Amending M50 Toll Charge structure to yield higher revenue

Bishop_Donal

Over the past while I have been thinking about a number of revenue raising options that are either
1.) already under consideration by the Government or
2.) adaptions of existing charges capable of increasing revenue which they have not yet thought of.

I think everyone is aware of the idea of splitting the existing charge on the M50 into a number of individual gates at a smaller rate (makes a lot of sense if you ask me).

However what surprises me a little bit is that they havn't considered varying the charge northbound v's the charge southbound.

Obviously the principal attractions (except airport) in the city are on the Southside (and I don't mean that in a negative way about the Northside, but it's just dictated by the natural environment as much as anything / plus I am westside so I'm impartial).

So does it not make more sense that people travelling Southside but naturally domiciled in the Northside should pay a higher charge (say Eur4 and that the charge heading back northside could be reduced to Eur2?).

Oranage2

2 questions?

1) do you drive?
2) Is this your homework?

starbelgrade

Isn't there a Dublin forum somewhere?

Bishop_Donal

Oranage2 wrote: »

2 questions?

1) do you drive?
2) Is this your homework?

1.) Yes
2.) Don't get you?

mikom

Is there a Toll on the motoring or Commuting & Transport forum which prevented you starting this thread there OP?

Jesus Wept

starbelgrade wrote: »

Isn't there a Dublin forum somewhere?

Moved to After Hours.

triple-M

so let me get this straight to instead of paying 3 + 3 euro for two trips paying 4 + 2 euro for two trips generates more revenue somehow?most people travelling northbound have to come back southbound at some stage

step 1. change toll structure but charge the same amount
step 2.???????
step 3.Profit

Bishop_Donal

triple-M wrote: »

so let me get this straight to instead of paying 3 + 3 euro for two trips paying 4 + 2 euro for two trips generates more revenue somehow?

step 1. change toll structure but charge the same
step 2.???????
step 3.Profit

I don't think I pay six euro, but maybe that's cos I'm registered.

Anyway that's not the point. Even if it's Five southbound and Three northbound. Whatever.

I take the points re: wrong thread, apols to those offended,.

starbelgrade

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Even if it's Five southbound and Three northbound.

Why charge the skangers less?

seantorious

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Obviously the principal attractions (except airport) in the city are on the Southside

I hear the southside is the only D4 sanctuary in the world outside of America.

sasser

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Over the past while I have been thinking about a number of revenue raising options that are either
1.) already under consideration by the Government or
2.) adaptions of existing charges capable of increasing revenue which they have not yet thought of.

I think everyone is aware of the idea of splitting the existing charge on the M50 into a number of individual gates at a smaller rate (makes a lot of sense if you ask me).

However what surprises me a little bit is that they havn't considered varying the charge northbound v's the charge southbound.

Obviously the principal attractions (except airport) in the city are on the Southside (and I don't mean that in a negative way about the Northside, but it's just dictated by the natural environment as much as anything / plus I am westside so I'm impartial).

So does it not make more sense that people travelling Southside but naturally domiciled in the Northside should pay a higher charge (say Eur4 and that the charge heading back northside could be reduced to Eur2?).

What principle attractions are you talking about?

JazzyJ

I don't think that's a change like that is going to make much of a difference. Most people will usually make 2 trips through that area at any time as they're usually going to and returning from somewhere.

In San Francisco they only charge one way on the toll bridges. Certainly speeds thinks up when going the non-tolled direction. Although this is a moot point with the removal of the barriers on the M50.

Bishop_Donal

sasser wrote: »

What principle attractions are you talking about?

I think you'll find that there are a lot more people who travel from North to South for their visit rather than vice verse. Hence, they obviously see something?

I suppose there are no major attractions to drag people the opposite direction (so generally people travelling northbound is mandatory)

sasser

Lol, what a gob****e you are

Bishop_Donal

sasser wrote: »

Lol, what a gob****e you are

??

My point is that more trips from N to S are voluntary (e.g. to RDS / Dublin Mountains / Wicklow / Powerscourt / Lansdowne), hence they should attract a higher rate. That's all. These trips are discretionary, so I think it's perfectly reasonable.

JazzyJ

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

??

