Private tax and insurance on a Berlingo

thedumberman

Hi All,

Just have a question that I didn't see much information on around the net.

I want to buy a Berlingo van, but I want to insure and tax it privately as I will have no commercial use for it. I am 25, a student and I currently drive a 1L corsa C. I phoned up Axa because they already insure my corsa and they refused to quote me for a Berlingo because they could only insure it commercially and I wasn't suitable as a student.

Obviously this is very annoying and I wondered if anyone else had the same experience and could provide some answer. I Would be really grateful.

PS: Please don't answer if your going to just say tax or insure it commercially. Its not something I want to do at all.

Cheers

dahamsta

Strictly speaking it's not something you /can/ do, the motor tax office will get you to sign a declaration these days saying it'll only be used for commercial purposes. It's a nonsense of course, but it can be added to the collection.

You'll need to try more than one insurer anyway, and if I was you I'd talk to another person in AXA too, people can get ideas in their head. If you talked to someone in an office try the main line, and vice versa. The people in my local office are incredibly helpful so that's always my first stop.

thedumberman

Yeah, I might take a trip into the office, you could be right there. I also plan to ring them up again and tell them "well then I guess i'm just going to have to cancel my current policy as I dont need 2 motors and I am getting the Berlingo" just to see what they say. BTW, I am only driving 7 months and still on provisional, although EDT is complete and awaiting test now, am I able to cancel my insurance, I pay monthly, just curious what the story would be there, I know Axa wont say yes lol

racso1975

Can i ask why you want the berlingo

thedumberman

Love the look of them and very handy for kiting, I have a beach buggy that is very hard to fit into the car, proper awkward, berlingo would sort that

George Dalton

Because it is a commercial vehicle it will need to be insured as a commercial. However this commerical policy also covers you for private (social, domestic and pleasure) use. So no problem there.

As you are not using the vehicle for commerical purposes the law states it must be taxed at the private rate. Some people do this, some tax it as a commercial anyway because it is cheaper and the chances of falling foul of the law are very low.

thedumberman

Are you absolutely sure I can insure it as a commercial and tax it as private? like 100% sure?

dahamsta

If in doubt, ask. GD is most likely right but you do need to provide a policy number when taxing, so it's better to ask to be sure.

George Dalton

thedumberman wrote: »

Are you absolutely sure I can insure it as a commercial and tax it as private? like 100% sure?

Yes definitely. You aren't changing the class of the vehicle, it is still classed as a commercial just taxed privately as it is being used privately. Actually to say you are taxing it privately is slightly misleading. It is more accurate to say that it should be taxed on the cc based rate even for post 2008 vehicles. You can't tax a van on the CO2 rate, as I found out when I tried to tax an 08 Focus van privately on the CO2 rate for €156 and was turned down

thedumberman

Lol, Cool, that sounds good. I tried Axa again and they still say no way josé, Im gonna try go into the branch.

Anyone know the score with cancelling insurance after 7 months in the first year? I pay monthly and if i cancelled will they still try bill me for the rest of the year?

Ardennes1944

this idea ran past me as well the other day, i only ever need 2 seats really and many carvans are much cheaper than their car counterparts. it would also allow me to carry my road bike easily. i work in an engineering job the odd time too and they all have vans there so i was thinking this would aid me

dahamsta

Not sure of the answer to that, but I was reading their terms a couple days ago and they do say that leaving after 6 months on a new policy won't entitle you to a relative refund; obviously this is on an annual policy. Check the Ts&Cs before you go in.

MugMugs

Ardennes1944 wrote: »

this idea ran past me as well the other day, i only ever need 2 seats really and many carvans are much cheaper than their car counterparts. it would also allow me to carry my road bike easily. i work in an engineering job the odd time too and they all have vans there so i was thinking this would aid me

Drove a connect to a few jobs. You will freeze your ass off in the winter.

OP You're entitled to a pro rata refund from your insurer and will lose your NCB for this year etc.... It's generally all very well documented in your policy book.

thedumberman

Yeah, I see that too, but as i am paying monthly there would be nothing to refund lol, I think they might try feck me over.gonna try the branch here in Tralee, Cheers for the help

thedumberman

MugMugs wrote: »

OP You're entitled to a pro rata refund from your insurer and will lose your NCB for this year etc.... It's generally all very well documented in your policy book.

Must check that out, cheers for the heads up.

Gareth2011

George Dalton wrote: »

Some people do this, some tax it as a commercial anyway because it is cheaper and the chances of falling foul of the law are very low.

You can't tax a commercial vehicle with commercial tax anymore unless you are have a VAT no. If you want to drive a commercial and use it for work you need to be registered for VAT. However if you are registered for VAT and you are stopped by guards using a vehicle that is taxed commercially outside of normal working hours depending on the work eg( your not driving a construction van around at 1am). If you are caught driving around at this time in it you are using it for pleasure and thats not what it was taxed for so in theory you are defrauding the system by (in the guards eyes) not taxing it properly.

I have no idea if it is enforced or not. You can tax it privatly too like the OP wants but it just costs more. Like I had a 2.8 Renault Master here. Was taxing it commercially. It was for work and pleasure and didn't need a VAT no back then. When the new law came in about having to be registered for VAT I either had to registered for VAT (self employed) or tax it privately.

