The Greek parents too poor to care for their children

Paddy Samurai

Greece's financial crisis has made some families so desperate they are giving up the most precious thing of all - their children.
One morning a few weeks before Christmas a kindergarten teacher in Athens found a note about one of her four-year-old pupils.
"I will not be coming to pick up Anna today because I cannot afford to look after her," it read. "Please take good care of her. Sorry. Her mother."
In the last two months Father Antonios, a young Orthodox priest who runs a youth centre for the city's poor, has found four children on his doorstep - including a baby just days old.
Another charity was approached by a couple whose twin babies were in hospital being treated for malnutrition, because the mother herself was malnourished and unable to breastfeed.
.................................Over the last year we have hundreds of cases of parents who want to leave their children with us - they know us and trust us," Father Antonios says.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16472310


Its a sad state of affairs in a so called "first world country " when people can't feed their kids.Don't they have social welfare in greece?.

Gordon

Paddy Samurai wrote: »

Don't they have social welfare in greece?.

As far as I recall it's one of the lowest 'paid' welfare allowances in Europe.

staker

Father Antonius must believe in that 'aul adage " one man's misfortune is another's gain".

ROFLcopter

The parents of those kids must be on the verge of becoming homeless and have nowhere to go, can't imagine the pain of giving up a child. I wouldn't want them living on the streets either.

Sleepy

For the love of the flying spaghetti monster, who still trusts priests with children?!

Chuck Stone

Maybe libertarians will help them?

Morlar

staker wrote: »

Father Antonius must believe in that 'aul adage " one man's misfortune is another's gain".

?

seamus

Paddy Samurai wrote: »

Its a sad state of affairs in a so called "first world country " when people can't feed their kids.Don't they have social welfare in greece?.

As far as I can tell, you have to been working full-time ongoing for two years before you qualify for the dole in Greece, and then you only get paid that for a year. There doesn't seem to be any automatic entitlement to continuous payments.

Though you'll understand that it's hard to find information on "living off the state in Greece", in English.

Sindri

This is a very sad story.

staker

Morlar wrote: »

?

Sleepy alluded to it, who would trust their children with clergy? A big brush to tar with I know but I couldn't see it happening here.

My name is URL

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Maybe libertarians will help them?

Wouldn't they be of the opinion that it should be charitable organisations that help them? Plenty of libertarians support such organisations so in effect are helping them. Which, in this case at least is a damn lot more than the state is doing.

Chuck Stone

My name is URL wrote: »

Wouldn't they be of the opinion that it should be charitable organisations that help them? Plenty of libertarians support such organisations so in effect are helping them. Which, in this case at least is a damn lot more than the state is doing.

Maybe you're right.

Morlar

staker wrote: »

Father Antonius must believe in that 'aul adage " one man's misfortune is another's gain".

?

staker wrote: »

Sleepy alluded to it, who would trust their children with clergy? A big brush to tar with I know .....

***********

Gordon

seamus wrote: »

Though you'll understand that it's hard to find information on "living off the state in Greece", in English.

Living off the state isn't a popular thing at all in Greece, instead it would be 'living off the family', so even if you were searching in Greek you wouldn't get many hits. People live with their parents, inherit family houses/holiday homes/businesses generally. Even married couples will many times live with the parents or vice versa. 'Scrounging/living off the state' isn't a buzzphrase in Greece like it is in Afterhours! If you're an EU citizen trying to get dole in Greece, you'll find it very difficult, firstly from the crazy mad beaurocracy that you need to go through to get it, and secondly, from the pittance that you are entitled to.

staker

Morlar wrote: »

?



Pathetic.

What's pathetic?

Morlar

staker wrote: »

What's pathetic?

You are. Alluding to this priest being involved in physical or sexual abuse on the basis that he is providing shelter to abandoned children/infants.

staker

Morlar wrote: »

You are. Alluding to this priest being involved in physical or sexual abuse on the basis that he is providing shelter to abandoned children/infants.

Post reported.

Next time I'll turn on the sarcasm filter, lighten up ffs. Last I looked this was AH.

Spread

seamus wrote: »

As far as I can tell, you have to been working full-time ongoing for two years before you qualify for the dole in Greece, and then you only get paid that for a year. There doesn't seem to be any automatic entitlement to continuous payments.

Though you'll understand that it's hard to find information on "living off the state in Greece", in English.

Surely you qualify for social welfare after the dole runs out?

Even here in the Great Satan you will get that type of handout.

Self preservation is a strong sense ......... so if no state aid ....... you either starve or you thieve to live .......... hence social welfare.

