Minister signs new roadworthiness testing regulations

niloc1951

MODEDIT:
As this is a current and important topic, we'll make it a sticky until the dust settles and everybody knows what's going on


The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport has signed S.I. No. 710 of 2011. EUROPEAN COMMUNITIES (VEHICLE TESTING) (AMENDMENT) REGULATIONS 2011.

The attached file is an extract from IRIS OIFIGIÚIL, JANUARY 3rd, 2012

Mandatory testing will be in force from 1st. March, 2012

As yet there is no mention of the new legislation on the RSA website, nor is there any information on how they propose to manage the first test for motor caravans over two years old.

For example
A motor caravan first registered on the 10th, March 2008 will need to have a valid test in place from the 1st. March 2012 to be legal, which need only be done any time between now and then at the owners convenience and subject to space availability at a VTN site.
However, the validity of the test will expire in the 9th. March 2012 and the vehicle will need re-certification within perhaps just ten days of passing a test

Just because a previous Minister made a bags of things I will feel very hard done by if after getting my test done between now and the end of February to be legal from March 1st. I will have to get it done again in June, the 6th. anniversary of first registration.

The Act is not yet posted on www.irishstatutebook.ie, they're only up to 641/2011, hopefully it will contain a 'fair' rollout provision.

Buford T Justice

niloc1951 wrote: »

The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport has signed S.I. No. 710 of 2011. EUROPEAN COMMUNITIES (VEHICLE TESTING) (AMENDMENT) REGULATIONS 2011.

The attached file is an extract from IRIS OIFIGIÚIL, JANUARY 3rd, 2012

Mandatory testing will be in force from 1st. March, 2012

As yet there is no mention of the new legislation on the RSA website, nor is there any information on how they propose to manage the first test for motor caravans over two years old.

For example
A motor caravan first registered on the 10th, March 2008 will need to have a valid test in place from the 1st. March 2012 to be legal, which need only be done any time between now and then at the owners convenience and subject to space availability at a VTN site.
However, the validity of the test will expire in the 9th. March 2012 and the vehicle will need re-certification within perhaps just ten days of passing a test

Just because a previous Minister made a bags of things I will feel very hard done by if after getting my test done between now and the end of February to be legal from March 1st. I will have to get it done again in June, the 6th. anniversary of first registration.

The Act is not yet posted on www.irishstatutebook.ie, they're only up to 641/2011, hopefully it will contain a 'fair' rollout provision.

I notice your use of the word hopefully there. I wouldn't be holding ones breath for even a reasonably good outcome from this.

salamander27

Here it is if it makes any sense to you....... I'm afraid my head begins to melt when I read these documents for too long!

But I think I gathered from the text (paragraph 5 at the bottom of the fifth page) is that a current road-worthiness cert will last until it expires, i.e. 12 months after it was obtained, or until 31st December 2013. So if you got a cert this year you're good to go! (I think.)

http://www.attorneygeneral.ie/esi/2011/B28984.pdf

Irishgoatman

I've just been onto the RSA in Ballina for an update.

Situation is as follows:

Testing criteria should be on their website by the end of the month and should be the same as the notification we received on the 22nd Nov. 2010 following the consultation.

With regard to the issue of windscreen discs, if I understood it correctly, they are in the process of taking over the admin side of this from individual VTN garages and centralising the computerisation in order that discs can be issued at the time of testing in order to eliminate the need to register your test at your local/county vehicle registration office. This is hoped to be done by the end of the year!. This will be for all vehicles that have to have a VTN not just campers.

Due date of test will be the date that the vehicle was FIRST registered, not just as a camper if it's a conversion. They are trying to organise things so that if, for example as in my case, I have a current cert that expires in July 2012 but my registration date is 17th Oct, then the next due date for my test (over 10 years old) will be 17th Oct 2013.
This might be a computer problem for them but they will do their best.

Hope this all makes sense.

Buford T Justice

Irishgoatman wrote: »

With regard to the issue of windscreen discs, if I understood it correctly, they are in the process of taking over the admin side of this from individual VTN garages and centralising the computerisation in order that discs can be issued at the time of testing in order to eliminate the need to register your test at your local/county vehicle registration office. This is hoped to be done by the end of the year!. This will be for all vehicles that have to have a VTN not just campers.