But then timing belt snapped so I was ok in that respect .:D

thedumberman

Gareth2011 wrote: »

You can't tax a commercial vehicle with commercial tax anymore unless you are have a VAT no. If you want to drive a commercial and use it for work you need to be registered for VAT. However if you are registered for VAT and you are stopped by guards using a vehicle that is taxed commercially outside of normal working hours depending on the work eg( your not driving a construction van around at 1am). If you are caught driving around at this time in it you are using it for pleasure and thats not what it was taxed for so in theory you are defrauding the system by (in the guards eyes) not taxing it properly.

I have no idea if it is enforced or not. You can tax it privatly too like the OP wants but it just costs more.

Thats what I thought, I dunno either if that law is enforced, I Dont think it is, but the fear is if i was ever responsable for an accidence, the insurance would screw me over

thedumberman

Gareth2011 wrote: »

Sure a Berlingo is only a 1.6 isn't it? Private Tax is

Engine Capacity
(c.c.)

Annual

€

Half-year

€*

Quarterly
€!
Arrears
Monthly
€#


1,501 to 1,600

478

265

135

47.80

1,601 to 1,700

506
280
142
50.60

These are vehivcles registered before 1st July 2008.

Usually 1.9 but you can get 1.6, not really worried about tax cost cause I expect it to be more than corsa lol, its a 2001 Berlingo

Gareth2011

Best bet is to lo0ok at this so

http://www.environ.ie/en/LocalGovernment/MotorTax/PublicationsDocuments/FileDownLoad,28859,en.doc

thedumberman

Gareth2011 wrote: »

Best bet is to lo0ok at this so

http://www.environ.ie/en/LocalGovernment/MotorTax/PublicationsDocuments/FileDownLoad,28859,en.doc

Nice one dude, Didn't realize the pre- 2008 car tax went up lol

Gareth2011

Yeah just went up in the budget :mad:. Having a van is a godsend tho. I used to have a medium wheel base master old shape and it was great. Could squeeze 32 pallets into the back of it. Carried full loads of furniture in it too. just over 6ft standing height in the back and 10ft long. Couldnt go wrong

thedumberman

Gareth2011 wrote: »

Yeah just went up in the budget :mad:. Having a van is a godsend tho. I used to have a medium wheel base master old shape and it was great. Could squeeze 32 pallets into the back of it. Carried full loads of furniture in it too. just over 6ft standing height in the back and 10ft long. Couldnt go wrong

Yikes, sounds like you'd fit my whole house into that :P I just want a small one meself, no need for anything bigger than a berlingo, dont like the old caddys, horrible lol.

barura

Hey horse! I was in this boat and after a long talk with several insurance brokers, got back to AXA, my insurer and they said "we'll send out a form" seeing as they're not really able to deal with my question.

On the form you get (van first policy iirc) there is a section where you can declare non business use, yet can still get insured.

What I was thinking of doing is actually just getting one of these:
http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/2839413



No nasty insurance problems and the seats fold flat to make a van like area. Cheap to insure too as they're pretty low risk in the old insurance companies eyes.

thedumberman

barura wrote: »

Hey horse! I was in this boat and after a long talk with several insurance brokers, got back to AXA, my insurer and they said "we'll send out a form" seeing as they're not really able to deal with my question.

On the form you get (van first policy iirc) there is a section where you can declare non business use, yet can still get insured.

What I was thinking of doing is actually just getting one of these:
http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/2839413



No nasty insurance problems and the seats fold flat to make a van like area. Cheap to insure too as they're pretty low risk in the old insurance companies eyes.

Yeah, I originally thought about going down this route but ended up with corsa, I want to buy my uncles van now, so not a multispace option as i want his specific van. but your dead right that is a great alternative but horrible interior was what pushed me away from those in the first place

barura

I wanted a van as a first car too, then ended up with a Polo. Must be some sort of idea that if you're not driving a van, just get a cheap car til you can!

George Dalton

Gareth2011 wrote: »

You can't tax a commercial vehicle with commercial tax anymore unless you are have a VAT no. If you want to drive a commercial and use it for work you need to be registered for VAT. However if you are registered for VAT and you are stopped by guards using a vehicle that is taxed commercially outside of normal working hours depending on the work eg( your not driving a construction van around at 1am). If you are caught driving around at this time in it you are using it for pleasure and thats not what it was taxed for so in theory you are defrauding the system by (in the guards eyes) not taxing it properly.

You don't have to be VAT registered. Plenty of people aren't VAT registered and yet have legitimate reasons for having a commercial vehicle and are able to tax it accordingly. For example farmers and small businesses that are below the VAT threshold.

The law is not enforced at all in my experience. I drive a commercially taxed van regularly for both business and personal use and have been through plenty of checkpoints at all hours of the day and night and have never been asked any questions about the purpose of my journey.

justbored

This post has been deleted.

thedumberman

justbored wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Cheers, I will definitely be giving FBD a ring, or might pop down to them, any idea if their offices are open today?