new to this but here goes... i built my own house back in 2007 and moved into in 2009. When I say I built, I mean self build option using only 3 trades bricky,electrician and plumber to do all the hot press work. I was in the construction trade myself so I was pretty handy.
Now my problem... neighbour had complained to me that my septic was was leaking which turned out to be wrong( only ground water ).I fixed the problem by digging a ditch and thought all was well until my neighbour call into me with a site map of my site and saying that my tank is in the wrong position as shown on the map. Turn's out the neighbour is correct and I contacted my architect... his reply to my was to put in for planning retention as the costs involved would be 3000 euro and a ruined lawn.I now I have breached planning permission but I'm wondering why the architect never pulled me on this and now i'm left with 3000 bill and or possible fine..........

Thanks for any replies to my query

Poor Uncle Tom

Your options:
1. Do nothing,
2. Put the tank/treatment system in the correct location,
3. Apply for planning permission for indefinite retention of the system where it is right now which will mean carrying out a full site characterization report and tests in accordance with the EPA's Code of Practice and you will need to provide certification of the existing system for the LA.

Personally I would wait until the weather clears up later on in the year and put the tank and percolation area where you have planning permission to do so.

If you effectively ran a self build site yourself the ball stays in your court. If you had a Clerk Of Works on your site or a PSDP then they have questions to answer.

This thread is not to turn into a blame game or it will be locked.

tred

churchtown2012 wrote: »

Hi Guys... new to this but here goes... i built my own house back in 2007 and moved into in 2009. When I say I built, I mean self build option using only 3 trades bricky,electrician and plumber to do all the hot press work. I was in the construction trade myself so I was pretty handy.
Now my problem... neighbour had complained to me that my septic was was leaking which turned out to be wrong( only ground water ).I fixed the problem by digging a ditch and thought all was well until my neighbour call into me with a site map of my site and saying that my tank is in the wrong position as shown on the map. Turn's out the neighbour is correct and I contacted my architect... his reply to my was to put in for planning retention as the costs involved would be 3000 euro and a ruined lawn.I now I have breached planning permission but I'm wondering why the architect never pulled me on this and now i'm left with 3000 bill and or possible fine..........

Thanks for any replies to my query

is the tank 7m from the house and the percolation over ten? Retention probably the way to go then. Approach the council. I wouldn do nothing, i have a feeling your neighbour has plans to do something about it??. These things happen. Engineer should have spotted it.

churchtown2012

thanks for the reply poor uncle tom...firstly dont want to turn this into a blame game as i feel i'm at fault and you learn by your mistakes....
your first option '' do nothing '' i dont think i'm in that position but as you clearly and rightly say now is not the time of year to go getting diggers in...
when i say i went the self build option i did employ a engineer from the start...again no blame attached

churchtown2012

thanks for reply tred
yes tank is 7m from the house and percolation over 10m. what i wondering now is if i pay for test to be carried out for where it is and it fails...would i be better off going ahead and spend the money of moving the system to the correct location

muffler

The situation appears to be that you got permission to install the septic tank at point A and somewhere along the line a mistake was made and the tank ended up at point B. The neighbour isn't happy with this and wants you to put the tank at point A where it should have been from the outset. Would that be a fair summary?

If yes then I would proceed with option 2 as mentioned above by Poor Uncle Tom and do so as suggested later on when the weather and associated ground conditions improve. In doing so you are merely conforming with the grant of permission.

archtech

You will get an epa site suitability test done for somewhere between 500 and 800 give or take.

You have a number of options available to you based on the results, if you decide to get the test done.

1. If the current arrangement satisfies the test, you could apply for retention
2. If it fails you move the current arrangement to its permitted area
3. Subject to seeking planning approval, it may be possible to leave the tank in its current location and just move the percolation area.

mickdw

When you say tank is in wrong position, Is the percolation area correct as per the planning?
Percolation location is important as this must be positioned as per trial hole and percolation testing. talk to planner about the situation

No6

mickdw wrote: »

When you say tank is in wrong position, Is the percolation area correct as per the planning?
Percolation location is important as this must be positioned as per trial hole and percolation testing. talk to planner about the situation

My thoughts exactly Mick, its the percolation that needs testing, If its only the tank in the "wrong" position, I would question how wrong it is, 2 or 3m I wouldn't worry too much 10 or 20m I'd have to think about it!!!