They want to do this for all commercial vehicles, and increase the DOE test by about €40 in order to pay for the centralized system.

Irishgoatman

Buford T Justice wrote: »

They want to do this for all commercial vehicles, and increase the DOE test by about €40 in order to pay for the centralized system.

As I said, ALL vehicles. But no mention was made to me about a cost increase. All I posted was what I was told. No speculation by me.

One of the reason for doing this, I was told, is because there have been quite a few cases of fraud with regard to DOE test certs on commercial vehicles. Having them all registered through a central system, with a windscreen disc which I advocated for, as with the NCT, will go a long way to eliminate this problem.

bluethunder

Hmmm...this is bad news for anyone that's cash strapped but I suppose it was inevitable. I'd be fairly confident of my 96 ducato getting through this but my only issue would be the kind of regulations they place on gas fittings. My gas bottle is internal and is not vented to outside of the van. It was a professional conversion done in 98 by Shamrock in Mayo. Suppose it would be relatively straight-forward to vent it but if they insist on it being external to the van that would mean putting in a door and sealing up the inside, a bit trickier.

Malta1

Not sure that they will be looking at gas fittings etc???

But for safety sake, gas definately should be vented to outside world

Irishgoatman

If you go to page 33, about 3/4 of the way down you'll see a post by Buford, " New regulations....." and the link.

This gives all the info.

Irishgoatman

bluethunder wrote: »

Hmmm...this is bad news for anyone that's cash strapped but I suppose it was inevitable. I'd be fairly confident of my 96 ducato getting through this but my only issue would be the kind of regulations they place on gas fittings. My gas bottle is internal and is not vented to outside of the van. It was a professional conversion done in 98 by Shamrock in Mayo. Suppose it would be relatively straight-forward to vent it but if they insist on it being external to the van that would mean putting in a door and sealing up the inside, a bit trickier.

We both have the same problem.
The difference, as I mentioned in a thread a while ago, is that my camper came out of the factory in 1986 built this way and there is nothing I can do about it.

But as has been said, checking of gas is not going to be in the test (at least not at the moment!).

Buford T Justice

Irishgoatman wrote: »

As I said, ALL vehicles. But no mention was made to me about a cost increase. All I posted was what I was told. No speculation by me.

I'm working as a HGV driver at the minute and its part of a document that the RSA have out at the moment with regard to changing the test system. I'm all for it too, but if you are an operator with say 10 trucks and trailers on the road, that's a €400 annual increase on the trucks, and the same again on the trailers that need testing. Its a bit much if you ask me. Then again, we seem to be the shmucks paying for everything lately.

Irishgoatman

Ah, so the 40 euro you mentioned is on commercial vehicles?.

Wrong thread perhaps ?.:)

Buford T Justice

Irishgoatman wrote: »

Ah, so the 40 euro you mentioned is on commercial vehicles?.

Wrong thread perhaps ?.:)

No, its for DOE tests, but as they only concern commercial vehicles at present that's why I mention them. Camper-vans are to be tested by the VTN and the fee is to be charged at the LGV rate. So the commercial price increases and then the camper-van price does so likewise.

Irishgoatman

I've just been on to the RSA (again) and yes it is being proposed that a fee be charged to cover the cost of setting up the new centralization system, but only on commercial vehicles. This is thought to be a one-off fee with no figure set as yet.

At this stage there is no reason to believe that it will apply to campervans as they are not commercial vehicles. They are only being tested at VTN garages because of their size.

But, of course, who knows what tomorrow will bring?.

kadman

Is the date of first registration for the test, the first registration in Ireland, or the first date of registration in the country of origin, as in the case with an import.

My own camper was first registered in Germany in 10 June 1992, but its first registration in Ireland was 1st June 2006. So what date am I governed by for a test.

And if its the first date of registration in Ireland, 1st June 2006, does that mean its a 2 year test for me at the moment.

I have no test cert at the moment, and with all the differing views, I haven,t a clue, when is the best time to book for a test. If I book one now, does that mean, it expires this June 2012, or will it run until June 2013.