My point is that more trips from N to S are voluntary (e.g. to RDS / Dublin Mountains / Wicklow / Powerscourt / Lansdowne), hence they should attract a higher rate. That's all. These trips are discretionary, so I think it's perfectly reasonable.

So what happens when they get there? Never return???

Pherekydes

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

I suppose there are no major attractions to drag people the opposite direction (so generally people travelling northbound is mandatory)

The Zoo is Ireland's most popular tourist attraction. Croke Park is busier than Lansdowne Rd, and Dublin Airport, while not an attraction per se, is a lot busier than the southside's airport.

Oh wait, the southside doesn't have an airport.

Bishop_Donal

JazzyJ wrote: »

So what happens when they get there? Never return???

Don't be silly.

The point is that the 'voluntary' trips are primarily North to South.

sasser

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

??

My point is that more trips from N to S are voluntary (e.g. to RDS / Dublin Mountains / Wicklow / Powerscourt / Lansdowne), hence they should attract a higher rate. That's all. These trips are discretionary, so I think it's perfectly reasonable.

Just because you think it's true doesn't actually make it true. That's a fact.

Bishop_Donal

sasser wrote: »

Just because you think it's true doesn't actually make it true. That's a fact.

Well I suppose I can only speak from my own experience, and that of the people I know. I can tell you that there is very little you'd be heading Northbound on the M50 for on a Sunday (and I am speaking for a lot of people). Driving to an industrial heartland is generally not something you'd be doing to keep the kids occupied.

Pherekydes

Forgot to mention the Botanic Gardens and of course it goes without saying, the Phoenix Park.

Del2005

There should be no toll on relief roads. Putting more tolls on the M50 will make traffic in Dublin City worst and lead to an increase in RTI's.

If one person you used to travel the M50 is killed in a RTI we'd need everyone in the country to travel on the M50 completely with out incident to cover the 3 million Euro the NRA says a traffic fatality costs the country.

dj jarvis

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Don't be silly.

The point is that the 'voluntary' trips are primarily North to South.

seriously ...... stop just stop , that "point" you just made has to be one of the most retarded things i have read on AH

Pherekydes

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Well I suppose I can only speak from my own experience, and that of the people I know. I can tell you that there is very little you'd be heading Northbound on the M50 for on a Sunday (and I am speaking for a lot of people). Driving to an industrial heartland is generally not something you'd be doing to keep the kids occupied.

You should bring them to Collins Barracks or the Botanic Gardens, both free. You could keep them happy and educate yourself at the same time.

Later in the summer, you could visit Croker on match day, or attend the National Athletics Championships, or the National Swimming LC Championships.

Bishop_Donal

Pherekydes wrote: »

You should bring them to Collins' Barracks or the Botanic Gardens, both free. You could keep them happy and educate yourself at the same time.

Later in the summer, you could visit Croker on match day, or attend the National Athletics Championships, or the National Swimming LC Championships.

v's
Powerscourt
Enniskerry
Brittas
Dublin Mountains
Wexford Beaches
Lansdowne (Matches / Concerts)
Open farm up in Goatstown (forget the name)
Gaeity
Grand Canal
Dundrum SC
Imaginosity
Dun Laoghaire (and Pavilion)
Bray
RDS

and that's about 20 secs of thinking.

All that said, this is not a question about what the Northside has or what the Southside has. It's about charging people who don't have to travel a bit more, so that overall Revenues can be increased a bit.

BTW, I regularly attend Crokers, but it doesn't take me north on the M50.

Pherekydes

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

All that said, this is not a question about what the Northside has or what the Southside has. It's about charging people who don't have to travel a bit more, so that overall Revenues can be increased a bit.

Fair enough, then. Can you produce stats that show that more journeys are made in one direction?

P.S. Don't forget Newgrange and Newry (for the shopping) on the northside. :rolleyes:

mikemac1

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Brittas
Wexford Beaches

If you're going to include places that far south then I may as well say I use that road to get to the Giants Causeway in Antrim

There's a reason you came to AH and it's because the Dublin forum doesn't entertain northside/southside generalisations

mikom

mikom wrote: »

Is there a Toll on the motoring or Commuting & Transport forum which prevented you starting this thread there OP?