Morlar

staker wrote: »

Post reported.

Next time I'll turn on the sarcasm filter, lighten up ffs. Last I looked this was AH.

That means it's ok to infer sexual / physical abuse of minors by the one person who seems to be doing something for them ?

All on the basis that this person is religious ?

*********

staker

Morlar wrote: »

That means it's ok to infer sexual / physical abuse of minors by the one person who seems to be doing something for them ?

All on the basis that this person is religious ?

Pathetic.

I'm not gonna bother, that's twice you've insulted me btw.

stovelid

Sleepy wrote: »

For the love of the flying spaghetti monster, who still trusts priests with children?!

At least it's something in your mouth, I guess.

Degsy

Spread wrote: »

Self preservation is a strong sense ......... so if no state aid ....... you either starve or you thieve to live .......... hence social welfare.

Or you could try working..

KindOfIrish

Sleepy wrote: »

For the love of the flying spaghetti monster, who still trusts priests with children?!

Fortunately, Orthodox Priests do not need to be celibate. They lead normal family life after work. I have never heard about child sex abuse in Orthodox Churches.

Micky Dolenz

Morlar,staker.

Why can't we all just get along?

Move on from it please.

Chuck Stone

Degsy wrote: »

Or you could try working..

In imaginary jobs so they can put imaginary food on an imaginary table?

Sounds like a fun game.

Spread

Degsy wrote: »

Or you could try working..

Kinda hard with the unemployment rate out there (20%) ........ I imagine

Not too many people leaving jobs ........ so no jobs on offer.

Try working that one out

Geuze

Most social exp is on pensions.

Unemployment Insurance is 19% of average wage for 12 months.

Seasonal un payment is 461.50 pm.

ilovesleep

This recession will set us back decades and decades in some ways.

Debt slavery
A reintroduction of classes - low, middle, high,
Lower classes paupering for the higher classes.
Discrimination and inequality as seen now in ireland with the law only applying to those not in politics.

Now, orphangages in greece :-(

Geuze

http://www.eu-employment-observatory.net/resources/reviews/NationalArticles/Greece-UBRvw2011.pdf

Young people aged 20-29 must wait a year with no payment until they get 73 per month for 5 months.

No unemployment assistance like here.

Geuze

Spread wrote: »

Surely you qualify for social welfare after the dole runs out?

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

Degsy

Chuck Stone wrote: »

In imaginary jobs so they can put imaginary food on an imaginary table?

Sounds like a fun game.

I know the city of Kalamata quite well and the neighbouring town of Stoupa and the service industries in both places are always looking for staff..its a lot like here,people dont wanna work for minimum wage and let foreigners do the shiity jobs whilst moaning about the fact.

Added to the fact that agriculture and fishing are both huge potential employers but people just dont want to work there..farmers growing olives for example have a hard time finding anybody to help them on the farms..they'd rather ponce about on the internet and pose around the place at night time.

I have a friend in greece who's been on the dole for four years despite her parents owning a restaurant in a busy area and she will *not* work there no matter what..instead she moans and whinges about how tough she has it and lies on the fcucking beach all day.

Spread

Geuze wrote: »

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

Will enquire about that here. I would have thought that unemployed people who live in the projects get some sort of aid - apart from their housing needs. They cannot all be flogging dope/pussy/neighbour's belongings to stay alive.
So how do the vast majority of longterm unemployed manage to live?

Spread

Spread wrote: »

Will enquire about that here. I would have thought that unemployed people who live in the projects get some sort of aid - apart from their housing needs. They cannot all be flogging dope/pussy/neighbour's belongings to stay alive.
So how do the vast majority of longterm unemployed manage to live?

In the US, the longterm unemployed live in prisons.

Why do you think the US has the highest prisoner numbers in the world?

Babybuff

scary situation, things must be fairly bad there.

partyatmygaff

staker wrote: »

I'm not gonna bother, that's twice you've insulted me btw.

He called you pathetic (And retracted it). You accused a man trying to do some good in the world of having malicious ulterior motives without so much as a shred of evidence. Comparing one to the other, one is a pretty nasty thing to say about anyone and the other is hardly worth mentioning.

It's a pretty sad story really. We say we have it bad over here in Ireland but what little problems we have are nothing in comparison to what's described in the OP and what goes on elsewhere in the world on a daily basis. I can't even begin to imagine how terrible it must feel to have to leave your child with someone else just to ensure they survive

Yakult

How long before it starts happening here I wonder.. That country is absolutely ****ed to the ground.

starbelgrade

Gordon wrote: »

Living off the state isn't a popular thing at all in Greece,

Neither is the concept of paying taxes.