I,d hate the thought of getting a test in March that will expire in June, I,d prefer to leave it off the road until June if thats the case.

thanks

kadman

bluethunder

kadman wrote: »

Is the date of first registration for the test, the first registration in Ireland, or the first date of registration in the country of origin, as in the case with an import.

My own camper was first registered in Germany in 10 June 1992, but its first registration in Ireland was 1st June 2006. So what date am I governed by for a test.

And if its the first date of registration in Ireland, 1st June 2006, does that mean its a 2 year test for me at the moment.

I have no test cert at the moment, and with all the differing views, I haven,t a clue, when is the best time to book for a test. If I book one now, does that mean, it expires this June 2012, or will it run until June 2013.

I,d hate the thought of getting a test in March that will expire in June, I,d prefer to leave it off the road until June if thats the case.

thanks

kadman

Why worry about this? The onus is on the Dept of Transport/Local Govt to write to all Campervan owners and advise them of the new testing regime. Until then you can plead ignorance because it's not like this has received any attention outside the campervan world.

Irishgoatman

kadman wrote: »

Is the date of first registration for the test, the first registration in Ireland, or the first date of registration in the country of origin, as in the case with an import.

My own camper was first registered in Germany in 10 June 1992, but its first registration in Ireland was 1st June 2006. So what date am I governed by for a test.

And if its the first date of registration in Ireland, 1st June 2006, does that mean its a 2 year test for me at the moment.

I have no test cert at the moment, and with all the differing views, I haven,t a clue, when is the best time to book for a test. If I book one now, does that mean, it expires this June 2012, or will it run until June 2013.

I,d hate the thought of getting a test in March that will expire in June, I,d prefer to leave it off the road until June if thats the case.

thanks

kadman

Registration date means the first time it was registered regardles of country. That date should be on your registration cert.
The third paragraph of my first posting explain how they are trying to work out testing dates.

With regard to the posting by bluethunder, they won't be writing to campervan owners but they will be publicizing this in all media. After all, car owners haven't had letters saying that the NCT charge is going up, just on all media.

bluethunder

Irishgoatman wrote: »

Registration date means the first time it was registered regardles of country. That date should be on your registration cert.
The third paragraph of my first posting explain how they are trying to work out testing dates.

With regard to the posting by bluethunder, they won't be writing to campervan owners but they will be publicizing this in all media. After all, car owners haven't had letters saying that the NCT charge is going up, just on all media.

Yes, but car owners get letters saying their cars are due for a test. I'd be amazed if they didn't send letters to all camper owners using Revenue/Motor Tax records.

kadman

So is the advice , sit tight until I,m notified. And plead ignorance.

I didn,t think ignorance of the law was an adequate defense. Will my local

guard feel the same way.

Is it not a requirement at the moment, to have a tested camper.

Please forgive me for my ignorance, as I,ve seen so many differing views, on so many

forums.

Thanks

bluethunder

kadman wrote: »

So is the advice , sit tight until I,m notified. And plead ignorance.

I didn,t think ignorance of the law was an adequate defense. Will my local

guard feel the same way.

Is it not a requirement at the moment, to have a tested camper.

Please forgive me for my ignorance, as I,ve seen so many differing views, on so many

forums.

Thanks

That's my advice, but i'm not an expert. I bought a camper last Aug. The only test I had to do was an Engineers Report and this was only for the Insurance company. You do not need a test cert to tax your vehicle. Furthermore, a Garda tried to pull someone in Limerick with a campervan saying it had no certificate of roadworthiness. The following was the result:

At a sitting of the Limerick District Court today (24/03/2011) following a successful defence submission on behalf of the owner of a 'motor caravan', that ‘motor caravans’ were not included in the list of vehicles to which the regulations below apply, Judge Tom O’Donnell ordered that the charge against the defendant be ‘struck out’.

The accusation which had been brought by Garda Brian P O’Dwyer and prosecuted by the D.P.P. against the defendant alleged that he:-

On the 27/06/2010 …….., being the owner of a vehicle to which the European Communities (Vehicle Testing) Regulations, 2004 applies, to whit Motor Vehicle registration number xxxxx …………..did fail to produce a certificate of roadworthiness………………….contrary to Article 20 and 22 of the European Communities (Vehicle Testing) Regulations, 2004.