Or even the roads forum, he would get more mileage out of this query there!

brambo

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Well I suppose I can only speak from my own experience, and that of the people I know. I can tell you that there is very little you'd be heading Northbound on the M50 for on a Sunday (and I am speaking for a lot of people). Driving to an industrial heartland is generally not something you'd be doing to keep the kids occupied.

You've obviously never heard of Ikea.

jack presley

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

v's
Powerscourt
Enniskerry
Brittas
Dublin Mountains
Wexford Beaches
Lansdowne (Matches / Concerts)
Open farm up in Goatstown (forget the name)
Gaeity
Grand Canal
Dundrum SC
Imaginosity
Dun Laoghaire (and Pavilion)
Bray
RDS

and that's about 20 secs of thinking.

All that said, this is not a question about what the Northside has or what the Southside has. It's about charging people who don't have to travel a bit more, so that overall Revenues can be increased a bit.

BTW, I regularly attend Crokers, but it doesn't take me north on the M50.

Anyone taking the M50 to get the Gaeity needs to get a new sat Nav

JazzyJ

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Don't be silly.

The point is that the 'voluntary' trips are primarily North to South.

WTF? Are you not getting the fact that generally when a trip is made somewhere a return trip is also done, so North to South and then South to North to return or even (god forbid!) South to North and then North to South.

Thoie

OP, you still haven't said how all these northern visitors to southern attractions are going to get home again? The likelihood is that if you're passing the toll in one direction, you're going to go home the same way. While it's possible to go through Dublin city centre to avoid the toll, that holds true in both directions.

Stiffler2

Oh that's just great, land us with more charges then yeah ?
Great Idea.

The only reason the northside has a toll is to pay for the extra overtime for the gardai dealing with incidents on the northside

Bishop_Donal

Stiffler2 wrote: »

Oh that's just great, land us with more charges then yeah ?
Great Idea.

The only reason the northside has a toll is to pay for the extra overtime for the gardai dealing with incidents on the northside

There are lots more charges coming (whether you like it or not).

I would just prefer to see as many as possible on discretionary items - that is some total of the point.

There is really no need to get so defensive.

joe stodge

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

??

My point is that more trips from N to S are voluntary (e.g. to RDS / Dublin Mountains / Wicklow / Powerscourt / Lansdowne), hence they should attract a higher rate. That's all. These trips are discretionary, so I think it's perfectly reasonable.

have you ever been on the northside of dublin?? or are you happy there in your little bubble on the southside??

Bishop_Donal

joe stodge wrote: »

have you ever been on the northside of dublin?? or are you happy there in your little bubble on the southside??

Ah come on.

I have been on the Northside a good few times & I go to the airport 15 - 20 times a year. I just genuinely find that when I'm chilling at the weekend, and just doing what I want to do, that invariably I end up heading South way more than North.

Irish Steve

There are threads, and then..................there are stoopid threads

There's a facility to ignore posters, is there a facitity to ignore threads?????????

Where do these people come from?????????????

earpiece

Those damn education cutbacks.

charlemont

Bishop_Donal wrote: »

Over the past while I have been thinking about a number of revenue raising options that are either
1.) already under consideration by the Government or
2.) adaptions of existing charges capable of increasing revenue which they have not yet thought of.

I think everyone is aware of the idea of splitting the existing charge on the M50 into a number of individual gates at a smaller rate (makes a lot of sense if you ask me).

However what surprises me a little bit is that they havn't considered varying the charge northbound v's the charge southbound.

Obviously the principal attractions (except airport) in the city are on the Southside (and I don't mean that in a negative way about the Northside, but it's just dictated by the natural environment as much as anything / plus I am westside so I'm impartial).

So does it not make more sense that people travelling Southside but naturally domiciled in the Northside should pay a higher charge (say Eur4 and that the charge heading back northside could be reduced to Eur2?).

Your a sick man !!!

earpiece

JazzyJ wrote: »

WTF? Are you not getting the fact that generally when a trip is made somewhere a return trip is also done, so North to South and then South to North to return or even (god forbid!) South to North and then North to South.

Don't be confusing OP with all this forward, backwards, sidey-ways stuff..... can't you see there is a problem here?:D

Super-Rush

mikom wrote: »

Is there a Toll on the motoring or Commuting & Transport forum which prevented you starting this thread there OP?

This.