Tmurf

Hey,
Not to sure about this but,
Is there something in the planning that if there was something wrong in a build and it has been built over 5-6 years that it is ok to leave it there,
no retention has to be applied ...
Again not sure about it

Poor Uncle Tom

Tmurf wrote: »

Hey,
Not to sure about this but,
Is there something in the planning that if there was something wrong in a build and it has been built over 5-6 years that it is ok to leave it there,
no retention has to be applied ...
Again not sure about it

The LA can not act on enforcement on any unauthorised development after a period of 7 years, but this does not make an unauthorised development legal and if the property was ever being sold it would have to be regularised at that stage as no solicitor or bank would sanction the purchase of any property which is partly an unauthorised development.

muffler

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

The LA can not act on enforcement on any unauthorised development after a period of 7 years, but this does not make an unauthorised development legal and if the property was ever being sold it would have to be regularised at that stage as no solicitor or bank would sanction the purchase of any property which is partly an unauthorised development.

+1 on above.

Just to add that I have seen people hitting problems with remortgages and also if they ever applied for planning again on the same site...it wouldn't be entertained until such time as the unauthorised development was regularised.

BryanF

muffler wrote: »

+1 on above.

Just to add that I have seen people hitting problems with remortgages and also if they ever applied for planning again on the same site...it wouldn't be entertained until such time as the unauthorised development was regularised.

+1
seen this especially with waste treatment units/perc areas - hammering small extension budgets

churchtown2012

thanks for all the reply's guy....just to answer some questions ask...good point made by mickdw but both the tank and percolation are in the wrong position and turn out the tank is not even 3 meters form the boundary which EPA states... so it looks like i start saving for the summer... any ideas of how much it costs to have tanks emptied??? also the test for the area came in at T10 which equals 36meters of percolation pipe minimum and i thought i was doing good by putting down nearly 100 meters of pipe ( but in the wrong area arrrrrrrrrrgh) how many meters of pipe would be sufice for a T10 value

Poor Uncle Tom

churchtown2012 wrote: »

......how many meters of pipe would be sufice for a T10 value

That isn't relevant, it's a case of whatever was designed, specified and got planning permission specifically for your site and as shown on your site layout plan.

churchtown2012

poor uncle tom i dont know what you mean by not relevant as there is nothing specified by my engineer... all it says on the site layout map is '' minimun of 36 meters of pipe to be used''

muffler

churchtown2012 wrote: »

poor uncle tom i dont know what you mean by not relevant as there is nothing specified by my engineer... all it says on the site layout map is '' minimun of 36 meters of pipe to be used''

Have you read the conditions attached to the planning permission?

churchtown2012

yes muffler but there was nothing on it about percolation area or tank

muffler

churchtown2012 wrote: »

yes muffler but there was nothing on it about percolation area or tank

I find that very odd. Not doubting you at all but tell me..did you have a site assessment/characterization carried out at planning stage?

is there any conditions in the PP that states something like "septic tank and percolation area to be constructed in accordance with EPA doc - waster water treatment systems for single houses" ?

Is there any mention of having to consult with the EHO?

If not then work to the approved site plan.

churchtown2012

muffler you have me thinking now, i will check the planning and post back thanks

churchtown2012

muffler just check the planning and it says....
A SEPTIC TANK TO PLANNING AUTHORITY'S APPROVAL SHALL BE SO PROVIVED AND MAINTAINED TO GIVE EFFLUENT QUALITY OF 20 MG/L BOD. 30MG/LSS OR BETTER. THE PERCOLATION AREA SHALL BE CONSTRUCTED AND MAINTAINED STRICTLY IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STANDARD RECOMMENDATIONS FOR SEPTIC TANK SYSTEMS SR6:1991

muffler

churchtown2012 wrote: »

muffler just check the planning and it says....
A SEPTIC TANK TO PLANNING AUTHORITY'S APPROVAL SHALL BE SO PROVIVED AND MAINTAINED TO GIVE EFFLUENT QUALITY OF 20 MG/L BOD. 30MG/LSS OR BETTER. THE PERCOLATION AREA SHALL BE CONSTRUCTED AND MAINTAINED STRICTLY IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STANDARD RECOMMENDATIONS FOR SEPTIC TANK SYSTEMS SR6:1991

That sorta answers you questions never mind mine