RickRoll

Geuze wrote: »

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

Ireland = Infinity

dsmythy

Wasn't long ago people were saying Ireland should be more like Greece.

noxqs

Geuze wrote: »

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

Incorrect. Denmark does have a dole scheme. You're referring to what is called "Dagpenge" which is 500 euros per week paid to people who were also a member of an "a-kasse" which is a union unemployment insurance sceme.

After 2 years, if still unsuccessful to gain employment, you can get "kontanthjælp" which is the equivalent of the "dole".

Google translate this page if you wish: http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagpenge

This is similar to the other Nordic Countries.

staker

partyatmygaff wrote: »

He called you pathetic (And retracted it). You accused a man trying to do some good in the world of having malicious ulterior motives without so much as a shred of evidence. Comparing one to the other, one is a pretty nasty thing to say about anyone and the other is hardly worth mentioning.

It's a pretty sad story really. We say we have it bad over here in Ireland but what little problems we have are nothing in comparison to what's described in the OP and what goes on elsewhere in the world on a daily basis. I can't even begin to imagine how terrible it must feel to have to leave your child with someone else just to ensure they survive

That retraction only came about because I requested he remove the personal attack.Had he said my opinion was pathetic I couldn't give a fiddler's, each to their own.
What was meant as a bit of tongue in cheek obviously hit a nerve with some, my opinion of the clergy wouldn't have me seeking any help in any shape or form from them whatsoever. And definitely not for my kids.

SisterAnn

Spread wrote: »

Surely you qualify for social welfare after the dole runs out?

Even here in the Great Satan you will get that type of handout.

Self preservation is a strong sense ......... so if no state aid ....... you either starve or you thieve to live .......... hence social welfare.

Yeah. Too right. You don't want to be caught doing that work thing whatever happens.

Why round on libertarians? I don't think the crazy borrowing and looney govt spending that got Greece where it is are policies on their agenda. Or am I missing something?

partyatmygaff

staker wrote: »

That retraction only came about because I requested he remove the personal attack.Had he said my opinion was pathetic I couldn't give a fiddler's, each to their own.
What was meant as a bit of tongue in cheek obviously hit a nerve with some, my opinion of the clergy wouldn't have me seeking any help in any shape or form from them whatsoever. And definitely not for my kids.

Have you any experience with the clergy of Greece? Unless you accuse anyone who works with children of child abuse, accusing him of child abuse and saying "Another man's loss is another man's gain" is just idiotic prejudice and incredibly nasty. There's nothing to joke about here, not even by the standards of AH.

staker

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Have you any experience with the clergy of Greece? Unless you accuse anyone who works with children of child abuse, accusing him of child abuse and saying "Another man's loss is another man's gain" is just idiotic prejudice and incredibly nasty. There's nothing to joke about here, not even by the standards of AH.

I didn't just accuse "anyone who works with children" of child abuse.
Why take it out of context when it's clearly just the clergy that's being talked about?
My idiotic prejudiced and incredibly nasty comment is as a result of both my
and hundreds of other people's treatment,torture and torment at the hands of the Catholic clergy over the last century in this country alone, which in no way makes it neither prejudiced nor nasty.
Nasty is what happens when a whole youth and life is taken from an innocent child at the hands of these monsters.
How any clergy can be defended in this day and age is beyond me- had I been a priest amid all these scandals I'd have quit.Greek,Irish or Swahili, they're a joke.

inforfun

Geuze wrote: »

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

NL does have "bijstand" after 3 years of unemployment. Which is the same amount for everybody. Add to that rent allowance of some kind (not as idiotic high as here btw).
Unemployent money used to work like this: 90% of your last earned salary for 6 months after this it was 70% of your last salary for 2,5 years.
"Bijstand" was 600 a month for a single person, living at home with parents.
These are figures from about 10 years ago, pretty sure they are not accurate anymore. Bijstand probably higher, unemployment money more than likely less and shorter in time.

But it is, just like here, possible to live pretty well in The Netherlands while not woking a day in your life.

As for the Greecs.... probably coming out with this news so they can blackmail the EU into giving more money again.

partyatmygaff

staker wrote: »

I didn't just accuse "anyone who works with children" of child abuse.
Why take it out of context when it's clearly just the clergy that's being talked about?

