Resignalling on Waterford-Limerick Junction line

cml387

Out on a cycle today I noticed a new electric signal and associated signalling ducting installed near the ahb crossing at Merck between Carrick and Clonmel.

Is this just crossing protection,or are they resignalling the whole line?

corktina

that sounds like the death knell to em if they are spending money!:(

foggy_lad

corktina wrote: »

that sounds like the death knell to em if they are spending money!:(

When they reopen the line in 100 years at least it might still have modern signalling, they are just future proofing it!

dowlingm

Does anyone know what the current status of the Limerick Junction-Waterford West signalling is? This is what it was in 2003

http://www.raiu.ie/uploads/raiu/cahir_viaduct.pdf

Movement of trains is controlled under the electric token block system. Single track sections between passing loops are protected by signals linked to a token machine in the controlling signal cabin. The issuing of a token by the signalman to a train driver allows a train to occupy a particular single track section of the railway. A token can only be removed from a machine if no other token for that particular line section is currently issued and if the points and signals for the route are correctly set. The route may only be re-set once the driver hands back the token to the controlling signalman at either end of the section and it is put back into a token machine.

Has the Limerick Junction-Tipperary (or Clonmel now?) token been removed and converted to mini CTC as part of the Limerick Junction cabin closures?

Hungerford

Limerick Junction to Tipperary was done as part of the Limerick Junction works. I think (but I am not sure) that IE removed Tipperary station's loop at the same time.

The rest of the line still retains its antique signalling although there are rumours that the 'Limerick' line out of Waterford is due to be pulled up soon to help facilitate the rundown of the service in preparation for closure for operational reasons.

Our man in Havana

So they plan to run the Limerick trains over the Dublin line from current diverge north of Waterford? That would require a new set of points and alterations to the CTC signalling.

I don't see the point of it.

Jehuty42

Our man in Havana wrote: »

So they plan to run the Limerick trains over the Dublin line from current diverge north of Waterford? That would require a new set of points and alterations to the CTC signalling.

I don't see the point of it.

As I understand it it's meant to facilitate closing Waterford West signal cabin and making the section from Dunkitt(the "current diverge north of Waterford") single line into Waterford station. IRN has the details. I guess you can look at it as IE maliciously reducing capacity to run down services, or as IE saving money by rationalizing track down to the bare minimum to run the current service to reduce maintenance costs, or as both, or as something else entirely.

dowlingm

Are Carrick, Tipp and Clonmel stations staffed in order to do ETS exchanges? If so I guess mini CTC-ing the line would mean staff cost savings on the line, which we normally think of terms of LC automations (unless the staff would have to be retained to work adjacent LCs?)

Our man in Havana

Tipp is not a block post anymore and is under the control of CTC.

Judgement Day

dowlingm wrote: »

Are Carrick, Tipp and Clonmel stations staffed in order to do ETS exchanges? If so I guess mini CTC-ing the line would mean staff cost savings on the line, which we normally think of terms of LC automations (unless the staff would have to be retained to work adjacent LCs?)

If stations on the South Eastern are anything to go by, the former signalmen would be retained to sell those tickets that the ATVMs can't deal with - 1798 passes, OAP tickets etc. :rolleyes:

Losty Dublin

The singling of the track at Waterford relates as much to making simple of it's rather odd arrangements than anything, although it will save a few € in the process. After the Cobh line was resignalled, Waterford Abbey-Waterford Central-Waterford West remained the last section signaled under Absolute Block Rules and equipment. The closures of the Rosslare line limited this to one section and while it didn't affect Dublin services working directly, the Limerick line trains had to stop at Waterford West to pick up or drop off the ETS staff, a situation that was odd to say the least. Add to it the fact that there is no staff left in the training centre with relevant knowledge in Ab-Block equipment and it was sooner rather than later that something had to budge down the South.

dowlingm

Our man in Havana wrote: »

Tipp is not a block post anymore and is under the control of CTC.

But isn't Tipperary-Clonmel still ETS? Oh but didn't they lift Tipp loop recently? So LJ-Clonmel is one long section now under mini-CTC, do I have that right?

Our man in Havana

The loop was lifted at Tipp Town and Clonmel-LJ is under CTC now.

Jehuty42

dowlingm wrote: »

But isn't Tipperary-Clonmel still ETS? Oh but didn't they lift Tipp loop recently? So LJ-Clonmel is one long section now under mini-CTC, do I have that right?

It's not mini CTC, it's full CTC from Connolly, that controls the Cork line, the Limerick Jn-Limerick branch line, and now, after the resignalling and redesign at Limerick Jn, it also controls the Limerick Jn area including the line as far east as Tipperary.

Losty Dublin

Tipp is the fringe box for CTC and retains it's ETS instrument towards Clonmel as well as controlling some local shunting discs. Given the short distance between Tipperary and Limerick Junction, the call was made to dispense with the loop at the station, a new 8 car long loop being provided for at the former pocket sidings to allow trains to cross if required.

Hungerford

Losty Dublin wrote: »

The singling of the track at Waterford relates as much to making simple of it's rather odd arrangements than anything, although it will save a few € in the process.

But it isn't just a simplification of the signaling - it's a reduction in capacity. The company plans to channel all trains running from Waterford West to Belview (a distance of 1.5 miles) through a single track section which appears to include the platform at Waterford station.

This means that, for example, Belview will be inaccessible when there is a passenger train parked at the station. This is quite an interesting development given that the relationship between CIE and Waterford Port hasn't been comfortable in recent years.

If they wanted to simplify the signalling, they could simply extend CTC to cover the other line. They will have to alter the CTC arrangements in any case to handle the reduction in capacity.

Jehuty42

Hungerford wrote: »

This means that, for example, Belview will be inaccessible when there is a passenger train parked at the station.

The IRN post linked to earlier claims this isn't the case:

The double line section from Waterford West to Waterford Central is also to be singled with a passing loop at Waterford Station to permit liner trains access to Bellview if the platform is occupied.

Our man in Havana

Waterford has a bay platform which terminating trains could be signalled into.

Does this mean that the Waterford Central box will now be closed?