Irishgoatman

Bluethunder is right in what he is saying, but only as things stand at the moment.

This, as you can see on the first posting, should change from the first of March.

Let's be honest, there is no logical reason why campervans should not be tested. After all they are mechanical vehicles.

I'm waiting to hear from the RSA regarding being notified of the test being due. I'll get back on when I hear.

niloc1951

bluethunder wrote: »

Why worry about this? The onus is on the Dept of Transport/Local Govt to write to all Campervan owners and advise them of the new testing regime. Until then you can plead ignorance because it's not like this has received any attention outside the campervan world.

Unfortunately, ignorance of a regulation is not an accepted defence for not complying. As in " garda I didn't know I shouldn't be going over 80 KmPH because I have a trailer"

BTW the test schedule is defined from the date of first registration, so kadman, as your camper is over ten years old it will require an annual test.

Des32

I got my motorhome tested last march for peace of mind and will do again this year. Hopefully the cert will be for 2 years this time.

I am in the transport business and get 15 vehicles tested every year both at NCT centres and VTN centres and I have never been notified when a road worthiness test is due.

I think it will be your own responsibilityto have your paper work in order.

Irishgoatman

Des32 wrote: »

I got my motorhome tested last march for peace of mind and will do again this year. Hopefully the cert will be for 2 years this time.

I am in the transport business and get 15 vehicles tested every year both at NCT centres and VTN centres and I have never been notified when a road worthiness test is due.

I think it will be your own responsibilityto have your paper work in order.

Hi Des, how are things?.

This is, I think, one of the reason they are aiming for a central computer system with windscreen discs. At the moment all records are only kept in the county, not nationally.
And yes, the test periods will be the same as for private cars.

bluethunder

niloc1951 wrote: »

Unfortunately, ignorance of a regulation is not an accepted defence for not complying. As in " garda I didn't know I shouldn't be going over 80 KmPH because I have a trailer"

BTW the test schedule is defined from the date of first registration, so kadman, as your camper is over ten years old it will require an annual test.

Ok, when I get the letter stating my van needs to be tested, i'm gonna scan it in and post it here!!

Irishgoatman

I've just been talking to the RSA for an update on notification of the forthcoming testing.

Individual notices will not be sent out until the whole system is centralized, (in the same way that individuals were not informed of the household charge for example), with the exemption of those who took part in the original consultation because, obviously, they have addresses and/or email addresses for them.

All campervan clubs will get notification.

As with all new laws/regulations it's up to the individual to find out about it. Unless they are controversial in which case they get into the news on TV.

Adverts will be placed in the weekend newspapers.

My contact told me that there are over 10,000 campervans registered in Ireland!, many of which could be laid up no longer in use, many could no longer be in the country and some people could have moved or be in the process of moving.

That's it so far.

old westie

Irishgoatman wrote: »

Registration date means the first time it was registered regardles of country. That date should be on your registration cert.
The third paragraph of my first posting explain how they are trying to work out testing dates.

With regard to the posting by bluethunder, they won't be writing to campervan owners but they will be publicizing this in all media. After all, car owners haven't had letters saying that the NCT charge is going up, just on all media.

But car owners are informed when they are first due their NCT test. I think as previous member says keep head down until informed . They have all our details.

Irishgoatman

old westie wrote: »

But car owners are informed when they are first due their NCT test. I think as previous member says keep head down until informed . They have all our details.

Yes because the car NCT is a centralized system!.
As I reported, once the system for campervans and commercial vehicles is centralized everyone will automatically be notified.

Until that happens it is, as Des32 said, your responsibilty to know the laws regarding your vehicle. Ignorance is no defence.

At the end of the day it's up to you.

As I've said before, I have mine tested each year for my own peace of mind anyway. At the last test I was told that there was a very small rust hole that would need doing sometime, not bad enought to fail the test this time but in a years time maybe, this was something that I wouldn't have known about, so I was able to get it done now whilst it was just a small job.