I suggest you read my post again. I asked if you had any experience with Greek Orthodox clergy. Assuming that (seeing as you live in Ireland) you probably haven't, I went on to say that unless you consider everyone who works with children to be in it just to abuse children it's nothing more than idiotic prejudice to assume that said priest would "Gain" anything from having abandoned children left on his centre's door step.

My idiotic prejudiced and incredibly nasty comment is as a result of both my
and hundreds of other people's treatment,torture and torment at the hands of the Catholic clergy over the last century in this country alone, which in no way makes it neither prejudiced nor nasty.

Actually it does. The Catholic church and Catholic clergy's actions in Ireland have nothing to do with the Orthodox Church and this paricular priest in Greece.

Nasty is what happens when a whole youth and life is taken from an innocent child at the hands of these monsters.
How any clergy can be defended in this day and age is beyond me- had I been a priest amid all these scandals I'd have quit.Greek,Irish or Swahili, they're a joke.

This man in question is not linked in any way to the Catholic church. If you want to tar ALL priests with the same prejudice then you may as well tar all men with the same prejudice. By your way of thinking, if one man abuses a child, all men become suspected child abusers.


At the end of the day, implying that a man taking care of children abandoned by their parents due to poverty is a child abuser merely because a small number of completely unrelated people who just so happen to share his job title abused is nothing short of nasty and incredibly prejudiced.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Its so sad to think of having to give up your child because you are unable to afford to look after it BUT the greeks brought all this on themselves, no one paid taxes, they under declared revenue at every turn about, they were greedy and their economy slowly shít itself.

Its all coming back to haunt them now and they have no one to blame but themselves.

staker

partyatmygaff wrote: »

I suggest you read my post again. I asked if you had any experience with Greek Orthodox clergy. Assuming that (seeing as you live in Ireland) you probably haven't, I went on to say that unless you consider everyone who works with children to be in it just to abuse children it's nothing more than idiotic prejudice to assume that said priest would "Gain" anything from having abandoned children left on his centre's door step.


Actually it does. The Catholic church and Catholic clergy's actions in Ireland have nothing to do with the Orthodox Church and this paricular priest in Greece.


This man in question is not linked in any way to the Catholic church. If you want to tar ALL priests with the same prejudice then you may as well tar all men with the same prejudice. By your way of thinking, if one man abuses a child, all men become suspected child abusers.


At the end of the day, implying that a man taking care of children abandoned by their parents due to poverty is a child abuser merely because a small number of completely unrelated people who just so happen to share his job title abused is nothing short of nasty and incredibly prejudiced.

I'll not read your post again, and you're right to assume. I see your opinion-incredibly prejudiced is not a way I'd describe mine. When you've had advances made to you by male clergy(I'm male too not that it matters) prejudice against that institution flies out the window.
Your generalisation that my argument qualifies against all men is absurd to say the least.
I suggest you read my post again where the real definition of nasty towards a couple of generations (that we know of) of children is. Try telling them my opinion is nasty.
We'll not agree, but to be branded pathetic is just not on.(Not by you btw).
You might retort, fair enough, I've said my last.

partyatmygaff

staker wrote: »

I'll not read your post again,

Fair enough. If you won't bother reading my post and actually understanding my point there's really no point in continuing this discsussion.

I do hope you eventually come to understand why implicitly accusing a man trying to help abandoned children of being a child abuser and of "gaining" from having children left on his centre's doorstep is an incredibly nasty accusation to level at someone. Just because certain Catholic priests abused children in the past in Ireland does not give you the right to accuse a priest that has nothing to do with either the Roman Catholic church nor Ireland of being a child abuser or of being in anyway linked to child abuse.

Spread

salonfire wrote: »

In the US, the longterm unemployed live in prisons.

Why do you think the US has the highest prisoner numbers in the world?

You get unemployment for two years and then you go on Welfare. If you're a Mom with kids you get, as well as money, free milk, juices, bread, cheese etc for all kids under 5. After that you go on a different program. If in rented accomodation you get assistance with the rent - just as you do in Ireland/Europe.
Granted, if you are incarcerated, the chances of getting a job are somewhat reduced. Where are you getting your figures from? The Sun, Daily Mail or The Enquirer?
Have a gander at this:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/21/america-serious-crime-rate-plunging

Spread

Geuze wrote: »

Many countries pay unemployment payments for a limited duration.

USA = 6 months, extended to 99 wks in recession
NL = 2 years
DK = 2 years

Greece = 1 year.

These countries do not have "dole" schemes after UI runs out.

Wrong in the case of the USA. As listed above - Welfare kicks in with it's various benefits. For the case of unemployed, this lasts 'til they get a job or 'til the Grim Reaper arrives